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This is great. More to the point, I can get behind a reviewer who would rather talk about stuff they like than stuff they don't like.
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Mar 26, 2019 16:09
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The thing is Ginkgopolis is over-hyped and not a very good game due to the high amount of luck/chaos with more than 2-3 players. I guess if you want to stick to those player counts it's neat. I really need to get rid of my copy ASAP if they plan on reprinting it.
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Mar 26, 2019 16:11
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Megasabin posted:The thing is Ginkgopolis is over-hyped and not a very good game due to the high amount of luck/chaos with more than 2-3 players. I guess if you want to stick to those player counts it's neat. I really need to get rid of my copy ASAP if they plan on reprinting it. Steph Hodge specifically says gink is her favorite game of all time and will never play it other than 2-3 player, so...maybe overhyped isn't the right word? Not great for all player counts, perhaps? I wouldn't recommend all games I love for all player counts, either.
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Mar 26, 2019 16:16
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dwarf74 posted:This is great. You should try listening to SVWAG: https://www.spreaker.com/user/10238956 They are very good at pinpointing what it is about games they don’t like and explaining what they do like about games. While they’ll outright admit they like this or that game because it’s “fun” (whatever subjective nonsense that means), they also enjoy talking about the mechanics or how compelling certain features are. Megasabin posted:The thing is Ginkgopolis is over-hyped and not a very good game due to the high amount of luck/chaos with more than 2-3 players. I guess if you want to stick to those player counts it's neat. I really need to get rid of my copy ASAP if they plan on reprinting it.
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Mar 26, 2019 16:23
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What are some of your favorite games that are older than 2-3 years and also not extremely heavy affairs (looking at you 18xx). I'm looking to trade some stuff in that otherwise wouldn't have resell value, and I'll get more for out of demand games. The easier to teach the better; bonus points if it is a solid 'engine' game that isn't RftG.
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Mar 26, 2019 16:33
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I want to know what his beef is with Hawaii.
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Mar 26, 2019 17:00
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Shadow225 posted:What are some of your favorite games that are older than 2-3 years and also not extremely heavy affairs (looking at you 18xx). I'm looking to trade some stuff in that otherwise wouldn't have resell value, and I'll get more for out of demand games. The easier to teach the better; bonus points if it is a solid 'engine' game that isn't RftG. These are my 10s/9s/8s of mediumish complexity pre 2016: 10 Dominion (and pretty much every expansion that's not Alchemy) Keyflower 9 Chaos in the Old World Terra Mystica Concordia Pandemic Legacy S1 Caylus Cuba Libre (on the heavier side of medium but very approachable) 8 Castles of Burgundy Captain Sonar A Game of Thrones board game 2nd edition (needs 6, although the new expansion may help with this) Dominant Species (stretching medium as far as it will go, you may consider this heavy) Tragedy Looper Kemet Tigris & Euphrates Brass Lancashire Hansa Teutonica Steam Chinatown Saint Petersburg 2nd Edition Ra Modern Art Battlestar Galactica Argent: The Consortium (heavier side of medium but very approachable imo) The Great Zimbabwe Santiago Chicago Express Orléans (needs intrigue expansion for replayability) Mombasa Triumph & Tragedy (3 player wargame that I would put in the high medium complexity, but it may be too much if you're not used to GMT wargames) T-Bone fucked around with this message at 17:14 on Mar 26, 2019 |
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Mar 26, 2019 17:07
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Lol.
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Mar 26, 2019 17:13
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Stumpus posted:Has there ever been a video where Tom Vassel has said he doesn't like a game? Or have I just not watched enough of his videos? There was that time he said he didn't like Dungeon Lords because it wasn't a dungeon crawl game.
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Mar 26, 2019 17:29
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T-Bone posted:These are my 10s/9s/8s of mediumish complexity pre 2016: Very cool list, thank you. Santiago looks interesting. I think it's about time Caylus entered my life. Discord I think has clockwork orange'd me into wanting to actually try Chicago Express. I'll definitely mull it over some more.
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Mar 26, 2019 17:44
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Oh and I missed Ginkgopolis there as one of my '8s'. I agree that it's not quite as good at 4-5 but it's a fantastic 2-3p game. Hopefully Pearl goes through with that reprint. e: oh and Space Alert, Space alert is a '9' T-Bone fucked around with this message at 18:58 on Mar 26, 2019 |
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Mar 26, 2019 18:01
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Poopy Palpy posted:There was that time he said he didn't like Dungeon Lords because it wasn't a dungeon crawl game. doesn't he dislike citow cause christianity or something?
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Mar 26, 2019 18:23
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SoftNum posted:doesn't he dislike citow cause christianity or something? Yes, he said he hated the game because it went against his Christian values and that he didn’t enjoy the thought of being a Chaos god destroying a fictional world.
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Mar 26, 2019 18:30
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T-Bone posted:Orléans (needs intrigue expansion for replayability) In case anyone missed it: https://www.dlp-games.de/shop/spiele/orleans-bundle_1032_1073 Still 53 left and two days left to buy it.
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Mar 26, 2019 18:50
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Power Grid got a new (Recharged) edition which reminded me that I never played it. What's the goon hivemind verdict on PG?
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Mar 26, 2019 18:58
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Terminally Bored posted:Power Grid got a new (Recharged) edition which reminded me that I never played it. What's the goon hivemind verdict on PG? It's a great game that kind of drags for me and gets a bit mathy. Playing with people who know what they're doing is nice. There's a fair amount of strategy in how to structure your bids and buy the resources to power your plants while still being able to afford everything and expand. Whole lotta balancing going on!
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Mar 26, 2019 19:04
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Yeah agreed on both points. It's very calculational and requires a group that knows what they're doing. I played the Italy map a couple of weeks ago and won pretty much because I got into a heads up auction with a player who didn't push me hard enough, which was pretty frustrating for the guy who finished 2nd. I think I've got it just below my '8s' in my rating. It's actually my dad's favorite game. The expansion maps are all pretty interesting and still widely available. I think if you like games like Chicago Express/Steam/Age of Steam or just tight auction games in general you'll probably get some kind of enjoyment out of Power Grid.
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Mar 26, 2019 19:07
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It also has the most egregious first player penalties in any game I've seen, to the point where it actively punishes you for playing well throughout instead of trying to snipe the win towards the end. That's fine in games like Kemet where it's all about jumping on the leader, but I hated it in an economic mathy game like PG.
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Mar 26, 2019 19:07
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I like Steam so I guess I'll try PG out. Thanks!Bottom Liner posted:It also has the most egregious first player penalties in any game I've seen, to the point where it actively punishes you for playing well throughout instead of trying to snipe the win towards the end. That's fine in games like Kemet where it's all about jumping on the leader, but I hated it in an economic mathy game like PG. Wait, how does it do that?
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Mar 26, 2019 19:10
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Oh hey BL I gave Clans of Caledonia a shot last night based on your hearty recommendation. I'm not sure if I like it as much as Terra Mystica but I do like that it's a bit more open and that the clans don't straightjacket you quite as much as TM's races sometimes can. I've always liked Navegador's market system and it was cool to see it in a more complex game (especially the way they apply it to the end game scoring with the export resources). It would seem that contracts are the dominant scoring method (and I think the designer sorta intended that). I had an insane board presence compared to the other players and still ended up losing by a couple of points to someone who went heavier into contracts. I think I probably could have won had the round scoring tiles been a bit more favorable to a board presence strategy, but yeah an interesting game for sure. You get a lot for such a small package.
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Mar 26, 2019 19:15
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Terminally Bored posted:I like Steam so I guess I'll try PG out. Thanks! quote:The catch-up mechanic in Power Grid favors players who are behind by granting two significant advantages. The player who is winning must bid first during the power plant auction. This opens up the possibility for the last player to gain a great power plant without needing pay much. Additionally, the player in last place gets to purchase resources first. As resources become more scarce, their cost goes up, so going first provides a huge advantage in this regard. I generally don't like catch up mechanics that punish the first player as opposed to helping the lower scores (same thing but different in execution, aversion loss, etc).
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Mar 26, 2019 19:19
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Its less that it penalizes the player in first and more that it hugely rewards positioning yourself later in turn order until the last turn.
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Mar 26, 2019 19:28
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taser rates posted:Its less that it penalizes the player in first and more that it hugely rewards positioning yourself later in turn order until the last turn. You go later in turn order by being lower in scoring. It rewards you for playing suboptimally and punishes you for playing well until the end. Some like that rubber band balance and love the game but it was a big sore spot for me.
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Mar 26, 2019 19:53
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Power Grid is a bit of a special case because it's more that the goal of the game is obfuscated than that it has a catch up mechanism. People tend to think that because the goal is "power the most cities on the final turn" that powering more cities on an intermediate turn means you're winning, but that's not at all the case because doing so doesn't actually affect your final score in any way. The actual game is balancing money recieved for powering and the ability to expand your network against turn order effects and the player auctioning plants first is often not the one who is winning. Of course, none of that is apparent to most people on the first few playthroughs which is a bit of a failure of the rulebook; I think it should be very explicit that number of houses placed is not necessarily a good measure of how well each player is doing and shouldn't be a goal in and of itself.
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Mar 26, 2019 19:54
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blackmongoose posted:Power Grid is a bit of a special case because it's more that the goal of the game is obfuscated than that it has a catch up mechanism. People tend to think that because the goal is "power the most cities on the final turn" that powering more cities on an intermediate turn means you're winning, but that's not at all the case because doing so doesn't actually affect your final score in any way. The actual game is balancing money recieved for powering and the ability to expand your network against turn order effects and the player auctioning plants first is often not the one who is winning. Of course, none of that is apparent to most people on the first few playthroughs which is a bit of a failure of the rulebook; I think it should be very explicit that number of houses placed is not necessarily a good measure of how well each player is doing and shouldn't be a goal in and of itself. This is also the case in Isle of Skye, where winning strategy is preparing to score late in the game. Catch-up mechanisms rub many people the wrong way, but in economic games they can work well.
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Mar 26, 2019 20:28
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Yeah, Power Grid's turn order bonus is simply another mechanism in the game, you have to decide on any given turn if what you're getting is worth moving to a worse spot in the order. I've had plenty of games led from the front, and plenty of others where the fight was to stay "worst".
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Mar 26, 2019 21:08
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My description of Power Grid is "Mario Kart the board game: if you're not first you get a blue shell, if you're first you're not winning." I used to have a lot of fondness for it, and unironically I think it could be rethemed as a racing game because that's basically what it is, but the moment I discovered other medium-heavy economic games like Container and Indonesia I dropped it like a bad hat.
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Mar 26, 2019 21:17
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It never even occurred to me to be annoyed about that mechanism in PG. I just took it as part of the strategy. There are lots of games where doing well right now hurts you later, even specifically in terms of turn order mechanisms.
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Mar 26, 2019 21:23
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Chill la Chill posted:You should try listening to SVWAG: https://www.spreaker.com/user/10238956 I feel like the (rare) times I post is mostly just to point out where you can play certain games online, but if you really just want to try it you can play it online at boite a jeux. Personally, I didn’t get the fuss about it, but tile placement generally isn’t my jam.
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Mar 26, 2019 21:28
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al-azad posted:My description of Power Grid is "Mario Kart the board game: if you're not first you get a blue shell, if you're first you're not winning." I used to have a lot of fondness for it, and unironically I think it could be rethemed as a racing game because that's basically what it is, but the moment I discovered other medium-heavy economic games like Container and Indonesia I dropped it like a bad hat. Would you consider Indonesia and Container equivalents? Container is so simple mechanically and can be taught in ten minutes, and it's been a while since I played it but I remember Indonesia being very heavy by comparison.
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Mar 26, 2019 21:30
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Bottom Liner posted:You go later in turn order by being lower in scoring. It rewards you for playing suboptimally and punishes you for playing well until the end. Some like that rubber band balance and love the game but it was a big sore spot for me. Yea like others have been saying, it's deceptive to describe it as a rubber banding mechanic when it's more like an element of positioning. It's like when people inaccurately describe late money strategies in fcm as come from behind victories when in reality they were winning all along, people just weren't looking at the right signs.
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Mar 26, 2019 21:48
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Stumpus posted:Has there ever been a video where Tom Vassel has said he doesn't like a game? Or have I just not watched enough of his videos? First off, Tom Vasel is sort of disliked around here. Not just because he's an easy-to-please neckbearded dork, but also because there have been Floridian goons claiming he is homophobic. Still, there is a geeklist that someone maintains that contains some of his negative reviews. This is a link to an extremely bad game from five years ago (holy crap five years what have I been doing with my life).
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Mar 26, 2019 22:00
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Chicago Express is 10 times the game Power Grid is with vastly less fiddling. The only compelling thing about PG for me is the market. I've also won games leading the entire time. Literally haven't played it since we got CE and Imperial. I'd rather play an 18xx but they're obviously in a different weight class and time commitment.
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Mar 26, 2019 22:07
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FulsomFrank posted:Would you consider Indonesia and Container equivalents? Indonesia I find pretty easy to teach all things considered with the heaviness being understanding how your actions create ripples. Out of the Splotter games I've played it's the least fragile: it's not easy but you won't go into a death spiral like FCM or Antiquity. Container is light upfront with a very heavy meta game. The game state is very fragile, with most first timers completely tanking the economy, and it takes a while to suss out how you can manipulate the market, what to bid at an auction, when to actually hold from auctioning, intentionally unbalancing your ship knowing that if one player buys it it'll tip their balance to the wrong end (you throw away the container type you have the most of at the end), and so on. The game can be played arbitrarily and you'll probably have a good time but after playing with a British couple a few weeks ago my third eye has been opened because I didn't think it would be so different with more aggressive (read: not as loving cheap and conservative as my friends) players.
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Mar 26, 2019 22:09
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GMT is still hinting at another 18xx being added to the P500 in the next couple of months in their latest newsletter. They did add their first ever cooperative game to this month's P500: https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/275586/banish-snakes-game-st-patrick-ireland They also released the art for the 1862 map: 
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Mar 26, 2019 22:22
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taser rates posted:Yea like others have been saying, it's deceptive to describe it as a rubber banding mechanic when it's more like an element of positioning. It's like when people inaccurately describe late money strategies in fcm as come from behind victories when in reality they were winning all along, people just weren't looking at the right signs. Eh, big late money in FCM is a gamble and a fail safe to players stalling and not pushing, evident by the trainer and first to 100 milestones tampering that strategy. They weren’t winning all along unless no one was trying to break the bank quickly or otherwise stop a late game play like that. But I see the point on Power Grid, I just don’t like how it feels in execution.
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Mar 26, 2019 22:27
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T-Bone posted:GMT is still hinting at another 18xx being added to the P500 in the next couple of months in their latest newsletter. Well it's not pink like 46 so that's an improvement. That co-op game is a bit 
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Mar 26, 2019 22:30
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cenotaph posted:Chicago Express is 10 times the game Power Grid is with vastly less fiddling. The only compelling thing about PG for me is the market. I've also won games leading the entire time. Literally haven't played it since we got CE and Imperial. I'd rather play an 18xx but they're obviously in a different weight class and time commitment. While I’m not going to disagree with your statement (Imperial and CE are both 10s for me), I think there’s still a niche for PG. PG is fiddly, but it’s not rules dense as long as one person is comfy with handling all the fiddling and giving new players an overview of what they’re doing, and how the market will fill. CE is simpler, but you can lose the game in one play, while PG is a little more forgiving while also not having the length of play that Imperial does. I don’t play PG much any more, as my group either leans towards small and fast or big and complicated, which puts a mid weight euro in and odd spot for us, but it still has a spot in my collection.
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Mar 26, 2019 22:35
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T-Bone posted:GMT is still hinting at another 18xx being added to the P500 in the next couple of months in their latest newsletter. Harsh loss conditions, according to BGG: quote:If you succeed in your endeavor, Christianity will thrive in Ireland, while paganism overruns Western Europe. The arts, writing, literature and history will flourish on the Emerald Isle! Soon, Irish missionaries will bring these civilizing attributes back to Great Britain and mainland Europe- as Thomas Cahill says in his book, the Irish will save Civilization.
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Mar 26, 2019 22:49
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| # ? May 11, 2024 14:21 |
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(((Civilization)))
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Mar 26, 2019 23:08
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