You know what still gets me about this series, is the title: The Sword of Truth. Sight unseen, it sounds like it's going to be a metaphor or something, like the titles of the Robert Jordan books — The Path of Daggers, A Crown of Swords, that sort of thing. Just poetic names with only the most tangential and figurative relation to the story. But then you read it and it turns out that no, it's literally about a sword that does Truth things. Like it has the loving word truth written on it It'd be like if The Fires of Heaven turned out to be about the atmosphere catching fire and burning, and not like in a poetic way like if you shot a nuclear missile into them, more like if someone set a campfire in the troposphere and God got third degree burns
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# ? Mar 26, 2019 13:34 |
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# ? Jun 10, 2024 06:56 |
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Data Graham posted:You know what still gets me about this series, is the title: The Sword of Truth. Sight unseen, it sounds like it's going to be a metaphor or something, like the titles of the Robert Jordan books — The Path of Daggers, A Crown of Swords, that sort of thing. Just poetic names with only the most tangential and figurative relation to the story. But then you read it and it turns out that no, it's literally about a sword that does Truth things. Like it has the loving word truth written on it What I remember from attending a Terry Goodkind signing in uhhh 2004 was that he grew to hate the sword imagery and saw it as a necessary evil to get people hooked and reading his message. He was proud of fighting with the publisher to remove the sword illustration from the chapter headings and the map from the front pages. These were the trappings of fantasy, and he did not view himself as a fantasy author but as a creator of provocative Literature.
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# ? Mar 26, 2019 16:35 |
wizzardstaff posted:What I remember from attending a Terry Goodkind signing in uhhh 2004 was that he grew to hate the sword imagery and saw it as a necessary evil to get people hooked and reading his message. He was proud of fighting with the publisher to remove the sword illustration from the chapter headings and the map from the front pages. These were the trappings of fantasy, and he did not view himself as a fantasy author but as a creator of provocative Literature. Look he just wanted to be able to say god was a rick rahl and the Man kept telling him he needed swords for truth.
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# ? Mar 26, 2019 17:54 |
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Data Graham posted:You know what still gets me about this series, is the title: The Sword of Truth. Sight unseen, it sounds like it's going to be a metaphor or something, like the titles of the Robert Jordan books — The Path of Daggers, A Crown of Swords, that sort of thing. Just poetic names with only the most tangential and figurative relation to the story. But then you read it and it turns out that no, it's literally about a sword that does Truth things. Like it has the loving word truth written on it For most of my life I thought "Sword of Truth" was "Sword of Shannara" which features a sword that literally reveals the truth. That's until I read this thread and discovered that "Sword of Truth" is far worse than the fantasy schlock of my youth and doesn't even have a Sword of Truth. It has a Sword of Beserker Rage with "Truth" scratched on the side by some rear end in a top hat.
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 05:44 |
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Mr. Prokosch posted:For most of my life I thought "Sword of Truth" was "Sword of Shannara" which features a sword that literally reveals the truth. That's until I read this thread and discovered that "Sword of Truth" is far worse than the fantasy schlock of my youth and doesn't even have a Sword of Truth. It has a Sword of Beserker Rage with "Truth" scratched on the side by some rear end in a top hat. Isn't it even dumber, in that "truth" is written in raised lettering on the grip?
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 07:42 |
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Mr. Prokosch posted:For most of my life I thought "Sword of Truth" was "Sword of Shannara" which features a sword that literally reveals the truth. That's until I read this thread and discovered that "Sword of Truth" is far worse than the fantasy schlock of my youth and doesn't even have a Sword of Truth. It has a Sword of Beserker Rage with "Truth" scratched on the side by some rear end in a top hat. How about you show some respect for The Sword of Truth! (which only lets you harm people if the wielder, subjectively, believes them to be wicked)
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 09:00 |
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There's an illustration of the sword hilt as drawn by a 7-year-old in at least one of the books. Here's a replica someone made from that:
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 09:12 |
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Shaking lemur butt posted:How about you show some respect for The Sword of Truth! (which only lets you harm people if the wielder, subjectively, believes them to be wicked) The wielder is the ultimate avatar of rationalism so they will always be objectively correct.
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 09:41 |
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Isn't the only "Truth" revealed the knowledge of which Box of Orden is the one that activates Godmode?
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 10:19 |
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gschmidl posted:There's an illustration of the sword hilt as drawn by a 7-year-old in at least one of the books. Is the hilt misaligned on purpose?
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 11:34 |
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Thanks, I loving hate this. Zedd's in the nearly-abandoned city of Aydindril, still guarding the Wizard's Keep. Setting off an ancient Anyway, here's this part. Had we gotten here sooner I might have just brushed past this, or waved onwards while making a comment about "smug logic-lords", but in this day and age, it takes on a certain special bitter tang: quote:Zedd held no illusions about ending the threat of the Imperial Order simply by killing Jagang. Jagang was merely the brute who led other brutes in enforcing blind faith in the Order, a blind faith that embraced death as salvation from what it preached was the corrupt misery of life, a blind faith in which life itself had no value but as a bloody sacrifice upon the altar of altruism, a blind faith that blamed the failure of its own ideas on mankind for being wicked and for failing to offer sufficient sacrifice in an endless quest for some illusive greater good that grew ever more distant, a blind faith in an Order that clung to power by feeding off the carcasses of the productive lives it ruined. I feel like before the current landscape we live in I would have called that chunk out in passing, but holy poo poo when that's a giant crisis a few fields don't know how to handle and my own is even going "yeah actually the reverse is true"... That does bring me to another thought, though. I know Goodkind is an objectivist, and that tends to go hand in hand with right-wing politics, or at the very least some libertarian poo poo. And this series has not shied away from political caricature and strawmen aplenty. So with the books continuing on at a relatively regular clip into the current time period? I think what I'm suddenly most morbidly curious about is how loving weird are the politics gonna get? Will there be a 2016 remastered Hildaberta Clangtor in the new novels? Am I going to see surreal fantasy Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez? (Yes I absolutely believe all of his targets are going to be women. No idea why.) I'm really chomping at the bit to find out now! Anyway, back to Zedd recounting where things are after his big scene in the last book: quote:For a time, after Jagang's army had moved on, they had wandered into the city, sometimes alone, sometimes in small groups, half starved, to search for food and to loot. Zedd had lost count of how many such men he had killed. I feel one thing that kinda kills me is that we never really get a sense of just how much the world has changed in Zedd's lifetime alone. It's been called out before but Zedd and Nathan were some of the most interesting characters by a mile just because they were old enough to have seen such alien poo poo to the rest of our cast. I guess the Sisters at the palace also count, but to a lesser degree given that most of them never did poo poo-all outside of the place. Anyway, Zedd's reminiscing lets us know that the Order armies have left the city for now and are going for "easier fare" - D'Hara, who don't have two absurdly pissed off old spellcasters holed up in the magical fortress from hell. He heads back inside (noticing three odd birds he doesn't recognize overhead, just to rub it in), and sets some physical traps and alarms as well on his return, anticipating that while anyone who gets inside might be able to see and try to pass his magical wards, they won't be looking for something as pedestrian as "bells on a string". When we leave him again, he's eating a lovely stew Adie made. Richard meets another dude from a few novels ago. Nicci went off to do some poo poo because Richard got sidetracked saving Kahlan, and the resistance is trying to use the Old World against the Order: specifically, all the roads. This is actually a giant plus in my book because that's exactly the kind of poo poo that changed Europe in history via the infrastructure Rome laid down, even if a lot of it went to poo poo as the empire crumbled - before Dream Daddy gets back from the New World, they're using the incredibly interconnected nature to spread their An absurdly grim fact is the following: quote:"More importantly, after eliminating those who resisted the Order's teachings, he filled the minds of children, who didn't know any better, with blind faith in those teachings, turning them into zealots eager to die for what they were taught was a noble cause— sacrifice to some all-consuming greater good. Those young men, their minds twisted with the teachings of the Order, are now off to the north conquering the New World, butchering any who will not take up their altruistic tenets." Nobody comments on this, but holy gently caress, they're straight up genociding an entire generation of the Old World. I really, really want to get into his post-failure R&K novels just to see if he does anything with the aftereffects of "I sent a mass of the world's population to another dimension and with it, most of the youth of a land mass the size of Russia". Probably not, but hey. Anyway, Nicci left a letter and a bundle. The letter says, in short: "Dear Richard and Kahlan - holy poo poo Jagang has done something loving horrifying and keep in mind I'm fantasy-Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS. I've left to go try and put a stop to that. In the meantime, y'all found a thing last novel that the guy writing these recaps didn't mention at all, so let me just point out it existed prior and, as you might expect when you look at it - it's a warning beacon. There are two of them paired, one in amber, one which I don't know anything about which will absolutely play into the climax of this novel. They're meant to warn you of something and I have no idea what it is. But anyway since it's shaped like Kahlan your wife probably hosed something up somehow. Love, Nicci" Cara touches the statue and it does ghost poo poo: quote:Cara wasn't pleased to find such a thing and didn't want to leave a representation of Kahlan lying about for anyone to find and to pick up for who-knew-what. Cara snatched it up, then, even though Richard started to yell at her to leave such a thing be. When she picked it up, it started turning translucent. In a panic, Cara set it back down. And before they can do anything with this, someone makes a noise, Richard draws the sword, and I'll leave you on a line that is probably supposed to make me fear for our hero, but instead I just chuckle: quote:The magic did not come out with the sword. ...actually I'm just gonna add one more line here and skip all of chapter 14, which is half "BODIES CRASHED INTO BODIES AND SWORDS ALSO CRASHED INTO BODIES" and half (literally half of the chapter) "Kahlan touched a man and used her power". This is loving endless and this is only a sample: quote:Kahlan's vision focused on the man bearing down on her. His arms lifted like a bear lost in a mad charge. His teeth were gritted with determination. A grimace twisted his face in his wild effort to reach her before she could dodge to the side, before she had a chance to escape. She knew he was too close for her to have that chance and so she didn't waste any effort in a useless attempt. THERE'S MORE PAGES OF THIS BEFORE IT'S DONE.
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 11:46 |
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They talk so much about how killing Jagang would not stop the Order, because they're an evil communist death cult, but this has always been bullshit. He's a dreamwalker, by far the strongest weapon in the Order's arsenal. The Sisters of the Light might very well have put a serious dent in Jagang's forces (when Zedd comes and rescues them from loving all up), but he has mages of his own to counter them. And most of these mages very much don't believe in the Order's teachings, but they're slaves to Jagang's dreamwalker powers. the_steve posted:Isn't the only "Truth" revealed the knowledge of which Box of Orden is the one that activates Godmode? The only objectively true fact, yes. Torrannor fucked around with this message at 13:15 on Mar 27, 2019 |
# ? Mar 27, 2019 12:02 |
END ME SCOOB posted:
Solidarity.
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 13:01 |
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the_steve posted:Isn't the only "Truth" revealed the knowledge of which Box of Orden is the one that activates Godmode? Engraved on the hilt is the word IDDQD.
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 13:03 |
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Torrannor posted:They talk so much about how killing Jagang would not stop the Order, because they're an evil communist death cult, but this has always been bullshit. He's a dreamwalker, by far the strongest weapon in the Order's arsenal. The Sisters of the Light might very well have put a serious dent in Jagang's forces (when Zedd comes and rescues them from loving all up), but he has mages of his own to counter them. And most of these mages very much don't believe in the Order's teachings, but they're slaves to Jagang's dreamwalker powers. Can't be a good fash if your enemy wasn't all powerful, but also very weak.
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 13:10 |
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END ME SCOOB posted:Nobody comments on this, but holy gently caress, they're straight up genociding an entire generation of the Old World. I really, really want to get into his post-failure R&K novels just to see if he does anything with the aftereffects of "I sent a mass of the world's population to another dimension and with it, most of the youth of a land mass the size of Russia". Probably not, but hey. Surprise! Everything continues as-is, including new evils.
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 13:14 |
This isn't a very good communist parallel with all the religion. as I recall when they do kill Jagang the IO falls apart The Yearded One's command of language is awful but I think we've made fun of it enough.
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 19:59 |
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TheGreatEvilKing posted:This isn't a very good communist parallel with all the religion. Hmm. The book pretty much ended like 10 pages after they killed Jagang IIRC, so when do we see the Order fall apart? In the sequels?
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 20:13 |
Torrannor posted:Hmm. The book pretty much ended like 10 pages after they killed Jagang IIRC, so when do we see the Order fall apart? In the sequels? I vaguely remember social order breaking down because Dick Roll was so good at sports
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 20:35 |
To be fair, he did accurately predict that an unfair referees call would start a soccer riot
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 20:54 |
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Torrannor posted:Hmm. The book pretty much ended like 10 pages after they killed Jagang IIRC, so when do we see the Order fall apart? In the sequels? Really, if you think about it, the Order pretty much wins. Sure, they lose Jagang, but, Richard gives them exactly what they wanted: A world without magic where they can all live in Strawman Pseudo-Communism.
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# ? Mar 27, 2019 23:37 |
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I've been catching up with the thread on and off for a while and now I'm finally caught up I'd like to say thanks for your cathartic comentary on this trash. Also why can't Dick's sister see the invisible man's 'shadow' in the sand? She definitely saw the fireball that she blocked in the last book. Ignoring that, as described wouldn't she have to be seeing the grains of sand where they would have been if the man wasn't there? Why doesn't she just see the man if she's unafected by the magic? This poo poo hurts my brain.
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# ? Mar 28, 2019 18:35 |
Data Graham posted:You know what still gets me about this series, is the title: The Sword of Truth. Sight unseen, it sounds like it's going to be a metaphor or something, like the titles of the Robert Jordan books — The Path of Daggers, A Crown of Swords, that sort of thing. Just poetic names with only the most tangential and figurative relation to the story. But then you read it and it turns out that no, it's literally about a sword that does Truth things. Like it has the loving word truth written on it Well um. The crown of swords is, in fact, the name Rand gave to the laurel crown. Cause there's swords in it, pointing down, making you feel them when you wear it. It's funny to me that the iron throne and the crown of swords both debuted in 1996. I don't know that any of the other books did that though. Towers of midnight are, y'know, some towers named that, but they're not literally midnight or made of pitch black magic essence of nightmare put there by wizards to protect the midnight castle or someshit.
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# ? Mar 28, 2019 19:29 |
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Mr Phillby posted:I've been catching up with the thread on and off for a while and now I'm finally caught up I'd like to say thanks for your cathartic comentary on this trash. If the spell was some sort of astral projection type thing where he wasn't physically there, but magically projected an illusionary/ethereal copy of himself, then she wouldn't see him because he isn't there. Of course, he shouldn't see her either...
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# ? Mar 28, 2019 19:33 |
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Magic system continues to be terrible, make no sense.
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# ? Mar 28, 2019 20:36 |
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silvergoose posted:Well um. The Towers of Midnight was also a name for the Forsaken, which fits the poetic criteria better. The "real" Towers of Midnight in Seanchan were never on-screen. Dirk the Average posted:If the spell was some sort of astral projection type thing where he wasn't physically there, but magically projected an illusionary/ethereal copy of himself, then she wouldn't see him because he isn't there. Of course, he shouldn't see her either... He did show up as some kind of astral projection, but I thought Richard saw him because some sand or dust particles swirled around the projection, making him visible? Then Jensen should have been able to see those, too.,even if she can't see the magic.
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# ? Mar 28, 2019 20:54 |
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the sand/dust was magic too, duh
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 00:45 |
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Types of Magic: Additive Subtractive Sand
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 09:23 |
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JcDent posted:Types of Magic: This tracks what with Jennsen being able to see the hourglass when it gets turned sideways. Sand: Magic for Everybody.
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 09:32 |
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END ME SCOOB posted:This tracks what with Jennsen being able to see the hourglass when it gets turned sideways. Sand: Magic for Everybody. maybe it's like how you usually can't see Stands if you aren't a Stand user, but you can see any physical objects that Stands are possessing or manipulating! oh god why am I comparing anything JoJos to this, what did Araki do to anybody
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 10:10 |
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I mean, a Stand is just Sand with tea. ...I'll see myself out.
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 10:20 |
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END ME SCOOB posted:I mean, a Stand is just Sand with tea. Noooo! Come back, we want to suffer with you through SoT! The evil pacifists are coming up, I wonder if that whole plot is as stupid as I remember.
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 12:34 |
I'll take stupider than you remember.
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 13:44 |
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It's real bad, I've read 75% of this one in note form.
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 19:40 |
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Given how one-note it is, I'm not surprised.
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 19:54 |
I demand you post the whole Richardinspirationalspeech.txt where he convinces them through his rightness that killing unarmed countrymen is the only moral action Also where he notes that the people hes
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 20:11 |
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Is it this novel where he's all "don't blindly follow someone or I'll kill you" immediately followed by "now follow me blindly or I'll kill you"?
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 20:37 |
Isnt that all of them
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 21:24 |
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TF CURES GENERATOR posted:Isnt that all of them All of them after like the second book yes.
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# ? Mar 29, 2019 23:17 |
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# ? Jun 10, 2024 06:56 |
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It's the one where Terry works through his feelings about anti-war protesters. Also there is a long boring bit about crawling through a cave. I can't remember much more but this book did get the biggest laugh out of me in the entire series for the you know the bit I'm talking about scene near the end.
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# ? Mar 30, 2019 18:18 |