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I feel so weird about Imperator. On one hand a new paradox game set in a interesting time period should be right up my alley, but I have to admit I haven’t been following the development much and when o saw some early gameplay video, the game seems like a cluttered EUIV reskin. I’m also concerned with how you make the game interesting for non Med powers, but consider all the crazy world conquests people do I guess I shouldn’t be overly concerned. Still Paradox is one of those studies that even if it’s not right initially they will improve the game over time. Is there an official thread yet?
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Apr 11, 2019 15:37
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Yeah honestly the things that make me not that interested are all the things it has in common with EUIV, but that's just a taste thing. Really not my cup of tea EUIV. And the character stuff at least looks good so far.
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Apr 11, 2019 17:19
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I'm looking forward to Imperator but I really just want a late antiquity Paradox game (which isn't the hot mess of WTWSMS)
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Apr 11, 2019 17:37
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Echoing the mixed feelings about Imperator. Some stuff looks amazing, other stuff looks depressingly familiar. Still really looking forward to trying it.
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Apr 11, 2019 17:40
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Just to show how paradox can’t win: I don’t want any of the ck2 role play stuff there (but have learned to tolerate it) and would be extremely happy if it turned out to be eu5 but in this time period.
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Apr 11, 2019 17:47
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Just to show the Paradox can win: Imperator looks sick af
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Apr 11, 2019 17:48
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It really does
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Apr 11, 2019 17:50
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Jesus I didn't realize Imperator was coming out so soon.
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Apr 11, 2019 17:55
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Paradox wins when they extract the surplus value of their employees labor.
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Apr 11, 2019 18:03
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Imperator looks great, I'd be extremely happy with a Rome themed EU5
Fader Movitz fucked around with this message at 19:29 on Apr 11, 2019 |
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Apr 11, 2019 18:24
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I'm going into Imperator: Rome knowing basically nothing about it and I'm not sure if that's good or not.
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Apr 11, 2019 18:26
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As long as conquering three quarters of the med causes your nation to convulse into a series of civil wars I'll be happy. Don't really want more ultra-stable EU4 states.
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Apr 11, 2019 18:37
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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Stairmaster posted:Paradox wins when they extract the surplus value of their employees labor. extremely nice low-key Victoria 3 clamour
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Apr 11, 2019 18:44
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PittTheElder posted:As long as conquering three quarters of the med causes your nation to convulse into a series of civil wars I'll be happy. Don't really want more ultra-stable EU4 states. Civil wars was like the one thing EU:Rome did well, and arguably better than any other Paradox title. Supposedly they want to replicate and expand on this and what they have looks interesting, though the big player empires in the dev clash have all been pretty stable. So it's possible that the way it works out at the moment, it's a bit too easy to manage for a skilled player.
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Apr 11, 2019 18:49
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The problem is that losing the civil war means game over.
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Apr 11, 2019 19:11
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Rome looks EU-ish to me but I’m rooting for it to feel/play like a proper EU5 (Rome Edition.) EU feels like the most dated and janky paradox game to me at this point despite being younger than CK2. Like CK2 is my crazy alcoholic grandma and EU4 is my fat, aging uncle that’s only fun to hang out with during hockey finals. I think the early Rome period is a great, fresh stand-in for the classic EU period thematically- old and new empires clashing, worlds colliding, exploration, trade, conquest, a few questionably hiterlific fans to hate on. I’m hopeful. And EU5 proper would be fun with a basic character system imo. Let a good general age into advising. Let me know beforehand if my 80-year-old king’s heir is the only living relative. Etc. Edgar Allen Ho fucked around with this message at 19:17 on Apr 11, 2019 |
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Apr 11, 2019 19:12
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Party In My Diapee posted:The problem is that losing the civil war means game over. Yeah. Hopefully that is made into a toggleable game rule, poo poo have it disable achievements if you have to. At least it probably won't be too hard to mod out. Edgar Allen Ho posted:Rome looks EU-ish to me but I’m rooting for it to feel/play like a proper EU5 (Rome Edition.) EU feels like the most dated and janky paradox game to me at this point despite being younger than CK2. I think a part of this is that generally CK2 has avoided the feeling of bloat that EU4 seems to have suffered with its updates and DLCs, where you have alot of new systems added by DLC that due to DLC can't always interact properly with each other (except when they end up backported into the main game by necessity) so they stand kind of artificially and obviously apart in a way that's odd and clunky. CK2's updates by contrast has mostly focused on adding mechanics for previously unplayable countries/rulers/religions or adding unique mechanics to those where they didn't exist. Another reason could be that ultimately EU4 builds on much older game concepts and mechanics than CK2. Despite being a newer game. Randarkman fucked around with this message at 19:29 on Apr 11, 2019 |
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Apr 11, 2019 19:24
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Randarkman posted:Another reason could be that ultimately EU4 builds on much older game concepts and mechanics than CK2. Despite being a newer game.
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Apr 11, 2019 19:46
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EU4 is definitely very iterative. They mentioned in the last dev diary that there's still code from EU3 kicking around in EU4, which I bet isn't the case with CK1 and 2.
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Apr 11, 2019 21:01
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Every now and then I get a strange urge to give Civilization 6 another try, to see if I might actually like it this time. So I install it, play for an hour or so, and find out that it's still the exact same game that it was two years ago. Maybe there's some better stuff in the expansions, but the base vanilla game is still exactly the same. Same awful UI, same awful gameplay systems, same awful tech quotes, same awful art style. They already have my money, why should they fix anything? It makes me really appreciate paradox, who are willing to listen to players when they say that something isn't working very well, and willing to make both big and small changes to their games to make them better.
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Apr 11, 2019 21:53
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Magissima posted:EU4 is definitely very iterative. They mentioned in the last dev diary that there's still code from EU3 kicking around in EU4, which I bet isn't the case with CK1 and 2. i would be shocked if there wasn't eu3 code still rattling around in there. all of the basic systems, even trade, are straight from eu3 at their core. imo eu3 & eu4 are basically just one game, eu4 was a direct iteration from the last patch of eu3 and it goes without saying that on the data/script side of things, the history files and about half of the events are from eu3 even if they're been changed over time to fit the current game mechanics ck2...might have retained a little bit of ck1? certainly a few of the events were ported wholesale, and the launch history files Jazerus fucked around with this message at 22:25 on Apr 11, 2019 |
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Apr 11, 2019 22:16
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Wasn’t CK1 a particularly weird case? Like it was a licensed EU engine game but being made by some russian company that went under and paradox had to salvage it?
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Apr 11, 2019 22:39
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With EU4 I just get frustrated by how many DLCs there are, and I bought 5 and the base game and then look in the thread and everybody's talking about 3 more DLCs that have the real important content, and there's too many totally separate systems for me to really get a handle on everything. Almost every DLC adds some big new system disconnected from everything else, as opposed to CK2, which only really has 3 DLCs that add totally new systems: Way of Life, Conclave, and Monks & Mystics. Everything's much more neatly bundled together. Half of the systems that the game throws at you weren't even historically under the control of the higher echelons of government, which is why I get grumpy about some of the micromanaging like exploration or merchants or institutions. Imperator covers a time period that wasn't wildly evolving socially/technologically/religiously/economically like the world was from 1444 to 1824, and splitting your attention across Europe seems simpler than splitting it across hemispheres. I expect Imperator to feel a lot less schizophrenic, and I'd hope that character systems give a lot more flavor to the systems that they do introduce rather than let them all wallow on their own. Although to be fair, how could a game not feel schizophrenic if it's trying to portray the french revolution, colonial independence, Hapsburg networking, and the protestant reformation.
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Apr 11, 2019 22:56
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:Wasn’t CK1 a particularly weird case? Like it was a licensed EU engine game but being made by some russian company that went under and paradox had to salvage it? My sense was that Paradox had designed the game and outsourced development to another studio and ended up pretty much having to restart from scratch? Yeah, remembered the name 'Snowball' and found an old thread. Randarkman posted:Yeah. Hopefully that is made into a toggleable game rule, poo poo have it disable achievements if you have to. At least it probably won't be too hard to mod out. Yeah, a DLC focused around civil wars would be cool. Obviously, you want to discourage losing the war, but letting you continue playing as the victorious rebellion should be possible. Just tank a whole poo poo load of your countries stats/stability/treasury etc. It would also be nice if civil wars could end in a stalemate. Caesar flops at conquering the Republic and winds up holding a Caesarid Kingdom in Gaul after a peace treaty. A CB to restart the civil war goes to both sides for X years, but then eventually times out and they're de facto separate nations. Fintilgin fucked around with this message at 23:35 on Apr 11, 2019 |
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Apr 11, 2019 23:18
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Krazyface posted:I haven't really been following Imperator: Rome, but this LP that's just started does a really good job of laying out some of its mechanics. This is a pro click. He seems to know the game better than I anticipated and he even actually edits somewhat well.
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Apr 12, 2019 00:22
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Jazerus posted:i would be shocked if there wasn't eu3 code still rattling around in there. all of the basic systems, even trade, are straight from eu3 at their core. imo eu3 & eu4 are basically just one game, eu4 was a direct iteration from the last patch of eu3 The trade system in EU4 is completely different than the one in EU3. I think it was the biggest difference on release. e: Oh and monarch points I guess. Admittedly quite the change. Going back to look at EU3 feels weird.
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Apr 12, 2019 00:38
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Watching some videos I'm really getting the feeling I can just jump in and start playing as if it were EU4, though I'm sure the first game or two would go badly. The similarity is way more obvious in solo videos than the MP streams. Also apparently quill18 fights wars in the diplomatic map mode, what the gently caress man
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Apr 12, 2019 00:44
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PittTheElder posted:The trade system in EU4 is completely different than the one in EU3. I think it was the biggest difference on release. you'd think so, but no, the movement of trade and persistence of merchants are the only substantial changes to trade. these, of course, totally transformed the system, but the concept of trade value accumulating in centers of trade that nations staff with merchants to skim off the top was in eu3 for a long time what i'm getting at is that from a code perspective, a major systems redesign was accomplished without having to rewrite the majority of the system at all
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Apr 12, 2019 01:55
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Crusader Kings 3 actually starts in 2013 where instead of retiring, Pope Benedict calls for a new Crusade to restore the Kingdom of Jerusalem and starts a hellwar between Israel and South America.
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Apr 12, 2019 02:12
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Jack2142 posted:Crusader Kings 3 actually starts in 2013 where instead of retiring, Pope Benedict calls for a new Crusade to restore the Kingdom of Jerusalem and starts a hellwar between Israel and South America... ...culminating in Israel deploying the Samson Option as the unending tides of Brazilians and Argies overtake Tel Aviv. It's all billed as a prequel to the CK2 After The End mod.
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Apr 12, 2019 03:37
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trapped mouse posted:This is a pro click. He seems to know the game better than I anticipated and he even actually edits somewhat well. There's two more links to early access let's play in the description too. One does Rome, one does Carthage. Neither are the best LP I have seen (the Rome one is pretty obnoxious), but they all seem to try their best to explain the mechanics, I feel ready for my first game already 
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Apr 12, 2019 08:03
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Here's quill18's video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=el3ZNNnxnWQ
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Apr 12, 2019 09:00
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Watching the videos I think it would be cool to have an "expansion planner"-style screen that summarises the alliances, pacts, strengths etc. of your immediate neighbours. EU4 diplomatic webs get complicated enough but this is going to be way worse with the huge number of hard-to-remember states. The streamers are spending a lot of time clicking around the diplomacy screens trying to keep track. I'm also a bit disappointed that the diplomat travel cooldown timer between diplomatic actions is back. I never understood the point of that. It's long enough to be annoying but doesn't seem long enough to really affect gameplay in any way. Maybe I'm missing something.
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Apr 12, 2019 09:14
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Magissima posted:EU4 is definitely very iterative. They mentioned in the last dev diary that there's still code from EU3 kicking around in EU4, which I bet isn't the case with CK1 and 2. It is still the case
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Apr 12, 2019 12:37
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fuf posted:Watching the videos I think it would be cool to have an "expansion planner"-style screen that summarises the alliances, pacts, strengths etc. of your immediate neighbours. EU4 diplomatic webs get complicated enough but this is going to be way worse with the huge number of hard-to-remember states. The streamers are spending a lot of time clicking around the diplomacy screens trying to keep track. This would actually be amazing, paradox take note. Should be easy to jam a new map mode in in a couple weeks right?
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Apr 12, 2019 13:35
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hot cocoa on the couch posted:Should be easy to jam a new map mode in in a couple weeks right? Actually I guess the diplomatic map mode already kinda does what I'm asking for...
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Apr 12, 2019 16:01
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fuf posted:Actually I guess the diplomatic map mode already kinda does what I'm asking for... Would be nice to see strengths of armies and navies, and stuff too though, maybe fort locations, like literally a “I’m looking to declare a war, who can I beat up?” kinda map mode
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Apr 12, 2019 16:19
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im watching a gameplay stream of the imperator rome and it just looks like a straight up remake of EU: Rome, which was a terrible boring game. why are they doing this. what are the actual differences?
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Apr 12, 2019 20:35
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Sheng-Ji Yang posted:EU: Rome, why are they doing this. Because unlike Vickie 3, this will sell
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Apr 13, 2019 04:03
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I was tentatively optimistic about Imperator until the recent dev stream where they had a bunch of house rules in a, uh, dev stream, and then some of the streamers who received builds of the game described it as a "very early" build of the game, even though it's 2 weeks out from release.  I guess the fact Paradox isn't hiding it or anything like that is grounds for tentative optimism, but we'll see.
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Apr 13, 2019 07:15
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