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When we had our first baby we enrolled in the EAT study which studied the link. They found significant reduction in peanut and egg allergies from early introduction, and we all got allergy tested. The missus apparently has an allergy to house dust, so she keeps using it as an excuse not to do the cleaning.. hmm. Argh, lovely snipe. Um.. in the year 202AD, the Roman Emperor Septimius Severus made christian baptism a criminal act. Serves em right, coming round here, taking our gods... OzyMandrill fucked around with this message at 18:17 on Mar 17, 2019 |
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Mar 17, 2019 18:12
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jabby posted:Rub your kids in dirt and shove peanut butter in their faces, for their health. jabby posted:It's almost certainly multifactorial. There's evidence for the helminth thing that worms were actually good at keeping our immune system in check, and there's evidence for the exposure theory.
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Mar 17, 2019 18:15
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A Buttery Pastry posted:Just have your kids eat earthworms straight from the source and they'll be allergy-free for life. I was thinking of how we used to make 'mud pies' back in the olden days (1960s). I bet kids don't do that now!
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Mar 17, 2019 18:18
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jabby posted:It's almost certainly multifactorial. There's evidence for the helminth thing that worms were actually good at keeping our immune system in check, and there's evidence for the exposure theory. There's probably some other factors we don't know too. Immunology is hella interesting, the fact that our immune systems work at all is insane. the consistent correlations between schizophrenia and autoimmune disorders led to a SLaM-led 2017 publication demonstrating, for the first time, that the mechanism of severe positive psychosis appears to be an autoimmune response pruning too many neural connections. They even discovered a pre-sympatomatic patient in the control group. They're due to finish a small trial around november this year, using Adalimumab/humira as a complete treatment for schizophrenia. Idea goes back at least two decades though, and the use of more general immunosuppressants in schizophrenia has been trialed before. What I'm saying is that the problem with our health and society are too few brainworms.
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Mar 17, 2019 18:19
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Did walnut-girl pass the exam?
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Mar 17, 2019 18:20
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:I was thinking of how we used to make 'mud pies' back in the olden days (1960s). I bet kids don't do that now! I was 0-9 during the 80s and we ran around like loving idiots, crashing our bikes, trying to climb trees, we did actually eat mud and all that poo poo. It was alright, it took me until my late 20s to meet someone with an allergy - nuts, tomatoes and apples apparently If the tomatoes and apples are cooked then it's fine.
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Mar 17, 2019 18:23
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jabby posted:Rub your kids in dirt and shove peanut butter in their faces, for their health. Thanks Dr Steve Brule
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Mar 17, 2019 18:24
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I was a mucky kid who covered himself in live ladybirds and spent most of the first seven years of my life rolling around in mud on a Tameside hillside, so I've never found the hygiene hypothesis super convincing for myself. Similarly, while I (imo) probably developed my peanut allergy from prudently avoiding them most of my life, it's unclear to me when I would have been skipping out on trying the rest of the bastards, relative to everyone else. My mum certainly had enough of them around the house. The first time I tried I was off to the hospital. Since moving to London I think I'm picking up asthma too, so that's nice.
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Mar 17, 2019 18:25
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josh04 posted:Since moving to London I think I'm picking up asthma too, so that's nice. Nah, that's just the London seeping into your being, give it a couple of years and you'll suddenly find yourself at Nandos campaigning for TIG. It's like a zombie virus but turns you into a MP.
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Mar 17, 2019 18:29
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My mum ate nuts all her life, until her mid-thirties, when a near-fatal allergic reaction to a handful of peanuts ruined Christmas morning. That was loving frightening to watch as a young child.
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Mar 17, 2019 18:31
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josh04 posted:I was a mucky kid who covered himself in live ladybirds and spent most of the first seven years of my life rolling around in mud on a Tameside hillside, so I've never found the hygiene hypothesis super convincing for myself.  It's that we lack certain specific helminths in our gut that have been eradicated from the wider human population in the area. Ones that can cause bad things (malnutrition, anemia) if you have too many of them, but are symbiotic in the numbers that most people would have had if they weren't paddling in sewage all day.
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Mar 17, 2019 18:33
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Yeah, the immune system is SUPER weird, type 1 diabetes is basically just it deciding 'you know what, you don't need a functional pancreas any more' and eating your islet cells. It can come at more or less any time of life, essentially without warning. I hate hayfever but I'm incredibly glad that it's my only noticeable allergy.
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Mar 17, 2019 18:34
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Guavanaut posted:The helminthic hygiene hypothesis isn't that kids are too clean and stay indoors all the time instead of hunting for woods porn like in my day Ah, the worms specifically seem kinda plausible. I never had worms. The other thing that people always bring up is that study from a few years ago suggesting that you could work a peanut allergy down by microdosing, which is extremely intuitive - but as far as I know, trying that with the other nut allergies will just gradually cause me to die.
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Mar 17, 2019 18:39
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OwlFancier posted:Dynamite should be an option. Or at least cheer on their descent into loving irrelevance. My main worry is what the hell is going to replace it. How do we create a completely objective source of information from nothing? (My prediction is we don't and every single news source devolves into people yelling at each other)
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Mar 17, 2019 18:45
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Angrymog posted:Did walnut-girl pass the exam? Yes  Getting allergic later in life: Yes I got allergic to alcohol mid 40s. Took me a while to realize that that was what was happening to me - tachycardia, rocketing high blood pressure - could feel the blood literally thumping in my veins! Haven't drunk alcohol now since 2005. That said, I have recently partaken of a liquer chocolate (just one, with baileys) with no harmful effects. I can also use it as a skin rub and if it's in mouth wash (and I spit that out when I use it). Also, I am extremely allergic to quorn. Had it twice with no apparent effects then the third time - wham. Jaeluni Asjil fucked around with this message at 18:53 on Mar 17, 2019 |
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Mar 17, 2019 18:49
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:I was thinking of how we used to make 'mud pies' back in the olden days (1960s). I bet kids don't do that now! Living in a moderate amount of filth made me the man I am today 
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Mar 17, 2019 18:55
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AceOfFlames posted:My main worry is what the hell is going to replace it. How do we create a completely objective source of information from nothing? You don't, the whole reason I get my media filtered through things like twitter is because you can very easily see or find out the biases of the person doing the reporting. People can try for objectivity with varying results, but the idea of objective reporting as a workable ideal is and always has been complete horseshit.
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Mar 17, 2019 18:57
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AceOfFlames posted:My main worry is what the hell is going to replace it. How do we create a completely objective source of information from nothing? You can’t have a completely objective source of news information, everything has a bias, for a whole host of reasons. A solution then is to regulate extreme cases via some sensible standards, and then support a varied industry that isn’t just a handful of sources all owned and run by a similar set of individuals.
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Mar 17, 2019 18:57
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AceOfFlames posted:My main worry is what the hell is going to replace it. How do we create a completely objective source of information from nothing? You don't. You let go of the idea that that is a thing you can have and have ever had. Objectivity is not a thing that can stem from a source, objectivity is a process which involves effort and participation.
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Mar 17, 2019 19:05
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jabby posted:Immunology is hella interesting, the fact that our immune systems work at all is insane. For example, when a virus like flu mutates it's outer proteins it creates a molecule that has almost certainly never existed in the universe before. Isn't that true of most genes? I get your awe of the immune system though, I find it utterly fascinating. Kurzgesagt has done some videos on it which are excellent, but sadly they're all old and they've not done any more since (which is a huge shame) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQGOcOUBi6s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0opgc1WoS4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRv19gkZ4E0
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Mar 17, 2019 19:05
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Hobo posted:You can’t have a completely objective source of news information, everything has a bias, for a whole host of reasons. I remember being told that all sources contain at a minimum the bias of the person they came from and (if a secondary source) the biases of the sources that person consulted, and that you should consider what those biases might be as well as your own back in pre-GCSE history lessons. The teacher brought in some copies of trash-tier tabloids from various different countries all poo poo-talking people from other countries as a simple way to illustrate that, and it's disappointing that people keep looking for the One True Unbiased Source rather than conceding that it's something that can barely be approximated. OwlFancier posted:You don't. You let go of the idea that that is a thing you can have and have ever had. (And that is a critical failure of our media class.)
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Mar 17, 2019 19:10
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Also unless you're doing like, engineering or medicine, who even gives a poo poo about objectivity? I'd rather have someone who is extremely unobjectively committed to loving up the rich and empowering everyone else than someone who very objectively doesn't want to do either of those things.
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Mar 17, 2019 19:14
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https://news.sky.com/story/police-treating-surrey-stabbing-as-a-terrorist-incident-11668741quote:Police declare terrorism incident after teenager stabbed in Surrey I have to assume there's considerably more than "Man shouts racist things and stabs someone" because god knows they don't like to break out the t-word if it involves white people. Anyway, assuming it gets even mild traction in the media, look for lots of think pieces about how we need to ban Facebook printed next to stories about how raping white children is one of the core tenets of Islam.
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Mar 17, 2019 19:16
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OwlFancier posted:Also unless you're doing like, engineering or medicine, who even gives a poo poo about objectivity? I'd rather have someone who is extremely unobjectively committed to loving up the rich and empowering everyone else than someone who very objectively doesn't want to do either of those things. Then how do you know if you are right? If you counter with "there is no "right way", objective truth is an illusion" then what is there to guide us? Feelings can easily lead us down the dark paths that the fash are going down.
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Mar 17, 2019 19:20
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OwlFancier posted:You don't. You let go of the idea that that is a thing you can have and have ever had. In my ideal world we'd have a lot more Monbiots, writing articles where the journalistic focus is on presenting an idea of why things are happening or where we might be going, and you learn "news" as a sort of side effect of reading this weird man's opinions on, say, veganism, and a lot fewer news sites just recycling press releases.
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Mar 17, 2019 19:20
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OwlFancier posted:Also unless you're doing like, engineering or medicine, who even gives a poo poo about objectivity? I'd rather have someone who is extremely unobjectively committed to loving up the rich and empowering everyone else than someone who very objectively doesn't want to do either of those things. But they would have to be major newspapers and not just niche ventures. It'd be nice to see newspapers that wouldn't talk about Jihadi Babies and Angelic white supremacist Babs and where 'female' was a standpoint for the journalism rather than a section like 'properties' and 'sport'. Regardless of whether they'd be more or less 'objective' that would make them less 'actual poo poo, from an arse'. I'm not sure whether British society could survive the shock of the change though.
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Mar 17, 2019 19:23
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I grew up running around in the woods, petting the family dogs etc and I still got all the animal/dust/pollen allergies and asthma and all that bs. It's cool if the research actually points to exposure as helping kids to avoid developing allergies, I'm just wary of anything that sounds like "the problem with kids today is" I've never had a super serious reaction to anything except lime cordial though. totally fine with limes, lime juice, lime sweets, limeade, limeys, but I drank some of that stuff on a school trip and my throat closed up so I couldn't breathe and I thought I was gonna die at Medieval Times jabby posted:Immunology is hella interesting, the fact that our immune systems work at all is insane. For example, when a virus like flu mutates it's outer proteins it creates a molecule that has almost certainly never existed in the universe before. And your immune system is capable of chopping that molecule up and creating an antibody that sticks to it through sheer brute force of random chance. While all the time deleting any antibodies it creates that might attack your own tissues. And all within a few hours or days of you becoming infected. It blows my mind to imagine it. Actually I think you'll find evolution is a myth
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Mar 17, 2019 19:24
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AceOfFlames posted:Then how do you know if you are right? If you counter with "there is no "right way", objective truth is an illusion" then what is there to guide us? Feelings can easily lead us down the dark paths that the fash are going down. Well I know I'm right because marx makes sense. My point is I don't care why you think what you think as long as you do good things. Equally I don't give a poo poo why you think what you think if what you think leads you to do bad things. Intent is irrelevant other than insofar as it leads to good outcomes. But the outcomes are what matter. So it's real easy to write off huge swathes of thought because they lead to poo poo outcomes. Lots of effort saved there. And outcomes are real easy to judge too. Safe, happy, healthy, productive people = good. Unsafe, unhappy, unhealthy people stuck doing stupid poo poo = bad. So when someone comes along saying about how we have to be real careful about upsetting the wealth creators you can just mentally dub them over with the charlie brown's mam noise. Cos it's about as relevant or meaningful. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 19:27 on Mar 17, 2019 |
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Mar 17, 2019 19:24
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AceOfFlames posted:Then how do you know if you are right? If you counter with "there is no "right way", objective truth is an illusion" then what is there to guide us? Feelings can easily lead us down the dark paths that the fash are going down. Nah, nah, you misunderstand: it's not "there is no objective truth" in terms of ideology*, it's that it's not even possible to simply present a litany of facts in a way that doesn't paint a particular picture and lead readers to certain conclusions. e/ so the point is to abandon the idea that objective news can exist, because it can't, and even if it did (or we had something that at least satisfied your personal definition of objectivity), it would still influence people in a particular way, and not necessarily a good one. Arguably always a bad way actually, because people would appeal to the supposed objectivity of their news sources as a reason they can't be wrong *there isn't, but that's not what we're talking about. Renaissance Robot fucked around with this message at 19:37 on Mar 17, 2019 |
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Mar 17, 2019 19:26
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 The NZ Prime Minister in a Hijab, hands clasped and emotional. That’s a real leader. UK: *dances on to stage to Abba*
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Mar 17, 2019 19:27
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Ratjaculation posted:UK: *dances on to stage to Abba* She sure is a wanker, OP. Can you imagine the media reaction if Corbyn did some poo poo like that 
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Mar 17, 2019 19:31
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Less focus on her stupid dancing and more focus on the time she went to Grenfell towers and hid from the survivors.
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Mar 17, 2019 19:44
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It is worth noting for the non-medically trained that our immune system doesn't recognise threats per se, it recognises non-self/foreign proteins and works against them. In this way it can be likened to the Home Office. We are all born with a massive, randomly generated library of antibodies aimed at various protein structures. During early childhood, the body prunes this library of any antibodies corresponding to its own proteins or things it considers innocuous (usually foods eg eggs, milk). Failure of this process is what eventually leads to autoimmunity and allergies, though some inherited genetic sequences also carry a higher risk - presumably because they are more likely to generate antibodies to "normal" human proteins. When a foreign protein is detected, it is picked up, rendered into conveniently sized chunks and then compared against this library until a match is found to direct the body's immune response.
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Mar 17, 2019 19:45
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Ratjaculation posted:
That said, photographing her through coloured glass makes her look like a sad clown at a children's party
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Mar 17, 2019 19:47
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AceOfFlames posted:Then how do you know if you are right? If you counter with "there is no "right way", objective truth is an illusion" then what is there to guide us? Feelings can easily lead us down the dark paths that the fash are going down.
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Mar 17, 2019 19:47
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Regarde Aduck posted:Less focus on her stupid dancing and more focus on the time she went to Grenfell towers and hid from the survivors. Just combine the two. https://twitter.com/Rachael_Swindon/status/1106921215447494656
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Mar 17, 2019 19:50
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AceOfFlames posted:Then how do you know if you are right? If you counter with "there is no "right way", objective truth is an illusion" then what is there to guide us? Feelings can easily lead us down the dark paths that the fash are going down. Well, that's philosophy innit? Humanity has spent its entire life pondering on these questions. And I'll say that cold, hard logic and reason have definitely taken people down some dark paths in the past (they weren't actually "rational and correct" and above emotion, they just believed that and used it as a way to justify what they were doing to people) You've seen those Christians in the US who say that the only thing stopping people (i.e. them) from committing robbery and rape etc is that they've been told it's wrong, and they have to follow the rules, right? They believe they're doing the "right" thing because there's an explicit moral code, a big judge in the sky giving the thumbs up, but I'm pretty sure we can all agree they're not "right" because their attitudes and perspective are bad, it's not ok to believe these things are acceptable, and even their motivations for not acting on them are questionable (coercion or reward vs some sense that their thoughts are wrong and they need to avoid harming people) It sounds like you're looking for an easy answer, something to follow - and honestly there are lots of them, you just need to use your own existing sense of right and wrong to work out what appeals to you. If you're left wing already you obviously feel that things like equality, social justice, solidarity etc are all important things, and I'm sure you can work out why they're important to you, why the opposite leads to outcomes you consider bad, etc e- oh you were talking about the media specifically lol well the same thing applies, you need to critically assess what you're reading and realistically that means developing a bs detector for "fair and accurate reporting of the facts" that reinforces bad ideas and bad narratives. There's no single truth that will unfold and redefine the world and the people in it once it's discovered baka kaba fucked around with this message at 19:56 on Mar 17, 2019 |
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Mar 17, 2019 19:50
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baka kaba posted:I grew up running around in the woods, petting the family dogs etc and I still got all the animal/dust/pollen allergies and asthma and all that bs. It's cool if the research actually points to exposure as helping kids to avoid developing allergies, I'm just wary of anything that sounds like "the problem with kids today is" I grew up on a farm in the woods, surrounded by animals and nature and poo poo, and if I go off my medication my immune system will eat my skin. Worm treatment would have been nice.
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Mar 17, 2019 19:56
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I survived biking without a helmet, no seatbelt, lead paint and indoor smoking Like and share if you did too.
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Mar 17, 2019 19:58
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thespaceinvader posted:Yeah, the immune system is SUPER weird, type 1 diabetes is basically just it deciding 'you know what, you don't need a functional pancreas any more' and eating your islet cells. What do you call it when that happens, but it stopped at 50% of your islet cells? Cause that's what happened to me. Weird they ain't growing back either though and the remaining 50% aren't being killed off.
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