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Bust Rodd posted:In the interest of discussion, what made Frasier a “smart” show? The writing is smart? To quote an ancient Greek haberdasher, "Euripides, Eumenides!"
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May 12, 2019 15:14
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I'd call Frasier "well-choreographed" before I'd call it smart.
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May 12, 2019 15:32
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I'm not eloquent with words, but the payoffs to Frasier's jokes seem clever and tickle my brian's pleasure centre, even when they're silly. Big bang theory's payoffs seem like they're trying hard to be clever, but they mostly just irritate me. I'm not sure why, but it's mostly jokes that make me roll my eyes out of my skull. This disregards the fact I find the likeability of the casts on different ends of the spectrum, which definitely influences things. SilvergunSuperman fucked around with this message at 15:45 on May 12, 2019 |
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May 12, 2019 15:42
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Teriyaki Hairpiece posted:I'd call Frasier "well-choreographed" before I'd call it smart. That's good too, it really is a farce a lot of the time.
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May 12, 2019 15:43
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It's smart, but that doesn't mean you have to have a college degree to understand it, or something like that. It just doesn't pander to the lowest common denominator quite as much as other sitcoms of its era. Like, it's a little too smart for the dumbest people on the planet to understand it, but the vast majority of people can understand it just fine. Though I'm probably giving people too much credit.
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May 12, 2019 15:54
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The really farcical episodes like the ski lodge episode are really well-constructed, where every element is funny in and of itself, but also builds up the larger whole. The only other 90s sitcoms that did this were perhaps later Seinfeld seasons and some parts of NewsRadio.
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May 12, 2019 16:14
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Calaveron posted:Veneer, drink!
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May 12, 2019 17:16
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Another Bill posted:[INTERIOR CELLAR] [Frasier believes his father had an affair with a family friend] Frasier: Would you come in for a moment, please? [Marion enters] After you met with Dad the other night, ah, he and I had a little conversation. That was the first time I learned what happened that summer. Marion: Oh, I'm sorry. Frasier: Well... I guess I'm not the sort of person who can hear news like that and just sweep it under the rug and forget about it. Marion: I know you're upset. But if it's any consolation, in time your father and I forgave them. Frasier: [puzzled] Forgave them? Marion: Frasier, your mother was a good person. So was my husband. They made a mistake. And anyways it was the early 80s. No one will miss three or four itinerant drifters. Tell your father I stopped by. I felt so silly crying in front of him the other night. I've been a little overemotional since Dan died and the FBI took our collection. Frasier: [outraged] ITINERANT DRIFTERS? THREE OR FOUR? WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE? Marion: That seems to be a bit of an over-reaction, Frasier. Why, I remember you playing drums down by the lake with a pair of human femurs they gave you, happy as a clam. Frasier: [looking green] Yes, well I rarely get to the shore anymore. Marion: Well... goodbye, Frasier. Frasier: Goodbye.
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May 12, 2019 17:56
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secular woods sex posted:Got bored and messed with this script awhile back: Wow. 
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May 12, 2019 18:03
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secular woods sex posted:Got bored and messed with this script awhile back: [Niles enters, hanging up his comically oversized 90s cell phone] Niles: Frasier! Terrible news! Maris hit a drifter with the Aston Martin last night! Frasier: Niles, that's awful. Was he alright? Niles: I don't know she just kept driving. The headlight is ruined, a mirror was taken off... it's going to cost me 15,000 dollars to repair the damages. Frasier [looking scandalized] : Oh Niles, you simply must go to the police. Niles: Well, I don't think there's any need to call the police, that's just how much it costs to fix an imported luxury vehicle.
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May 12, 2019 21:42
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Frasier was "smart" because it was a collection of what the average 90s viewer thought smart people were like: knowledgeable about the world, degree from a prestigious university, charatable and a social climber, liked classical music and opera, versed in The Classics, carried a suitcase, threw around big words, drank speciality drinks at a coffee shop, shopped at Whole Foods and could critique wine or foods. That it's often a well constructed farce just gets at how empty the concept of it being a Smart Show was.
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May 13, 2019 00:53
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Bust Rodd posted:In the interest of discussion, what made Frasier a “smart” show? The wine? The fancy objet de artes Take an episode like the ski lodge, it's not just well written with zingers and gags it's a step-by-step recreation of a 19th century French farce. A lot of Frasier episodes take inspiration from various theatrical comedy styles and are written in a formulaic way so that all the absurdities and escalations both come naturally and end up neatly tied together by the end of ~22 minutes of screentime. It's not just that the show is 'funny' its that it is meticulously organized and put together 420 Gank Mid fucked around with this message at 02:01 on May 13, 2019 |
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May 13, 2019 01:01
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Ham Radio
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May 13, 2019 01:34
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420 Gank Mid posted:It's not just that the show is 'funny' its that it is meticulously organized and put together. screamed frasier
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May 13, 2019 01:39
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The Saucer Hovers posted:screamed frasier As Martin in the background, I don’t know, farts on it or something
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May 13, 2019 01:42
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The Saucer Hovers posted:screamed frasier If you think frasier is the meticulous one I dont know what you'd call Niles
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May 13, 2019 02:00
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If you like Frasier, you'll love Hay Fever by Noel Coward. Now that's something that's actually high-brow but also loving stupid but also intelligent and also amazing.
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May 13, 2019 02:58
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Calaveron posted:Ham Radio 420 Gank Mid posted:If you think frasier is the meticulous one I dont know what you'd call Niles
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May 13, 2019 04:47
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The smartest part of Frasier is that Niles and Frasier are both fancy but get caught up in their own stupid bullshit constantly.
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May 13, 2019 14:52
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Sweaty IT Nerd posted:The smartest part of Frasier is that Niles and Frasier are both fancy but get caught up in their own stupid bullshit constantly. I still remember the verbal beating Martin gave them at that steakhouse for their foofy classist bullshit. Our house growing up was more like Roseanne than anything you'd see on Frasier, so that scene really etched itself in there. Weird, the stuff that sticks with you.
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May 13, 2019 15:06
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I think a lot of it is that Frasier and Niles are genuinely smart people, and Martin and Roz aren't dumb either, but they still get caught up in doing hilariously dumb things for reasons that make sense to them at the time. A lot of the extended themes are basically new money comedy, since that's what Frasier and Niles are (though it seems implied their mother was pretty wealthy, they did go to a fancy school) and so they can get involved in rich people stuff (Maris also helps there) while still being grounded, especially since Frasier works in showbiz and thus interacts with quite a variety of people.
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May 13, 2019 15:09
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flakeloaf posted:I still remember the verbal beating Martin gave them at that steakhouse for their foofy classist bullshit. Our house growing up was more like Roseanne than anything you'd see on Frasier, so that scene really etched itself in there. What always bothered me about that episode is the bit where the waitress cuts Niles and Frasier's ties off. That was just Martin being a dick and not telling them about the dress code. If they'd taken him to a restaurant and he'd been humiliated for not knowing the dress code, that would have been the focus of the episode and ended with a realisation by Frasier that he'd acted like a dick.
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May 13, 2019 15:46
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Sunswipe posted:What always bothered me about that episode is the bit where the waitress cuts Niles and Frasier's ties off. That was just Martin being a dick and not telling them about the dress code. If they'd taken him to a restaurant and he'd been humiliated for not knowing the dress code, that would have been the focus of the episode and ended with a realisation by Frasier that he'd acted like a dick. If you'd told me that's how an early draft of that episode had gone, I'd have believed you.
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May 13, 2019 15:48
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Ghost Leviathan posted:(though it seems implied their mother was pretty wealthy, they did go to a fancy school)
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May 13, 2019 16:38
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Dr Hester Crane was also a psychiatrist. fake edit: thanks some Frasier wiki
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May 13, 2019 17:07
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Sunswipe posted:What always bothered me about that episode is the bit where the waitress cuts Niles and Frasier's ties off. That was just Martin being a dick and not telling them about the dress code. If they'd taken him to a restaurant and he'd been humiliated for not knowing the dress code, that would have been the focus of the episode and ended with a realisation by Frasier that he'd acted like a dick. Yeah, I have a few $30-50 ties and if someone just randomly cut one of them off, I'd be a bit peeved.
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May 14, 2019 01:07
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Timby posted:Yeah, I have a few $30-50 ties and if someone just randomly cut one of them off, I'd be a bit peeved. Why on earth, I mean clip ons exist idiot
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May 14, 2019 01:08
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flakeloaf posted:I still remember the verbal beating Martin gave them at that steakhouse for their foofy classist bullshit. Our house growing up was more like Roseanne than anything you'd see on Frasier, so that scene really etched itself in there. They WERE being loving ridiculous too, I've legit never heard of anyone thinking steak is beneath them (certain cuts maybe, but it was a steakhouse!!)
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May 14, 2019 02:04
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SilvergunSuperman posted:They WERE being loving ridiculous too, I've legit never heard of anyone thinking steak is beneath them (certain cuts maybe, but it was a steakhouse!!) You must have never experienced the crimes that can be perpetrated on an innocent steak.
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May 14, 2019 02:25
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Holy poo poo,Daphne's burns on Martin for being horny for the Korean lady were sick.
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May 14, 2019 06:18
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The weirdest thing about Frasier to me was Daphne's English phrases being poo poo no English person ever says but are like cartoon English people noises, like all the made up words in harry potter. The rest of the show seemed pretty clever, especially the comedy of errors episodes, and of course the general "you can have big words and fine tastes but still be a dumb jackass sometimes" tone Martin added. But that part just sticks out as some kind of Big Bang Theory prototype. I guess it was a less global era in media and American audiences really didn't know wtf English people sounded like. Maybe the script just had directions like DAPHNE MAKES VAGUE ENGLAND NOISES instead of lines for her sometimes. "Withershins upon the tullybottom as me old dad used to say Mister Crane!" Apparently Eddie got like 90% of the fanmail sent to the show and its kind of beautiful that grown rear end people would write actual pen and paper letters to a dog.
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May 14, 2019 09:22
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wit posted:The weirdest thing about Frasier to me was Daphne's English phrases being poo poo no English person ever says but are like cartoon English people noises, like all the made up words in harry potter. The rest of the show seemed pretty clever, especially the comedy of errors episodes, and of course the general "you can have big words and fine tastes but still be a dumb jackass sometimes" tone Martin added. But that part just sticks out as some kind of Big Bang Theory prototype. I guess it was a less global era in media and American audiences really didn't know wtf English people sounded like. Maybe the script just had directions like DAPHNE MAKES VAGUE ENGLAND NOISES instead of lines for her sometimes. "Withershins upon the tullybottom as me old dad used to say Mister Crane!" We had to do speeches every year in elementary school. Friend of mine did his (I think) sixth grade speech on Moose (and a few other the others), the dog that played Eddie. I don't even remember him being a fan of Frasier. He just did his speech on the dog.
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May 14, 2019 14:40
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wishbone fan fics littered the internet back when
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May 14, 2019 16:29
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Wishbone was a dog who was rescued by an unknown pet store owner from a house down the road. She was treated for shock. No one knows now what was in that dog's heart, her mind, what brought it to the animal shelter. We only know she got the same treatment her owner, David J. Cramer, got decades ago when he lost a puppy to dog poo. Wishbone was adopted into our family who gave up his beloved dog for the love of their son and daughter. We wish he could have been adopted by the same family today since Wishbone was so close to them.
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May 14, 2019 16:35
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wit posted:The weirdest thing about Frasier to me was Daphne's English phrases being poo poo no English person ever says but are like cartoon English people noises, like all the made up words in harry potter. The rest of the show seemed pretty clever, especially the comedy of errors episodes, and of course the general "you can have big words and fine tastes but still be a dumb jackass sometimes" tone Martin added. But that part just sticks out as some kind of Big Bang Theory prototype. I guess it was a less global era in media and American audiences really didn't know wtf English people sounded like. Maybe the script just had directions like DAPHNE MAKES VAGUE ENGLAND NOISES instead of lines for her sometimes. "Withershins upon the tullybottom as me old dad used to say Mister Crane!" Eddie was fantastic, especially considering that Jack Russell's are hyperactive little jerks. I always lose it when Eddie stares down Frasier. "DAAAAADD!!!! Eddie keeps staring at me!!"
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May 14, 2019 17:27
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wit posted:The weirdest thing about Frasier to me was Daphne's English phrases being poo poo no English person ever says but are like cartoon English people noises, like all the made up words in harry potter. The rest of the show seemed pretty clever, especially the comedy of errors episodes, and of course the general "you can have big words and fine tastes but still be a dumb jackass sometimes" tone Martin added. But that part just sticks out as some kind of Big Bang Theory prototype. I guess it was a less global era in media and American audiences really didn't know wtf English people sounded like. Maybe the script just had directions like DAPHNE MAKES VAGUE ENGLAND NOISES instead of lines for her sometimes. "Withershins upon the tullybottom as me old dad used to say Mister Crane!" It's just really, really funny! Daphne sucks out loud a fair few eps, for her English stuff and especially the indignant crap
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May 14, 2019 22:20
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my immersion ruined from being an accent goldilocks  Like Frasier in Ham Radio: "the gamekeeper sounds too cultured!" Meanwhile nobody else gives a gently caress
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May 14, 2019 22:52
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I am Niles Crane the stupidest man alive. After my insanely contentious, difficult and bitter divorce which earned me my financial independence and most importantly, my self respect I went back to my exwife after her indentured servant died to console her, much to the detriment of my girlfriend, and then went to help her during her bout with an abusive boyfriend, again much to the terrible detriment of my pregnant wife, the woman who I pined for for seven years, and the situation eventually developed into being an unwitting accessory to murder, during which again, I pledged my loyalty to said ex wife Stupidest character in television I tell you
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May 15, 2019 01:16
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One thing that bugs me, and I'm 99% sure Frasier is guilty of this, is when speakers of British English are written to say the word fanny when they should be saying bottom.
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May 15, 2019 01:16
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Sweaty IT Nerd posted:One thing that bugs me, and I'm 99% sure Frasier is guilty of this, is when speakers of British English are written to say the word fanny when they should be saying bottom. This makes me laugh more than it bugs me An easy way to remember: Up the fanny, your mum's a granny Up the bum, no harm done
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May 15, 2019 01:58
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