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Ruptly's russian state, what are VPI TV's affiliations? vvvv tyvm! Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 19:00 on Feb 23, 2019 |
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Feb 23, 2019 18:57
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RaySmuckles posted:what kind of line of poo poo argument is this? Yeah, you didn't read or understand my point either. I'm not arguing whether or not US intervention is justified. I am questioning if the results might be different because fairly recently Venezuela was a good democratic country. Something that all the other countries you listed are not.
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Feb 23, 2019 18:58
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Thanks for your concern, I'm still alive and things remain calm where I live, tho the frontier with Colombia is only two hours away.  People are gathered at the Plaza in front of the church in support of Guaidó. I'm worried about the other goon still in Venezuela, but can't remember his username. Also, I'm a woman.
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Feb 23, 2019 18:59
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VPI is pro-opposition. I think it's run out of Miami. VPI has a journalist narrating, but the Ruptly feed is just a camera crew on the bridge. EDIT: Maduro dancing salsa with Cilia Flores right now on television is  https://twitter.com/AnaVHerrero/status/1099368860535480326 Chuck Boone fucked around with this message at 19:04 on Feb 23, 2019 |
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Feb 23, 2019 18:59
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brugroffil posted:Good Lord Is it really a hot take to say living in a dictatorship was a bad time?
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Feb 23, 2019 19:02
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zapplez posted:Yeah, you didn't read or understand my point either. I'm not arguing whether or not US intervention is justified. I am questioning if the results might be different because fairly recently Venezuela was a good democratic country. Something that all the other countries you listed are not. It's a good democratic country right now
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Feb 23, 2019 19:04
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zapplez posted:Is it really a hot take to say living in a dictatorship was a bad time? Libya sucks a lot now. That said Maduro has squandered a peaceful end.
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Feb 23, 2019 19:06
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zapplez posted:Is it really a hot take to say living in a dictatorship was a bad time? I sure ain't having fun right now.
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Feb 23, 2019 19:06
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Blue Nation posted:I sure ain't having fun right now. Stay safe out there. I'm sure you've already heard about the shootings the other night. Be careful
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Feb 23, 2019 19:13
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zapplez posted:Is it really a hot take to say living in a dictatorship was a bad time? Libyans once had free healthcare, free childcare, free education, free income when unemployed, and were one of the richest and most egalitarian nations in Africa. Now they have slave markets
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Feb 23, 2019 19:15
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CCTV footage of National Bolviarian Police officers firing tear gas at the leading truck of the convoy that tried to cross the bridge into Colombia. I think that this is the Urena bridge, though: https://twitter.com/kejalvyas/status/1099371156640055298
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Feb 23, 2019 19:16
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Reality Winter posted:It's a good democratic country right now Nah. The ongoing food crisis and denial of humanitarian aid alone shows it's failing.
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Feb 23, 2019 19:16
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Algund Eenboom posted:Libyans once had free healthcare, free childcare, free education, free income when unemployed, and were one of the richest and most egalitarian nations in Africa. Now they have slave markets This isn't Libya, goodbye.
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Feb 23, 2019 19:21
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Maduro has just ordered Venezuelan air space closed to commercial flights. I'm not sure if he gave a timeline or reason: https://twitter.com/ElNacionalWeb/status/1099368138637012992
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Feb 23, 2019 19:23
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Chuck Boone posted:Maduro has just ordered Venezuelan air space closed to commercial flights. I'm not sure if he gave a timeline or reason: Will this block outgoing privately chartered flights?
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Feb 23, 2019 19:24
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ChaseSP posted:Nah. The ongoing food crisis and denial of humanitarian aid alone shows it's failing. "...because of the ~$30 billion of US sanctions" is the 2nd half of this sentence, right? do we just act like those aren't a thing or that their purpose isn't precisely to make people make stupid comments like yours? the whole point is to starve the country and foment a civil uprising. how can you judge the quality of government when they're being crippled by punitive sanctions?
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Feb 23, 2019 19:25
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https://twitter.com/sandiegovial/status/1099373847948742657 Looks like they took one armored car. I would guess they have pushed the police out of one of their roadblocks in the town.
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Feb 23, 2019 19:25
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Discendo Vox posted:Will this block outgoing privately chartered flights? I missed the declaration so I don't know if he gave any details. El Nacional cites a source saying that only government airplanes are allowed to fly.
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Feb 23, 2019 19:26
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zapplez posted:Yeah, you didn't read or understand my point either. I'm not arguing whether or not US intervention is justified. I am questioning if the results might be different because fairly recently Venezuela was a good democratic country. Something that all the other countries you listed are not. Chile was a democratic country until the US intervened. Should I start listing more examples?
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Feb 23, 2019 19:26
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RaySmuckles posted:"...because of the ~$30 billion of US sanctions" is the 2nd half of this sentence, right? The sanctions are on private accounts, the food crisis is from a collapse of agriculture due to it being impossible to grow food at a profit due to price ceilings and mass inflation Screaming at others about being idiots won't change the facts.
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Feb 23, 2019 19:27
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Algund Eenboom posted:Libyans once had free healthcare, free childcare, free education, free income when unemployed, and were one of the richest and most egalitarian nations in Africa. Now they have slave markets I have no idea where you are getting your history but Libya was not great. Holy poo poo they had public hangings on the regular. Homosexuality was illegal and punishable by up to five years in jail. Their healthcare system was not good since the 80s. And so what if the rulers were rich? Its easy with oil. The country is terrible now too. But still , my point was its possible for the results in Venezuela to be different than Iraq/Libya. It's not guaranteed Venezuela will be worse when Maduro is shuffled out.
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Feb 23, 2019 19:28
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Bob le Moche posted:Do you disagree with my statement? Do you think the US would send aid to Venezuela purely out of humanitarian concern if it wasn't a part of its regime-change plans? Why are you changing subjects? Starving child don’t eat that food because it was sent with dubious intent!
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Feb 23, 2019 19:31
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Stop playing to their advantage by arguing the virtue of a American armed intervention. It can easily be refuted by the state of the current us government and appointment of lovely figures like Abrams shows the admin is at best completely incompetent and malicious at worst should the US actually intervene with armed forces.
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Feb 23, 2019 19:31
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steinrokkan posted:Chile was a democratic country until the US intervened. Should I start listing more examples? Is Chile not democratic today? How is Chile doing compared to the rest of South America? But holy gently caress I am done arguing the same point over and over again. I am hopeful Venezuela will recover better than other US blunders. Thats it. I hope the citizens do well and the ruling class gets out of power. The end. Choosing US intervention, or sanctions, or assassination, or revolution, might be a better choice than the country continuing to starve. But that choice is not up to us anyways.
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Feb 23, 2019 19:34
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Today of all days can we quit with the loving America thread bullshit?Chuck Boone posted:I missed the declaration so I don't know if he gave any details. El Nacional cites a source saying that only government airplanes are allowed to fly. This may be an attempt to prevent high-level defections, then.
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Feb 23, 2019 19:36
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ChaseSP posted:The sanctions are on private accounts, the food crisis is from a collapse of agriculture due to it being impossible to grow food at a profit due to price ceilings and mass inflation Screaming at others about being idiots won't change the facts. the new sanctions, while nominally on private accounts, are likely to be pretty crippling (due to the criteria being super sweeping) that said, claiming they retroactively caused the food crisis is still very stupid, just as it was the last fifteen times at least caps lock broken, prior to the Guaido declaration causing people to remember Venezuela existed, made a valiant effort at claiming food shortages were due to Polar and other agricultural corporations conspiring with each other and the US to fabricate a famine and overthrow socialism
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Feb 23, 2019 19:38
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GreyjoyBastard posted:the new sanctions, while nominally on private accounts, are likely to be pretty crippling (due to the criteria being super sweeping) Yeah, you're right on the recent sanctions being too wide sweeping and being a mistake but it isn't as if they said explicitly the new sanctions. Also the food issues predate the recent sanctions so regardless it's not as if they were speaking purely of them if they actually knew what was going on in Venezuela.
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Feb 23, 2019 19:42
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RaySmuckles posted:"...because of the ~$30 billion of US sanctions" is the 2nd half of this sentence, right? Ca. you tell me when and which sanctions directly affecy food import Also if you pull up recent sanctions can you explain the 3 years before those sanctions were even thought of. It must be hard acting like a nazi sympathiser WAR CRIME GIGOLO fucked around with this message at 19:58 on Feb 23, 2019 |
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Feb 23, 2019 19:55
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Looks like the convoy was enough to push the police to deadly force. https://twitter.com/soldadoDfranela/status/1099372037708148744 https://twitter.com/cristiancrespoj/status/1099378949841473537 https://twitter.com/VeneNoticias_/status/1099379326712274945 https://twitter.com/JohanLozada26/status/1099379301739315200 Oh and it seems the aid on the bridge is now burning. https://twitter.com/LaTuristaKAM/status/1099383147991568386 RaffyTaffy fucked around with this message at 20:03 on Feb 23, 2019 |
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Feb 23, 2019 19:59
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Far cry from capitulation, but it is something at least: https://twitter.com/ReutersVzla/status/1099380352395681793
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Feb 23, 2019 19:59
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Private Witt posted:Far cry from capitulation, but it is something at least: shooting your own people tends to start that. if they keep it up parts of the military might defect too.
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Feb 23, 2019 20:02
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Algund Eenboom posted:Libyans once had free healthcare, free childcare, free education, free income when unemployed, and were one of the richest and most egalitarian nations in Africa. Now they have slave markets
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Feb 23, 2019 20:06
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Jose Andres (the chef)'s group is part of a convoy trying to deliver food, and apparently has a drone. Maduro's thugs set the aid trucks on fire. https://twitter.com/WCKitchen/status/1099383797731201024
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Feb 23, 2019 20:09
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https://www.pscp.tv/w/1ZkJzkAyvbexv?t=6m5s Was a short stream of people moving items off the burning truck RaffyTaffy fucked around with this message at 20:16 on Feb 23, 2019 |
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Feb 23, 2019 20:10
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:Ca. you tell me when and which sanctions directly affecy food import lmao, get off you high horse the only nazis in this scenario are the americans and its painfully obvious they're about to invade and bomb venezuela after a failed coup that they themselves orchestrated here are a couple of good, informative podcasts over the last 2 weeks that i think have done a good job explaining the situation, certainly helped contextualized the situation for me, hosted by a dude who has been consistent for over 10 years with a wide array of guests including former un rapporteur Alfred de Zayas who just finished reporting to the un how damaging the sanctions have been in late 2018. these links also have the transcripts so you can read them instead of just listen here's a quote: quote:In the report (to the UN), Zayas writes, “The effects of sanctions imposed by Presidents Obama and Trump and unilateral measures by Canada and the European Union have directly and indirectly aggravated the shortages in medicines such as insulin and anti-retroviral drugs.” He charged that the sanctions contributed to many deaths and that the sanctions contravene the human rights obligations of the countries imposing them. He added that “sanctions can amount to crimes against humanity” and he recommended that the International Criminal Court open an investigation into the nations imposing the sanctions. De Zayas also wrote a piece for The Independent newspaper in London where he compared the drumbeat for regime change in oil-rich Venezuela to the 2003 invasion of Iraq and the 2011 overthrow of Muammar Gaddafi in Libya. https://theintercept.com/2019/02/13/neoliberalism-or-death-the-u-s-economic-war-against-venezuela/ https://theintercept.com/2019/02/20/regime-change-we-can-believe-in-the-u-s-agenda-in-venezuela-haiti-and-egypt/
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Feb 23, 2019 20:11
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Alfredo Romero from the Foro Penal Venezolano is reporting that four people were killed by pro-regime militias in Santa Elena de Uairen in Bolivar state, and 18 others were injured https://twitter.com/alfredoromero/status/1099377069409079301 Chuck Boone fucked around with this message at 20:17 on Feb 23, 2019 |
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Feb 23, 2019 20:12
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Extends "I have decided to break all political and diplomatic relations with the fascist government of Colombia and all its ambassadors and consuls must leave in 24 hours of Venezuela," said Maduro, before a massive demonstration in Caracas https://twitter.com/AFPespanol/status/1099387278688960512
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Feb 23, 2019 20:19
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I’ve gotta do a deep dive effortpost on UN politics and structuration sometime. I’m surprised it’s taken this long to cycle back around to de Zayas.
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Feb 23, 2019 20:19
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Watch Maduro start a loving war
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Feb 23, 2019 20:21
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RaffyTaffy posted:Extends "I have decided to break all political and diplomatic relations with the fascist government of Colombia and all its ambassadors and consuls must leave in 24 hours of Venezuela," said Maduro, before a massive demonstration in Caracas hasn't he done that before, like a couple years ago?
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Feb 23, 2019 20:22
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