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I feel like you could go deer hunting with a buck knife and a can-do attitude in a good number of places in the US. Definitely in Nebraska, where I grow up. Dumb things have no survival instinct to fear humans.
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Apr 18, 2019 21:30
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Mr. Lobe posted:I feel like you could go deer hunting with a buck knife and a can-do attitude in a good number of places in the US. Definitely in Nebraska, where I grow up. Dumb things have no survival instinct to fear humans. Black powder hunting is absolutely a thing. You can get an outstanding black powder rifle for super cheap. Troll craigslist for bows/crossbows and you can start hunting for probably less than 100$ The most bougie thing with hunting I can think of is these rich people hunting clubs. There's one in my state that has thousands of acres and only allows ultra-rich sports stars and ceos in.
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Apr 18, 2019 21:34
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spacetoaster posted:But that's true for everything if you go that way. When I brought up soccer I was thinking of the people I've seen with 1,000 dollars worth of gear + private lessons + fees to be on the "good" team type soccer folks. I get where you're coming from, but soccer is just a real weird example to use because there's absolutely no way you can get the cost of entry of hunting down to the cost of entry of soccer, that's the primary reason why every country on earth plays soccer and it's existed for millennia. Even if you're carving up your own spear or making your own bow or w/e using only rocks you're going to wind up taking more time and effort doing that than you'd take procuring a ball of some kind. spacetoaster posted:Entry level hunting is pretty low (and you don't have to use a gun). And then you're getting a shitload of ethical meat. I'm not entirely sold on the "ethical meat" part either, like it assumes you're using a gun or a particularly good bow, the projectile has enough power to destroy the animal's brain immediately, and you never miss. If any of this isn't the case then you're pretty much just causing suffering for your own entertainment
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Apr 18, 2019 21:36
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spacetoaster posted:Black powder hunting is absolutely a thing. You can get an outstanding black powder rifle for super cheap. People aren't using those for hunting, they're using them because it's the only kind of gun you're allowed to use if you have a criminal record  e: Though tbf I bet there's some historical reenactment renfest dorks who hunt with muskets just to be dorks about it
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Apr 18, 2019 21:38
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Shame Boy posted:People aren't using those for hunting, they're using them because it's the only kind of gun you're allowed to use if you have a criminal record Also a lot of places the bow/black powder season starts earlier, meaning more easy animals. It's a thing
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Apr 18, 2019 21:39
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yeah, black powder hunting generally gives you the first crack at killing a deer. people absolutely hunt with them. I know one weird dude who only shoots black powder for sport and recreation. to the best of my knowledge, hes not trying to skirt atf firearm regulation
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Apr 18, 2019 21:43
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A&W has a vegetable patty but they charge extra for it. It's really good apparently but paying more for veggie is putting people off.
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Apr 18, 2019 21:44
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Shame Boy posted:I get where you're coming from, but soccer is just a real weird example to use because there's absolutely no way you can get the cost of entry of hunting down to the cost of entry of soccer Absolutely, I'm not meaning to argue that. It's just that I bet the entry into hunting is a lot lower than people who know nothing about it think. Shame Boy posted:I'm not entirely sold on the "ethical meat" part either, like it assumes you're using a gun or a particularly good bow, the projectile has enough power to destroy the animal's brain immediately, and you never miss. If any of this isn't the case then you're pretty much just causing suffering for your own entertainment It's not for entertainment. It's for getting food (really healthy food that's higher in nutrients and has never had drugs/hormones injected into it). Spending hours out in nature and stuff is entertaining, but it's not the point. I'd also argue that causing suffering is relative. What if I put the shot through the animals lungs/heart and it bounds a few feet before it collapses (which is considered by a lot of hunters to be more ethical because that's a larger target than the head)? Compared to what we're doing in factory farms I'll take a fairly quick death after living a life free. Shame Boy posted:People aren't using those for hunting, they're using them because it's the only kind of gun you're allowed to use if you have a criminal record Dude, you don't know what you're talking about. https://www.outdoorlife.com/muzzleloader-test-hunting-rifles  You can buy black powder rifles at any outdoors store. Even walmart. spacetoaster has issued a correction as of 21:49 on Apr 18, 2019 |
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Apr 18, 2019 21:44
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The only black powder hunter I ever met was a marine sharpshooter who said modern weapons were unsporting for him, so I guess they do exist
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Apr 18, 2019 21:45
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Former DILF posted:The only black powder hunter I ever met was a marine sharpshooter who said modern weapons were unsporting for him, so I guess they do exist That's dumb as gently caress
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Apr 18, 2019 21:46
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JudgeX posted:cool post, It's drawn from a variety of sources. If you are interested in terrestrial game I recommend reading anything about bison or passenger pigeons For a summary of how ridiculous unregulated commercial exploitation of wild game was in the 19th century. That started to change in the early 20th century. Good popular books that will introduce you to some of the issues with fisheries I can recommend a few books. Four Fish: The Future of the Last Wild Food by Paul Greenberg is about the modern shift towards aquaculture. It looks closely at trends in salmon, tuna, bass, and cod fisheries, and the economic push to farm raise these species even if maybe they aren't the best candidates for domestication. For a look at the intersection of commercial fishing, sports fishing, aquaculture and everything else water related, I recommend the book The Death and Life of the Great Lakes by Dan Egan. Its jam packed with insight into our relationship with the water and how we have effected natural systems. It tells lots of great stories, it makes a good narrative out of what are really complex issues. It tells the stories of Asian carp, Zebra mussels, the local fish, and stocked salmon. It provides a lot of insight into WHY people manage resources the way it does, why it fails, and natures surprising capacity to fix itself. edit:  An adorable Heath Hen, once so common on the East coast of North America and cheaply bought it was considered cruel to feed them to your servants. Exterminated from the mainland by 1900, extinct in the nineteen-twenties. Squalid has issued a correction as of 22:08 on Apr 18, 2019 |
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Apr 18, 2019 21:52
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Bombadilillo posted:Also a lot of places the bow/black powder season starts earlier, meaning more easy animals. It's a thing I knew the bow thing but wasn't aware it also applied to black powder, huh spacetoaster posted:Absolutely, I'm not meaning to argue that. It's just that I bet the entry into hunting is a lot lower than people who know nothing about it think. Yeah I got ya spacetoaster posted:It's not for entertainment. It's for getting food (really healthy food that's higher in nutrients and has never had drugs/hormones injected into it). Spending hours out in nature and stuff is entertaining, but it's not the point. I'd say that's still for entertainment but ok spacetoaster posted:I'd also argue that causing suffering is relative. What if I put the shot through the animals lungs/heart and it bounds a few feet before it collapses (which is considered by a lot of hunters to be more ethical because that's a larger target than the head)? Compared to what we're doing in factory farms I'll take a fairly quick death after living a life free. I mean yeah but compared to factory farming killing the thing by skinning it alive would be less unethical. Luckily those aren't the only two options. spacetoaster posted:Dude, you don't know what you're talking about. Yes I'm aware those exist, I know someone who owns one. Guess what he's never actually used it to do 
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Apr 18, 2019 21:53
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spacetoaster posted:Why do you think that? Did you actually try to go hunting and have to reject the idea because it was so expensive? Because it's not, at all. because i come from a familial and geographic background where hunting is a cultural hobby and I know exactly the people that get to and don't get to do it little secret --- it's bourgeois as gently caress and you just don't identify as the bourgeoisie gently caress
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Apr 18, 2019 21:56
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Outrail posted:A&W has a vegetable patty but they charge extra for it. It's really good apparently but paying more for veggie is putting people off. when we moved to iowa, my wife was excited that a restaurant in town had a veggie burger. turns out after further investigation, it was simply a beef burger with lettuce, onion, and tomato. i bought some beyond patties a couple days ago because they were on sale at the grocery store. havent tried em yet, but im glad to read good things
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Apr 18, 2019 22:00
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the basic tools of hunting are the cheapest and easiest and simplest part of the process, and always have been, its all the parts after that
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Apr 18, 2019 22:02
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lancemantis posted:because i come from a familial and geographic background where hunting is a cultural hobby and I know exactly the people that get to and don't get to do it where abouts is that? the biggest hunter i know is a handyman and volunteer driver for the ambulance I know the ceo of the hospital he works at is a giant waterfowl enthusiast and built a goddamn wetland and travels all over the country. bougie fucks that travel to hunt are a thing, as are salt of the earth types. my wife enjoys hunting. i have never gone. we both grew up poor as gently caress and were below average for income until last year
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Apr 18, 2019 22:04
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Eat This Glob posted:where abouts is that? the biggest hunter i know is a handyman and volunteer driver for the ambulance No, you see I saw a hunter once and he was bougie as gently caress.  Seriously though, it's cheap and easy. And the wildlife department in your area would love to help anyone get into it.
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Apr 18, 2019 22:07
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lancemantis posted:the basic tools of hunting are the cheapest and easiest and simplest part of the process, and always have been, its all the parts after that Dependant on where you live 1. $ Tags and/or liscence 2. Vehicle to get to where you can hunt which can be hours away. 3. Tools or $ to have butchered Agreed. Theres a good amount of upfront money for no guarantee of reward on the other end.
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Apr 18, 2019 22:08
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Bombadilillo posted:Agreed. Theres a good amount of upfront money for no guarantee of reward on the other end. Are we still talking about hunting?
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Apr 18, 2019 22:09
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spacetoaster posted:Are we still talking about hunting? Out of context that does look like incel.txt
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Apr 18, 2019 22:12
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lancemantis posted:the basic tools of hunting are the cheapest and easiest and simplest part of the process, and always have been, its all the parts after that like when it's time to shake that bear
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Apr 18, 2019 22:13
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Hunt the rich
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Apr 18, 2019 22:14
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honestly presenting hunting as the sport of the everyman is like arguing camping and backpacking are activities of the everyman activities know for their broad and diverse representation
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Apr 18, 2019 22:20
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Outrail posted:A&W has a vegetable patty but they charge extra for it. It's really good apparently but paying more for veggie is putting people off. part of it is economy of scale, part is also how radically we subsidize meat in the US, to the point that meat tacos cost less at taco bell than bean burritos, and part of it is just  if the veggie burger cost the same or less than the real thing, that would imply it wasn't a quality item. Mark up the price, like Carl Jr's beyond burger (about double the regular burger) and suddenly you've got a premium item on the menu you can advertise to everyone the patties being sold in carl's are just slightly better than Morningstar farm's veggie patties. But I've had beyond and impossible meats even at places where you're paying $15 bucks a plate that really are surprising.
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Apr 18, 2019 22:20
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My relationship with soccer parents is a pretty lovely capitalism story. My kids are all young (not in, or close, to high school) and we had an exchange student come live with us for a school year (9 months or so). He was 15 so he went to the highschool and wanted to play soccer. Here's the crazy poo poo that I had no idea about with highschool soccer (probably highschool sports in general): - 800 dollars for the gear (bag, socks, shirts, shorts) - Even more money for shoes and stuff - There are several teams (travel team, home team, jv team, some other team, etc) - Those teams are in a pecking order and the parents are all very much assholes to each other all the time based on your kid's place on what team - Soccer is VERY IMPORTANT and if your kid isn't on the right team it's a BIG loving DEAL so a lot of the parents pay ungodly amounts of money for private lessons - Parents absolutely bribe the school/coaches to make sure their kids get on the correct team - And they're openly racist and horrible Our student just got on the lower team and played soccer and I just tried to not give a poo poo about all the other drama. So yeah, soccer is a pretty awesome sport for poor people around the world, but we in America have found a way to turn it into a poo poo show.
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Apr 18, 2019 22:23
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like fishing was the most accessible activity where i grew up, and a lot of that was based in just rampant poaching and tresspassing like i don't think i've fished with a permit in my life
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Apr 18, 2019 22:29
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spacetoaster posted:But that's true for everything if you go that way. When I brought up soccer I was thinking of the people I've seen with 1,000 dollars worth of gear + private lessons + fees to be on the "good" team type soccer folks. this is literally only in America lmao it is the exact loving opposite in every other county and it’s why America sucks rear end at the sport
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Apr 18, 2019 22:38
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A Buff Gay Dude posted:this is literally only in America lmao it is the exact loving opposite in every other county and it’s why America sucks rear end at the sport Anyone have any insight as to why this is in the States? All I can think is that American Football was just first past the post here, and Soccer/Football ended up as bougie suburban momsport as a way to distinguish white upper-middle class households from.... I don't know, that barely holds water given that dumbshit amounts of money with throw into American Football. Someone who is good at sports history, please help.
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Apr 18, 2019 22:46
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Eat This Glob posted:when we moved to iowa, my wife was excited that a restaurant in town had a veggie burger. turns out after further investigation, it was simply a beef burger with lettuce, onion, and tomato. Ahahahaha goddamn the midwest owns
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Apr 18, 2019 22:46
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A Buff Gay Dude posted:this is literally only in America lmao it is the exact loving opposite in every other county and it’s why America sucks rear end at the sport It's the same way in China (lovely rich people deeply involved) too. And I have no experience with western Europe, but I imagine it's similar too.
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Apr 18, 2019 22:48
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lancemantis posted:honestly presenting hunting as the sport of the everyman is like arguing camping and backpacking are activities of the everyman i see lots of poc camping in downtown seattle 
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Apr 18, 2019 22:53
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spacetoaster posted:It's the same way in China (lovely rich people deeply involved) too. uh no it’s the opposite in Western Europe my dude tho there the talent is scooped up by academies who pay for all that stuff themselves, so while it’s arguably more of a pure meritocracy there are different issues
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Apr 18, 2019 23:50
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A Buff Gay Dude posted:uh no it’s the opposite in Western Europe my dude Maybe. I was talking specifically about kids school teams, not sports academies. I'm glad though that France doesn't have the lovely rich sports parents.
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Apr 19, 2019 00:06
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spacetoaster posted:And I have no experience with western Europe, but I imagine it's similar too. nope
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Apr 19, 2019 00:07
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yeah sports development in the US is also hilarious almost all of our Olympians are just rich kids vs a lot of other countries where becoming an Olympian is much more attainable because they pay for it on national levels
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Apr 19, 2019 00:09
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i remember when the ioc cancelled wrestling in future olympics for some crazy bougie poo poo involving horses or something? Modern pentathlon? they eventually had to relent since it is the only sport since it has been around since the first ancient olmpics and requires like no equipment and everyone got pissed. wrestling owns and is like the most meritocratic sport next to running
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Apr 19, 2019 00:18
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as a good ol' boy hillbilly myself black powder rifles are pretty uncommon around here but that's mostly because we're all insanely poor and most peoples .308s and whatnot are heirlooms from their grandpa or whatever. but once and a while you get the overlap of redneck gun nerd with history nerd and those people tend to be very in to them, and slowly end up with a couple of usable pieces and some historical ones they keep around for show
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Apr 19, 2019 00:19
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and on a related note track and field is the poor students sport of choice since all you need is track spikes, which are kind of pricey but are surprisingly durable.
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Apr 19, 2019 00:21
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the only real place you'll see a more diverse pool of talent in US Olympic sports is where they're accidentally subsidized by also being high school/collegiate ones
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Apr 19, 2019 00:23
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Outrail posted:A&W has a vegetable patty but they charge extra for it. It's really good apparently but paying more for veggie is putting people off. Yah, the beyond meat burgers ar A&W are really good, and have become my go to fast food option. They seem to be going over fairly well in Canada at least, since they just started serving a beyond meat breakfast sandwich.
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Apr 19, 2019 01:18
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