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Jobbo_Fett posted:Pretty sure there would have been some forewarning. Which particular massacre of Italian by Germans are you talking about? Probabaly talking about the Cephalonia Massacre, where, after Italian troops on Cephelonia resisted the First Mountain Division's attempt to disarm them, most of the Italians taken prisoner were executed.
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Feb 19, 2019 21:12
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zoux posted:Befehl Sechsundsechzig... Mussolini was deposed so Hitler triex to have him reinstated. As for German/Italian aggression.... therr were a few orders to disarm Italian troops stationed throughout Axis controlled territory. Refusal to continue fighting the allies meant they had to surrender. On some occasions the Germans prefer corpses over PoWs.
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Feb 19, 2019 21:15
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Didn't know any other thread to post this in off the top of my head. Anyway, loving nazis. 
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Feb 19, 2019 21:17
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Jobbo_Fett posted:Pretty sure there would have been some forewarning. Which particular massacre of Italian by Germans are you talking about? I was thinking of The Massacre of Kefalonia. Turns out my memories were a bit faulty, though: The Italian soldiers in question had surrendered to the Germans, they weren't allies sitting next to each other. The German 1st Alpin Division slaughtered about 5200 soldiers of the Italian division "Acqui". Edit: Also, the entire story was a lot more complicated then I remembered: There were violent clashes during the negotiations for the surrender, and after the Italian division surrendered, the Italian General Gandin asked his troops if they wanted to fight the Germans. They wanted to, as it turns out. So General Gandin send a rather confusing message back to the German Oberstleutnant Barge, in which Gandin told his German counterpart that his division didn't agree with the surrender, but promised not to fight the Germans. They also promised to give up their heavy weapons, but wanted to stay at their posts. The German answer was to assault the Italian positions with Stukas, followed by landings of reinforcements and overrunning the Italians. Meanwhile, Oberstleutnant Barge got the boot by General Hubert Lanz, commander of the German reinforcements. During the fighting, about 1300 Italians and 40 Germans became casualties. Afterwards, the OKW ordered to reward the traitorous Italian behavior (that was a literal quote from the OKW) with bullets. The German forces then started massacring the surrendering Italians everywhere on Kefalonia. Including officers. Even General Gandin was murdered.
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Feb 19, 2019 21:19
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Randarkman posted:Didn't know any other thread to post this in off the top of my head. What are we looking at here? Some WWII game?
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Feb 19, 2019 21:20
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In general the Germans were particularly ruthless and brutal towards Italy after they surrendered in 1943. Don't think they got quite that barbaric anywhere else on the Western Front. Epicurius posted:What are we looking at here? Some WWII game? Yes. Company of Heroes 2. It's more the name of one of the German players, loving Christ.
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Feb 19, 2019 21:22
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Epicurius posted:What are we looking at here? Some WWII game? Looks like the load screen for the Battle of Berlin, 1945 (colorized)
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Feb 19, 2019 21:22
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I suspect it has more to do with the Italian government declaring war on Germany than Mussolini himself.
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Feb 19, 2019 21:22
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 Sounds like they need a better military history program as Gettysburg University (this guy was a trustee)
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Feb 19, 2019 21:45
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I read that as "I was 20 years old and too busy partying to give any thought to whether someone might think this was in bad taste." It's good to shame people who did this stuff, to a degree, if only to send the message to today's college kids that blackface, Nazi uniforms, and Confederate gear are not acceptable. On the other hand, I think the people who did this stuff way back when deserve the opportunity to say, "Hey, I was young and dumb, but I can point to concrete things I have done as an adult that show that I am not some jackass bigot, so I have no intention of quitting my job."
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Feb 19, 2019 22:01
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I don't want to get into all that I just thought it was funny that a guy who went to Gettysburg College was claiming ignorance about milhist related matters. Here's the pic, did only SS guys wear the Nazi armband or did all Wehrmacht guys wear one from time to time. Looking up Hogan's Heroes the only character that ever seems to be wearing one is a recurring Gestapo colonel. Looking into it even more, seems like the dudes who played Klink and Schultz emphatically believed that their characters were not Nazis but rather reflected Good Germans  Which, yeah we know isn't true now but I'll cut the Jewish guy who lost family in the Holocaust some slack zoux fucked around with this message at 22:12 on Feb 19, 2019 |
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Feb 19, 2019 22:03
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I mean asking about the authenticity of specific aspects of those uniforms is about like inquiring if the fifteen missiles and  laser i drew on the f16/a10 hybrid in my 4th grade trapper keeper is an authorized NATO loadout.
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Feb 19, 2019 22:15
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Cyrano4747 posted:I mean asking about the authenticity of specific aspects of those uniforms is about like inquiring if the fifteen missiles and Honestly I would have gotten an A in robot drawing
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Feb 19, 2019 22:18
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Cyrano4747 posted:I mean asking about the authenticity of specific aspects of those uniforms is about like inquiring if the fifteen missiles and I would like to award you this DARPA fellowship e: JESUS CHRIST https://twitter.com/zoeschlanger/status/1097910888663793665
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Feb 19, 2019 22:19
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Hey, I did a few public-battle reenactment events in the early 2000s where I wore Soviet and / or German uniforms, so no political/entertainment career for me. No, at no point did I wear a Nazi armband, but I did wear a "naughty German helmet."
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Feb 19, 2019 22:32
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Cessna posted:Hey, I did a few public-battle reenactment events in the early 2000s where I wore Soviet and / or German uniforms, so no political/entertainment career for me. The dickelhaube
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Feb 19, 2019 22:33
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zoux posted:Here's the pic, did only SS guys wear the Nazi armband or did all Wehrmacht guys wear one from time to time. Wehrmacht pretty much never wore arm bands. They did have swastikas on their uniform - there's one on their belt buckle, there's one on the eagle on their chest, and there are others on awards and such. SS - well, Waffen SS (the military arm of the SS) wore pretty much the same uniform as the Wehrmacht with a few differences. The cut of the uniform was often slightly different, the insignia was different, and they often wore distinctive camouflage smocks and helmet covers with a different camouflage pattern/colors from the ones the Wehrmacht wore. Allgemaine SS - broadly speaking the party hacks who made sure the trains went to the camps on time - wore armbands on their pre-war black uniforms. Early in the war they switched to uniforms that looked more like regular army uniforms and stopped wearing armbands.
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Feb 19, 2019 22:38
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HEY GUNS posted:they look a little disreputable to people not used to the light cav lifestyle, racism. They end up getting blamed for things in a lot of atrocity accounts and I never know how true any of it is because of the racism Interesting, thanks. Does this also lead to them getting lower pay? Also, are there any other interesting stereotypes?
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Feb 19, 2019 22:44
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Elyv posted:Interesting, thanks. Does this also lead to them getting lower pay? Also, are there any other interesting stereotypes? Stereotypes: Germans can endure harsh conditions, Italians get deserty when the weather gets cold, Bavarians get deserty if you leave Bavaria, the Corsicans are too vicious to make good soldiers, the French are savage on the attack but can easily be baited into doing something rash (the "furia franceze"). My favorite stereotype is that the Welsh are especially dexterous so if you need someone to weave branches for a gabion you should try to find one. I mean, it's racist, but it's so far removed from our context that it's just old-timey and not...you know, mean. HEY GUNS fucked around with this message at 22:53 on Feb 19, 2019 |
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Feb 19, 2019 22:50
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Cessna posted:Hey, I did a few public-battle reenactment events in the early 2000s where I wore Soviet and / or German uniforms, so no political/entertainment career for me. Your future depends on this dweeb. If he survives then so will you.  You should visit Auschwitz though
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Feb 19, 2019 23:10
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HEY GUNS posted:I don't know. The people called "Imperial Croats" (I don't think they were all Serbo-croatian people, I think this means everyone who came from the southeast of Europe and worked for the Empire) were recruited differently because of something having to do with their social structures, and I don't know much about that. Please do list all stereotypes and sub stereotypes you have come across, there must be a load of them just about the 5 billion shades of Germans that were present. Stuff like Saxons can't hit the side of a barn with their guns etc.
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Feb 19, 2019 23:15
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HEY GUNS posted:yes! in forests or mountainous ground, before the main advance, or when fighting in cities. were they specialized troops? or like handpicked guys from the ranks of I assume the musketeers? pikes seem anathema to open order, how did that poo poo work?
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Feb 19, 2019 23:23
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HEY GUNS posted:the Corsicans are too vicious to make good soldiers, the French are savage on the attack but can easily be baited into doing something rash (the "furia franceze"). Napoleon would have confused the hell out of them.
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Feb 19, 2019 23:23
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HEY GUNS posted:French are savage on the attack but can easily be baited into doing something rash (the "furia franceze"). “Elan” is the preferred nomenclature Or cran, I get the two confused
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Feb 19, 2019 23:27
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I like to think Cran is the eleven volume dial for Elan.
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Feb 20, 2019 00:28
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HEY GUNS posted:I don't know. The people called "Imperial Croats" (I don't think they were all Serbo-croatian people, I think this means everyone who came from the southeast of Europe and worked for the Empire) were recruited differently because of something having to do with their social structures, and I don't know much about that. So is weaving a basket while making suggestive eyebrows at the camp followers the 16th century welsh version of tying a cherry stem into a knot with your tongue?
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Feb 20, 2019 00:31
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Furia Franceze, by Estée Lauder.
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Feb 20, 2019 01:00
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I guess that finally explains how the live animal exhibit became the taxidermy exhibit one night.
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Feb 20, 2019 01:03
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it's just biology, Welsh fingers obviously have an extra gabion-weaving muscle. you're all the real racists
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Feb 20, 2019 01:12
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Zudgemud posted:Please do list all stereotypes and sub stereotypes you have come across, there must be a load of them just about the 5 billion shades of Germans that were present. Stuff like Saxons can't hit the side of a barn with their guns etc. I know that since at least Frederick the Great's wars the usual line was that saxons weren't very good at war, but this one is true KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:were they specialized troops? or like handpicked guys from the ranks of I assume the musketeers? pikes seem anathema to open order, how did that poo poo work?
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Feb 20, 2019 01:23
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for some reason the discussion of racisms and that mention of anti balkan poo poo reminded me of reading King Umberto II's wiki, where the people who hated how much awesome gay sex he had seemed to blame it on his mom being from the Balkans. they didn't even say which part not only was he a 'balkan playboy', he was also 'oriental' in his decadence because I guess Asia begins at the Adriatic also I ran into italo balbo, apparently everyone's favorite fascist. in 1933 he led a world tour of Italian aviators and became an American celebrity. he got on the cover of Time and had a street in Chicago named after him that they still can't get people to rename, presumably because nobody remembers him. when the war started he was basically immediately shot down in a transport plane by Italian AA lol
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Feb 20, 2019 02:09
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oystertoadfish posted:for some reason the discussion of racisms and that mention of anti balkan poo poo reminded me of reading King Umberto II's wiki, where the people who hated how much awesome gay sex he had seemed to blame it on his mom being from the Balkans. they didn't even say which part IIRC "oriental sexual decadence" is coded very gay in old timey racism.
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Feb 20, 2019 02:13
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Cyrano4747 posted:IIRC "oriental sexual decadence" is coded very gay in old timey racism. racisms of the past
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Feb 20, 2019 02:18
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HEY GUNS posted:racisms of the [s]past[/] present In my experience the stereotype has mutated to the present as "hypersexual dragon ladies/demure waifus (depends on the individual)" than code for being gay, I hear it a lot from people who are excited to deploy to Japan for gross reasons.
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Feb 20, 2019 02:28
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oystertoadfish posted:it's just biology, Welsh fingers obviously have an extra gabion-weaving muscle. you're all the real racists Es ist ein Kompliment!
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Feb 20, 2019 02:50
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oystertoadfish posted:for some reason the discussion of racisms and that mention of anti balkan poo poo reminded me of reading King Umberto II's wiki, where the people who hated how much awesome gay sex he had seemed to blame it on his mom being from the Balkans. they didn't even say which part Montenegro. She was the daughter of the last King of independent Montenegro.
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Feb 20, 2019 03:10
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Cessna posted:Hey, I did a few public-battle reenactment events in the early 2000s where I wore Soviet and / or German uniforms, so no political/entertainment career for me. As I've said about video games before (mostly WW2OL), somebody has to play the bad guys. In the taking your turn sense, not the "fanatically collects memorabilia" sense.
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Feb 20, 2019 05:58
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thanks! apparently the royal family of montenegro has had a crazy last 300 years. it was a theocracy where uncle handed the throne down to nephew from 1696 to 1852, when one of em got married. they married well but got swallowed by yugoslavia in 1918. now they all live in france, apparently Petrović-Njegoš dynasty (wiki) in general, the post-relevance nobility occupy a lot of wikipedia space. they almost never actually do anything but there usually seems to be a shitload of money in their lives like i guess umberto's son is still around and was an arms dealer and arrested for but acquitted of something involving prostitution https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vittorio_Emanuele,_Prince_of_Naples naturally there's a guy who disputes his claim to the kingdom of italy, and apparently he's the son of a croatian fascist puppet king from ww2??? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Amedeo,_Duke_of_Aosta_(b._1943) oh his dad was a house of savoy member who bizarrely got designated Tomislav II from 1941 to 1943 to legitimize the ustase (i had never heard of that) but never went there, luckily for him https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Aimone,_Duke_of_Aosta quote:Ciano's diary noted a conversation between Aimone and himself, where Aimone was "proud of having been chosen King of Croatia, but has no exact idea of what he is supposed to do and is vaguely uneasy about it" i never actually said that umberto ii was the last king of italy, btw. his dad was a fascist collaborator so he stepped down to try to help win a referendum on the monarchy but the monarchy was abolished anyway. they even banned it's interesting how the north voted very republican and the south voted very monarchist, which both lines up with the cultural divisions in the country afaik. someone mentioned it in the context of the german occupation of italy, either here or in LP, and attributed the north/south division to the german occupation - i bet they're both true. maybe if the occupation hadn't happened they'd still have a king like most of the rest of em https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1946_Italian_institutional_referendum oystertoadfish fucked around with this message at 06:17 on Feb 20, 2019 |
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Feb 20, 2019 06:04
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mllaneza posted:As I've said about video games before (mostly WW2OL), somebody has to play the bad guys. In the taking your turn sense, not the "fanatically collects memorabilia" sense. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mq8RnAfCFwk
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Feb 20, 2019 07:00
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mllaneza posted:As I've said about video games before (mostly WW2OL), somebody has to play the bad guys. In the taking your turn sense, not the "fanatically collects memorabilia" sense. With videogames you could probably program things so that in a multiplayer game each player plays the Allies and then the enemy is rendered as the Axis. Of course, that's if you don't wanna make asymmetrical mechanics for the sides, and these days the big thing in multiplayer shooters is character customization anyways.
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Feb 20, 2019 07:33
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