|
Scruffpuff posted:More evidence of their "flight model" being one hack after another. Apparently they're simulating gravity by occasionally moving the ship "down" - where "down" is considered "where the bottom of the ship is." No, they are stimulating gravity (and drag) by altering the "ghost" thrust in your ship. So they are just increasing the thrust on the wrong side. Once you deactivate the thrust system your ship will often float. But don't deactivate the whole ship (or run out of fuel) or it will switch state to the fps (not the in-Atmo) physics system and fall like a rock when the actual gravity vector is activated. Elite managed it by not being idiots. SC has at least four different physic models "working" side to side: fps (one version for stations, another for planets), space, in-atmo (a hack of the space one), and physics grid.
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 17:31
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 13:49 |
|
|
 The second link goes to Leonard Skinly's Twitter account.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 18:01
|
|
|
Pixelate posted:Look at least the flight model works now. And gravity. Ahahahaha remember how we talked about how gravity is treated as a simple thrust effect upon your ship? It totally is, and they just stuck it to the top of the spaceship 
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 18:35
|
|
|
trucutru posted:No, they are stimulating gravity (and drag) by altering the "ghost" thrust in your ship. So they are just increasing the thrust on the wrong side. Once you deactivate the thrust system your ship will often float. I remember a big bullshit ATV where they went over how the thrust system wasn't "faked" like other games'. Each maneuvering thruster actually did something, and if you lost too many you wouldn't be able to maneuver anymore. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 18:57
|
|
|
Zazz Razzamatazz posted:I remember a big bullshit ATV where they went over how the thrust system wasn't "faked" like other games'. Each maneuvering thruster actually did something, and if you lost too many you wouldn't be able to maneuver anymore. Someone just post that old gif of the thrusters spinning around wildly as a ship tries the most basic of maneuvers , none of them pointing anywhere near where they should be
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 19:01
|
|
|
Pixelate posted:Look at least the flight model works now. And gravity. Sarsapariller posted:Ahahahaha remember how we talked about how gravity is treated as a simple thrust effect upon your ship? I mean, I know I shouldn't be surprised by this poo poo at this point, but god drat, CIG. Come on.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 19:08
|
|
|
Sarsapariller posted:Ahahahaha remember how we talked about how gravity is treated as a simple thrust effect upon your ship? How else would you do it?
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 19:22
|
|
|
Agony Aunt posted:Hey, look! Working doors! yeah john carmack was a programming genious wasnt he. unfortunately he was no great visionary. thats why doom was missing the core features we expect in a true classic game like: - macrotransactions - a weekly show - sign language - foip - a dedicated and controlled forum - a wankpod that is why doom has barely any legacy and was soon completely forgotten
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 19:28
|
|
|
Zazz Razzamatazz posted:I remember a big bullshit ATV where they went over how the thrust system wasn't "faked" like other games'. Each maneuvering thruster actually did something, and if you lost too many you wouldn't be able to maneuver anymore. And how CIG where not cheating with the first person camera actually being in your players head, only to have a ridiculous amount of head sway/jank/bob which they then had to make a system to counter their own original dumb unified animation system. And after all this time it still looks like an amateur attempt from the late 90s. "Never been done before" Chris Roberts is a game design clown .... But a very sexy bear.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 19:39
|
|
|
Dementropy posted:
Lol. Just lol if you can't explain "Technical Debt" as a developer/programmer. loving lol. God drat, tojal!
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 19:39
|
|
|
Jobbo_Fett posted:Lol. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technical_debt  ARGH I CAN'T WRAP MY HEAD AROUND THIS ITS SO COMPLEX! "Technical debt (also known as design debt or code debt) is a concept in software development that reflects the implied cost of additional rework caused by choosing an easy solution now instead of using a better approach that would take longer." ...
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 19:43
|
|
|
tojal's either a bigger idiot than hahahahahahahaahahahaha who am I kidding those fuckers are all equally stupid.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 19:44
|
|
|
Jobbo_Fett posted:tojal's either a bigger idiot than hahahahahahahaahahahaha who am I kidding those fuckers are all equally stupid. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 19:52
|
|
|
Jobbo_Fett posted:tojal's either a bigger idiot than hahahahahahahaahahahaha who am I kidding those fuckers are all equally stupid. Nah, I legit think tojal is the dumbest. He's so apocalyptically stupid it's hard to understand how he functions on a day to day basis. The other day he got into an argument with King_Kroket (the dude who actually sees and accurately describes the issues with development but hates goons so much he'll never admit it) about something and accused him of being a refund troll.  A cursory glance at kroket's history would show we literally had to ban him for spamming "lol hate sub" in every thread to try and make people mad. Tojal is mind-bogglingly stupid, which makes it  that he and Vertisce seem to have teamed up lol
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 20:13
|
|
|
The cast of sordid backers grows thin. Those same names keep popping up. Apparently. What do I know? I only gobble up these reddit copypastas, because I'm afraid to take the plunge and go read the originals. Tojal's rants make him more like an elder machine-spirit soother than a senior software engineer, and seemingly he might be the most horrid guy to work with. Or could this be that only SC triggers such behaviour? Or should I just go watch the two latest episodes of Discovery instead of trying to conduct futile personality analysis of a wall of text? Choices.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 20:30
|
|
|
Beet Wagon posted:Nah, I legit think tojal is the dumbest. He's so apocalyptically stupid it's hard to understand how he functions on a day to day basis. He's actually more bad faith than that. His bit on PCI was from wikipedia and used an irrelevance to talk about it to try and reinforce his lack of knowledge. Software engineers don't deal with PCI, that's a job for Networks and Netsec. As for their constant insistence that chargebacks are 'fraud', they're completely and utterly confused about the process required to get a chargeback in the first place, as well as remedying of injury. For one thing _fraud_ has a very high bar to pass in terms of proof; we had a very long conversation with Derek about throwing it around as a concept because he was _absolutely certain_ that selling jpegs was a crime, and I pointed out that a _good faith attempt_ to deliver indicates anything _but_ fraud. In fact, the only times you'll see fraud prosecuted is usually around wire fraud, which is _entirely_ cut and dried, mainly because you have to sign the piece of paper that incriminates you.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 20:33
|
|
|
The thing is, it takes a certain amount of low cunning to argue in bad faith that way. That SC Bursar guy was pretty good at it, and Vertisce, for as many galaxy brained takes as he has, can do it. Tojal is - like fandred in some ways - pure, unfiltered stupid. Even when he tries a logic trap or to cite wikipedia as his own work, he telegraphs is so hard it's almost impossible to miss. He's a dumb guy trying to keep up with slightly less dumb guys, and it shows.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 20:42
|
|
|
Beet Wagon posted:The thing is, it takes a certain amount of low cunning to argue in bad faith that way. That SC Bursar guy was pretty good at it, and Vertisce, for as many galaxy brained takes as he has, can do it. Tojal is - like fandred in some ways - pure, unfiltered stupid. Even when he tries a logic trap or to cite wikipedia as his own work, he telegraphs is so hard it's almost impossible to miss. He's a dumb guy trying to keep up with slightly less dumb guys, and it shows.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 20:47
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/discolando/status/1115340881362481152 Steve must be some kind of sexy bear.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 20:59
|
|
|
Daztek posted:
Hav fucked around with this message at 21:10 on Apr 8, 2019 |
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 21:01
|
|
|
tooterfish posted:Gravity is a simple thrust effect though. It is a simple vector effect but the thing is that they cannot use the vectors provided by cryengine to do that because those are part of the fps physics engine, not the in-atmo one. So they have to work with what they have, and what they have is thrusters, and the thrusters are attached to the ship, and the ship moves around, so it's possible to gently caress up, so of course they did.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 21:10
|
|
|
Amazing Zimmo posted:https://twitter.com/discolando/status/1115340881362481152 Steve is a pretty cool guy   Anyway, anything new in the world of SC? Only thing I watched in the last 2-3 weeks is a 3.5 video from FailureToReport and it seems everything is going as smooth as usual for CI 
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 21:20
|
|
|
Agony Aunt posted:He will continue to back as long as he thinks it is worth it. I'd like to know, what loving computer game is worth even close to 3k? I can't think of any computer game ever that would have been worth thousands of dollars, not even games i spent years playing. If you had a wow subscription from day one, you would have given blizzard nearly $3000 by now. But in return you would have gotten 15 years of a real game you can play.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 21:32
|
|
|
ggangensis posted:
I think you'll be disappointed. They've got enough money to keep going for a year or two, maybe more. The thing is Star Citizen will always be too poo poo for them to release it to press reviews. They've made so many absurd promises they can't ever say it's feature locked or half the backers will lose their minds. They're stuck in perma-alpha collecting more and more money. When it's a decade old, has collected 300 million (+ investor funds) and it's still this janky, barren alpha it's going to be even more of a joke than now. Both the time spent and money received work against Star Citizen's credibility. Get ready for the long haul.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 21:57
|
|
|
Peter.Quint posted:I think you'll be disappointed. They've got enough money to keep going for a year or two, maybe more. Up until the Beta release, at least. They got some breathing room. After that, though, it's going to be touch and go as they'll have to show something like progress to the stated goal of pushing out the single player campaign that everyone has already paid for. It's actually kinda fun to see what they've _stopped_ doing as they chase the release. Peter.Quint posted:Get ready for the long haul. Duke Nukem Forever was fifteen years. They're halfway. Edit: Looks like $20 million according to George B? Lets be generous and double it. Hav fucked around with this message at 22:09 on Apr 8, 2019 |
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 22:07
|
|
|
Peter.Quint posted:I think you'll be disappointed. They've got enough money to keep going for a year or two, maybe more. Then funding tracker is amazingly consistent, with every hour thousands of dollars pouring in, plus the odd spike from ship sales or perhaps a whale splurging. In recent months the average hourly rate seems to have increased as well. Maybe this is more people subscribing (for what, i have no idea, since subscription value has significantly decreased). Maybe the whole funding tracker is just one big lie. No idea. But it does appear the backers are not yet milked dry and will continue to fund this thing for years to come. Which is pretty good, since it needs years before they can even do a soft release of a 1.0. As you said, any sort of hard release, ta-da, here is the real 1.0, is probably not an option, because at that point they would be meaured against what they promised for the game on release.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 22:10
|
|
|
Agony Aunt posted:Then funding tracker is amazingly consistent, with every hour thousands of dollars pouring in, plus the odd spike from ship sales or perhaps a whale splurging. If we accept those financials they published doesn't that imply that the tracker is basically correct? I can believe they apply some kind of smoothing to the numbers, blend all revenue together, that kind of thing, but the idea that it's massively wrong seems like it might be one of our goon myths. They are, after all is said and done, pretty drat good at milking those whales.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 22:22
|
|
|
Agony Aunt posted:But it does appear the backers are not yet milked dry and will continue to fund this thing for years to come. Which is pretty good, since it needs years before they can even do a soft release of a 1.0. As you said, any sort of hard release, ta-da, here is the real 1.0, is probably not an option, because at that point they would be meaured against what they promised for the game on release. This is a pretty big reason why I follow the SC drama, I'm genuinely curious what will happen with the game in 5-10 years. Will we ever get a disappointing "release" that enrages some of the fans, while making the True Believers worship the game even more, while being completely ignored by the greater gaming community? Will it slowly fading away into nothingness as backers quietly stop pledging money, but keeping up the facade of doing so on reddit? Or will a lawsuit annihilate the company, giving a nice Enemy for the developers to pin the failure on? I wish I could skip ahead 10 years to watch a nice hour long post-mortem on youtube.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 22:25
|
|
|
Jobbo_Fett posted:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technical_debt What do you call it when you choose a hard solution now that's also worse and piles on more refactoring later than a different, easy solution that's also less labor-intensive in the long run? Potato Salad fucked around with this message at 22:38 on Apr 8, 2019 |
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 22:32
|
|
|
Fashionable Jorts posted:This is a pretty big reason why I follow the SC drama, I'm genuinely curious what will happen with the game in 5-10 years. I think Star Citizen's future is already drawn entirely in shades of beige. It'll be a sub-par MMO with a small but devoted player base using its one system to bro-slap each other around in awesome battles in space and on Squadron 42 will be a somewhat janky FMV adventure in space with minimal opportunity for player interaction which stays frosty until Episode 2, at which point it doesn't, and it disappears. 10 years from now, someone will ask "Hey man, remember that space game that pulled in 300 million dollars and was kind of dull and never really lived up to the hype?", to which the answer will probably be a collective shrug.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 22:35
|
|
|
Fashionable Jorts posted:Or will a lawsuit annihilate the company, giving a nice Enemy for the developers to pin the failure on? I wish I could skip ahead 10 years to watch a nice hour long post-mortem on youtube. I'm here for this, too. We've had these long vapourware development times before. We've had lofty promises turning out to mediated by reality. We've even seen expensive DLC before, but all of those in one package? There's a point of satisfaction that some of the whales have in 'helping out a creative', but the people who got conned by the whales throwing around disposable cash and leveraging themselves to the hilt? These are some of the same people bitching about Brie Larson thinking it would be nice for more female lead roles in the MCU. I'm guessing that there's going to be some sweet, sweet legal action coming out of this based on hurt feelings alone, never mind the whole deliciousness of arguing that thousands of people threw money at them on the basis that they might not actually release a game. Again, future income for the 'investors' is based on the current installed base being a fraction of the proposed installed base, rather than, as we suspect, already at saturation. We're working off the basis of knowing something about the genre, environment and field, but the 'investors' are working off whatever RSI has said. Peter.Quint posted:If we accept those financials they published doesn't that imply that the tracker is basically correct? I can believe they apply some kind of smoothing to the numbers, blend all revenue together, that kind of thing, but the idea that it's massively wrong seems like it might be one of our goon myths. They are, after all is said and done, pretty drat good at milking those whales. 'Goon myths' almost always have a basis in fact. Personally, I just accept the funding tracker as-is, as it's a published material by a company. That becomes important if someone has to explain why they made up numbers to publish widely, and also becomes important for people asking whether all of those accounts are actually _accurate_. Money laundering being an actual thing and all.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 22:38
|
|
|
Potato Salad posted:What do you call it when you choose a hard solution now that's also worse and piles on more refactoring later than a different, easy solution that's also less labor-intensive in the long run? That's Star Citizen. And/or numberwang.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 22:38
|
|
|
Beet Wagon posted:A cursory glance at kroket's history would show we literally had to ban him for spamming "lol hate sub" in every thread to try and make people mad. Tojal is mind-bogglingly stupid, which makes it 
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 22:41
|
|
|
Peter.Quint posted:If we accept those financials they published doesn't that imply that the tracker is basically correct? I can believe they apply some kind of smoothing to the numbers, blend all revenue together, that kind of thing, but the idea that it's massively wrong seems like it might be one of our goon myths. They are, after all is said and done, pretty drat good at milking those whales. They specifically say that they pick and chose which items were from where. So the headline income figure in the "financials" that they released are stated to be from the tracker, NOT from their various financial accounts. So it really had to match the tracker exactly exactly since that was the source in those "financials".
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 22:50
|
|
|
Jonny Shiloh posted:10 years from now, someone will ask "Hey man, remember that space game that pulled in 300 million dollars and was kind of dull and never really lived up to the hype?", to which the answer will probably be a collective shrug. I have a few friends who are into gaming and are fairly knowledgeable on the subject, and even they have no idea what Star Citizen is. Some will go "oh yeah, that thing" when I explain a bit more about it, but its pretty funny how the biggest and best AAAA videogame ever has made absolutely zero impact on the gaming landscape. In ten years from now, I imagine it'll be next to impossible to find people who even cared about it. Outside of these forums, I'm pretty sure the only times I see SC get mentioned is as a one-sentence punchline.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 22:51
|
|
|
Fashionable Jorts posted:I have a few friends who are into gaming and are fairly knowledgeable on the subject, and even they have no idea what Star Citizen is. Some will go "oh yeah, that thing" when I explain a bit more about it, but its pretty funny how the biggest and best AAAA videogame ever has made absolutely zero impact on the gaming landscape. In ten years from now, I imagine it'll be next to impossible to find people who even cared about it. Oddly, I was talking to a mate of mine about SC the other day (he's my board game/war game buddy, we nerd out over cardboard, I know right) and he mentioned a couple of his old pals from the Vanguard MMO days had moved on to Star Citizen when that folded, and were constantly trying to get him to buy into the BDSSE. He's genuinely not interested in it (he's a pen and paper guy) so he was most amused when I showed him this thread. He's now actually started to think that his proselytising mates might have a vested interest in trying to get him involved. I'm pretty sure I didn't say "scam", "pyramid scheme" or "hot steaming pile of gaming horseshit" more than once, God knows I was tempted though.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 23:01
|
|
|
https://www.pcgamer.com/a-real-life-lobbyist-was-just-permanently-banned-in-eve-online-for-corruption/quote:Dear Citizens of New Eden, tl;dr - lobbying and insider trading in Eve again. But this time by a professional.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 23:09
|
|
|
Every null CSM member does inside trading. When the R64/T2 change in...2013?...was announced, it was plainly discoverable that people had been hoarding otherwise-worthless r64 products for weeks at great scale.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 23:16
|
|
|
Amazing Zimmo posted:https://twitter.com/discolando/status/1115340881362481152 I was all, “Oh, obviously this is some kind of personal thing that makes sense in context” but it doesn’t. Unless he’s talking about these remarks about Steve Jobs, in which case obscure  on your colleagues?
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 23:16
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 13:49 |
|
|
Potato Salad posted:Every null CSM member does inside trading. Yeah, but it's the difference between insider trading and leaking information across an NDA that allows insider trading, and they've canned people before for loving with the NDA. There's an implication that personally identifiable might have been leaked too, and that's one of those '2% of gross product' parts of the GDPR.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2019 23:18
|
|