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MonsterEnvy posted:The Imperium is fascist. There is no questioning it, but it is portrayed as being utterly awful to the point of parody. You are not supposed to see it as a good thing. The original basis of the Imperium (and thus the entire setting) is clearly post-death of Julius Caesar Rome. In other ways it's a pastiche with many other things (the Imperial Guard is fascist; but there is a lot of popular culture references to the dark ages/Middle Ages going on in the Imperium too, for example). But as the Gladiator line goes, "There was once a dream that was Rome" and most of the space marines, generally the unabashed heroes of the setting even when they are often fatally flawed, would like to restore it if they could. (This was "Rome" combined with some fashion of post-scarcity, different than a Republic).
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Feb 22, 2019 20:27
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Sodomy Hussein posted:The original basis of the Imperium (and thus the entire setting) is clearly post-death of Julius Caesar Rome. In other ways it's a pastiche with many other things (the Imperial Guard is fascist; but there is a lot of popular culture references to the dark ages/Middle Ages going on in the Imperium too, for example). But as the Gladiator line goes, "There was once a dream that was Rome" and most of the space marines, generally the unabashed heroes of the setting even when they are often fatally flawed, would like to restore it if they could. (This was "Rome" combined with some fashion of post-scarcity, different than a Republic). But the imperium was always bad. The Emperor is a bad person, if he even qualifies as a person. The age of strife was also terrible and what little we know about the Dark Age of Technology sounds pretty bad. There was never a glory day, never a dream. Just oppression and a strong man dictator who wanted to control the Galaxy.
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Feb 22, 2019 20:34
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I think you'll find 40k is a deeply serious setting.
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Feb 22, 2019 20:45
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How do I get Marines to be on the AdMech's side? I know the Iron Hands and their descendants are big Cogheads but none of them seem like the "Let's garrison a world"-type chapters. And I need them to be on the AdMech side because a theme I'm going for is the humanity vs. (augmented-/post-/trans-/non-)humanity thing, and where the AdMech (and Marines) are on that spectrum, especially w/r/t something like the Genestealer Cultists?
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Feb 22, 2019 20:48
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neaden posted:But the imperium was always bad. The Emperor is a bad person, if he even qualifies as a person. The age of strife was also terrible and what little we know about the Dark Age of Technology sounds pretty bad. There was never a glory day, never a dream. Just oppression and a strong man dictator who wanted to control the Galaxy. I think there's a difference between the early work where the setting first got serious, wherein: - We have references to a divided humanity that has somehow become scattered across the stars - Standard template constructs are introduced that allow you to live in peace and plenty anywhere in the galaxy, and liberated worlds are given freedom from stand-ins for Vikings, Turks, and other invading hordes - Eldar represent our lost and awe-inspiring antiquity - Like our own history, it's now unclear precisely what happened beyond the basic facts, who is telling the truth, or if anyone knows the truth (see: various Roman emperors that we only know about from heavily-politicized accounts) Nowadays the Warhammer setting is just one pants-on-head comical horribleness after another, and I think newcomers and long-time fans are both reacting negatively to this. It turns out that the God-Emperor was an arrogant dumbass and several of his greatest champions were from day one violent psychopaths. OK. This part of the setting was never designed to be something we had to color in or that would be interesting as a drama; it's the legendarium basis for the actual story. It would be like taking A Song of Ice and Fire's Age of Heroes and applying the same setting beats from the actual story to that time period. Or making a movie about Melkor and Eru Illuvatar, where we have to discover Melkor's motivations and have inane side plots about his girlfriend. The point is that it's a long way from the kind of stuff this imagery calls to mind: 
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Feb 22, 2019 20:55
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Yeah, but we're dealing with the 40k lore in relation to its use for an RPG. Yes, Imperium is legitimately fascist. That also doesn't mean a GM can't run a game on whatever planet of the week they want where they use a genestealer cult as some sort of allegory of MAGA Chuds taking hold with that diminishing the evil of the Imperium. The fun of the 40k setting and part of the commentary it has in common with Dredd is exploring the viewpoint that fascism often has of, "we need to be this way because the alternatives will be worse." In the 40k setting there are factions/species that: want to break you down into your organic parts to use you as food, torture you for multiple lifetimes, use you as a pawn to delay their demise, shoot you with green laser beams, football hooligan your whole species, cut off your head/bleed you dry/gently caress all your holes/give you space AIDS/mutate you. When that is what humanity faces daily, you get fascists being able to grab power. Like have fun in your dumb grim dark setting.
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Feb 22, 2019 20:56
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Now I'm just imagining a dog in Commissar uniform.
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Feb 22, 2019 20:59
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Schadenboner posted:How do I get Marines to be on the AdMech's side? I know the Iron Hands and their descendants are big Cogheads but none of them seem like the "Let's garrison a world"-type chapters. How many marines do you need? You could probably get a marine or two for quality assurance. Up to you if this is a fancy way of saying that marines personally deal with faulty terminator suit producers. Or it could just be official justification for a Coghead who really wants to show off with a marine bodyguard.
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Feb 22, 2019 21:41
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Just have a group of Mentors chapter marines stationed there futzing* around with some AdMech toys unique to that craftworld. *”Exploring tactical applications”
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Feb 22, 2019 21:44
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habituallyred posted:Or it could just be official justification for a Coghead who really wants to show off with a marine bodyguard. Ooh, like an honor guard from the Iron Hands?
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Feb 22, 2019 21:46
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Just have the forge world be one of a chapter's bonded suppliers. Marines show up to protect their logistics.
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Feb 22, 2019 21:47
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Their last remaining supplier after [event] happened. They started off really wanting to keep them friendly for survival, but now there are so many personal relationships and favours of varying type and level involved that they're becoming a bit coggy themselves. Could even be recruiting from the planet's youths that are specially-kept/adjusted to grow into skitarii.
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Feb 22, 2019 22:25
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The Marines are on loan from the Reclaimers chapter, here combing the wastes for archaeotech, and they have a strong relationship with the Adeptus Mechanicus and Ciaphas Cain HERO OF THE IMPERIUM
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Feb 23, 2019 06:12
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Pharmaskittle posted:Then prove it. Call Vulkan the n-word. neoliberal? i thought the imperium was fascist?
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Feb 23, 2019 10:58
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Techmarine drags the whole company over to help the forge buddies who supply his favourite pattern of rocket bike.
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Feb 23, 2019 11:51
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Schadenboner posted:How do I get Marines to be on the AdMech's side? I know the Iron Hands and their descendants are big Cogheads but none of them seem like the "Let's garrison a world"-type chapters. Don't see why the Marines couldn't have a Monastary on the planet, and/or use it as a Recruiting world. They will defend the poo poo out of their Recruiting worlds, it's one of the big reasons Planetary Governors let themselves be picked for the job.
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Feb 23, 2019 18:31
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Friend wanted to play a Tau in W&G in a primarily non-Tau party, what are your thoughts on these homebrew stats:quote:TAU STATS:
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Feb 24, 2019 07:05
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susan posted:Friend wanted to play a Tau in W&G in a primarily non-Tau party, what are your thoughts on these homebrew stats: Funnily enough, I wrote up the wargear stuff a few months back and it's almost exactly what you have here. Just goes to show how transparent the design is for wargear.
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Feb 24, 2019 17:00
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You might want to differentiate between castes, all those careers are of course going to be Fire Caste, but for future careers or options.
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Feb 24, 2019 18:07
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thatbastardken posted:neoliberal? i thought the imperium was fascist? Hey, the things aren't that bad.
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Feb 26, 2019 08:19
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Sodomy Hussein posted:Nowadays the Warhammer setting is just one pants-on-head comical horribleness after another, and I think newcomers and long-time fans are both reacting negatively to this. So much this. I stumbled into the setting post Dawn of War 1 (I had read Space Marine, The Best Book About Space Marines, before without any knowledge that Warhammer or miniature wargaming are things) and I'm super pissed at all the Beast books, THE TAU RAN OUT OF PLASMA BULLETS FROM SHOOTING SO MUCH CATACHANS, and all the "endless doom, scale-less gloom and enemies that are always endless" waves we always get. Though some of it comes from me getting more interested in military history and war in general, and being angry at writers thinking that bigger=better.
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Feb 26, 2019 08:22
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How has nothing come out for Warhammer 4th or W&G in months. One mini-adventure book and some free pdfs, this is not acceptable customer service 
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Feb 26, 2019 08:51
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Pharmaskittle posted:Then prove it. Call Vulkan the n-word. Nocturnal?
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Feb 26, 2019 10:29
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JcDent posted:So much this. I stumbled into the setting post Dawn of War 1 (I had read Space Marine, The Best Book About Space Marines, before without any knowledge that Warhammer or miniature wargaming are things) and I'm super pissed at all the Beast books, THE TAU RAN OUT OF PLASMA BULLETS FROM SHOOTING SO MUCH CATACHANS, and all the "endless doom, scale-less gloom and enemies that are always endless" waves we always get. Personally I think the trick is just to be discriminating in what you ingest regard ing the setting. I'm rereading Eisenhorn, not whatever fluff GW is putting out now. If I hear there's a new amazing author making great new books that's fine, but I'm not going to read, like, a GW newsletter, not after they killed the old world and made AoS; I'm happy with what they've done with the minatures hobby lately but still pretty soured/hesitant about their treatment of the setting the current GW has largely inherited. If someone asked me for the elevator pitch of 40k, say before a campaign, I'd direct them to this, which is one version of the rulebook preface which has been kicking around a long time. Jack B Nimble fucked around with this message at 14:31 on Feb 26, 2019 |
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Feb 26, 2019 14:26
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Jack B Nimble posted:Personally I think the trick is just to be discriminating in what you ingest regard ing the setting. I'm rereading Eisenhorn, not whatever fluff GW is putting out now. If I hear there's a new amazing author making great new books that's fine, but I'm not going to read, like, a GW newsletter, not after they killed the old world and made AoS; I'm happy with what they've done with the minatures hobby lately but still pretty soured/hesitant about their treatment of the setting the current GW has largely inherited. This is real real fukkin good, except Marines a poo poo.
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Feb 26, 2019 15:26
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In many ways I like the 30k/Horus Heresy era of the setting better. The primarchs are kind of interesting, and they are great to read when you know what is coming. I think I've read more of the Horus Heresy books than stuff in the 40k line. But yeah, there are only a few of the authors (Gav Thorpe, Ghram McNeill, ADB) that I will read. After the Gato Blood Ravens travesty I try to stick with known quantities only.
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Feb 26, 2019 15:46
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Speaking of ARPEEEGEEE content, just got an email from Cubicle 7, as I was an idiot who ordered the 4e Starter in September. Choice bits! quote:Confirm all shipping details (No need to email back to this newsletter with address changes) We will be emailing everyone their address details that we have for them so they can confirm everything is still correct. This address confirmation should be sent out in about 2 weeks. This is only mildly rage inducing, but then we reach the kicker. quote:The suggested retail date (or street date) mentioned for stores is June 2019. That is a retail date only - we fully intend on sending these Starter Sets to pre-order customers as soon as they are finished. 
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Feb 26, 2019 15:52
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Schadenboner posted:How do I get Marines to be on the AdMech's side? I know the Iron Hands and their descendants are big Cogheads but none of them seem like the "Let's garrison a world"-type chapters. They could always be another Steel Confessors-type situation where the Cogboys made their own chapter (again).
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Feb 26, 2019 16:44
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Yvonmukluk posted:They could always be another Steel Confessors-type situation where the Cogboys made their own chapter (again). What kind of special snowflake Mary Sue bullshit is this?
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Feb 26, 2019 16:55
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Werix posted:What kind of special snowflake Mary Sue bullshit is this? I think it was cooked up for Games Day or something?
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Feb 26, 2019 16:56
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MonsterEnvy posted:The Imperium is fascist. There is no questioning it, but it is portrayed as being utterly awful to the point of parody. You are not supposed to see it as a good thing. Eh, aspects of the Imperium are fascist but it's a pastiche of the worst parts of a bunch of different systems that humanity's tried. The only real constant is that the local flavor of imperial power will be bad, whether it's feudal, a theocracy, democracy or fascist regime.
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Feb 26, 2019 17:14
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30k is awesome and a game using Deathwatch rules as a mixed band of pre-heresy duders would be awesome for the alternative armor patterns and colors alone. 4e starter set getting bumped to June is nuts, Im basically taking it as meaning no new books will come out until 2020. Greaat.
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Feb 26, 2019 19:15
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4e has at least two more projects scheduled for this years. But it is a shame the 4e Starter set is taking so long to get the physical version out.
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Feb 26, 2019 19:24
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It is a big shame. I love 4E a lot so far, but just being a corebook is tough when I have all my 2nd Edition books just sitting there ready to go. Still, the system being updated was a really nice thing and I will be buying anything else they put out in the Old World.
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Feb 26, 2019 19:52
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MonsterEnvy posted:4e has at least two more projects scheduled for this years. But it is a shame the 4e Starter set is taking so long to get the physical version out. Lord_Hambrose posted:It is a big shame. I love 4E a lot so far, but just being a corebook is tough when I have all my 2nd Edition books just sitting there ready to go.
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Feb 26, 2019 19:57
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Dre2Dee2 posted:30k is awesome and a game using Deathwatch rules as a mixed band of pre-heresy duders would be awesome for the alternative armor patterns and colors alone. Eh, I played in a table top game that was exactly that and while it was fun to have a future chaos primarch as a boss (the iron warrior PC was constantly collecting evidence of everyone else loving up because HE wasn't going down for someone else, apparently he survived some decimation in his back story, we were all in proto deathwatch as a political punishment) I still got bored playing a space muhreen compared to a more human Dark Heresy or Rogue Trader PC, especially when the whole party is Asartes. But yeah, it was still a good setting for our DW game.
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Feb 26, 2019 20:04
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Warthur posted:How hard it is to just use 2nd edition stuff in 4E? I imagine you could convert monsters and NPCs fairly easily, especially since you already have some converted already which you can use as benchmarks. Really easy. I definitely have more than enough knowledge about the setting where I can run anything I would care to, but I really want to see more books.
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Feb 26, 2019 20:29
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Jack B Nimble posted:Eh, I played in a table top game that was exactly that and while it was fun to have a future chaos primarch as a boss (the iron warrior PC was constantly collecting evidence of everyone else loving up because HE wasn't going down for someone else, apparently he survived some decimation in his back story, we were all in proto deathwatch as a political punishment) I still got bored playing a space muhreen compared to a more human Dark Heresy or Rogue Trader PC, especially when the whole party is Asartes. See, one of the better FFG games I played in, though short lived, was a Deathwatch one where we really played into our chapter differences and kind of made our own drama. It takes the right group of people to do it without everyone taking it personally, but having the Black Templar and Dark Angel having radically differing views on what to do with the Eldar offering to help, and other players picking sides, was fun.
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Feb 26, 2019 20:43
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I was the ultramarine and my my primary feeling was "marge simpson closing her lips tightly and making a quiet hum of anxious concern".
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Feb 26, 2019 21:47
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Crossposting from the procedural generation thread, this is an attempt by the newest state-of-the-art AI to try to write a warhammer 40k wiki article. quote:Kroot: a species of reptilian alien soldiers, with a penchant for eating a particular type of cheese!
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Feb 26, 2019 22:20
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