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ROFLburger posted:Do the other more recent anno games own as hard as 1800? thinking about trying the others when i get bored with this Age of Discovery is the direct ancestor to 1800. It is placed in 1600s with potato farms and beer production chains, their New World equivelent are middle eastern islands that produce spice and carpets to get you your nobility population on the european islands. The ship combat is like 1800, where you can play it competitively like an evolution of brood war rts philosphies. 2204 is the most recent game and is mechanically far more chill. The production value put into the game is top fuckin notch and the campaign has like a poo poo ton of guided scenereos I never got to. It is hard to explain. It... Has no real failure state... So if you are looking for punishing mechanics. Like 1800 is chill, but 2204 is made for folks who just ripped a bong and take the 2 hr reminder message seriously. It incoperated some idle incremental clicker mechanics, so if you are just waiting to get enough materials to get your next tech step, the game really encourages you to like play the optional combat game or just come back tomorrow buddy you've been playing for 4 hours. So thats my take.
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May 8, 2019 19:46
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They do, though they lack the EXTREMELY good feature of being able to pick up and move buildings (among other quality of life features). 1404 and 2070 are both excellent. I have well over 300 hours in 2070. It's very similar to 1404 fundamentally, but replaces the Occident/Orient island mechanic with multiple factions who have different styles of interacting with the environment and generating energy. It also has an entire underwater segment that can be roughly compared to 1800's New World. Both games are pretty as gently caress, too.
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May 8, 2019 19:51
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Move mechanic came from 2205.
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May 8, 2019 22:27
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2205 also had far and away the best resource management UI of the series. You can, in one screen, see the exact consumption/demand of every resource and your net surplus or shortfall.
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May 8, 2019 22:38
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Also trading across regions simply trades X items/minute, instead of 1 boatload every 'whenever-the-ships-feel-like-it'. On the whole the logistics are very modern and smooth that way. Oh, this region needs 2 more juice cartons a minute? There you go. Also the concept of services for citizens going by road instead of in a set radius was also introduced in 2205. Prior to that coverage was binary. Just covering temperate islands with giant cities was very nice.
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May 8, 2019 22:55
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SubNat posted:Also the concept of services for citizens going by road instead of in a set radius was also introduced in 2205. Prior to that coverage was binary. The trade system was also the major point of contention among fans and the thing it was criticized the most for since it took virtually all the planning and challenge out of the game. I enjoyed it but I get where the critics are coming from. Slapping down a factory and playing with a slider doesn't present much of a challenge, especially when goods just magical themselves around and couldn't be interrupted (until they added the random events later on). 1800 is much closer to a classic Anno game while still adding something new and refining old concepts. I found most of the top tier production chains in 2070 and 1404 much, much more challenging.
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May 8, 2019 23:07
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Psychotic Weasel posted:and the thing it was criticized the most for since it took virtually all the planning and challenge out of the game. 2205 is the only entry in the series I've played specifically because of this. Figuring out how to cram all these buildings into my available space to make my dumb fucks happy while also walking the tightrope of power generation with regards to limited space and coastal slots is plenty of challenge for me, I really, really don't want to add unpredictable logistics I have to further think about to that already volatile mix I have trouble keeping up with already.
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May 8, 2019 23:17
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Cythereal posted:2205 also had far and away the best resource management UI of the series. You can, in one screen, see the exact consumption/demand of every resource and your net surplus or shortfall. how the gently caress does 1800 not have this screen
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May 8, 2019 23:57
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Cythereal posted:2205 is the only entry in the series I've played specifically because of this. Figuring out how to cram all these buildings into my available space to make my dumb fucks happy while also walking the tightrope of power generation with regards to limited space and coastal slots is plenty of challenge for me, I really, really don't want to add unpredictable logistics I have to further think about to that already volatile mix I have trouble keeping up with already. Right there with you, tempted to go back to 2205 really.
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May 9, 2019 00:19
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ROFLburger posted:how the gently caress does 1800 not have this screen Best part is that it would have the number pop up to tell you what your productions at when putting down relevent buildings. Have a rice shortfall? Plop down a rice farm and the -2 turns into +4 so you know at a glance that you have enough. Godsend for new luxury goods, pop down a computer factory and it immediatly says -9 to -6, expand this plant
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May 9, 2019 00:26
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I’m middle of the road, While I like having the logistics management be a valid part of the gameplay again I would have no problem with streamlining a bunch of it like 2205, especially with regards to different sectors. Sector to sector trade being a specific dock building that makes it a static guaranteed thing would be my perfect middle round probably. A couple small changes to the island to island trade UI, but I think that on-map trade is good and interesting part of Anno. Mazz fucked around with this message at 00:30 on May 9, 2019 |
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May 9, 2019 00:27
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I'd be fine I'd they didn't use the old trend system. I'm fine having to manage boats but id like to know that my demand has outstripped my transit before the riots start
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May 9, 2019 00:30
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Yeah, I should clarify I don’t mind the underlying systems but the way data is displayed to us for stuff like that needs a lot of work. I.E. The gameplay model is mostly fine but it feels nebulous as poo poo because the UI is terrible.
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May 9, 2019 00:34
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I think a hybrid system would be cool. Give the player a small island fort/palace that is like the ARC from 2070 that acts as a central stockpile for resources that are shipped from off the map the new world, and the have each map have its individual trade routes 1404 style. Then just have each sector ship so many resources per minute to another sector. That way trade balancing and networks still exist but you don't get this wildly unpredictable sector shipping issue. I'd also like an island that just serves as the player ARC for global effect item / expedition preparation / just so I have a palace to upgrade and recreate Howth under the Guiness Family circa 1900, it just so happens that would also be pretty cool.
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May 9, 2019 00:37
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Omnicarus posted:I think a hybrid system would be cool. Give the player a small island fort/palace that is like the ARC from 2070 that acts as a central stockpile for resources that are shipped from off the map the new world, and the have each map have its individual trade routes 1404 style. Then just have each sector ship so many resources per minute to another sector. That way trade balancing and networks still exist but you don't get this wildly unpredictable sector shipping issue. Very on board with this
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May 9, 2019 00:38
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ROFLburger posted:how the gently caress does 1800 not have this screen I think some people consider fighting with the UI to be gameplay and/or difficulty.
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May 9, 2019 00:39
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ROFLburger posted:Do the other more recent anno games own as hard as 1800? thinking about trying the others when i get bored with this 2070 is mechanically 1404 but better, but the setting is less charming . I still played it over 300 hours.
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May 9, 2019 00:52
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ROFLburger posted:Do the other more recent anno games own as hard as 1800? thinking about trying the others when i get bored with this Like, 1404 is really good but still quite a similar setting to 1800 so it might not feel much different so I'd recommend 2070 as it has the same gameplay as 1404 but lots of new additions like eco-balance, power generation and ocean surface building.
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May 9, 2019 00:58
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Yeah I think the map to map trading is about the only true roadblock I have to wanting to play further in a save. When you can pretty safely overproduce rum for Artisans it’s not bad, but once it starts to run into having to balance the throughput of a noisy system with no real automatic controls, I just lose interest. I’ve patiently waited for one ship to enter the new world map to send the other from the old world for spacing, and not more than an hour later I caught one waiting for the other to finish trading in the new world, completely bunches up. The new world just takes too long to get the feedback where the on map trading it doesn’t feel like an absolute chore to size it. Also if we don’t get some other solution to it, at least give me the drat numbers without having to have an out of game for my ships. That’s ridiculous.
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May 9, 2019 05:11
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Zedd posted:2070 is mechanically 1404 but better, but the setting is less charming . I still played it over 300 hours. 2070 is an incredibly bleak picture painted with a really pretty pastel brush imo. The world is hosed, the remnants of humanity are living on small fragments of habitable earth left over from climate change, and the ruling class lives in arcology-class submarines that occasionally pop up, build a city, and harvest all available resources. A rogue US Carrier Group led by a hereditary admiral named Keto occasionally comes through and fucks up everyones' poo poo but never actually settles anything, they exist just to pirate resources and move to the next area of open water. Silicon Valley's venture capital class lives on land while being supported by robot waifus and immortality pills produced in the depths of abyssal ocean canyons. Three political groups, environmentalists, industrialists, and technocrats, hold absolute monopolies on all culture, societal function, and food supplies and they all fight endless wars against rebel Mad-Max style navies and each other while trying to build massive monuments that prove their ideology as the right one.
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May 9, 2019 05:49
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Also the environmentalist are loving terrible at their jobs which is why they think it's super good to take up the remaining wilderness with organic tea farms and the only reason the tech guy is in charge of the techs is because he programmed the ai that picked the next leader.
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May 9, 2019 05:57
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The environmentalists also have weather control tech they use to make their islands absolutely loving wonderful paradises (that also give all your farm plots 175% productivity when maxed out). Meanwhile the Industrialists go "MORE COAL" for power because the game was made in Germany which has an absolutely crazy pro-coal and anti-nuclear stance so the game lets you get pretty much clean coal while the other Tycoon power source:
Agean90 posted:Also the environmentalist are loving terrible at their jobs which is why they think it's super good to take up the remaining wilderness with organic tea farms and the only reason the tech guy is in charge of the techs is because he programmed the ai that picked the next leader. He's also the biggest loving moron and ruins EVERYTHING in the campaigns. He goes "Hey let's give this incredibly dangerous and virulent Hollywood Computer Virus we don't understand how it works to the super-smart A.I. What's the worst that can happen?" The A.I. runs amok, steals Tycoon nuclear arsenal and starts burning the planet until the Tycoons and Ecos unite military forces to put it down. Advanced A.I.s are required to basically be emotionally lobotomized for the next 135 years as a result because no one trusts him. By the way FOXCONN in 2205 is basically a corporation that made its money recovering S.A.A.T. technology. In addition to recovering an ARK with a working E.V.E. mainframe their creation A.D.A.M., the A.I. on the research station in 2205, very obviously runs on F.A.T.H.E.R.'s code and has a line where corrupted/infected F.A.T.H.E.R. tries to surface and A.D.A.M. has to suppress him. And the expansion? "Whoops! Oh-well. Excuse me while I experiment with this needlessly complicated geothermal power plant in a deep ocean vent despite the warnings of the scientist researching it and the nearby settlement. Oh whoops, now there's tsunamis everywhere!" Dr. Devi and S.A.A.T. are literally canonically the reason that everyone's still trying to fix the climate with future science in 2205. I forgot where you can find it, but there's backstory somewhere in the game that basically says between F.A.T.H.E.R. slinging nukes around like candy and the
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May 9, 2019 09:50
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I realize I never played 2070 with any of the Deep Ocean stuff and it's been long enough it'd all mostly be new to me anyway. I hope all the global poo poo being dead doesn't mess with the game at all. I apparently bought like 90% of the DLC at some point too. Might have to fire that up today.
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May 9, 2019 13:22
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2070's online stuff is still going. It used be in dead/maintenance mode in 2016 or so but in like 2017 they have restarted cycling the world events and stuff again.
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May 9, 2019 14:00
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Apparently I also bought Deep Ocean last year but never played it, I guess this thread is about to have a lot of 2070 talk.
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May 9, 2019 14:14
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If I had to describe the Anno series in just a single unrelated video I would probably choose this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRGMAW1wzQ8
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May 9, 2019 21:43
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Mazz posted:I realize I never played 2070 with any of the Deep Ocean stuff and it's been long enough it'd all mostly be new to me anyway. I hope all the global poo poo being dead doesn't mess with the game at all. I apparently bought like 90% of the DLC at some point too. Unless you want to do the cycling scenarios the global stuff really won't matter, and as has been said it's been brought back anyways. Deep Ocean basically adds more to the Techs which makes them pretty cool: -Tier 2 Tech citizens can actually produce enough revenue to make a profit. -Introduces Tier 3 Tech citizens, "Geniuses" which have an unsettling 1,000 yard stare going on but just vomit out money in return for having some of the most frustrating production lines. -Power transfer buildings that let you shift power between islands, the birth of the technology that lets you beam power from the moon to earth in 2205! -A monument for Techs -Undersea vents don't mysteriously just stop producing a couple hours after your Ark enters the sector and actually keep producing forever, which gives you expensive, high-tech yet infinite (i.e. no having to buy/build replenishment items)
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May 10, 2019 00:01
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Alkydere posted:[nuclear Power]
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May 10, 2019 05:13
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It's rare, especially if you bother to get any of the "reduces technological disaster" items or build global "make nuclear plants safer" items to slot into your ARK. But it's so much cheaper to get a few "+productivity -pollution" items affecting coal power plants and/or coal pits. At least until you get the S.A.A.T. energy transfer buildings up and running, then you can just make a nuclear island off somewhere. And yeah, no, it's playing the anti-nuke fear straight. Germany/Blue Byte really does not like nuclear fission. As shown by 2205 where they have an energy crisis and they find it easier to build fusion plants on the moon which is controlled by a hostile political body and beam electricity down to Earth then build some Gen XXII or whatever nuclear reactors
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May 10, 2019 05:25
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Played a little last night, going back to old style building ranges, farm field layouts, and no replace tool was really rough. For all of 1800s UI flaws it really gets a lot right too.
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May 10, 2019 13:21
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Mazz posted:Played a little last night, going back to old style building ranges, farm field layouts, and no replace tool was really rough. For all of 1800s UI flaws it really gets a lot right too. The fields in 1800 are so amazing. Though I'd really like global events from 2070 to make it over to 1800, makes the game feel more lively.
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May 10, 2019 13:40
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Thom12255 posted:The fields in 1800 are so amazing. Though I'd really like global events from 2070 to make it over to 1800, makes the game feel more lively. Now everything is jellyfish formation - trade union with farms in range, ring of warehouses just outside the range and tentacles of fields stretching outward to fulfill the field number requirement. At least fields of different farms merge their fences, so it's not noticeable they're a bunch of tentacles and not one area.
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May 10, 2019 14:08
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Pyromancer posted:Now everything is jellyfish formation - trade union with farms in range, ring of warehouses just outside the range and tentacles of fields stretching outward to fulfill the field number requirement. That’s true but really only when you need to maximize value. The sheer awesomeness of being able to pick a corner of an island that’s all weirdly shaped and filling it in with 12 farms where like 4-6 old square farms would fit before is incredible and probably my favorite thing in 1800 by far. Example:  There’s a level of space efficiency there that cannot be matched in the old style, and I love it. Not to mention how awesome those sprawling fields filled with workers look. EDIT: Phone is linking weird small version, I’ll fix later Mazz fucked around with this message at 15:54 on May 10, 2019 |
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May 10, 2019 14:34
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It's painful, but I usually have to prioritize aesthetics over efficiency, unless it's goods I sorely need for some reason. If nothing else, it gives me an excuse to be aggressive and claim space.
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May 10, 2019 18:25
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Yeah, I tend to have my main, pretty island have very aesthetic farms and the other islands to have massive dense shoves.
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May 10, 2019 19:02
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Productivity may produce in game number, but aesthetic cities produce player joy.
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May 10, 2019 19:02
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Yeah, the 1-tile plots was perhaps the simplest yet best idea that 1800 had. Especially with the fields merging (and how it happens with non-farm plots as well). I wanted to go back to 2070 last night but between the knowledge that the fields wouldn't merge...and the fact that there are no production chain replacements like in 2205 and 1800 kinda put the kibosh on that. There's something surprisingly fun about editing a supply chain to use a different resource, be it using pig farms for canned food in 1800, or telling expensive cattle ranches to gently caress off in 2205 when you make the gourmet meals use rice instead.
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May 10, 2019 19:52
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It's also worth mentioning that both 2070 and 2205 have big-ish modpacks that change up the games a bit as well, if anyone wants to revisit them in a different light. Anno 2170 / ARRC : http://anno2170-arrc.de/?language=en Anno 2205 Revolutions: https://www.reddit.com/r/anno/comments/b2wfgt/anno_2205_revolutions_mod_english_version/ (Eng Translation.) Last I played 2070 was with 2170 on, and it was very nice how monuments let you control the entire island, without needing building radiuses anymore. Alongside a lot of ornamentals. Being able to build parts of the Tech chains on land also gives you a lot more options. Giant harbor areas and cities are pretty neat too, it's a shame they're a bit tedious to set up, due to road requirements. And inland canals are quite pretty.  I dunno how far along the 2205 one is in comparison, seems like it's mostly balance adjustments and the like. (The original site / german site is currently down it seems like.)
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May 10, 2019 20:35
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I hosed up another game with Von Malching/Gasparov/Beryl. I actually beat them down alright in the wars I had going. Which NPC combo should I try next game? I've played with everyone except the hard npcs. I like friendly people mostly. Bente is too easy though. Wibbly is my dude, favorite NPC so far for his voice lines really. Beryl is stone cold. George seems annoying and yells his lines... fuckin mine explosions. Von Malching can eat a butt. Not sure about the others.
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May 11, 2019 05:05
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You start running out of friends once they get more powerful. George is probably the strongest AI to be outright friendly, I don't think any of the tier 3s remotely count.
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May 11, 2019 06:23
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