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Cease to Hope
Dec 12, 2011
estates were added to the free version of EU4 last September.

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Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017

by sebmojo

Cease to Hope posted:

estates were added to the free version of EU4 last September.

Wow, what sort of idiot would refuse to buy a dlc, and then wait a full few months to play a game they own, without even extensively checking the dev diaries or wiki

Cease to Hope
Dec 12, 2011

Edgar Allen Ho posted:

Wow, what sort of idiot would refuse to buy a dlc, and then wait a full few months to play a game they own, without even extensively checking the dev diaries or wiki

you can stop now

aardvaard
Mar 4, 2013

you belong in the bog of eternal stench

i can't believe new features can be confusing for players who haven't learned them yet, because other than that, paradox games are very straightforward and easy to learn

Alchenar
Apr 9, 2008

aardvaard posted:

i can't believe new features can be confusing for players who haven't learned them yet, because other than that, paradox games are very straightforward and easy to learn

It would be really nice if Paradox games did a check between the current checksum and the last checksum they ran on and then pulled a high level list of 'these are the big things that are new since you last played, read up on them *here* if you want'.

Arrhythmia
Jul 22, 2011

Edgar Allen Ho posted:

Wow, what sort of idiot would refuse to buy a dlc, and then wait a full few months to play a game they own, without even extensively checking the dev diaries or wiki

You're really upset for no reason dude

Koramei
Nov 11, 2011

I have three regrets
The first is to be born in Joseon.

Alchenar posted:

It would be really nice if Paradox games did a check between the current checksum and the last checksum they ran on and then pulled a high level list of 'these are the big things that are new since you last played, read up on them *here* if you want'.

I think it’s a relatively simple thing to read up on features for a game like EU4 that basically necessitates some wiki use anyway, but this would actually be pretty cool.

Dwesa
Jul 19, 2016

Maybe I'll go where I can see stars

Alchenar posted:

It would be really nice if Paradox games did a check between the current checksum and the last checksum they ran on and then pulled a high level list of 'these are the big things that are new since you last played, read up on them *here* if you want'.
Hmm, Cities: Skylines already does that in a way. Maybe they could find inspiration in a game they published.

Alchenar
Apr 9, 2008

Also the problem with paradox expansions isn't really 'new features', it's reworking existing features in a way that that you wouldn't notice if you weren't scanning the dev diaries and only become apparent in-game when something suddenly doesn't work as you expected it to.

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017

by sebmojo

Arrhythmia posted:

You're really upset for no reason dude

Listen, getting drunk and yelling at video games that I like is how I blow off steam, and I will NOT stop.

Pdox games, especially EU4, really do have some horrid, non-intuitive feature bloat though.

Average Bear
Apr 4, 2010
I couldn't imagine EU4 without revanchism

ThatBasqueGuy
Feb 14, 2013

someone introduce jojo to lazyb


Just another reason why Vicky 2 is the best paradox game :enkidel:

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017

by sebmojo

ThatBasqueGuy posted:

Just another reason why Vicky 2 is the best paradox game :enkidel:

Weird way to spell Ricky.

Unrelated: thinking about vicky 2, I had an account on the paradox forums during its development and ate a ban for saying it was dumb and racist to make almost the entirety of Africa unclaimed, virgin land for the entreprising “civilized” nation to stick a flag on. Johan himself banned me <3.

Paradox has come a long way from that. I can invade Sweden as a proselytising, monotheistic Anansi-worshipping Songhai empire now.

Edgar Allen Ho fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Mar 13, 2019

Party In My Diapee
Jan 24, 2014
Hopefully Imperator will let me kill all men as the Sarmatians.

Drone
Aug 22, 2003

Incredible machine
:smug:


Paradox just stickied this post on all of the subreddits where they have PDX employees as mods (so for all of their main games except /r/CrusaderKings, which is apparently independent):

quote:

Greetings,

In light of the Christchurch mosque shootings, we've been made very aware that islamophobic memes, even within context of the video games, have no place in a community. Despite the fact that the shootings are unrelated to our community, we do feel like we could and should be harsher on these things.

While we understand that the vast majority of people are making a joke when they write that they want to "Remove kebab", these memes have always been in that weird gray area where something is joke when called out and it isn't when people start to discuss it. Plenty of people write half-racist rants about "Turkroaches" or "Remove Kebab" and when called out, respond in anger that it's just a meme. In context of current events, these jokes are especially tasteless.

This isn't good for the name of our community, it's not making people feel welcome in our community, and there's a lot of bad people that feel like they're in good company in a community that's mostly joking around when they say these things.

While you may be joking when you make a "Tyrone Niger" joke, and while 99% of the community understand that it's a joke, it makes it complicit in creating a community where the 1% of actual racists feel welcomed and understood.

We understand that it's a thin line, and if you're talking about the crusades in game context, you're not meaning this in an islamophobic way. But there's a lot of misplaced jokes that you'd never hear about, say, the French; anyone making a "Surrender Monkey" joke here quickly gets called out because we all found out that hard way that France has quite a military history.

We hope for your understanding.

Kind regards,

It's long loving overdue to be honest. Paradox likes to talk about how they don't tolerate this kind of vitriol or memes on their official forums (for good reason) and seem to think that that's enough, but all too often they're uncomfortably silent on some of the other highly questionable parts of their community (specifically, rampant pandering to fascists in HOI4).

Edit: also apparently there are rumors floating around in those threads about one of the shooters having "kebab removed" etched into his gun. What a truly fantastic community this is, all filled with very fine people.

Edit2: Meneth replied quite quickly about HOI4, which actually surprises me.

Drone fucked around with this message at 14:09 on Mar 15, 2019

Fellblade
Apr 28, 2009
The kebab stuff is something I’ve had to call out friends who play PDX games repeatedly, and I am certain they all picked it up from reddit.

So good poo poo PDX, I’d like to think it wouldn’t take a horrible event to make this happen but it’s not like reddit is their own forums.

Phlegmish
Jul 2, 2011



I think 'remove kebab' was actually started by Turks as an ironic take on Serbian attitudes, something like that? Regardless, if we'll be seeing less of these lovely low-effort memes, all the better.

Raskolnikov38
Mar 3, 2007

We were somewhere around Manila when the drugs began to take hold
banning the nazi flag mods from the workshop would be a decent first step

aardvaard
Mar 4, 2013

you belong in the bog of eternal stench

i thought it came from that propaganda video where a guy with an accordion celebrates war crimes?

Drone
Aug 22, 2003

Incredible machine
:smug:


Raskolnikov38 posted:

banning the nazi flag mods from the workshop would be a decent first step

From what I understand about the Steam workshop, they (PDX) don't actually have the ability to do this. I might be wrong though. And they totally should do it.

Westminster System
Jul 4, 2009
Ban communist iconography too whilst we're at it.

AnoHito
May 8, 2014

Westminster System posted:

Ban communist iconography too whilst we're at it.

*looks at like a solid 20% of the avs on these forums*

Probably best not to throw that particular stone.

Cease to Hope
Dec 12, 2011

Westminster System posted:

Ban communist iconography too whilst we're at it.

are you lost

Davincie
Jul 7, 2008

Westminster System posted:

Ban communist iconography too whilst we're at it.

there’s no need for this whataboutism at this time

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!
Ban capitalist iconography as well.

Just have everything be a white void

Raskolnikov38
Mar 3, 2007

We were somewhere around Manila when the drugs began to take hold
i forgot that we resurrected baader and meinhof and let them run wild

Cease to Hope
Dec 12, 2011
huh, same poster

Westminster System posted:

Ban communist iconography too whilst we're at it.

Westminster System posted:

But every da....

Oh.

OH.



Slightly relevant, I guess? Conversation reminded me of it.

Make countries that didn't even exist at the time do terrible things!

Xerophyte
Mar 17, 2008

This space intentionally left blank

Phlegmish posted:

I think 'remove kebab' was actually started by Turks as an ironic take on Serbian attitudes, something like that? Regardless, if we'll be seeing less of these lovely low-effort memes, all the better.

I'd only heard it from EU4 people and thought using kebab for Turkey and Turks was your standard uncreative food based semi-racism ("frogs", "krauts", etc) but apparently its origin is a lot weirder:

https://www.quora.com/Can-you-explain-the-concept-of-the-Remove-kebab-joke posted:

In 1995, Serbian partisans in Bosnia serving with Republika Srpska separatists made a nationalist music video using a trumpet, electric keyboard and an accordion. In this video the makers apparently say a lot of not very nice things about Bosniaks, Albanians, and other South Slavic Muslims, and exhort the viewer to support Radovan Karadžić, who was later convicted as a war criminal.

Sometime in the early teens, someone found this video and thought that it was horrifically, hilariously bad. I agree - I’ve watched the whole thing and it’s so objectively terrible it’s vaguely amusing. Then, someone posted it on 4chan along with the following poorly formatted, poorly written, poorly spelled racist screed in English:

"REMOVE KEBAB remove kebab
you are worst turk. you are the turk idiot you are the turk smell. return to croatioa. to our croatia cousins you may come our contry. you may live in the zoo….ahahahaha ,bosnia we will never forgeve you. cetnik rascal gently caress but gently caress rear end in a top hat turk stink bosnia sqhipere shqipare..turk genocide best day of my life. take a bath of dead turk..ahahahahahBOSNIA WE WILL GET YOU!! do not forget ww2 .albiania we kill the king , albania return to your precious mongolia….hahahahaha idiot turk and bosnian smell so bad..wow i can smell it. REMOVE KEBABFROM THE PREMISES. you will get caught. russia+usa+croatia+slovak=kill bosnia…you will ww2/ tupac alive in serbia, tupac making album of serbia . fast rap tupac serbia. we are rich and have gold now hahahaha ha because of tupac… you are ppoor stink turk… you live in a hovel hahahaha, you live in a yurt

tupac alive numbr one #1 in serbia ….gently caress the croatia ,..FUCKk ashol turks no good i spit in the mouth eye of ur flag and contry. 2pac aliv and real strong wizard kill all the turk farm aminal with rap magic now we the serba rule .ape of the zoo presidant georg bush fukc the great satan and lay egg this egg hatch and bosnia wa;s born. stupid baby form the eggn give bak our clay we will crush u lik a skull of pig. serbia greattst countrey"

So, it's originally irony poking fun at Serbian nationalists, sort of. Because it's 4chan people of course decided to also use "remove kebab" in the double-ironical sense of praising the Bosnian genocide, which is what the asswipe in Christchurch was doing.

Average Bear
Apr 4, 2010

Westminster System posted:

Ban communist iconography too whilst we're at it.

E: made my point.

Average Bear fucked around with this message at 16:08 on Mar 15, 2019

Westminster System
Jul 4, 2009

Davincie posted:

there’s no need for this whataboutism at this time

True, though communist iconography is actually banned in some places.

CharlestheHammer posted:

Ban capitalist iconography as well.

Just have everything be a white void

At least someone understands. Might be a bit too close to the Bourbon flag though, you know. That'd be monarchist.

Cease to Hope posted:

huh, same poster

It finally happened!

At least I know how to provoke activity in this thread.

Cease to Hope
Dec 12, 2011

Westminster System posted:

It finally happened!

At least I know how to provoke activity in this thread.

wow, you sound like some sort of epic puppetmaster

aardvaard
Mar 4, 2013

you belong in the bog of eternal stench

Westminster System posted:

Ban communist iconography too whilst we're at it.

wish you would ban yourself while you're at it

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Drone posted:

Paradox just stickied this post on all of the subreddits where they have PDX employees as mods (so for all of their main games except /r/CrusaderKings, which is apparently independent):


It's long loving overdue to be honest. Paradox likes to talk about how they don't tolerate this kind of vitriol or memes on their official forums (for good reason) and seem to think that that's enough, but all too often they're uncomfortably silent on some of the other highly questionable parts of their community (specifically, rampant pandering to fascists in HOI4).

Edit: also apparently there are rumors floating around in those threads about one of the shooters having "kebab removed" etched into his gun. What a truly fantastic community this is, all filled with very fine people.

Edit2: Meneth replied quite quickly about HOI4, which actually surprises me.



Hopefully this means the next PDXCon won't have SS cosplayers, wait who am I kidding

feller
Jul 5, 2006


Westminster System posted:

True, though communist iconography is actually banned in some places.


At least someone understands. Might be a bit too close to the Bourbon flag though, you know. That'd be monarchist.


It finally happened!

At least I know how to provoke activity in this thread.

So is your point that we shouldn’t ban anything ever because it doesn’t personally bother you or it’s boring or whatever

Koramei
Nov 11, 2011

I have three regrets
The first is to be born in Joseon.

Obliterati posted:

Hopefully this means the next PDXCon won't have SS cosplayers, wait who am I kidding

Wait, did the past ones seriously?

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Koramei posted:

Wait, did the past ones seriously?

To be fair I only saw one last year

Crazycryodude
Aug 15, 2015

Lets get our X tons of Duranium back!

....Is that still a valid thing to jingoistically blow out of proportion?


Drone posted:

From what I understand about the Steam workshop, they (PDX) don't actually have the ability to do this. I might be wrong though. And they totally should do it.

They managed to take down all the Nazi Stellaris mods IIRC

Westminster System
Jul 4, 2009

Cease to Hope posted:

wow, you sound like some sort of epic puppetmaster

Not really, but its actually interesting to click through to that quote and see how much of a cycle things are sometimes, so I actually genuinely thank you for that.

Senor Dog posted:

So is your point that we shouldn’t ban anything ever because it doesn’t personally bother you or it’s boring or whatever

I'm not making an honest argument for or for not banning anything, we all know who did what under whatever symbol. Thankfully we don't have communist terrorists going around killing people (at least, as much), so our five pointed stars are safe. Except in like, Indonesia, or most of Eastern Europe. Getting rid of trashy racist talk and dumb racist memes is great. It's a shame it takes people dying to spur it on. In regards to iconography, generally speaking, Governments legislate for that, and Paradox can adhere its standards to those laws - such as how vanilla HoI4 is censored in Germany.

Suppose I have to go weather barbarossa to atone for my sins now.

Crazycryodude posted:

They managed to take down all the Nazi Stellaris mods IIRC

More or less any outright ones. Don't think theres any flags, but plenty of "white male portraits only" or "western european names" etc namelists out there which are essentially the same thing under a more acceptable name.

Westminster System fucked around with this message at 15:40 on Mar 15, 2019

Average Bear
Apr 4, 2010
DAE think nazi and communist the same thing??

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Orv
May 4, 2011

Westminster System posted:

Not really, but its actually interesting to click through to that quote and see how much of a cycle things are sometimes, so I actually genuinely thank you for that.


I'm not making an honest argument for or for not banning anything, we all know who did what under whatever symbol. Thankfully we don't have communist terrorists going around killing people (at least, as much), so our five pointed stars are safe. Except in like, Indonesia, or most of Eastern Europe. Getting rid of trashy racist talk and dumb racist memes is great. It's a shame it takes people dying to spur it on. In regards to iconography, generally speaking, Governments legislate for that, and Paradox can adhere its standards to those laws - such as how vanilla HoI4 is censored in Germany.

Suppose I have to go weather barbarossa to atone for my sins now.

You seem like you'd be a blast at parties.

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