|
All my slow cars are manual because there's not some sort of amazing talent involved in driving cars like 99.99% of the developing world does. Racing car drivers don't shift with their legs.meatpimp posted:All cars are good, if they're fast. If I'm on holiday you can be damned sure I'm ticking the 'Manual' box on the rental form and then driving that rental shitheap up the gravel road hill to the villa like I'm gunning for Loeb's time. Meanwhile Bape comes to LA and rents an automatic Malibu or something and then hides from me because of it. Bape Culture posted:Ether frenzy is a coward and shifting gears is fun as hell Least it doesn't take me 6 months to put dampers on my car (that I broke from moneyshifting)!!!!! 
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 22:56
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 24, 2024 13:21 |
|
|
Jealous Cow posted:I had a M4 with DCT and it was insanely fast and totally unengaging because more than a few seconds on the pedal and you’re doing double the limit. To be honest I think the M4 is just insanely fast and totally unengaging as a general rule. I felt exactly the same way about that car in both formats. It's faster than mine on paper, but sure doesn't feel faster or more exciting at all.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 22:58
|
|
|
What sort of characteristics can make a fast car more or less engaging? Handling? Noise?
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:10
|
|
|
I think for most people it's going to come down to steering feel and handling characteristics more than anything else, but also I don't think there's ever going to be an objective measure of what is or isn't engaging in a car. A lot of it is just the kind of feedback that a car gives you while you're driving and whether it's the type of feedback that appeals to you in particular.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:17
|
|
|
Handling, a car that is very damped feels like you're just sort of floating. Traction control can take the fun out of hard accelerations. lovely tires will effect handling. A big reason the e30 is such an engaging car is in my opinion the steering wheel feel. You feel everything the car is experiencing (in a good way), cornering in an e30 and e36 feels like having your hands on the suspension itself. Having a bunch of horsepower is fun but if the feeling of hard acceleration or tight cornering isn't transmitted to the driver it will feel like a slightly beefier economy car. It also effects your performance as a driver.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:17
|
|
|
Oh god a friend of mine has an M4 with a tune on it and he took me for a drive and it is legit the first time I think I’ve ever actually screamed out loud, I was like one of those bikini girls in the 800HP Supra vids (or nowadays the 1200HP Twin Turbo Lamborghini vids I guess). The world outside started to distort. And the brakes, holy poo poo. Amazing. But I don’t think driving one as my own car would do much for me at all. I can accept that DCT is the superior option as far as speed etc. but I love driving manual, even in traffic, I don’t give a poo poo. It’s much more engaging. Each to their own though. I am a bit pissed that manuals are a dying breed though as I know it won’t be long before you can’t get them anymore.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:20
|
|
|
Noise, the way the power is delivered, refinement (or perception of refinement) in the drivetrain. Power delivery is a lot more linear in the F80's and they shift smoother too (by design) in their most harsh modes, the E9x has a lot more clunky racecar feel to it (in a good way) and the 1st-2nd rush is fun, but the real move is to drag up to the top of 1st at about 35-45 and then slot it into second and floor it, you'll get such a rocket-ship launch it makes any new passenger cackle with delight and surprise. Can't get that same feeling in the new cars because with the turbos, they have more torque at start so the kick of the RPM's hitting the sweet spot isn't as obvious and apparent. The relatively clunkiness means - the engine chatters and the D mode can be a bit less than smooth-shifting while cold, and the LSD gronks until you've put about 2 miles on it.. etc... and generally makes you feel like you're driving a Cup Car that's getting warmed up. The sound of the intake is almost as amazing as the sound of the exhaust in the E9x, it's an addictive roar that doubles the feeling of 'Zoom' that the F80 just can't get as it farts away from the line and hums to 100mph instead of 'blitzes' to it. Perception of course due to the audio cues, because the new one IS faster to 100. The traction control in the F80 is 1000x better than in the E9x so that also helps make the thing feel less 'exciting' because you can get a little slip going with the traction control on (it's ridiculously restrictive in the 'on' position on E9x) so to get the epic and heroic sideways action in the E9x you actually need to go European MDM which is the 'half-traction control' (which gives like 20% more yaw before kicking in than the NA version of the mode does, M Dynamic Mode and it's the #1 best thing you can possibly code on a NA one because it's still too restrictive in the NA at default).... so then you end up turning the TC off completely, and putting the shift violence up to the secret level 6 (only available with TC off completely) and then it's like being kicked in the back when you hit the 2nd-3rd-4th shifts. And with TC off completely, I prefer to have both hands on the incredibly satisfying-feeling steering wheel. The new one isn't as harsh or violent in any of that, and the extra refinement + far better TC makes the whole thing feel less tricky or difficult to drive REALLY FAST (on a track of course) than the feeling the E9x gives. Ether Frenzy fucked around with this message at 23:28 on Feb 3, 2019 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:26
|
|
|
Edit: ^^^^^^^ Very well said. One thing I loved about the E92 is how it feels like a fairly cheap car they stuffed a massive engine in. It really did feel like a race car. Unfortunately it developed a lot of rattled and squeaks from the relatively harsh suspension. I let my wife’s friend drive my E92 since she was very used to driving a manual as she had been driving a manual base Cobalt her entire life. She never got it over 2000rpm and was in 6th at like 40mph lol Jealous Cow fucked around with this message at 23:30 on Feb 3, 2019 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:27
|
|
|
lol at that, but in retrospect Jealous Cow posted:she had been driving a manual base Cobalt her entire life. That's probably for the best.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:30
|
|
|
Here4DaGangBang posted:But I don’t think driving one as my own car would do much for me at all. This was actually how I felt about the 135i I drove a while ago. Nowhere near as quick as a tuned M4, but the thing felt too unreasonably fast and just kind of squirrel-y for what it was. I kind of have difficulty explaining why I didn't like it, but "not engaging" or "not rewarding" are definitely the phrases that come to mind for me. I thought I was going to end up buying that car on the spot, but I walked away from the test drive weirdly disappointed. Still interested in finding a 128i with a stick to try out because in theory I really liked that car.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:30
|
|
|
Paradoxish posted:I thought I was going to end up buying that car on the spot, but I walked away from the test drive weirdly disappointed. I’m hoping this is not me after I test drive an M2, whenever that may be. Modern cars are getting so much power that you can’t possibly use anywhere near all of it except on a track, my mate was lamenting this as we drove in his M4 actually. And also the way the boost is just there from such low RPM now. Back in the day there was a bit of theatre to turbo cars, having to drive around lag and the shove in the back which came afterwards was somehow a bit more fun than just having boost instantly. Obviously around town that makes cars so tractable and that’s great, but the rest of the time..
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:42
|
|
|
The beginning of this video, I put some text overlay on it to show the switch from bumbling around in "D" (I was in 7th gear at the time) to the "S" shifting modes. https://vimeo.com/150465592
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:43
|
|
|
I beat ether down mulholland drive in a stock manual malibu and he lost his mind rip
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:43
|
|
|
E30 update  lol User Error fucked around with this message at 23:58 on Feb 3, 2019 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:45
|
|
|
https://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1519128 What's a fair price for this? 25k seem reasonable?
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:45
|
|
|
That's a lot of miles.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:51
|
|
|
Residency Evil posted:Ugh. Anyone have thoughts on this one? I'm thinking about bad decisions. My dog would probably prefer an m3 over a Mercedes wagon or GTI right? https://www.mbusa.com/mercedes/vehicles/model/class-E/model-E63S4S I mean if you're going to get a Mercedes Wagon at least get the right one. BMW are cowards for not doing a true M wagon in the USA.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:56
|
|
|
Popete posted:That's a lot of miles. Yeah I know, although it seems they've kept up on maintenance. Is $25k too much? H110Hawk posted:https://www.mbusa.com/mercedes/vehicles/model/class-E/model-E63S4S I mean if you're going to get a Mercedes Wagon at least get the right one. BMW are cowards for not doing a true M wagon in the USA. Once I actually have kids and need to carry poo pooand we pay off my wife's med school loans, definitely.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:58
|
|
|
Residency Evil posted:Once I actually have kids and need to carry poo poo, definitely. What have kids got to do with it? 
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:58
|
|
|
H110Hawk posted:What have kids got to do with it? I'm still grieving (my mistaken) sale of my Cayman. I'm not ready for a giant wagon yet.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2019 23:59
|
|
|
I'd buy it for $30k if that's the car you want. That's a pretty rare combo (E90 + manual) and that Melbourne Red is loving Excellent in person. In the entire time I've owned mine I've only ever seen one other E9x in that Melbourne Red and I chased him down to tell him it looked awesome. Like Somewhat Heroic said - it's rare I even see another E92, compared to the 50 Challenger/Mustangs per mile, and I live in LA where there's no shortage of good cars (saw a new NSX today and gave the guy a thumbs up which he returned.) There's definitely a cool "Hey man nice car" community when you do see another E9x owner out on the road, with waves etc. Lots of miles on that one but sounds like it's been well taken care of, and I've seen some pretty high mileage examples showing (250k+) on that forum nowadays anyhow. E: Just read the last post. Buy it at $28k now!!
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 00:01
|
|
|
Ether Frenzy posted:I'd buy it for $30k if that's the car you want. That's a pretty rare combo (E90 + manual) and that Melbourne Red is loving Excellent in person. In the entire time I've owned mine I've only ever seen one other E9x in that Melbourne Red and I chased him down to tell him it looked awesome. Like Somewhat Heroic said - it's rare I even see another E92, compared to the 50 Challenger/Mustangs per mile, and I live in LA where there's no shortage of good cars (saw a new NSX today and gave the guy a thumbs up which he returned.)  I'm looking for a fun DD, and I'm not going to get overly nostalgic over a color combo on an 8 year old mass produced sedan. I'm pretty open to pretty much any color but I'd prefer not black.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 00:04
|
|
|
Fair enough. Just figured if you'd been looking then manual + E90 is rare enough. The black is extremely underwhelming and both variants of them are the worst color this car comes in, it hides the angular lines and just looks meh. Imho.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 00:16
|
|
|
It's absolutely criminal how many e9x m3s are fuckin black. Horrible.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 01:12
|
|
|
BraveUlysses posted:It's absolutely criminal how many e9x m3s are fuckin black. Horrible. Phone posting so I won’t go into all the other things posted, but on the E90 in the North American market variants of black, white, and grey/silver made up for more than 85% of the cars delivered. Jet Black and Jerez Black over 50%, Jerez being the most common. Only about 220 Melbourne Red sold over the four year span. About 350 in Interlagos Blue like mine. Then when you factor in the ZCP (competition package) only was around for the final 2011 year (a little over 1200 sedans) your options get limited real quick. DCT to 6MT was almost perfectly split 50/50.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 02:38
|
|
|
I was looking at the new M5 and M5C this weekend and the residuals for leasing are horrible. On a 36 month lease the residuals are 55%, 54%, and 52% for 10k, 12k, and 15k miles respectively. I seem to recall F10 M5 having residuals ranging from 61% - 64% depending on milage. Anyway, I suppose the positive is that off lease M5s should be a great deal in a couple of years.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 03:21
|
|
|
BraveUlysses posted:It's absolutely criminal how many e9x m3s are fuckin black. Horrible.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 03:25
|
|
|
Mr. Apollo posted:I was looking at the new M5 and M5C this weekend and the residuals for leasing are horrible. On a 36 month lease the residuals are 55%, 54%, and 52% for 10k, 12k, and 15k miles respectively. The crash in 2008-2009 led to massive cuts to new car production, boosting used car values in the 2012-2016 range. This allowed manufacturers to raise residuals and offer very attractive lease terms. This flooded the market with new cars, and the market is correcting now causing residuals to drop. This will be a problem for brands that built a lot of business over the past decade on low payment leases, particularly domestic and low-cost Japanese brands. It also means the days of the $800/mo M3 are over.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 03:30
|
|
|
KOTEX GOD OF BLOOD posted:E92 looks best in jet black. Fight me. Coupes are gross hth
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 03:48
|
|
|
Jealous Cow posted:The crash in 2008-2009 led to massive cuts to new car production, boosting used car values in the 2012-2016 range. This allowed manufacturers to raise residuals and offer very attractive lease terms. This flooded the market with new cars, and the market is correcting now causing residuals to drop.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 03:54
|
|
|
BraveUlysses posted:Coupes are gross hth Ew, I looked at this post and I read it with my eyes!
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 03:54
|
|
|
KOTEX GOD OF BLOOD posted:E92 looks best in jet black. Fight me. citation needed
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 04:27
|
|
|
BMW hosed their lease program 2 years ago. No "free money" 7 security deposits etc anymore either. Based on the boards I follow, I think Penfed is picking up BMW's slack with their balloon payment plans, since they have very accurate residuals and gap insurance. You have to sell/trade in the car yourself after 3/4/5 years though, instead of turning it in. SUV's are not included.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 04:28
|
|
|
Residency Evil posted:https://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1519128
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 04:37
|
|
|
I don't know a huge amount about E90 M3s, is there any particular reason that 2011 is a more desirable year than a 2009 or 2010? Because I've run across single owner M3s that are a year or two older than that car with half the miles going for less than that guy is trying to get. I realize the color combination is unusual, but a $5k premium seems excessive.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 04:50
|
|
|
Keyser_Soze posted:BMW hosed their lease program 2 years ago. No "free money" 7 security deposits etc anymore either. The SUVs are still reasonably lease-able, but they’ve really pulled back incentives. They haven’t even had a pull ahead program for a long time now. The sales manager at my local dealer is doing some shady poo poo to get around BMW pulling back on the pull ahead funding. You order your car, it’s shipped to the dealer, and he puts it into the loaner fleet for 3-4 months, taking a $1500 markdown provided by BMW each month, which he takes off the price. They have a -ton- of cars in their loaner fleet because of this. I sort of expect him to get fired any day now. Paradoxish posted:I don't know a huge amount about E90 M3s, is there any particular reason that 2011 is a more desirable year than a 2009 or 2010? Because I've run across single owner M3s that are a year or two older than that car with half the miles going for less than that guy is trying to get. I realize the color combination is unusual, but a $5k premium seems excessive. Newer iDrive is a big one, and I think there was an LCI for 2011 so there would be some updated styling as well.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 04:54
|
|
|
GoGoGadgetChris posted:Nah. I am not surprised people have opinions. I compare it to the fuddy old men with their guns because they think there's no opinion - you're either right or a deranged fool huh, we must be on some kind of car forum then 
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 05:52
|
|
|
whoops i'm a dumbshit This 2008 128i I got is great. I saw the USB port and assumed "absolutely all of my contemporary iPhone expectations are satisfied" without testing." lol Is there some way to satisfy all my contemporary iPhone + auto expectations, or should I just get a replacement head unit?
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 05:58
|
|
|
EDIT: I used a EONON in my ZHP and loved it. I actually went through 3 versions, AMA.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 05:59
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 24, 2024 13:21 |
|
|
NumbersMatching320 posted:huh, we must be on some kind of car forum then I'm not sure if I'm not understanding you or you're not understanding me, but yes, we are in a car forum!
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 06:10
|
|