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Who do you want to be the 2020 Democratic Nominee? This poll is closed. |
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| Joe "the liberal who fights busing" Biden |
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27 | 1.40% |
| Bernie "please don't die" Sanders |
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1017 | 52.69% |
| Cory "charter schools" Booker |
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12 | 0.62% |
| Kirsten "wall street" Gillibrand |
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24 | 1.24% |
| Kamala "truancy queen" Harris |
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59 | 3.06% |
| Julian "who?" Castro |
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7 | 0.36% |
| Tulsi "gay panic" Gabbard |
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25 | 1.30% |
| Michael "crimes crimes crimes" Avenatti |
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22 | 1.14% |
| Sherrod "discount bernie" Brown |
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21 | 1.09% |
| Amy "horrible boss" Klobuchar |
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12 | 0.62% |
| Tammy "stands for america" Duckworth |
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48 | 2.49% |
| Beto "whataburger" O'Rourke |
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32 | 1.66% |
| Elizabeth "instagram beer" Warren |
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284 | 14.72% |
| Tom "impeach please" Steyer |
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4 | 0.21% |
| Michael "soda is the devil" Bloomberg |
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9 | 0.47% |
| Joseph Stalin |
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287 | 14.87% |
| Howard "coffee republican" Schultz |
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10 | 0.52% |
Jay "nobody cares about climate change  " Inslee |
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13 | 0.67% |
| Pete "gently caress the homeless" Butt Man |
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17 | 0.88% |
| Total: | 1930 votes | ||
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Failed Imagineer posted:She's not running tho You 100% sure?  https://twitter.com/daveweigel/status/1123050521856827392
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Apr 30, 2019 21:48
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Biden and Hillary running would cause in a Centrist cage match where they would all murder each other before they allow someone else the ability to rule.
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Apr 30, 2019 21:51
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If she ran (which isn't likely) it would tank Biden. 
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Apr 30, 2019 21:52
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Yiggy posted:Sure but those people who think trump and Biden are the same stayed home last time and no doubt stayed home in ‘12. No one really has them as part of their models because of course they won’t vote.
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Apr 30, 2019 21:54
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Tbh I fully would be unsurprised if the Dems were to nominate a proven loser like hillary
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Apr 30, 2019 21:54
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VideoGameVet posted:If she ran (which isn't likely) it would tank Biden. Yeah for real I would be pretty happy if she ran for Bernie's sake
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Apr 30, 2019 21:58
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Hahaha... pull the trigger!
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Apr 30, 2019 21:59
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Didn't she already announce she's not running months ago?
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Apr 30, 2019 22:02
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Pembroke Fuse posted:Hahaha... pull the trigger! We're not that lucky and you know it. Jaxyon posted:Disillusionment is not the only factor that got people to vote Obama and not Hillary. No, but the argument from Hillary supporters went that she could turn out POC voters reliably. As it turns out, she couldn't, and it wasn't just because of voter disenfranchisement.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:05
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Skex posted:See there you go assuming that I'm not on the Left, that I'm not also hoping that Benie will be able to win and demonstrate that running on the premise of doing popular good things will win. I'm just not willing to consign humanity to accepting the apocalypse if the reality that I've seen my entire life continues. Bernie may be the best option, that doesn't mean that he's the only good option and it sure as gently caress doesn't mean that there is no value in getting some incremental improvement and putting a brake on the backsliding in order to hopefully buy time for demographics to catch up and more Boomers to die if he fails to get the nomination. The other choices may be less ideal but none of them are anywhere near as awful as this thread pretends. There's no more time for incremental bullshit. Bernie is not important for me, it's that he is symbolic of more left-wing possibility. If he goes out in a wet fart campaign against a monster like Joe Biden, then we are screwed and the electorate is not ready to move past the center-right position our country is stuck in with enough time to actually do anything about climate change. We don't have time to wait for all the lovely boomers to die.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:05
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Skex posted:See there you go assuming that I'm not on the Left, that I'm not also hoping that Benie will be able to win and demonstrate that running on the premise of doing popular good things will win. I'm just not willing to consign humanity to accepting the apocalypse if the reality that I've seen my entire life continues. Bernie may be the best option, that doesn't mean that he's the only good option and it sure as gently caress doesn't mean that there is no value in getting some incremental improvement and putting a brake on the backsliding in order to hopefully buy time for demographics to catch up and more Boomers to die if he fails to get the nomination. The other choices may be less ideal but none of them are anywhere near as awful as this thread pretends.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:05
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Judakel posted:Not enough to cause her to lose the rust belt states. I love when people hate Hillary enough to end up at conclusions like “GOP voter supression, meh, big deal”.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:06
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Hillary will announce Sanders threatened her not to run, Bernie must resign.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:06
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Also it's impossible to separate true disillusionment from the Hillary campaign with the natural apathy that came from months of the media proclaiming "She has a 99.999% chance to win, it's all over!" Of course if you think the election doesn't matter, you're not going to turn out.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:07
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InnercityGriot posted:There's no more time for incremental bullshit. Bernie is not important for me, it's that he is symbolic of more left-wing possibility. If he goes out in a wet fart campaign against a monster like Joe Biden, then we are screwed and the electorate is not ready to move past the center-right position our country is stuck in with enough time to actually do anything about climate change. We don't have time to wait for all the lovely boomers to die.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:07
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Mellow Seas posted:I love when people hate Hillary enough to end up at conclusions like “GOP voter supression, meh, big deal”. Not actually what anybody has said, but you keep on defending Mother's e-honour three years after the fact.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:09
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cargo cult posted:what if there's an recession but not enough time to help bernie, but one that prompts a bunch of insurgent campaigns like AOCs? are you saying you'd have completely given up by that point and that it wouldnt matter Of course not, but if we get a recession not in time to help Bernie than we have either Trump in the presidency or a Centrist body snatcher who will do nothing but capitulate to the investment classes for four years. Obviously you try again in four years but who is the noted left Dem pol ready to run for the presidency in another four years? It matters that he wins because the left Dem bench has been basically bare forever and there's nobody else.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:16
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i'm obviously no hillary fan but it is incredibly dumb you can get 3 million more votes and lose.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:16
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InnercityGriot posted:Of course not, but if we get a recession not in time to help Bernie than we have either Trump in the presidency or a Centrist body snatcher who will do nothing but capitulate to the investment classes for four years. Obviously you try again in four years but who is the noted left Dem pol ready to run for the presidency in another four years? It matters that he wins because the left Dem bench has been basically bare forever and there's nobody else. Wasn't it pointed out that, technically, AOC would be 35 by the time of her inauguration in 2025 if she ran in 2024? Just saying...
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Apr 30, 2019 22:21
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InnercityGriot posted:Of course not, but if we get a recession not in time to help Bernie than we have either Trump in the presidency or a Centrist body snatcher who will do nothing but capitulate to the investment classes for four years. Obviously you try again in four years but who is the noted left Dem pol ready to run for the presidency in another four years? It matters that he wins because the left Dem bench has been basically bare forever and there's nobody else.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:26
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reignonyourparade posted:Alternately, they've read Literally Any Of Your Posts Ever. If you think that you haven't actually read any post I have ever made, ever. Judakel posted:Generational shifts are a myth in a system where a minority can overrule a majority. You don't know what you're talking about. You're perception is too limited, you are viewing this in the context of now and ignoring all of the improvements that have occurred over the last 30 years, Sure we lost ground on the economic side of the fight but 30 it's not like the conservatives suddenly became racists, they've always been that way in fact 30 years ago they were worse. Yes the right has been resurgent and they have gamed the systems to maximum effect, but they are also desperate, note that they've given up any pretext of playing within the rules. They're not doing that because they're feeling confident, they're doing it because they know that their time is running out. All of that "you won't replace us" nonsense is shaking their fists at their own mortality and vainly screaming into the void trying to stop the inevitable. 100 years ago women didn't have the right to vote, 50 years ago Jim Crow was the rule of the land, 30 years ago people were arguing about whether gay people should be allowed to live (100 years ago it's wasn't even a debate) hell 10 years ago it was still against the law for gay people to be married. poo poo changes and yes the system is built to be resistant to change which is a mixed blessing, good when you aren't in power bad when you are, It makes it harder to make progress, but at the same time it makes said progress more resilient because it's more difficult for someone to come around later and undo that progress. You keep blaming Liberals and Democrats for the fact that Republicans lie cheat and break the law to win which is  I mean do you talk politics to people other than online and at activists events? People don't change easily or rapidly. It took years of Pride Parades, Designing Women, Queer eye and Ellen for attitudes to homosexuality to shift to the point where a gay man is running for President at it's not the most talked about aspect of his run. If you think that generational shifts are a myth, then you haven't been paying attention. We have a good field of candidates, the vast majority of whom are better more progressive and dare I say more leftist than anyone who won the nomination in the history of the loving country. Seriously if Bernie wasn't in the race then you'd have people defending any criticism against Warren, if she wasn't in the race we wouldn't be hearing people calling Buttigeg a sociopath. It would be nice to be able to have a reasonable discussion of the pros and cons of each candidate but we can't because any discussion of Harris it's all "cop" "cop" "truancy" or any discussion of Warren has to include genegate. Every one of them, even the worst centrist corporate tools would make a better President than any Republican and yeah I get it "Benie is our best chance and we're all doomed if we don't take the threat seriously" but stating it over and over again in response to any suggestion that he might not be the only decent option isn't going to make his victory anymore certain. My breakdown. Bernie I'm an old school Leftist so yeah I like him best for the role because he's the most consistent, on the other hand he's old and old people simply aren't as flexible and adaptable to change, which probably goes a long way to explaining why he can't figure out how to connect with black voters in a way that convinces them that he's a superior choice to Biden or Harris. Warren, She's good, she's focused on policy and in general good ones. Sure she's not perfect but her ideas have a much easier path to implementation and would start the process of weakening capital so that the rich have fewer resources to obstruct positive change with going forward. Buttigeg, Yeah he's a bit of a blank slate, he's green and it would be nice if we had a little better track record on good policy, however it sounds like he has a good grasp of the structural impediments that we're facing in trying to address the challenges we face and is young enough that he's able to change and grow in good ways. Beto, like Buttigeg he's a gamble, maybe he's a centrist pos but so far he's the only one to call for radical change on our immigration policy and is pushing Climate change as the most important issue we're facing. Harris, She's a black woman who grew up in America and is a Democrat, I seriously doubt that she doesn't take white supremacists seriously. yeah her record is a bit harsh but she was a black woman prosecutor and you don't get into that position without having to do some poo poo. Castro, I actually like him a lot, he's got a good record in SA and seems to legit give a poo poo about people. Biden, He's my least favorite of the ones who seem to have a real chance at the nomination. but he did write the Violence Against Women Act and pushed the issue of Gay marriage over the hump the problem is I don't know how much of his past policy positions was cynical political pandering and how much represented his internal views on things. I'm not super familiar with the others who are various levels of bleh to ick and honestly they are such long shots that unless something drastic happens they'll be out of the race after the first primary if not sooner. The question isn't who I support, or for that matter who you or anyone else on this forum supports but rather who is going to have sufficient support to secure the nomination? And there are a lot of factors involved in that ultimate decision that aren't controllable and while they may not be morally right still exist and will effect the outcome. Hostility of a significant portion of the Democratic electorate towards Bernie is a thing, as is the fear and loathing that the elites have for him.Then we get to how the media handles it an lol if you think that won't have an effect. then again he has a massive operation with over a million volunteers and that might be enough to overcome the institutional obstacles to his nomination. There is also the fact and it's a fact that he has a weakness when it comes to outreach to minority voters that he hasn't shown himself to be particularly adept at addressing and correcting. I hope that he can overcome those but it's an open question at this point and so putting all of my eggs into a single basket is just a recipe for disappointment. Skex fucked around with this message at 22:35 on Apr 30, 2019 |
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Apr 30, 2019 22:30
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Mellow Seas posted:I love when people hate Hillary enough to end up at conclusions like “GOP voter supression, meh, big deal”. That's not what I said, you dullard. Skex posted:If you think that you haven't actually ready any post I have ever made, ever. Liberals are to blame for Donald Trump.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:34
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Mellow Seas posted:I love when people hate Hillary enough to end up at conclusions like “GOP voter supression, meh, big deal”. Hey Mellow, I am deliberately going to be very polite when I say this. Hillary is a very bad person and now that she is no longer in a 1 v 1 with a big dumb orange poo poo poster it is perfectly alright to hate her loving guts for the narcissistic, money grabbing, warmongering turboshit that she is. No one thinks voter suppression is meh friendo, just that maybe having her* to vote for might have contributed to people not wanting to put the effort in. EDIT:* originally I wrote turd on a stick here and I wish to apologise to turds everywhere for the comparison, my bad.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:35
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Judakel posted:That's not what I said, you dullard.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:39
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Cerebral Bore posted:Not actually what anybody has said, but you keep on defending Mother's e-honour three years after the fact. I’m not defending anybody’s anything. Just, people reach stupid conclusions when they have to construct a reality out of a belief system that nobody could ever like Hillary and Hillary could never do anything good. gently caress, just pointing out that “actually maybe a 10,000 vote margin could be related to voter suppression” gets me called a loving Hillary fanboy.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:50
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Hillary's going to endorse Bernie because there's an unbroken brain out there that needs correction.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:52
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Mellow Seas posted:I’m not defending anybody’s anything. Just, people reach stupid conclusions when they have to construct a reality out of a belief system that nobody could ever like Hillary and Hillary could never do anything good. gently caress, just pointing out that “actually maybe a 10,000 vote margin could be related to voter suppression” gets me called a loving Hillary fanboy. Nobody's saying it's not related to voter suppression. Just that maybe the fact that nearly 90,000 ballots left the president spot blank has more to do with it. e: I assume we're alluding to Michigan
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Apr 30, 2019 22:55
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Mellow Seas posted:I’m not defending anybody’s anything. Just, people reach stupid conclusions when they have to construct a reality out of a belief system that nobody could ever like Hillary and Hillary could never do anything good. gently caress, just pointing out that “actually maybe a 10,000 vote margin could be related to voter suppression” gets me called a loving Hillary fanboy. The fact that the election was ever even that close shows what a poo poo candidate she was.
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Apr 30, 2019 22:57
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Skex posted:he can't figure out how to connect with black voters in a way that convinces them that he's a superior choice to Biden or Harris. https://twitter.com/RoseAnnDeMoro/status/1103469738796044288 Oops, my narrative!
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Apr 30, 2019 23:00
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WampaLord posted:https://twitter.com/RoseAnnDeMoro/status/1103469738796044288 March 6, 2019
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Apr 30, 2019 23:01
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LinYutang posted:March 6, 2019 Feel free to find a more recent poll that disproves it! Have fun looking! https://twitter.com/jakebackpack/status/1123205477695938561
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Apr 30, 2019 23:02
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Ok, public service announcement, Hillary was not a good candidate and drastically underperformed. She was also a potential victim of voter suppression. Both things can be true. Ok good talk.
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Apr 30, 2019 23:02
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Judakel posted:Not enough to cause her to lose the rust belt states. The ones that she lost by a combined 70k?
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Apr 30, 2019 23:04
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Mellow Seas posted:Ok, public service announcement, Hillary was not a good candidate and drastically underperformed. She was also a potential victim of voter suppression. Both things can be true. Ok good talk.
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Apr 30, 2019 23:05
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Jaxyon posted:The ones that she lost by a combined 70k? Yes, the ones she failed to get peoole to turn out in.
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Apr 30, 2019 23:05
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Son of Thunderbeast posted:Good to get that cleared up with... *checks thread* nobody at all, because nobody was saying both things couldn't be true. Glad we're all finally on the same page though Some people expressed some difficulty with the idea of someone saying “B” while also believing “A”. Just lookin’ out!
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Apr 30, 2019 23:10
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Mellow Seas posted:Some people expressed some difficulty with the idea of someone saying “B” while also believing “A”. Just lookin’ out! No, they didn't. It's this kind of disingenuous attempt to twist and misrepresent people's words that makes everyone think you're Hillfolk.
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Apr 30, 2019 23:17
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E: Oh whatever gently caress it Mellow Seas fucked around with this message at 23:21 on Apr 30, 2019 |
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Apr 30, 2019 23:18
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Mellow Seas posted:E: Oh whatever gently caress it This is it, chief.
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Apr 30, 2019 23:25
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| # ? Jun 12, 2024 23:10 |
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https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1123352740363681792 Look at this moron.
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Apr 30, 2019 23:26
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