|
Lightning bolts and two minis: lightning bolts was so op that I thought I'd got bored of the game. Playing two minis and actually worrying about whether we'll be able to complete quests has made it fun again! I really think the lightning Bolts class had serious serious issues. If your whole shtick is "high risk, high reward" you can't also have things that let you entirely mitigate risk at no cost. It's not interesting. Playing as two minis has made the game exciting again! At one point it became apparent that my bear was going to wander across some lava, and it was brilliant.
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 23:51
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 10:07 |
|
|
Can you please explain why you think Lightning Bolts is OP? I'm playing it now and having a blast and while I agree that it's pretty powerful I would disagree that it's OP or game breaking. Maybe it's my current party composition (Music Note and Triforce)? Elephant Ambush fucked around with this message at 23:59 on Feb 4, 2019 |
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2019 23:57
|
|
|
Elephant Ambush posted:Can you please explain why you think Lightning Bolts is OP? I'm playing it now and having a blast and while I agree that it's pretty powerful I would disagree that it's OP or game breaking. Basically, you can do consistent high damage without effort, you can do next to guaranteed 15 or so damage (level dependant) to two enemies with two items, if ever theres a mission where that somehow isn't enough firepower you have two executes, you can jump 8 with an enhancement, and you're never close to dying. Since all the game really has is puzzles over how to get to certain places and how to kill certain things, you just get to repeatedly say "nah, I'm not puzzling anything, I just outright beat it with no recourse to me". Maybe it's because there are four of us, so enough players to pick up the slack if I messed up, but I would basically just go as ham as I could, no regard for my well-being, and basically end up soloing missions, without dying.
|
|
#
?
Feb 5, 2019 00:09
|
|
|
Lightning Bolts is our last box to open and i'm going to get it before tomorrow's game by sneakily doing my Triforce solo scenario first (retirement goal spoiler) as I need 5 gold more to retire so whatever the item does I can just sell it and bang, mua ha We have several people with the same class retirement goal racing for different routes to it which has been entertaining.
|
|
#
?
Feb 5, 2019 00:13
|
|
|
xiw posted:Lightning Bolts is our last box to open and i'm going to get it before tomorrow's game by sneakily doing my Triforce solo scenario first (retirement goal spoiler) as I need 5 gold more to retire so whatever the item does I can just sell it and bang, mua ha Its super mediocre, relying as it does on you moving 4+ squares in a round, on a class that has literally one 4+ move in its entire arsenal, without spending elements. God I hate Triforce.
|
|
#
?
Feb 5, 2019 00:15
|
|
|
!Klams posted:Basically, you can do consistent high damage without effort, you can do next to guaranteed 15 or so damage (level dependant) to two enemies with two items, if ever theres a mission where that somehow isn't enough firepower you have two executes, you can jump 8 with an enhancement, and you're never close to dying. Since all the game really has is puzzles over how to get to certain places and how to kill certain things, you just get to repeatedly say "nah, I'm not puzzling anything, I just outright beat it with no recourse to me". Maybe it's because there are four of us, so enough players to pick up the slack if I messed up, but I would basically just go as ham as I could, no regard for my well-being, and basically end up soloing missions, without dying. I see what you mean but my current party composition won't really allow me to do that. I keep pushing the boundaries every scenario though! It fits my playstyle very well. Edit: TTS goons! My wife stumbled across how to increase max HP on standees. Click on the middle of the HP bar until it says "Max" above the HP bar. Then click the right arrow until the correct max HP value is displayed. Then click the middle of the HP bar again. This owns! My wife owns! Elephant Ambush fucked around with this message at 05:56 on Feb 5, 2019 |
|
#
?
Feb 5, 2019 00:27
|
|
|
!Klams posted:Basically, you can do consistent high damage without effort, you can do next to guaranteed 15 or so damage (level dependant) to two enemies with two items, if ever theres a mission where that somehow isn't enough firepower you have two executes, you can jump 8 with an enhancement, and you're never close to dying. Since all the game really has is puzzles over how to get to certain places and how to kill certain things, you just get to repeatedly say "nah, I'm not puzzling anything, I just outright beat it with no recourse to me". Maybe it's because there are four of us, so enough players to pick up the slack if I messed up, but I would basically just go as ham as I could, no regard for my well-being, and basically end up soloing missions, without dying. I've only been playing it for three scenarios, but so far it's been a similar experience for me. Room full of enemies? Pop the +range helm, Shiny Distraction, and a power potion, Flurry of Axes, kill or injure most everything. One scenario I had a whopping 15 enemies in range. Small room with tough enemies? Facetank them easily with Defiance of Death, and then murder them all with Resolute Stand and your melee AoE item of choice. In-between you've got a bunch of solid high damage cards mixed with the utility of stuns and solid multi-target attacks. I've yet to pop the last use of DoD or lose a card to avoid damage, which makes the class all reward and no risk, which is nuts when the reward is doing more damage than any other class can hope to achieve. If this keeps up and we haven't just been doing scenarios that favor the class specifically, I'm gonna have to ask my party for ideas on how to nerf the class just to keep it sporting.
|
|
#
?
Feb 5, 2019 07:07
|
|
|
Zulily Zoetrope posted:I've only been playing it for three scenarios, but so far it's been a similar experience for me. Room full of enemies? Pop the +range helm, Shiny Distraction, and a power potion, Flurry of Axes, kill or injure most everything. One scenario I had a whopping 15 enemies in range. Small room with tough enemies? Facetank them easily with Defiance of Death, and then murder them all with Resolute Stand and your melee AoE item of choice. In-between you've got a bunch of solid high damage cards mixed with the utility of stuns and solid multi-target attacks. I've yet to pop the last use of DoD or lose a card to avoid damage, which makes the class all reward and no risk, which is nuts when the reward is doing more damage than any other class can hope to achieve. If this keeps up and we haven't just been doing scenarios that favor the class specifically, I'm gonna have to ask my party for ideas on how to nerf the class just to keep it sporting. Oh God, yeah, I completely forgot about flurry of axes. There's just no situation where you ever think "Hey guys, can any of you do anything about this?" ever. You're ALWAYS more than equipped to deal with it. I only actually had 2 full sessions with the Berserker, because my quest involved killing stuff, and, y'know. Yeah. Zero issue with that. So luckily it was basically the TURN that my group finally broke beyond just looking at me sideways and instead started asking 'can I see your cards? Can you REALLY do that?' that I achieved retirement. (It was a mission that involved navigating across traps to and then killing an insanely high toughness high shield enemy and I completed it on my ... second? Third? Turn, without flipping any cards or being in peril at any point. Well. Except the very final moment where technically I exhausted, but, y'know.) I think if you just make Flurry max 2 (mayyyyybe 3) instead of 4, make glass hammer and resolute stand both care about "half" your health (round up, adjust XP gain, maybe flat 3?), and likewise back from the brink only heal up to half. Finally make defiance of death next 3 damage, not next three fatal damage. I suspect that back from the brink is designed that way specifically so that it's not easy to hover at the crucial half health zone, but I think that whole mechanic is VASTLY overvalued, I basically never cared about trying to achieve it since the rest of the kit is so strong, and just sometimes incidentally had turn on. I think by putting the emphasis back on it, making it easier to get to and stay at, at the cost of the rest of the kit, it means you're more likely to spend time at low health where a single big hit can mean disaster, which means there's actually some decisions. It also means your huge hits are just huge and not 'WAY more than you ever need to kill anything'. At level 4, I feel like doing an attack 8 is already a pretty big deal, it doesn't really need to be an attack 15. Maybe this feels like overkill, because I appreciate this is a huge nerf, but I feel like by making it easier to get to exactly the sweet spot of health would make a bunch of the other cards shine a bit more, and that overall the class would feel more coherent. !Klams fucked around with this message at 13:28 on Feb 5, 2019 |
|
#
?
Feb 5, 2019 13:25
|
|
|
re: Lightning Bolts I never touched Flurry of Axes and still found the class ludicrously powerful. Blood Pact bottom plus Cauterize/Break the Chains/Fatal Fury or any other ways to multiattack is great. Everyone goes gaga over Flurry of Axes but I found Shiny Distraction to be such a hilariously strong pick that I never regretted it.
|
|
#
?
Feb 5, 2019 17:56
|
|
|
Trasson posted:re: Lightning Bolts Yes, but getting both is an option. Seeing Red is a decent card, especially if you're gonna pair it with Blood Pact for stupid damage, but I wouldn't pick it over either level 4 option.
|
|
#
?
Feb 5, 2019 18:16
|
|
|
All this Lightning class talk is just making me resent that after seeing someone else unlock and play the class at Prosperity 6 through to L9, I'm getting my crack at the class in the latest minicampaign and thus going from level 1 to (maybe) 4. A lot of classes feel very different starting at level 1 than at level 4 or level 6. It's an interesting part of the design.
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2019 01:14
|
|
|
Narsham posted:All this Lightning class talk is just making me resent that after seeing someone else unlock and play the class at Prosperity 6 through to L9, I'm getting my crack at the class in the latest minicampaign and thus going from level 1 to (maybe) 4. I like starting new TTS campaigns with all level 1 characters but none of the starting 6. You're right, some of the classes start out kinda eh until maybe level 3 or 4.
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2019 02:01
|
|
|
Elephant Ambush posted:I like starting new TTS campaigns with all level 1 characters but none of the starting 6. You're right, some of the classes start out kinda eh until maybe level 3 or 4.
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2019 02:04
|
|
|
dwarf74 posted:Triangles is particularly egregious, here. Haha yeah I'm probably never going to play that class. I dunno. Never say never. Maybe after I play everything else and get bored. Or maybe I will just hate myself one day and create an all element based party.
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2019 14:20
|
|
|
Our group just got our first campaign (for all of us) going; I was a little surprised by the difficulty of the first scenario, I guess because I was assuming "first mission == tutorial" - we were all low on cards by the time the last enemy dropped, but the tension was probably a much better introduction/hook to the game than an easier scenario ever would have been. Anyway, super dope, looking forward to keeping this going - fortunately we're all co-workers and can play weekly after work, so hoping we can make good progress through the campaign.
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2019 14:28
|
|
|
Crusader posted:Our group just got our first campaign (for all of us) going; I was a little surprised by the difficulty of the first scenario, I guess because I was assuming "first mission == tutorial" - we were all low on cards by the time the last enemy dropped, but the tension was probably a much better introduction/hook to the game than an easier scenario ever would have been. The first mission is a tutorial of all the mistakes you can make. The opening room, for example, is perfectly set up for characters to quickly, move up to the bandits and then get murdered by the bandit attacks, whereas if you move slowly to go after the bandits they wont have the movement to reach you. The second room has archers in the back and enemies up front to teach you the same lesson but in ranged form, and also has traps so you can learn why pushes and pulls cam be good. The third room (and trapped doorway) reached you about multiattacking enemies and why having jump cards are important.
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2019 14:36
|
|
|
Piell posted:The first mission is a tutorial of all the mistakes you can make. The opening room, for example, is perfectly set up for characters to quickly, move up to the bandits and then get murdered by the bandit attacks, whereas if you move slowly to go after the bandits they wont have the movement to reach you. Yeah this. It's an impressively well designed tutorial scenario that doesn't follow the convention of "tutorial = easy". I've played it dozens of times and it really never gets old. Especially shoving goons into traps. That's easily the most satisfying thing in that scenario.
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2019 14:44
|
|
|
Crusader posted:Our group just got our first campaign (for all of us) going; I was a little surprised by the difficulty of the first scenario, I guess because I was assuming "first mission == tutorial" - we were all low on cards by the time the last enemy dropped, but the tension was probably a much better introduction/hook to the game than an easier scenario ever would have been. She exhausted barely into the second room. It was a lesson, all right! And like all good lessons, we completely thrashed it on the second go-round. (There's some common advice to run the first scenario at Easy, on Level 0. I'd say this depends on your group's temperament more than anything. If you don't want your intro to a new game to be "oops, we died" then it's probably a good idea. Keep in mind, this is literally the weakest character you will ever play, right there in that first scenario. Level 1, basic gear - with bad choices if you followed the rulebook's advice, no choice on your action cards, base modifier deck with all the bad stuff in so it's weighted at +0...)
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2019 15:32
|
|
|
It's been shocking to us just how much easier scenarios are on the second time around. Not even just the avoiding mistakes based on what is in what room for door opening and stuff. The game just feels like iterating on a scenario lets you break it open in very satisfying ways.
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2019 15:45
|
|
|
Elephant Ambush posted:I like starting new TTS campaigns with all level 1 characters but none of the starting 6. You're right, some of the classes start out kinda eh until maybe level 3 or 4. I'm not saying it's "eh," just very different and much less flashy. Lightning spoilers: The "half health" cards are actually far more viable, as is the Attack = number of lost cards. In the right group--like the Gadgeteer/Diviner group I'm in--you could address shield at low level through the overheal/retaliate combo I'd otherwise never expect to see in play. Heck, overheal and "hp in damage" would be viable, too. Triforce at L1 is a very specific puzzle; you're no Spellweaver, but you can be OK. Your top priority is to push XP until you get to L4 or 5. You'll note that every "1" card in your deck can earn XP. Option 1: conditions ahoy. Use Shaping the Ether for all but one room (either play it later or dump it in the final room before dropping your big loss attacks), and trade damage for utility and conditions. You'll have a stun, an AoE wound and push, and two Attack 4/range 3 cards. This is viable but suboptimal for anything but getting XP. Option 2: help from a friend. You need another character willing to generate and let you use an element. The Cragheart is great for this, but a few other characters generate elements they don't care much about using. Cragheart's earth gives you the following combos: Range 3, 2 target stun; Attack 4 Range 4; and Attack 5 Range 3. Option 3: on your own. You rely on subpar attacks in the absence of other elements from friends or certain enemies. The tops of the four cards that take only one element aren't your sole option, though, as you can do a reasonable Move 5, 1 XP or even a clutch Attack 1, range 3 stun plus 1XP. Keep in mind that your cards are less powerful because of that XP and focus on generating it. You rely on loss cards to set you up for two big turns: for example, the bottom of Ice Spikes is Attack 5 range 3 immobilize 1 XP and sets up for next turn's Pure Augmentation Attack 5 range 3 1 XP play, but you have to have the cards to do that properly. At L1, two attack 5s is OK; your Attack 4 all enemies in range 2 then Attack 5 is sometimes great.
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2019 17:13
|
|
|
Elephant Ambush posted:I like starting new TTS campaigns with all level 1 characters but none of the starting 6. You're right, some of the classes start out kinda eh until maybe level 3 or 4. Likewise I started the first mini-campaign with Angry/Spikey Face who only gets 3 non-loss ranged attacks in his initial level 1 kit. I'm basically having to do tricks with stam potions and early rests to be able to continuously function as my class role. It will get better at 3 and beyond but it was definitely an adjustment starting with 12 cards and being drained of core options halfway through my first rest cycle.
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2019 17:28
|
|
|
Guy A. Person posted:Likewise I started the first mini-campaign with Angry/Spikey Face who only gets 3 non-loss ranged attacks in his initial level 1 kit. I'm basically having to do tricks with stam potions and early rests to be able to continuously function as my class role. It will get better at 3 and beyond but it was definitely an adjustment starting with 12 cards and being drained of core options halfway through my first rest cycle. I noticed the same thing. You really have to lean on rotating the right dooms and of course exploiting the Detonation + Frightening Curse combo. Those 2 cards were frequently my first turn.
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2019 17:36
|
|
|
I'm too lazy to quote myself but I'm the rando who's gonna play this with their parents and it's looking shockingly less scary and seems to work? I read the rulebook cover to cover twice and watched the RTFM video and got my girlfriend to watch it too. My parents have the actual game because gently caress traveling with that for 2 hours and it was my mom's idea, so my dad photocopied the back with the reference sheets, which ended up with him reading (some of) the rules too. I got the app loaded up and I think good to go. (Anything I should be worried about? It seems good.) Me and my girlfriend can kind of just DM the road card and poo poo, (we're customizing equipment ; we're not telling the olds that's a thing yet, they get the basics). My dad adorably already did the math out on the Spellweaver's refreshing. (He's a math prof) So we're going up Friday, I'm gonna set up the scenario in advance, then my mom comes home with Indian food and I'll explain the rules while we eat. Then we're gonna play and drink cocktails for several hours. As I predicted we're me as Brute, girlfriend as Scoundrel, dad as Spellweaver and mom as Tinkerer. So I think we're well balanced. And my laptop will be keeping track of elements and monsters and poo poo to help. Am I missing anything? This sounds like it's going to be the best thing ever or loving terrible, but I'm leaning positive.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2019 06:10
|
|
|
Xiahou Dun posted:Am I missing anything? This sounds like it's going to be the best thing ever or loving terrible, but I'm leaning positive. I think you'll be fine. The first game will be rough as you figure your poo poo out, but don't let that discourage you. Taking charge and controlling equipment for them for the beginning is actually a really good plan, I think that'll save a lot of time and explanations of how things work. One thing with the app is to figure out which initiative order method you prefer (I assume you're using Gloomhaven Helper?), and working with it a few times. I personally prefer setting it to Numpad, then when everyone has selected their card you just go in clockwise order asking what speed they chose.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2019 08:13
|
|
|
Yeah, that sounds like it should be fine! I'd definitely tell your dad at least that Stamina Potions are insanely good. Your mom probably won't need one, since the Tinkerer has 12 cards, but they're good for literally everyone else. You will probably want Boots of Striding before too long.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2019 08:54
|
|
|
Play the game a few times before using Helper, imo. It does a lot of stuff and it helps if you understand the flow of the physical game.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2019 13:55
|
|
|
Counterpoint: using monster decks is hugely cumbersome and annoying.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2019 18:26
|
|
|
Some Numbers posted:Counterpoint: using monster decks is hugely cumbersome and annoying.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2019 18:51
|
|
|
Some Numbers posted:Counterpoint: using monster decks is hugely cumbersome and annoying. Eh, it's fine if you have the broken token tuckboxes. I find the game plays a lot better with four people because you can distribute the admin out. Eveyrone has to know what they're doing though and chip in.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2019 18:59
|
|
|
Hieronymous Alloy posted:I find the game plays a lot better with four people because you can distribute the admin out. Eveyrone has to know what they're doing though and chip in. Truth. We have one player managing monster decks, one player tracking statuses, one player managing elements and placing monsters, and one player distracting the cats so they don't jump on the board
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2019 19:01
|
|
|
I'm the weirdo that really enjoys being the DM. I handle all the admin, no apps, and don't find it too bad other than sometimes forgetting to take off damage tokens after killing a monster. Trip report: wife and I just one-shot scenario 27 last night, and I'm still not sure how we did that.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2019 19:32
|
|
|
Kaza42 posted:Truth. We have one player managing monster decks, one player tracking statuses, one player managing elements and placing monsters, and one player distracting the cats so they don't jump on the board Yeah, we usually split monsters up evenly, with each person controlling both the status card and the action cards, I handle monster deck and a 4th monster if there's one, 5th plus just rotate to whoever else. The guy who played Spellweaver still controls the element board. I feel like I have a pretty good handle and the best attention span but even then having everyone knowledgable helps check math and make small corrections when necessary. Last night it happened a few times, having lots of people to go "wait, what? why did they get that much damage through shield?" helps a ton.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2019 19:48
|
|
|
Wait. I lied. I don't understand the OS of Gloomhaven Helper like at all. I got it confused with the thing I saw on a Shut Up and Sit Down video. I believe this is useful but what. I'm reading through the documentation and I'm totally lost. I have a god drat PhD for gently caress's sake. I can't even set the initiatives. I just want something to keep track of monsters and elements. Help? Edit : Or I could figure that out like 10 seconds later after loving around. Sorry. But still any help is cool and good.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2019 05:51
|
|
|
Played for the first time tonight; my wife was the cragheart and I was the mindthief. We beat it on our first go and only screwed up a couple times (missed a shield on an enemy for a turn or two and discarded a card instead of losing one for a short rest once). I was surprised how well we did since I read that people recommend playing the first scenario on "easy" due to the learning curve. We _did_ get to open the treasure chest and my internal reaction went something from excitement to disappointment to being super impressed. The idea that everyone gets to benefit from the first treasure chest being opened is a really cool idea for the intro scenario. Now everyone gets to be excited about the new thing instead of just one character. It was a really cool design choice.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2019 06:04
|
|
|
Slimy Hog posted:Played for the first time tonight; my wife was the cragheart and I was the mindthief. We beat it on our first go and only screwed up a couple times (missed a shield on an enemy for a turn or two and discarded a card instead of losing one for a short rest once). I was surprised how well we did since I read that people recommend playing the first scenario on "easy" due to the learning curve. I just realized the reason it was so easy was because we hosed up the monster movement out of last room.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2019 17:02
|
|
|
Slimy Hog posted:I just realized the reason it was so easy was because we hosed up the monster movement out of last room. Welcome... to Gloomhaven. I've been playing this game for about a year and we still make mistakes. That's just how it is.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2019 17:14
|
|
|
In the last three days i've spent probably 12 hours researching, reading the rules and watching videos, unboxing the game, driving a two hour round trip to get a broken token insert, assembling said kit and sorting everything- i've got like 12 hours invested in GH without having played a single second of it  gonna fix that tonight, though!
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2019 18:12
|
|
|
boar guy posted:In the last three days i've spent probably 12 hours researching, reading the rules and watching videos, unboxing the game, driving a two hour round trip to get a broken token insert, assembling said kit and sorting everything- i've got like 12 hours invested in GH without having played a single second of it Im in a similar boat. A friend of mine mentioned he wanted to play a dungeon crawler and everybody raves about Gloomhaven. Since said friend is a 2 hour drive away I've spent so much time reading, organizing and painting and have yet to play. Here's the starting 6 painted up:  We'll be starting with a 3 person party then adding a 4th down the line. So far it looks like Mindthief and Cragheart are gonna be picked. Any of the remaining choices a bad pick to go along with those?
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2019 21:20
|
|
|
god drat, those look great man
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2019 21:54
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 10:07 |
|
|
Yeah wow nice paint jobs!
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2019 22:05
|
|