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Hieronymous Alloy posted:I'm not sure he "accepted" anything. From what I've seen so far this appears to be a unilateral move by the prosecutor. The early claims of a "deal" seem to have been amended/corrected. If he surrendered his bail money without a trial it required his consent as an act to happen. The only real thing we know about that money is that it wasn't done through the courts as per normal plea bargain or sentencing. It's a giant unaccountable wild card that could blow holes in darn near any theory until we understand what it was.
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Mar 27, 2019 14:44
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https://twitter.com/EmpireWriters/status/1110562098310873094
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Mar 27, 2019 14:50
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Snazzy Frocks posted:Do you think he'd accept paying $10k and community service if he was innocent? Moreso if he was actually attacked in a hate crime?
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Mar 27, 2019 14:57
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Snazzy Frocks posted:Do you think he'd accept paying $10k and community service if he was innocent? Moreso if he was actually attacked in a hate crime? Do you think “community service” was the likely outcome of 16 felony charges?
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Mar 27, 2019 15:10
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Snazzy Frocks posted:Do you think he'd accept paying $10k and community service if he was innocent? Moreso if he was actually attacked in a hate crime? Innocent people have been known to plead guilty and end up on death row.
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Mar 27, 2019 15:15
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Data Graham posted:Do you think “community service” was the likely outcome of 16 felony charges? He didn't even get sentenced. The excuse was "Well he does a lot of work in the community, so he can just keep doing that". Iean the work he does in the community is LGBT and BLM activism so the DA saying to keep saying the cops ain't poo poo to minority groups is hilarious
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Mar 27, 2019 15:18
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Your Parents posted:Like, the two guys he paid are on video buying rope and masks and red hats. sexpig by night posted:what actually was on the tape was them buying masks before a polar vortex, and I think it was actually tape they were getting not rope. Yeah this is what I heard, that the only thing on video was them buying masks in cold weather, and CPD lied about the rest, anyone have a source on that E: And what's these guys' motive now? It was supposed to be a $3,500 check (seems low to commit a crime but I guess we all assumed they were poor black immigrants who would do anything for a nickel amiright), but now we've found out that was a cop lie and the money was for their personal training services so uhhhh now they did it just to make white people sad? VitalSigns fucked around with this message at 16:19 on Mar 27, 2019 |
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Mar 27, 2019 15:48
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VitalSigns posted:Yeah this is what I heard, that the only thing on video was them buying masks in cold weather, and CPD lied about the rest, anyone have a source on that Someone posted a screenshot of a leaked video of them buying the masks in the last Uspol thread, I'm sure someone could find it with some searching. TMZ had a copy of the check/memo line and the breakdown of their services for his upcoming music video. Actually checking Jussie's tag on TMZ might turn all this up. I'd try but I'm having trouble doing stuff atm.
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Mar 27, 2019 15:52
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Koalas March posted:Someone posted a screenshot of a leaked video of them buying the masks in the last Uspol thread, I'm sure someone could find it with some searching. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2XYAsj5ORs
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Mar 27, 2019 15:55
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Z. Autobahn posted:Like my best guess at this point is a Coen Bros-esque poo poo-show where a variety of people have all made stupid or sketchy choices, even when they're at odds with each other; we just don't know which people those are or what their choices were. The best part is, in a very Coen Bros way, if he did it or not is completely irrelevant to the current outcome. Say the cops provably, through their own leaks, fabricated evidence to get a warrant. Now all evidence collected as a result of that is tainted. So it doesn't matter what they found, or made up after that, it's all tainted. So the DA is put between a rock and a hard place, and does this weird rear end deal normally reserved for idiot teenagers. And Smollett is given a choice between paying 10g or dealing with a bunch of cops who can, will, and have murdered people for not playing along.
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Mar 27, 2019 15:57
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Relentless posted:The best part is, in a very Coen Bros way, if he did it or not is completely irrelevant to the current outcome. That's my take, yeah. Whatever he did (or, probably, didn't) do, the case has now been so hopelessly screwed and tattooed there's no way to continue without it being an even bigger clusterfuck anyway. Dropping the whole thing is the only rational choice for the DA no matter how much the cops poo poo themselves over it.
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Mar 27, 2019 16:11
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Captain Invictus posted:That's what the cops want, though. Muddy the waters. Make you not believe the victim immediately. Right, but Smoullette is the one who both surrendered his bond and then proclaimed he was exonerated, which is mutually exclusive to me.
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Mar 27, 2019 16:56
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HootTheOwl posted:Right, but Smoullette is the one who both surrendered his bond and then proclaimed he was exonerated, which is mutually exclusive to me. In his situation, is that 10k worth staying in a fight with CPD?
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Mar 27, 2019 16:57
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Crossposting from the cop thread: CWB Chicago got the case files for the Smollett case quote:CWBChicago is posting the complete Chicago Police Department investigative file on the Jussie Smollett "hate crime" investigation that we have received in response to a Freedom of Information Act request. Megillah Gorilla fucked around with this message at 17:22 on Mar 27, 2019 |
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Mar 27, 2019 17:03
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I don't normally assume someone is guilty of a crime because the cops successfully shook them down for money, and I'm not going to start now even if it is a black guy
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Mar 27, 2019 17:05
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SNIP - actually, this is better in the cops thread.
Megillah Gorilla fucked around with this message at 17:21 on Mar 27, 2019 |
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Mar 27, 2019 17:11
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Relentless posted:In his situation, is that 10k worth staying in a fight with CPD? If it was 10k to get the CPD to layoff, why did they have that press conference with the mayor?
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Mar 27, 2019 18:13
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Maybe the cops who thought they could pass off a check to personal trainers for personal training as a "help me kick my own rear end" payment aren't the most reasonable people, and trying to apply some kind of hyperrational game theory to prove someone must be guilty of something in order to explain the cops throwing a temper tantrum is dumb
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Mar 27, 2019 18:16
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From the police reports posted earlier in the thread they weren't allowed a look at the check itself, just the deposit and the amount.
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Mar 27, 2019 18:21
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Were they also not allowed to know what those guys do for a living and not allowed to check their public website for rates
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Mar 27, 2019 18:24
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My buddy and I were talking about it this morning. The issue is even if Smollett did fake the attack the cops are so used to half assing things particularly when dealing with black people that they undoubtedly did all kinds of shady poo poo just from habit. It's like OJ, he was almost certainly guilty but the cops were so corrupt and racist and so used to being able to rail road poor black people who lacked financial resources that it was trivial for a person with actual power and resources to expose all of their malfeasance. Given the history of the CPD I guaranty they did some shady hosed up poo poo just because that's how they are used to operating and the DA knew full well that if it went to trail all that poo poo would be aired to the public. For Smollett's part of course he's going to happily take the deferred prosecution and a $10k loss. Trials are risky and convict innocent people all of the loving time so only an idiot would chose to go to trial if they have a choice. edit: Dyslexia sucks Skex fucked around with this message at 18:55 on Mar 27, 2019 |
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Mar 27, 2019 18:33
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As a non gang-affiliated famous gay dude, ie a huge target, yes you'd pay ten grand to get out of chicago city lockup without even thinking twice about it
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Mar 27, 2019 19:59
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According to my research of recently watching random episodes of the Shield, the cops probably would have murdered Jussie if it looked like he was about to be released and staged it as a suicide.
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Mar 27, 2019 21:33
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Herstory Begins Now posted:As a non gang-affiliated famous gay dude, ie a huge target, yes you'd pay ten grand to get out of chicago city lockup without even thinking twice about it He was already out of lockup; he posted bond last month.
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Mar 27, 2019 23:34
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The CPD is corrupt as hell, but none of us have any idea what the hell is going on with this clusterfuck, and we should all stop pretending that we do know. We don't know if he actually was attacked and was framed by the cops, and we don't know if he faked it and the cops simply screwed up the case, and we don't what the DA's motives really are. None of you really know jack poo poo, and neither do I. In theory there's nothing wrong with speculating, but because this is a hot button issue, it is unfortunately inevitable that certain people here are going to assume you are a chud slobbering all over cop dick if you don't pick your words very very carefully. predicto fucked around with this message at 23:48 on Mar 27, 2019 |
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Mar 27, 2019 23:43
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:The problem with that theory is that all the claims supporting the notion that Jussie faked anything -- are sourced through the cops, who we now know were acting in bad faith. I don't know that we know this. It's just very likely given what the DA did, presuming the DA is not a total moron. The part where the DA may have just forced themselves into retirement due to irreparable breakdown in trust with the police is also interesting.
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Mar 27, 2019 23:43
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Skex posted:My buddy and I were talking about it this morning. The issue is even if Smollett did fake the attack the cops are so used to half assing things particularly when dealing with black people that they undoubtedly did all kinds of shady poo poo just from habit. It's like OJ, he was almost certainly guilty but the cops were so corrupt and racist and so used to being able to rail road poor black people who lacked financial resources that it was trivial for a person with actual power and resources to expose all of their malfeasance. If I was forced to make a guess with a gun to my head, this is the guess I would make.
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Mar 27, 2019 23:49
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Snazzy Frocks posted:Do you think he'd accept paying $10k and community service if he was innocent? Moreso if he was actually attacked in a hate crime? lol spotted the person whose government isn't "Prison Hell"
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Mar 28, 2019 00:00
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tbh I feel like 95% of the people still insisting the story is fake are just because it "feels fake" and are being guided by their intuitions. Not the idea of a gay black man being attacked, obviously, but the specific details. Like I remember during the Kavanaugh thing there was a Twitter thread by a professor who specializes in hoax claims, and she listed her list of things to look for as a way of showing that Ford's testimony was legitimate, things like how hoaxes tend towards overkill and clean easily followable narratives (the perps yelling exactly how they knew him and why they were doing it), while real claims tend to have lots of unrelated or even 'narratively contradictory' details (like how in the Kavanaugh case, the other boy falling on Brett is a bit of almost-slapstick). Like there's zero evidence that it was fake at this point, but I think a lot of people just think it 'feels fake' and that's a hard feeling to shake (Worth noting that it's entirely possible the attack was 'fake' in the sense that it was some people, like the brothers, loving with Jussie and he's still the victim who had nothing do to with it; this almost seems like the most plausible scenario at this point). Z. Autobahn fucked around with this message at 01:06 on Mar 28, 2019 |
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Mar 28, 2019 01:01
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If you have businessy chuddy types in your sphere: "Corporate America brought $664.9 billion of offshore profits back to the U.S. last year, falling short of the $4 trillion President Donald Trump said would return as a result of the 2017 tax overhaul." https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-03-27/trump-s-offshore-cash-promise-falters-as-665-billion-returns
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Mar 28, 2019 02:23
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Z. Autobahn posted:tbh I feel like 95% of the people still insisting the story is fake are just because it "feels fake" and are being guided by their intuitions. Not the idea of a gay black man being attacked, obviously, but the specific details. Like I remember during the Kavanaugh thing there was a Twitter thread by a professor who specializes in hoax claims, and she listed her list of things to look for as a way of showing that Ford's testimony was legitimate, things like how hoaxes tend towards overkill and clean easily followable narratives (the perps yelling exactly how they knew him and why they were doing it), while real claims tend to have lots of unrelated or even 'narratively contradictory' details (like how in the Kavanaugh case, the other boy falling on Brett is a bit of almost-slapstick). Everything seemed reasonably clear until the DA dropped/deferred (it is still unclear which they did, based on reports I've read), but a large part of that "clarity" comes from the PD attempting to try Smollett in the court of public opinion. This is a totally bizarre, extremely unusual story and your personal political predilections can shape what seems certain, unclear, doubtful, or impossible. Will be interesting to see if Smollett reappears on Empire.
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Mar 28, 2019 02:27
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If you want a non-shouty history review of the investigations into dear leader, Frontline did this the other day, after the Barr report: "For two years, special counsel Robert Mueller's probe into Russian meddling in the 2016 election has dominated headlines. Drawing from interviews with U.S. officials, Trump advisers, legal experts and journalists, FRONTLINE offers an inside look into the investigation that President Donald Trump has continually deemed a "witch hunt." " https://www.pbs.org/video/mueller-investigation-hleb8x/ I've only seen the first half hour, so don't spoiler the end!  But do watch for Bannon speaking less kindly of the current state of things.
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Mar 28, 2019 02:31
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Sodomy Hussein posted:Everything seemed reasonably clear until the DA dropped/deferred (it is still unclear which they did, based on reports I've read), but a large part of that "clarity" comes from the PD attempting to try Smollett in the court of public opinion. This is a totally bizarre, extremely unusual story and your personal political predilections can shape what seems certain, unclear, doubtful, or impossible.
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Mar 28, 2019 02:35
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Sodomy Hussein posted:I don't know that we know this. Yeah we do, even if we assume that the cops were just too stupid/incompetent to figure out why someone who needs personal training would write personal trainers a check for their personal training fee, and chalk up all the other info they leaked which turned out to be false as them being too stupid to do their jobs, you can't chalk up leaking damaging information about an active investigation to the press up to incompetence that was definitely bad faith.
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Mar 28, 2019 03:59
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VitalSigns posted:Yeah we do, even if we assume that the cops were just too stupid/incompetent to figure out why someone who needs personal training would write personal trainers a check for their personal training fee, and chalk up all the other info they leaked which turned out to be false as them being too stupid to do their jobs, you can't chalk up leaking damaging information about an active investigation to the press up to incompetence that was definitely bad faith. Point of clarity, the information they leaked has not been proven true or untrue, but at some point a grand jury did pass down 16 counts.
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Mar 28, 2019 04:05
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On the one hand, thanks WaPo:quote:Was there a plea deal? On the other hand, woof, there's a lot to unpack here: quote:If prosecutors had a strong case against Smollett, why would they drop the charges? https://www.washingtonpost.com/arts...m=.29b52422adae
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Mar 28, 2019 04:12
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Okay, the discussion is still going, so I'll post what I put in the cop thread here. I read through all the files the cops released in the Smollett case. <Link to files here via CWB Chicago who did the FoI request> <Link to me going through all the files in the cops thread> There's no security camera footage or interrogation tapes in the files, just what the police put in every report they filed related to the case. In short: Apart from the confessions of the two brothers, the cops have nothing. There is not a single thing in those police reports, not a single piece of physical evidence, which directly links Smollett to the attack beyond some incredibly flimsy circumstantial evidence. Seriously go read the reports for yourselves, the entire case relies on the testimony of two immigrants who were most likely threatened with deportation or just being tossed into an ICE dungeon. The interviews with the brothers read as "[redacted] was shown a length of rope. [redacted] agreed rope was used in the crime." "[redacted] was shown bottle. [redacted] agreed bottle was used to pour bleach on Smollett" They lead them by the hand (or dragged them) the whole way. The reports do not contain a single thing the brothers volunteered about the case which the police did not already tell them to say. Megillah Gorilla fucked around with this message at 04:43 on Mar 28, 2019 |
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Mar 28, 2019 04:37
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Sodomy Hussein posted:Point of clarity, the information they leaked has not been proven true or untrue, but at some point a grand jury did pass down 16 counts. It's a well worn saying that a prosecutor could indict a ham sandwich.
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Mar 28, 2019 08:19
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Why even bother with a trial, if you're indicted you must be guilty
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Mar 28, 2019 08:27
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Sodomy Hussein posted:Point of clarity, the information they leaked has not been proven true or untrue, but at some point a grand jury did pass down 16 counts. 'why would you be at a trial if you weren't guilty' is some deeply fascist logic my dude
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Mar 28, 2019 14:37
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