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Here's some lighthearted "reviewing" of an M41 light tank, partially restored in New Zealand: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQa19p9YKpM
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Apr 2, 2019 22:12
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That actually got me thinking, so I found my copy of "Unwomanly Face of War" and it turns out there was one interview with another woman who pitched in 50,000 rubles along with her husband to help finance a new tank, with the similar stipulation of "we get to use it." According to the account, the husband and wife made it through the whole war together serving in the same tank. I'll just transcribe that interview here since I have time: Alexandra Leontievna Boiko, First Lieutenant "My husband and I lived in the Far North, in Magadan. My husband worked as a driver, I as a ticket collector. As soon as the war began, we asked to be sent to the front. We were told to work where we were needed. Then we sent a telegram addressed to Comrade Stalin, saying that we contributed 50,000 rubles (a lot of money at the time, it was all we had) to the construction of a tank, and we both wanted to go to the front. We received an expression of gratitude from the government. And in 1943 my husband and I were sent to the Chelyabinsk tank training school, which we finished as externs. In that school they assigned us a tank. We were both senior driver mechanics, and a tank only needs one. The superiors decided to appoint me commander of an IS-122 tank, and my husband a senior driver mechanic. We went through the whole war as far as Germany. Both wounded. Have decorations. There were quite a few girl tankmen of medium-sized tanks, but I was the only one who worked on a heavy tank. I sometimes think it would be good if some writer wrote about my life. I do know know how to do it myself..."
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Apr 2, 2019 22:23
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Cessna posted:I made a 15mm version of her tank for a wargame: dope
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Apr 2, 2019 22:27
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Grammarchist posted:That actually got me thinking, so I found my copy of "Unwomanly Face of War" and it turns out there was one interview with another woman who pitched in 50,000 rubles along with her husband to help finance a new tank, with the similar stipulation of "we get to use it." According to the account, the husband and wife made it through the whole war together serving in the same tank. I'll just transcribe that interview here since I have time:
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Apr 2, 2019 23:07
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HEY GUNS posted:the family that slays nazis together Edited slightly
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Apr 2, 2019 23:12
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chitoryu12 posted:Yes. Polite and written speech have no gender differences, but it's expected that men and women conform to behavioral expectations even to the degree of speech patterns and tone of voice (like women speaking with a higher pitch than is really natural for them and men using a rougher, less polite form). Is this really any different than English? I've noticed many women speaking English will affect an overly high pitch, while men tend towards affecting lower pitches. One language with an extremely pronounced gender difference is Thai. In Thai anyone speaking politely will end their sentences with one of two words: kráp, or kâ. These words signal the end of a thought (if you are furious you would end a sentence with wa instead) and may be used as just a blank/filler word like um or ah or like in English. However men will almost exclusively use kráp, while women will only use kâ. As a result it eliminates almost all ambiguity when determining someone's preferred gender.
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Apr 2, 2019 23:45
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edit: i kinda left this tab open for a day i guess, topic of conversation has changed
oystertoadfish fucked around with this message at 00:31 on Apr 3, 2019 |
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Apr 2, 2019 23:51
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zoux posted:https://twitter.com/cjane87/status/1113073821064589316 https://mobile.twitter.com/IanTinny1/status/1113172763030769664 because of course
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Apr 2, 2019 23:56
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...did not know that. very interesting
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Apr 3, 2019 00:01
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bewbies posted:...did not know that. very interesting if you go to that guy's personal site you'll also learn that the swastika is actually the letter S crossed. It stands for socialism.
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Apr 3, 2019 00:03
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Marxist-Jezzinist posted:if you go to that guy's personal site Why would you do this to yourself?
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Apr 3, 2019 00:03
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Marxist-Jezzinist posted:if you go to that guy's personal site you'll also learn that the swastika is actually the letter S crossed. It stands for socialism. some people are too stupid to live
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Apr 3, 2019 00:04
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Sometimes the truth comes from a dude with a twitter feed full of jordan peterson and mises and a bright idea about what letters look like. Sorry you guys are all ignorant philistines
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Apr 3, 2019 00:08
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I speak for all of us in the thread when I say this from the heart: gently caress you, Ian Tinny you prick.
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Apr 3, 2019 00:11
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:some people are too stupid to live I wasted a reply :-(
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Apr 3, 2019 00:12
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zoux posted:A Daye which shalt Endure and in Infamous Memory Eterne Dwell 
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Apr 3, 2019 00:44
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Ice Fist posted:Why would you do this to yourself? KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:some people are too stupid to live
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Apr 3, 2019 00:47
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Squalid posted:Is this really any different than English? I've noticed many women speaking English will affect an overly high pitch, while men tend towards affecting lower pitches. They have something similar in Japanese, sentence ending particles like "wa" or "no" are feminine, while "yo" or "zo" are masculine. The pronouns are much more specific than English: "ore" and "boku" are both personal male pronouns with differing connotations, while "watashi" is a neutral personal in formal situations, but casually it's female.
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Apr 3, 2019 03:48
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I'm not doing anything productive at the moment, so here are some more excerpts from Soviet women veterans. Klavdia Grigoryevna Krokhina, First Sergeant, Sniper: "We quickly turned into soldiers. You know, there was no time to think, to dwell on our feelings. Our scouts took a German officer prisoner, and he was extremely surprised that so many soldiers had been killed at his position, and all with shots in the head. Almost in the same spot. A simple rifleman, he insisted, would not be able to make so many hits to the head. That's certain. 'Show me,' he asked. 'The rifleman who killed so many of my soldiers. I received large reinforcement, but every day up to ten men fell.' The commander of our regiment says, 'Unfortunately, I cannot show you. It was a girl sniper, but she was killed.' It was our Sasha Shliakhova. She died in a sniper's duel. And what betrayed her was her red scarf. She liked that scarf very much. But a red scarf is visible against white snow. When the German officer heard that it was a girl, he was staggered, he didn't know how to react. He was silent a long time. At the last interrogation before he was sent to Moscow (he turned out to be a bigwig) he confessed: 'I've never fought with women. You're all beautiful... Our propaganda tells us that it's hermaphrodites and not women who fight in the Red Army.' So he understood nothing. No. I can't forget." Elena Pavlona Shalova, Komsomol leader of an infantry battalion: "What a beautiful word - Victory... I wrote my name on the Reichstag. I wrote with charcoal, with what was at hand: 'You were defeated by a Russian girl from Saratov.' Everybody left something on the wall, some words. Confessions and curses. Victory! My girlfriends asked me, 'What do you want to be?' And we were so hungry during the war, unbearably. We wanted to eat our fill at least once. I had a dream - when I got my first postwar salary, I would buy a big box of cookies. What do I want to be after the war? A cook, of course. I still work in the public food industry."
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Apr 3, 2019 03:57
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This is a kinda grim question but did the nazis ever, well, yknow to servicemen who were disabled from combat? I know this probably isn't the thread where someone will stick up for them and say "don't be ridiculous; they're not cartoonishly evil" because I think we all know better.
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Apr 3, 2019 09:12
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Milo and POTUS posted:This is a kinda grim question but did the nazis ever, well, yknow to servicemen who were disabled from combat? I know this probably isn't the thread where someone will stick up for them and say "don't be ridiculous; they're not cartoonishly evil" because I think we all know better. The what?
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Apr 3, 2019 09:37
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Vahakyla posted:The what? Making them sniff your farts while they can't dodge. It is true!
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Apr 3, 2019 09:40
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Nenonen posted:Making them sniff your farts while they can't dodge. We've already established they're bastards.
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Apr 3, 2019 09:45
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The youtube algorithm gets weird when you watch enough tank videos. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQscjnv8D_k
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Apr 3, 2019 10:11
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Milo and POTUS posted:This is a kinda grim question but did the nazis ever, well, yknow to servicemen who were disabled from combat? I know this probably isn't the thread where someone will stick up for them and say "don't be ridiculous; they're not cartoonishly evil" because I think we all know better. If you mean 'execute them for no particular reason' then no, not that I'm aware of. I assume you're thinking of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aktion_T4 but killing racially impure/degenerates so they can't pass on their subhuman genes is not the same as killing glorious Aryan war heroes, if you're a Nazi.
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Apr 3, 2019 10:47
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bloom posted:The youtube algorithm gets weird when you watch enough tank videos. I got a video the other day of Toto's Africa. Played over coloured Afrika Corp footage.
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Apr 3, 2019 13:14
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Is Tom Holland's In The Shadow Of The Sword considered good history?
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Apr 3, 2019 13:33
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Milo and POTUS posted:This is a kinda grim question but did the nazis ever, well, yknow to servicemen who were disabled from combat? I know this probably isn't the thread where someone will stick up for them and say "don't be ridiculous; they're not cartoonishly evil" because I think we all know better. A bit serendipitous, but when I was looking for the Russian tank-couple interview there was another story from a medic/nurse who was assigned to a hospital that had been used as an infirmary for the Germans late in the war. The Germans had evacuated some, but didn't have time to get to all their wounded out, especially the worst off. Apparently the soviets found a bunch of dead Germans that had apparently been "mercy killed" to prevent capture. That's just one account, but it doesn't seem far-fetched. Another story talks about running into an infirmary that had been evacuated except for the amputees, who had been left without new bandages, water or food for three days. So I don't know if putting comrades out of their misery was an unofficial or official standard. If you were referring to whether Nazis in the domestic sphere would murder disabled veterans for the sin of being disabled, that's actually a really good question in its own right. I'm not sure how they were seen during wartime.
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Apr 3, 2019 14:11
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There's a big difference between mercy killing the wounded to prevent capture and euthanasia of the wounded because they're not of use to society. I have no doubt the former happened, especially given the propaganda going around about what the Soviets would do to anyone who fell into their hands. This is also a big part of why you see instances of women and families in Prussia committing suicide ahead of the Red Army. As for killing wounded vets as "useless" no. They didn't. Full stop. They had a whole system for honoring people who they held up as wounded heroes who had sacrificed for the Reich, very similar to how pretty much every country makes at least a symbolic attempt to recognize physical sacrifice in wartime. They had a whole series of wound badges that basically recognized just how hosed up you got. While the US just has a single medal, the Purple Heart, given for any injury in combat from a simple flesh wound all the way up to death, they had differing levels depending on all sorts of factors. Were you wounded? Did you lose sight? Partial sight? Lose a finger? Hand? Arm? Etc. I mention this because you're not going to give a Gold wound badge (top level) to a dude and then put him down. They also understood wounded vets as a resource. In the short term they were put to work in industry depending on how badly wounded they were. Google is failing me right now, but I've seen pictures war amputees working in German factories. Finally, they also had plans for them after the war. The initial plan was to put a lot of what they considered disabled heroes into teaching. This was to both soak up a large population of disabled vets (something that was on their minds given the WW1 experience of vets) and also to properly instill patriotic values into the children via soldier-teachers who could provide a visible example of sacrifice. You know the amputee vet teacher in Starship Troopers? That but 100% in earnest. The other important thing to remember is that all of their obsession with culling out weakness was focused on what we today would describe as congenital defects, at least as understood within the racial worldview of the Nazis. Being born with a disability or being Jewish were inheritable characteristics that you could pass on to your offspring, thus further polluting the genetic stock of the Volk. A wounded vet can't pass on his double amputation to his kids. As far as the Nazis were concerned as long as your 100% Aryan cock and balls still worked you were A-OK breeding stock.
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Apr 3, 2019 14:29
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Milo and POTUS posted:This is a kinda grim question but did the nazis ever, well, yknow to servicemen who were disabled from combat? I know this probably isn't the thread where someone will stick up for them and say "don't be ridiculous; they're not cartoonishly evil" because I think we all know better. I would guess, though this is only a guess, that it never happened, the Nazi's were indeed in many cases cartoonishly evil but what they were not were universally fools. One very good way to crater your front line troop and indeed wider civillian morale is the knowledge that if you get wounded someones going to shoot you in the back lines, it seems like the sort of thing that would be very difficult to keep quiet, people generally knew about what was going to happen when the mentally disabled started getting killed by the state and often tried to have their family members rediagnosed or withdrawn from facilities, indeed the program was suspended in 41 in part due to public unrest about it when news got out. I can only imagine the outcry would have been far greater if it was war veterans rather than the genetically disabled. It also seperately is very obviously not a case of genetic inferiority from the perspective of Nazi racial science, which to me seems like the obvious distinction they would draw.
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Apr 3, 2019 14:31
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Cyrano4747 posted:As far as the Nazis were concerned as long as your 100% Aryan cock and balls still worked you were A-OK breeding stock. And getting that shot off still gets you that Gold Wound Badge. (Citation: For Führer and Fatherland: Military Awards of the Third Reich - Angolia, John)
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Apr 3, 2019 14:42
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Given the varying numbers and indeed sizes of balls among the Nazi leadership, it would be pretty hypocritical of them
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Apr 3, 2019 14:44
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Milo and POTUS posted:I know this probably isn't the thread where someone will stick up for them and say "don't be ridiculous; they're not cartoonishly evil" because I think we all know better. I mean, this is kind of an important point really, they weren't cartoonishly evil in like the Skeletor sense where they do stuff intentionally to be a dick. They had a particular worldview - 'there are different biological races; our Aryan race is the best and should be on top; other races are subhuman and exist only to serve or are actively threats to our race'. Then they took what they perceived to be the necessary and logical actions to put that into effect. Shooting Aryans didn't fit into that.
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Apr 3, 2019 14:53
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Cessna posted:Borderline? Hold on on Bella and Edward getting married, most players lose interest and drift away once you wrap up the main quest line even if you have real good custom content to follow up with.
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Apr 3, 2019 15:00
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This picture seems appropiate for the current topic.
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Apr 3, 2019 15:03
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Squalid posted:Is this really any different than English? I've noticed many women speaking English will affect an overly high pitch, while men tend towards affecting lower pitches. There's the pitch difference, but also the expectation that men and women will use different words entirely. Generally men are meant to use more informal language, fewer honorific prefixes, and different sentence endings. It's more like if men in America were expected to always use "Y'all" and women were expected to always use "All of you" and a woman saying "Y'all" would be a sign of her unusual masculinity.
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Apr 3, 2019 15:11
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The metal eagle insignia on his hat is unusual; usually that is a stitched cloth. The raised cockade is also odd. Not unique, but rare. The hat and collar "litzen" (bar-insignia) are post-1943, and he has the darker "tresse" (trim) of post-1941 (pre-1941 the "tresse" was a bright silver). But he has the bellows-folded pockets of a pre-1942 feldbluse. I can't quite make out the "cypher" on his shoulder. It might be a Feldherrenhalle insignia but it is too blurry to tell. The swastika-and-sword on his left pocket is an SA "Sports Badge," given for passing physical fitness tests.
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Apr 3, 2019 15:21
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If you have JSTOR access, here is a pretty good article on the Nazis handling of veterans. https://www.jstor.org/stable/1879949
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Apr 3, 2019 15:24
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Cessna posted:The metal eagle insignia on his hat is unusual; usually that is a stitched cloth. The raised cockade is also odd. Not unique, but rare. Late war hat and chest eagles started to be cloth pieces that were cut. Not super uncommon at that point.
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Apr 3, 2019 15:31
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Been reading a short collection of interviews with German veterans of D-Day. Pretty interesting both in terms of the physical logistics of the defense and also since the interviews were from the early 50s these guys were only minimally deprogrammed. Like they recognize Germany was wrong in a general sense but still describe their mission as "defending France." Common thread throughout is seeing the total scale of the invasion after being wounded/captured and realizing just how hopeless it was. They all remark on seeing no horses as the most shocking thing, confirming to them that America was just on another level industrially. Anyway the Omaha beach segment matched that effort post a few pages back, the German machine gunner interviewed was keeping everyone in his sector bottled up in a brutal slog that only got broken with renewed bombardment and the arrival of tanks on the beach. He was adamant that more preliminary bombardment would have been better, apparently what there was in the morning really did a lot of damage to his bunker, but then it just stopped and shortly after the landing craft showed up to a still intact position.
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Apr 3, 2019 15:42
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