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Oh dear me posted:But they were trying to do the right thing when they hurt people, and had realized it was wrong and stopped when you side with them. All of which is true of Cole himself! I don't think Cole is perhaps at that level of analysis and introspection yet.
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Feb 25, 2019 23:48
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Cole was so bad and his magnetic poetry dialogue was insufferable. I prefer Sera to Cole, at least she has some good banter with Blackwall.
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Feb 25, 2019 23:52
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Sera sucks, she's worse than Anders and Fenris combined, like if you combined them into some abominable companion called Fenders.
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Feb 26, 2019 00:55
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Do people generally prefer dialog wheels to branching dialog trees? Like, I generally think revanchist views of game design, but this is a modernization of which I don't really understand the point. One of the things I like about RPGs is having lots of dialog options keyed off lots of variables, and the dialog wheel really seems to constrict that.
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Feb 26, 2019 01:58
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Modern AAA games do carry the expectation that dialogue is fully voice acted, and it takes an excessive amount of time for the player read through several entire lines, pick one, then have to wait as their character delivers the exact same line. With the Mass Effect-style "mood" dialogue wheel the player still has some reason to hear the line because they don't know the exact delivery ahead of time. I can't think of any games where the protagonist is unvoiced but there's still a dialogue wheel.
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Feb 26, 2019 02:08
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My only real issue with the dialog wheel is it sometimes lies. That's why I quicksave before every conversation.
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Feb 26, 2019 02:16
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prometheusbound2 posted:Do people generally prefer dialog wheels to branching dialog trees? Like, I generally think revanchist views of game design, but this is a modernization of which I don't really understand the point. One of the things I like about RPGs is having lots of dialog options keyed off lots of variables, and the dialog wheel really seems to constrict that. This is one of the things I really liked about PoE. It seemed like there were more dialog options rather than with the wheel. PureRok posted:My only real issue with the dialog wheel is it sometimes lies. That's why I quicksave before every conversation. Also this. It gives a short synopsis that can be super misleading.
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Feb 26, 2019 02:47
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PureRok posted:My only real issue with the dialog wheel is it sometimes lies. That's why I quicksave before every conversation. I can't remember the specifics, but I feel like it tricked me into making a decision toward the end of Blackwall's questline that I would not have made if I had known the full consequences of it. I think it was something like the dialogue option said "I'll be watching you" which I interpreted as "you can hang out but I'll be keeping an eye out" but which came out as "you are now my prisoner and you cannot so much as take a piss without my permission" and it made him hate me forever Or something else, I don't remember the specifics, just a vague sense of "I didn't mean to do that!"
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Feb 26, 2019 02:52
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The Witcher 3 doesn't present its dialog as a wheel, but its functionally similar. There are limited choices that only pop up when you have a choice, or to ask questions. But I think the Witcher 3 handles it a lot better. First, Gerald is more of a defined character than Hawke/Shepard/the Inquisitor. So there's less of a role in defining his personality. Second, the dialog options usually pop up when there's an actual choice. Bioware games do 3 preset tones, which is kind of boring. I guess Hawke was the most defined Bioware protaganist (haven't played Andromeda) but my favorite part of Inquisition was having him killed.
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Feb 26, 2019 03:28
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prometheusbound2 posted:I guess Hawke was the most defined Bioware protaganist (haven't played Andromeda) but my favorite part of Inquisition was having him killed. Andromeda's protagonist was an intensely North American youth. The wheel gave you 4 choices of style: professional, logical, emotional, and cheesy, or something like that. Which was incredibly dull.
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Feb 26, 2019 09:06
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Human Revolution really nailed it. Brief summary of the line, but if you wanted to know exactly what Jensen was going to say you just had to hover over the option for a bit and it would turn into the full line!
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Feb 26, 2019 09:54
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Thanks for telling me to stick with it until the mage quest. Feels almost like old DAO. I hosed up a dropped Cassandra for Blackwall because he's cool, but I specced him two hand. Having a hell of a time in Alexius's pad with no real tank. (edit) Oh wow. Lelianna is still the best isn't she. The Dregs fucked around with this message at 16:19 on Feb 26, 2019 |
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Feb 26, 2019 15:57
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Having played the Mass effect trilogy again recently - a game where I almost never choose anything other than top choice or bottom choice - I really think two choices, essentially yes or no, are all you need most of the time, and much of what your character says could be decided for you by character decisions you make in the beginning. "My character is not religious" could spare you from making surprise pious remarks about heaven after a death. "My character most values kindness/wit/respect", gives you diplo, sarcastic, angry Hawke. Unless people really like choosing very similar options from a wheel again and again.
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Feb 26, 2019 16:06
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Oh dear me posted:Having played the Mass effect trilogy again recently - a game where I almost never choose anything other than top choice or bottom choice - I really think two choices, essentially yes or no, are all you need most of the time, and much of what your character says could be decided for you by character decisions you make in the beginning. "My character is not religious" could spare you from making surprise pious remarks about heaven after a death. "My character most values kindness/wit/respect", gives you diplo, sarcastic, angry Hawke. Unless people really like choosing very similar options from a wheel again and again. Mass Effect 1 & 2's more neutral choices could be quite good on their own, and would often lead to more interesting outcomes than blindly picking the blue or red text. It's one of the biggest things missing from ME3 imho.
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Feb 26, 2019 16:11
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Oh dear me posted:Having played the Mass effect trilogy again recently - a game where I almost never choose anything other than top choice or bottom choice - I really think two choices, essentially yes or no, are all you need most of the time, and much of what your character says could be decided for you by character decisions you make in the beginning. "My character is not religious" could spare you from making surprise pious remarks about heaven after a death. "My character most values kindness/wit/respect", gives you diplo, sarcastic, angry Hawke. Unless people really like choosing very similar options from a wheel again and again. I never play a character in a Bioware game as universally one way or another, so I'd like that setting only if it's optional.
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Feb 26, 2019 16:32
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Cythereal posted:I never play a character in a Bioware game as universally one way or another, so I'd like that setting only if it's optional. Maybe, but I don't think your second clause follows from the first. When I vary my Shepard's responses it's because the binary choice in a dialogue is going to make her say something I don't want her to, like that Mordin's "putting in a good word for us wherever he is" after I've shot him. If dialogue reflected disposition decisions you made at the start that should mean more character nuance, not less. Perhaps people will always want some veto power, but still - players don't choose every single thing their character says in most voiced games, and that's not usually seen as a problem.
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Feb 26, 2019 17:48
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Oh dear me posted:Maybe, but I don't think your second clause follows from the first. When I vary my Shepard's responses it's because the binary choice in a dialogue is going to make her say something I don't want her to, like that Mordin's "putting in a good word for us wherever he is" after I've shot him. If dialogue reflected disposition decisions you made at the start that should mean more character nuance, not less. When I vary my PC's responses, it's because maybe she's lying in this particular moment, maybe she acts and talks differently around different people, maybe she reacts one way in some situations and another way in others. Maybe she changes her mind. Maligned as it is, I think Andromeda is the best Bioware game to date for letting you guide your protagonist's personality and giving her a lot of potential for characterization. I played Andromeda three times, twice as Sarah, and without ever touching the saint/rear end in a top hat split I came away feeling in both games that Sarah was a very different person in each due to the dialogue options I'd chosen.
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Feb 26, 2019 17:55
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Cythereal posted:I came away feeling in both games that Sarah was a very different person in each due to the dialogue options I'd chosen. Seriously? OK, I've only managed to complete the game once, but that is due in large part to feeling every Sarah seemed the same. (Like the Inquisitor before her.) I'll go for "dialogue an insoluble problem", then.
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Feb 26, 2019 18:00
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Cythereal posted:Maligned as it is, I think Andromeda is the best Bioware game to date for letting you guide your protagonist's personality and giving her a lot of potential for characterization. I played Andromeda three times, twice as Sarah, and without ever touching the saint/rear end in a top hat split I came away feeling in both games that Sarah was a very different person in each due to the dialogue options I'd chosen. I dunno it always felt like a downgrade from previous games. Like in ME1 when you talk religion with Ashley you can respond five different ways, each with varying levels of nuance, but the same talk with Suvi in ME:A is two responses at extreme ends
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Feb 26, 2019 18:09
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I think religion in DA:I is one area where having a binary choice in the beginning of the game would be a big mistake since events throughout the game could reasonably change your character's perspective (or outward position) on religion pretty significantly.
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Feb 26, 2019 18:20
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Cythereal posted:When I vary my PC's responses, it's because maybe she's lying in this particular moment, maybe she acts and talks differently around different people, maybe she reacts one way in some situations and another way in others. Maybe she changes her mind. Brain worms
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Feb 26, 2019 18:20
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A Buff Gay Dude posted:Brain worms Andromeda's a terrible game in general, but it did have some good points to it. Just not many.
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Feb 26, 2019 18:26
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Obsidian games feature many types of dialogs and many types of dialog checks. Many times the outcome is the same, and there's not intensive plot branching. But even when the reaction is a single one off line, I enjoy the reactivity. It's like adding subtle extra seasoning to a recipe. I don't know of any other developer that does this.
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Feb 26, 2019 18:39
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Sinteres posted:I think religion in DA:I is one area where having a binary choice in the beginning of the game would be a big mistake since events throughout the game could reasonably change your character's perspective (or outward position) on religion pretty significantly. Religion is a big part of what intrigued me about DAI. The idea my PC could be an Andrastain, an elven god worshiper or an atheist was very neat. I dislike the gameplay immensely but its dialogue wheel is the best yet and the talk you can have with Mother Giselle about losing your faith after Haven or after seeing who it was with you in the Fade is the peaks of the game's writing for me.
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Feb 26, 2019 18:40
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Cythereal posted:Maligned as it is, I think Andromeda is the best Bioware game to date for letting you guide your protagonist's personality and giving her a lot of potential for characterization. I played Andromeda three times, twice as Sarah, and without ever touching the saint/rear end in a top hat split I came away feeling in both games that Sarah was a very different person in each due to the dialogue options I'd chosen. It also had a weirdly charming little detail in that both Sara and Scott have slightly distinct personalities from one another, despite the fact that you can technically play them however you want. Sara's a huge nerd, and Scott has webbed toes.
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Feb 26, 2019 18:50
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The Dregs posted:Thanks for telling me to stick with it until the mage quest. Feels almost like old DAO. I hosed up a dropped Cassandra for Blackwall because he's cool, but I specced him two hand. Having a hell of a time in Alexius's pad with no real tank. Yeah, she is. My favorite parts of DA:I involved the old DA:O gang.
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Feb 26, 2019 18:57
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Bogus Adventure posted:Yeah, she is. My favorite parts of DA:I involved the old DA:O gang. Kinda makes me wonder what Oghren is up to Weirdly enough only three former companions have straight-up exited the narrative after their final turn as companions, and all are from Awakening: Oghren, Velanna, and Sigrun.
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Feb 26, 2019 19:03
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Bogus Adventure posted:Sera sucks, she's worse than Anders and Fenris combined, like if you combined them into some abominable companion called Fenders. Don’t give them any ideas. Serdris
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Feb 26, 2019 19:09
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NikkolasKing posted:Religion is a big part of what intrigued me about DAI. The idea my PC could be an Andrastain, an elven god worshiper or an atheist was very neat. I dislike the gameplay immensely but its dialogue wheel is the best yet I disliked DAI'S dialogue wheel mostly because you can never not be earnest, but also because religion is the only serious pc character differentiation in the game and I really wish Bioware would shut up about it. Ashley 'soldiers can be religious, don't you agree?', Mordin/Padok Wiks 'scientists can be religious, don't you agree?', Andromeda person 'scientists can be religious, don't you agree?' I AM SICK OF ANSWERING THIS QUESTION. DAI dealt with the topic much better, I do agree, but I wish they could find another topic to obsess about. E: on Oghren - he just turned into Grunt.
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Feb 26, 2019 19:35
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Pattonesque posted:Kinda makes me wonder what Oghren is up to Oghren is probably off somewhere getting drunk, and plowing that dwarf lady from Lake Calenhad. I'm probably in the minority, but I liked the companions from Awakenings a lot. They were all flawed and disgruntled, but they had a chemistry, including Awakenings Anders, who also ruled. It's sad that DA2 shitted both him and Justice up by taking away his devil-may-care attitude. Where's the Anders who just wanted to adopt cats and take them along with you on your quest? ditty bout my clitty posted:Don’t give them any ideas. DA4: The Seranning
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Feb 26, 2019 23:18
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Bogus Adventure posted:Oghren is probably off somewhere getting drunk, and plowing that dwarf lady from Lake Calenhad. All of them were fantastic I thought. As strong as the main cast probably. Anders in Awakening was a legitimately awesome companion and I can see why the bought him back even if the did butcher his character. I though Nathaniel was also a real stand-out and I'm actually pretty hopeful that Velanna pops back up with Solas.
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Feb 27, 2019 01:13
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Nephthys posted:All of them were fantastic I thought. As strong as the main cast probably. Anders in Awakening was a legitimately awesome companion and I can see why the bought him back even if the did butcher his character. I though Nathaniel was also a real stand-out and I'm actually pretty hopeful that Velanna pops back up with Solas.  as well as Sigrun.You're absolutely right about Nathaniel. He's great, and his character arc is fantastic. You go from hating each other's guts to being comrades in arms once he realizes that his father was a massive shithead.
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Feb 27, 2019 01:32
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Bogus Adventure posted:
I mean he knew he just wanted to believe he was only a poo poo to his family instead of an actual monster
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Feb 27, 2019 01:45
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The Dregs posted:Thanks for telling me to stick with it until the mage quest. Feels almost like old DAO. I hosed up a dropped Cassandra for Blackwall because he's cool, but I specced him two hand. Having a hell of a time in Alexius's pad with no real tank. The best way to play DA:I is do sidequest poo poo until you get tired of it or until you enough power to do a main quest, and then do a main quest. If you're doing side areas, do the main area quests there, but ignore the fetch quest stuff unless you actually enjoy that. And that's it. You should experience the story beats and not deal with too much crap if you do that.
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Feb 27, 2019 01:57
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justice and anders were both great in awakening. it would have been cool to see solace interacting with justice and helping him sort out himself out in the material realm. instead da2 just turned them both into one psycho and in inquisition we got cole 
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Feb 27, 2019 01:58
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Oh dear me posted:Andromeda's protagonist was an intensely North American youth. The wheel gave you 4 choices of style: professional, logical, emotional, and cheesy, or something like that. Which was incredibly dull. The facial expressions were as dumb as the responses.
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Feb 27, 2019 05:27
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Nephthys posted:All of them were fantastic I thought. As strong as the main cast probably. Anders in Awakening was a legitimately awesome companion and I can see why the bought him back even if the did butcher his character. I though Nathaniel was also a real stand-out and I'm actually pretty hopeful that Velanna pops back up with Solas. Velanna as a Solas minion would be a great use of her.
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Feb 27, 2019 07:34
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Sigrin is probably dead by now between being a warden and dead legion. The character I really want to see again is the Architect. Aside from Awakening and his tie in novel he hadn’t done poo poo and will hopefully come into play involving Solas/fade/Blight plot stuff.
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Feb 27, 2019 07:40
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A Buff Gay Dude posted:Brain worms In Andromeda your character does say different incidental dialogue based on what options you chose earlier. It's cool but it's not noticeable unless you play through more than once and who the hell is doing that? So I'd agree with it being a nice thing, but absolutely the only nice thing. chaosapiant posted:Sigrin is probably dead by now between being a warden and dead legion. I think this is mostly down to not many people playing Awakening. I know I never did.
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Feb 27, 2019 10:05
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What is with the poo poo loot in DAI? I am level 10 now and I rarely see anything usable by anybody, and lord knows I loot enough corpses and boxes. The craftable stuff I find is also trash for the most part. Also, can I recruit that Cullen fellow with the hat? He was in a bunch of cutscenes a bit ago. is he in Skyhold somewhere?
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Feb 27, 2019 17:49
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