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How much plastic waste does making a new microplastics filter produce? 1976 - Plastics as a material class becomes the most used material in the world. The Guardian publishes the following: quote:The latest American opinion is that for at least the next 10 years, plastics will remain unseparated from other organic waste and will continue to be burned. A solution may lie in pyrolysing plastics at very high temperatures to produce basic chemical “building block” components such as ethylene and benzene from which to start again to make plastics and other chemicals. Using almost unimaginably higher temperatures, it might one day be possible to vaporise all waste into reusable chemical elements with profound effects on the energy and material supply situation. Guavanaut fucked around with this message at 13:26 on Apr 4, 2019 |
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Apr 4, 2019 13:24
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Tesseraction posted:On a more positive note John Crace's sketch for yesterday is another belter https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/apr/03/brexiters-castigate-pm-for-denying-them-what-they-voted-against If you like PINO coladas...
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Apr 4, 2019 13:25
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Captain Fargle posted:Between Article 13 getting voted in through trickery and this thread's constant talk about how anti-socialist it is I've honestly become rather glad we're leaving the EU. It just seems to be a massive barrier to necessary progress to me now. There are good reasons to dislike the EU. This isn’t one of them. There are currently three places on the planet that are big and important enough not to have to follow basic economic and trade rules set somewhere else: America, China and the EU. Of these three, the EU allows the most scope for actual socialism, which is pretty ironic since China is allegedly a communist country. The UK outside Europe is going to have to take economic rules and norms from other countries (mostly the US, China, and EU). It will have to, because it doesn’t have enough by itself to negotiate exceptions and the UK is not self sufficient in food or basic industrial materials. The kind of rules that other countries impose will almost certainly prevent the UK from implementing progressive policies more than EU membership does. It will also fundamentally alter our government’s relationship with multinational companies. By and large, they have to listen to the EU, pay its fines, etc. They don’t need to do that to the UK.
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Apr 4, 2019 13:25
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Hentai Jihadist posted:Yeah personally iv accepted hell world and there is no good outcome here. the IMF's main funder is the US so of course that would be impossible
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Apr 4, 2019 13:27
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This sounds like a hell of a pub quiz https://twitter.com/PinkNews/status/1113773246564974592 https://twitter.com/IanDunt/status/1113775069963149313
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Apr 4, 2019 13:29
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Brexit will kill thousands and impoverish millions but it might kickstart the long overdue national discussion about who we want to be as a nation now we're no longer the thing that we were. Which is not to say that it's worth it in the long run or even that that discussion won't end with 'we're fash now' but like it's something I guess. Also if you want to actually make that 2017 Labour manifesto into reality you're gonna have to find a way round the EU at some point, again doesn't have to be by leaving but you can;t pretend there's no problems there.
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Apr 4, 2019 13:30
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Guavanaut posted:How much plastic waste does making a new microplastics filter produce? They're all made from recycled plastic, so....less than zero?
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Apr 4, 2019 13:34
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why would you ever drink tequila shots when there’s a pub quiz to be won (it’s me, I’m the gooniest goon)
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Apr 4, 2019 13:35
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the UK, before this ridiculous brexis fracas at least, was strong enough within the EU to be allowed quite a bit of leeway that smaller states weren't. obviously the union has stupid rules about compensation when expropriating poo poo, but typically with a bit of dash and fire and some clever positioning, most of the 2017 stuff should be doable the issue is that 2017 wasn't actually terribly radical
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Apr 4, 2019 13:36
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Rustybear posted:Also if you want to actually make that 2017 Labour manifesto into reality you're gonna have to find a way round the EU at some point, again doesn't have to be by leaving but you can;t pretend there's no problems there. Corbyns soft brexit is probably the best way to do it and then, even when it goes against what the EU rules, just poo poo on the rulebook and say nothing. See if the they feel like making a fuss over it while the rest of the EU keeps fracturing at the seams from neoliberal policies. Lots of member countries seem to be bucking the EU and getting away with it to me. Except Greece.
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Apr 4, 2019 13:37
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Rustybear posted:Also if you want to actually make that 2017 Labour manifesto into reality you're gonna have to find a way round the EU at some point, again doesn't have to be by leaving but you can;t pretend there's no problems there. That'll be true even if the regulations are enforced via a trade deal, if anything it'll be harder to get around since UK's influence will be so much less. e: Basically it's a battle either way, better to do as the poster above me said. Or a complete no-deal but that would be very harmful for the country. Private Speech fucked around with this message at 13:39 on Apr 4, 2019 |
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Apr 4, 2019 13:37
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Jose posted:the IMF's main funder is the US so of course that would be impossible The funniest thing about the 'WTO rules!' thing is it's like you do understand the WTO was set up by your granddad and his chums to facilitate the asset stripping of resources from the developing world right? Like the organ grinder's long since dead and the monkey has just inherited the script.
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Apr 4, 2019 13:38
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V. Illych L. posted:the UK, before this ridiculous brexis fracas at least, was strong enough within the EU to be allowed quite a bit of leeway that smaller states weren't. obviously the union has stupid rules about compensation when expropriating poo poo, but typically with a bit of dash and fire and some clever positioning, most of the 2017 stuff should be doable it wasn't but it was also cobbled together pretty last minute. I'd expect the next one to be a lot more radical
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Apr 4, 2019 13:38
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Rustybear posted:Brexit will kill thousands and impoverish millions but it might kickstart the long overdue national discussion about who we want to be as a nation now we're no longer the thing that we were. Which is not to say that it's worth it in the long run or even that that discussion won't end with 'we're fash now' but like it's something I guess. As noted by Beefeater above the main issue is that the UK outside of the EU has basically no power on the word stage to affect any change and will have to follow the whims of the EU, US and China. A once powerful country getting pushed around by it's more powerful neighbours it's a pretty strong recipe for fascism to prosper, especially when people do not have the luxury of principals.
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Apr 4, 2019 13:38
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Rustybear posted:The funniest thing about the 'WTO rules!' thing is it's like you do understand the WTO was set up by your granddad and his chums to facilitate the asset stripping of resources from the developing world right? Like the organ grinder's long since dead and the monkey has just inherited the script. People talk about no deal being good because the EU is undemocratic and controls everything and the tories want to jump straight into bed with the US which will be far more undemocratic
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Apr 4, 2019 13:39
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Newport West by-election is on the go today. Which is an excuse to post this fun parody of a parody of that New York State of Mind song from years back. Because Goldie Lookin' Chain were probably the greatest export from Newport. Anyway, been a Labour seat since 1987, Labour's candidate is a physiotherapist, the Tory candidate used to be Mayor of Newport & the UKIP candidate is loving Neil Hamilton. Flynn won by 5000 in 2017 and you'd hope that majority could be maintained but it could be closer?
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Apr 4, 2019 13:39
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jfc https://twitter.com/jimwaterson/status/1113775654783393793
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Apr 4, 2019 13:40
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https://twitter.com/Ankaman616/status/1113782821934510081
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Apr 4, 2019 13:40
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Rustybear posted:I think the key idea is not that socialists can form majorities to achieve stuff (of course they can) it's whether they can leverage European institutions to achieve stuff without a overwhelming mandate; and the answer is that the institutions almost always act as a brake not an accelerator of change if that makes sense. Not always, there are lots of instances where the change is brought about through the imposition of regulations, like in areas where corporations have vested interests and are reluctant to change. Like with incandescent light bulbs, remember the boomer rage about that one? lmao V. Illych L. posted:the EU has utterly failed on all the major challenges issued to it, from dealing with the refugee crisis in a civilised manner to empowering its reactionary central bank to completely hamstringing our economies' ability to adjust to e.g. the urgent need for a much greener economy through its ridiculous state aid rules. other environmental issues are not nearly so bad, but the Union is still cheerfully complicit in a mass extinction event which genuinely threatens to make the world itself uninhabitable over time Again, I find it hard to view the refugee crisis as a EU failure rather than a Europe failure, though I certainly agree the EU wasn't up to the challenge. EU members have never given the EU the authority or power needed to deal with something like that in the face of member states' obstruction, the blame for that one should mainly fall on national governments imo. The governments least hostile to immigrants were the ones that wanted a joint EU immigration response, and it failed mainly because of countries demanding 'no muslims'. it's also hard to see how it could have been worked out better by some alternative authority imo; if you'd try to work out a better response to the next refugee crisis, where'd you turn to? The climate response is absolutely an EU failure though, I agree the EU's response to climate change is terribly insufficient and far too slow to change. But national vested interests in defending their carbon-based industry wouldn't be subject to a more restrictive authority if it were absent, would they? The EU is pretty much unarguably the authority best placed to enforce industrial development toward less earth destruction, through its internal regulations yes, but also through imposing change on other economies through its imports regulations It's kind of hard to discuss the EU's failures because I often find myself agreeing with the basic criticism but the proposed solutions never add up. Is the proposed solution to a given EU criticism that more power be centralised to EU authorities, or less, or none? It's just naive or dishonest to claim that there's some alternative structure that'd step in to uphold the basic underpinnings of the European economy, and whichever authority you propose do the job would be subject to much of the same limitations and be forced to juggle the same international/national/local considerations, with no guarantee they'll be any more resistent to corporate demands
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Apr 4, 2019 13:41
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for the extent of the flexibility accorded to the sufficiently audacious in the EU, look no further than Hungary of course, free markets are much more important to the EU than silly stuff like human rights, so the reaction will probably be stronger - but then, the UK is also a much stronger country than Hungary
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Apr 4, 2019 13:42
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There's going to be a lot of gammon cognitive dissonance going on here: https://www.theguardian.com/food/2019/apr/04/eu-to-ban-non-meat-product-labels-veggie-burgers-and-vegan-steaks
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Apr 4, 2019 13:45
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V. Illych L. posted:for the extent of the flexibility accorded to the sufficiently audacious in the EU, look no further than Hungary I think the issue with Hungary came out of more naive optimism than anything else. At the time they were added there was a deep belief that just being part of the EU would naturally mean that the country would become more and more like it's western neighbours. Instead it went full fash and the EU has no idea how it deal with that.
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Apr 4, 2019 13:45
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V. Illych L. posted:for the extent of the flexibility accorded to the sufficiently audacious in the EU, look no further than Hungary The lesson there is also that there are very different sets of rules of play for member states and non-member states. It's certainly not the case that countries outside the EU get to play loose with the rules without consequence, it's got fairly decent ways of making trading partners hurt
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Apr 4, 2019 13:47
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Tijuana Bibliophile posted:Not always, there are lots of instances where the change is brought about through the imposition of regulations, like in areas where corporations have vested interests and are reluctant to change. Like with incandescent light bulbs, remember the boomer rage about that one? lmao I don't want to sneer because incremental change is the best we can hope for etc. etc. but it super hard for me not to just fall back to 'on the one hand decades of entrenched fiscal contraction boo on the other hand GDPR and lightbulbs yay!'
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Apr 4, 2019 13:48
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Julio Cruz posted:why would you ever drink tequila shots when there’s a pub quiz to be won Just lmao if you don't bring your own poppers to the quiz Also https://twitter.com/hoennzollern/status/1113765765541507072?s=19 Lmao Failed Imagineer fucked around with this message at 13:52 on Apr 4, 2019 |
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Apr 4, 2019 13:49
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Aramoro posted:As noted by Beefeater above the main issue is that the UK outside of the EU has basically no power on the word stage to affect any change and will have to follow the whims of the EU, US and China. A once powerful country getting pushed around by it's more powerful neighbours it's a pretty strong recipe for fascism to prosper, especially when people do not have the luxury of principals. I thought the point about trade gravity was that whether we are inside or outside the EU they have the whip hand over us; it's a neutral point.
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Apr 4, 2019 13:52
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StarkingBarfish posted:There's going to be a lot of gammon cognitive dissonance going on here: A dumb rule, but probably quite a good sign that the meat industry is getting really worried.
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Apr 4, 2019 13:53
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Failed Imagineer posted:Just lmao if you don't bring your own poppers to the quiz Ultimate power move is bringing poppers for all the other teams.
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Apr 4, 2019 13:54
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https://twitter.com/kyliemaclellan/status/1113785443936555008 Quite encouraging that they could only find twenty five for their 'please capitulate to the Tories immediately' brigade.
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Apr 4, 2019 13:56
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forkboy84 posted:Newport West by-election is on the go today. Which is an excuse to post this fun parody of a parody of that New York State of Mind song from years back. Because Goldie Lookin' Chain were probably the greatest export from Newport. Hamilton's going to get more votes that the Tory lmao,  to a Welsh charity if I'm wrong
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Apr 4, 2019 13:57
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Tijuana Bibliophile posted:Not always, there are lots of instances where the change is brought about through the imposition of regulations, like in areas where corporations have vested interests and are reluctant to change. Like with incandescent light bulbs, remember the boomer rage about that one? lmao I'm not sure how much the looming ban was responsible for the development of good LED bulbs and how much was the mass of research that was done in the wake of efficient blue LEDs being discovered in the 90s, but it does seem like something that could have been better achieved by subsidy than by prohibition; you can still buy candles and oil lamps and we all admit that they're terrible sources of light, and so nobody* uses them as an actual lighting solution. *I have an old center draft oil lamp, it produces about 40 candle power (somewhere around a 60W bulb) but about 600W of heat, making it to incandescent bulbs as incandescent bulbs are to LEDs, plus the cost of the fuel**. Using it as a light source would be a stupid idea, but when my boiler breathed its final gasps around January last year, it was a good way of making the front room livable, so I guess there are some niche uses. **Thanks to Euro 6, diesel now has less sulfur in it than refined lamp oil did in the 1930s and burns cleaner too, while costing about 1/8th of what lamp oil costs now, that's an example of good environmental regulation. namesake posted:Ultimate power move is bringing poppers for all the other teams.
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Apr 4, 2019 13:59
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lol https://twitter.com/OwenJones84/status/1113782215027122177
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Apr 4, 2019 14:01
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Beefeater1980 posted:There are good reasons to dislike the EU. This isn’t one of them. I would like to add something to this sentiment. The point of discussion shouldn't be "Is the EU bad? Y/N", it should be "Is a world without the EU better or worse?" Let's take one of the worst crimes the EU is responsible for, the treatment of refugees. Do you really think that a world without the EU would have behaved differently? Or do you think that the countries that are receiving refugees would have been left even more alone to handle that crisis? The assistance and funding may have been criminally low and the stance Draconian...but do you think a random non Mediterranean European state would have behaved differently on their own? If yes, I guess the idea is that if everyone would have been left on their own we would have more socialist governments due to the lack of anti EU politics? But for the majority of fash/nationalist parties in EU, that's just the easiest scapegoat. If not Brussels, the enemy would have been the usual ones (whatever minority dujour for example). Saying "if we leave we may get a good thing going" sounds like a very naive argument. Socialist policies are present in a lot of EU countries so it's not like being in the EU is THE obstacle that has prevented the UK from going socialist. My full university fees have been lower than a single year of college in the UK; I had access to free or fees-only healthcare for most of my life. That's a country that is in the EU. And is currently in the hands of populists and fash cause the previous socialdemocratic party has been a poo poo ncentrist weaksauce one. The EU may be bad, but a world full of individual nationalist countries is worse. Being in the EU doesn't mean being unable to enact socialist policies and being outside of it doesn't mean being able to do it; even more so in this moment in time, even more so in a country where the world socialism is seen as an intrinsic negative one by the public at large. Corbyn may very well be able to make a positive change in the UK...but I think it would have a major impact for the world at large if the UK was in the EU when that happens, instead of being its own separate thing. That Italian Guy fucked around with this message at 14:07 on Apr 4, 2019 |
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Apr 4, 2019 14:02
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Coohoolin posted:Just saw this thread, reminded me of an earlier discussion- this is what I find problematic about how we treat "sectarianism" in this country. Sorry I'm a bit confused here, which bit of this do you find problematic?
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Apr 4, 2019 14:06
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Rustybear posted:I thought the point about trade gravity was that whether we are inside or outside the EU they have the whip hand over us; it's a neutral point. Inside the EU we 'are' them so it's not an insignificant distinction.
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Apr 4, 2019 14:08
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Brincels? https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/apr/04/brexit-brexiteers-brincels-ultras-war-martyrdom
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Apr 4, 2019 14:08
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https://twitter.com/DmitryOpines/status/1113709790151217153
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Apr 4, 2019 14:09
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Imagine being so loving brokebrained you still think BBC is biased towards remain
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Apr 4, 2019 14:10
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moostaffa posted:Imagine being so loving brokebrained you still think BBC is biased towards remain Everyone thinks it's BBC is biased against them.
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Apr 4, 2019 14:12
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moostaffa posted:Imagine being so loving brokebrained you still think BBC is biased towards remain It is, internally.
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Apr 4, 2019 14:15
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I can't get enough of are Dan