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That is also covered in the article I linked, yesquote:To keep the tables turning, they had to make sure people wouldn’t be comfortable for too long—a time period (and bench angle) that varied from restaurant to restaurant. Certain chairs and benches indicated how long the restaurateur expected the meal to take.
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May 12, 2019 20:14
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i like nice words
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Anne Whateley posted:Context is a thing Yeah that's why I was mentioning the cushions at least. An off white cushion might look nice?
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May 12, 2019 20:44
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My neighbor needs her vanity top replaced. It has double integral sinks. Unfortunately it's in an odd size (69 :giggity:) Is the only option to get one that's around 72 inches and then have someone cut it to size on the ends? like this one https://www.homedepot.com/p/Avanity...T73WT/206765374 (72 inch double integral sink tops seem to be rare)
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May 12, 2019 20:58
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1024x768 posted:I completed my first ever woodworking project: a ~~~*farmhouse chic*~~~ table and bench: Is there some sort of plastic or wood caps on ends of the legs of those chairs? I’d be worried about them scraping the floor up.
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May 12, 2019 21:38
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1024x768 posted:RE: the chairs - yeah - they aren't great, but they were $20 each on amazon - it'll work until I find something more permanent. When guests at the table ends sit, they just pull the chair out so the legs are outside the bottom frame and it's still pretty comfortable. Anne Whateley posted:Those chairs are famously miserable, but the woodworking is great! That's because these chairs are all knockoffs of the Tolix Marais chair. Real Tolix chairs are great to sit in (for a metal chair) and last like 40 years, but so many lovely knockoffs are just made to sucker people into buying the 'general design' which ends up with everyone having these poorly-made, uncomfortable seats. Even the pictures linked in the article aren't the real thing and it doesn't even mention what they're all 'supposed' to be, other than a waning allusion to 'an old French design'. It's interesting that an original 85-year-old design of one of the most significant chairs of the century is completely unknown to people due to the proliferation of low-quality knockoffs, even though people have much more visibility due to design blogs / Pinterest / whatever. The Tolix and the Emco 1006 are probably the most unknown of these, even though people 'recognize' the general silhouette. I think knockoff Eames DSWs are more prolific recently, but most people know what they are. actionjackson posted:My neighbor needs her vanity top replaced. It has double integral sinks. Unfortunately it's in an odd size (69 :giggity:) Tell your neighbor I hope her divorce goes well
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May 13, 2019 02:36
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PRADA SLUT posted:That's because these chairs are all knockoffs of the Tolix Marais chair. You're like an encyclopedia of chair knowledge. Props.
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May 13, 2019 03:19
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actionjackson posted:My neighbor needs her vanity top replaced. It has double integral sinks. Unfortunately it's in an odd size (69 :giggity:)
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May 13, 2019 03:35
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My wife and I are in a debate on whether or not to get a coffee table for our small studio apartment. Personally, I think it would help a lot as right now we have to leave our glasses on the floor if we want to drink anything while watching TV/movies. She thinks that a coffee table will make the space feel more cramped and is very opposed to the idea. I'm just really tired of both of us accidentally kicking over glasses and getting water everywhere. Neither of us are interior designers so any advice you guys could give will be much appreciated, even if it's "Move everything around". I laid out the living/bedroom area in a room layout app so you guys can get a better idea of what we're working with: With measurements:  Without:  (The small rectangle in the bottom right corner is a radiator, so we can't move that. Desk is a combo desk/entertainment center as it has both an iMac and the TV on it. Rectangle next to the bed is an Ikea kallax that we are using as a room divider.)
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May 13, 2019 04:37
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How about a foldable one you can store under the couch, or between the couch and the wall when not in use?
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May 13, 2019 04:46
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Get a footstool, you can put your drinks on it when you need to, it's easy to stow, and depending on y'all's heights you might actually use it for its nominally intended purpose.
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May 13, 2019 04:49
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Are the two openings on the left side places you need to walk through or just windows? If windows, I’d try swapping the TV and couch and then have room for some small end tables for the sofa. Even with the couch where it is now, two small, round end tables would give you somewhere to set a drink and you’d still have plenty of space to walk through the opening. The couch is already sticking out into the opening so it wouldn’t look much worse. It might even look better/more intentional, and you could stick a low table or shelf behind the part of the sofa/end table in the opening so it reads more ‘room divison’ and less ‘hey our couch is too big for this tiny apt’ That being said, I think a low, narrow, rectangular table a little shorter than the couch is wide would be fine and you can put your feet on it too. I hate footstools as coffee tables because then you just spill your drink on the not very flat top of the footstool and the floor instead of just the floor.
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May 13, 2019 05:10
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I think a low rectangle would be fine, too. Unless, when you say it's a desk, is there a desk chair right there not in the pic? Another option is a piece that's only like 6" wide that goes behind the couch. It's not good for much, but it's very unobtrusive and it's okay for glasses and maybe a lamp. In your case, I would stop it short of the door, not go the full length of the couch if it protrudes into the opening.
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May 13, 2019 05:19
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Kaiser Schnitzel posted:Are the two openings on the left side places you need to walk through or just windows? If windows, I'd try swapping the TV and couch and then have room for some small end tables for the sofa. I guess you could call them doorways? They lead into other parts of the apartment but don't actually have doors on them. Entryway, maybe? I'm not too knowledgeable on terminology. The larger 57" opening on the left side is the entryway to the kitchen. The top 36" opening leads to a small foyer that the front door empties into, the smaller 29" opening below that is the entryway to a closet and the bathroom. Unfortunately, the only windows are on the south wall and span the area between the radiator and the couch. We do get a good amount of sunlight, though. Anne Whateley posted:I think a low rectangle would be fine, too. Unless, when you say it's a desk, is there a desk chair right there not in the pic? There is a desk chair, but only the back of it actually sticks out from the desk. It doesn't really protrude much into the space so I didn't think to include it. The chair also doesn't have any wheels/castors which could get stuck on a carpet or anything. actionjackson posted:How about a foldable one you can store under the couch, or between the couch and the wall when not in use? While I like this idea in theory, I've not had good experiences with smaller folding tables. Maybe I've only bought cheap ones, but the ones I've used have been pretty heavy and kind of a pain to keep lugging back and forth. My worry is that we'd either never use it or just leave it out all the time. When I was initially considering the coffee table idea, I had thought an acrylic or glass top would help keep the space looking more spacious. The theory being when you look into the area you would see the smaller footprint of the legs rather than a tabletop. Is that actually a thing or am I just talking out of my rear end?
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May 13, 2019 06:17
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If you leave it out all the time, that just means you've got enough room after all.
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May 13, 2019 06:21
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Chip McFuck posted:When I was initially considering the coffee table idea, I had thought an acrylic or glass top would help keep the space looking more spacious. The theory being when you look into the area you would see the smaller footprint of the legs rather than a tabletop. Is that actually a thing or am I just talking out of my rear end?
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May 13, 2019 06:22
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PRADA SLUT posted:That's because these chairs are all knockoffs of the Tolix Marais chair. There’s a pretty great episode of 99% Invisible about the Emco 10-06. Delves nicely into the impact/intent of knock-offs in general, too. https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/77-steps/
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May 13, 2019 07:10
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Anne Whateley posted:Another option is a piece that's only like 6" wide that goes behind the couch. It's not good for much, but it's very unobtrusive and it's okay for glasses and maybe a lamp. In your case, I would stop it short of the door, not go the full length of the couch if it protrudes into the opening. This is an excellent suggestion!
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May 13, 2019 07:14
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PRADA SLUT posted:That's because these chairs are all knockoffs of the Tolix Marais chair. Why would an “original” be any different to the clones in any functional sense? Does the extra $400 make them magically more comfy? The clones will be functionally identical provided they’re built with an ounce of care. Ultra cheap ones may lack some finish, but unless they’re flexing about they will work the same. It’s not like the chair was designed with any nod to comfort or based on any ergonomic research, it’s just a durable metal chair that can be mass produced cheaply. All the complaints in that article apply 100% to the original - flat base, too small etc. I resent the fact that it’s possible to sell a $400 version at all, and that anyone is allowed to own exclusive rights over a design a dead person made 85 years ago. The sucker is the person who spends that much on a simple dining chair.
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May 13, 2019 08:02
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Chip McFuck posted:While I like this idea in theory, I've not had good experiences with smaller folding tables. Maybe I've only bought cheap ones, but the ones I've used have been pretty heavy and kind of a pain to keep lugging back and forth. My worry is that we'd either never use it or just leave it out all the time. Folding tables would probably be more hassle than they're worth. You'd be better off with a large tray that you could place on the couch or on a footstool to serve as a table when you need one, but could easily be tucked away when you want the space back. I'd favor an acrylic table for similar reasons, easier to move if you need your floor for something.
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May 13, 2019 09:02
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End tables?
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May 13, 2019 11:51
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Anne Whateley posted:Another option is a piece that's only like 6" wide that goes behind the couch. It's not good for much, but it's very unobtrusive and it's okay for glasses and maybe a lamp. In your case, I would stop it short of the door, not go the full length of the couch if it protrudes into the opening. I'mma second this. They're generally called sofa or console tables and they're awesome for narrow spaces.
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May 13, 2019 11:53
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Yeah the behind the couch option is probably the smartest answer. If it's purely for cups I'd probably even go the route of making my own little like 3-4 inch deep board on some quick 2x4 legs since they'll never be seen.
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May 13, 2019 12:06
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Putting something behind the couch hadn't occurred to me and is a really good idea. I think it's hard for me to visualize anything else besides a coffee table because I've always wanted a Noguchi ever since I saw one in person. It would never work in our current apartment, but maybe one day. Anyway, if we were to go with the behind the couch option, how long should it be? Should it span the whole length of the couch? Would it look weird if it didn't? We've also been obsessed with getting higher quality furniture ever since the couch came a couple days ago. It's the first piece we bought together that isn't something from Ikea or a hand-me-down. Eventually, we'd like to replace the desk with a media console as we don't really use the desktop computer anymore except for the occasional day when I need to work from home. That'll give us a little more space.
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May 13, 2019 14:34
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If you plan on staying in that place awhile consider wall mounting the tv. When you leave it will be a pretty basic spackle job to cover up and will make the space feel much more wide open.
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May 13, 2019 14:53
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A lot of two dimensional thinking in here. Personally, I'd hang a platform from the ceiling directly in front of the couch, about forehead-level, that you could reach up to to store your drink on. Attach it to rails which are mounted to the ceiling, and then every time you stand up or sit down you can slide it backwards so you don't need to duck underneath it.
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May 13, 2019 15:22
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The Wonder Weapon posted:A lot of two dimensional thinking in here. Personally, I'd hang a platform from the ceiling directly in front of the couch, about forehead-level, that you could reach up to to store your drink on. Attach it to rails which are mounted to the ceiling, and then every time you stand up or sit down you can slide it backwards so you don't need to duck underneath it. You might even attach some sort of pulley system attached to an dirty old motor that you could have at eye level, waiting to take a chunk out of a passerby’s face.
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May 13, 2019 15:40
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The Wonder Weapon posted:A lot of two dimensional thinking in here. Personally, I'd hang a platform from the ceiling directly in front of the couch, about forehead-level, that you could reach up to to store your drink on. Attach it to rails which are mounted to the ceiling, and then every time you stand up or sit down you can slide it backwards so you don't need to duck underneath it. TheMightyHandful posted:You might even attach some sort of pulley system attached to an dirty old motor that you could have at eye level, waiting to take a chunk out of a passerby’s face. 
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May 13, 2019 15:54
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Studio apartment suggestion- get a big wheeled ottoman that can serve as a table when you put a tray (like from ikea, which is where mine is from) on top of it. That way you can put your feet on it when you want, and wheel it into a corner when you want (or into the couch to make a quasi-chaise).
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May 13, 2019 16:12
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Murphy table
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May 13, 2019 16:43
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The Dave posted:If you plan on staying in that place awhile consider wall mounting the tv. When you leave it will be a pretty basic spackle job to cover up and will make the space feel much more wide open. I think that's a desk that it's sitting on, so it can't be done. Bongo Bill posted:If you leave it out all the time, that just means you've got enough room after all. It definitely does not. Jaded Burnout posted:End tables? This is what I would do wooger posted:Why would an “original” be any different to the clones in any functional sense? Does the extra $400 make them magically more comfy? This is the kind of thinking that makes the knockoff furniture market so prolific. People love to think they're pulling one over on the man, like using this One Weird Trick that furniture manufactures hate, when in reality they're just buying a low-quality product that's advertised to them as being 'just as good as the original', and people buy into it because they want to believe they're being a ~clever consumer~. Sure, a knockoff will be 'functionally identical' in the sense that your rear end still goes on it, but its made with lower-quality material, little attention to detail, nonexistent quality control, a lack of skilled craftsmanship, cheaper joints, shortcuts in the frame, and with essentially a planned obsolescence which results in people throwing them away and shelling out more money year after year replacing them. Nobody is making knockoff furniture with the same care or detail because that costs money and they're in it for the cheap sale in a race to the bottom against everyone else doing the same thing. If you discount those things then yeah, I guess they're otherwise 'functionally identical'. Also, here's why the Emeco costs more than some factory-churned knockoff garbage: https://vimeo.com/176436988 PRADA SLUT fucked around with this message at 17:04 on May 13, 2019 |
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May 13, 2019 16:48
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On the other hand there is plenty of designer furniture that is a total ripoff. I don't disagree with prada but you have to balance both sides.
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May 13, 2019 17:02
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PRADA SLUT posted:This is the kind of thinking that makes the knockoff furniture market so prolific. People love to think they're pulling one over on the man, like using this One Weird Trick that furniture manufactures hate, when in reality they're just buying a low-quality product that's advertised to them as being 'just as good as the original', and people buy into it because they want to believe they're being a ~clever consumer~. You gave zero examples that are likely to affect the comfort of sitting in the chair That it wears out faster and you have to replace it, even multiple times, is fairly irrelevant when it costs 1/30 the price I'm all for quality over quantity as a general rule but there is definitely a point where the math swings the other way
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May 13, 2019 17:11
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Kaiser Schnitzel posted:Are the two openings on the left side places you need to walk through or just windows? If windows, I’d try swapping the TV and couch and then have room for some small end tables for the sofa. Something like this might also be an option:  Google "stickley sofa" or "mission style sofa" for comparisons. Basically your sofa arms are your endtable.
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May 13, 2019 17:12
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In brief, just because cheap things are lower quality than expensive things doesn't automatically mean the expensive things are superior. It depends on what you're optimizing for.
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May 13, 2019 17:16
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How about noguchi replicas?
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May 13, 2019 17:18
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actionjackson posted:On the other hand there is plenty of designer furniture that is a total ripoff. I don't disagree with prada but you have to balance both sides. No, you don't compare the two because it's not a question of price. You can think the price is a ripoff all you want, but at least they're producing an original product. I wouldn't buy a fancy watch or whatever because it's not worth the price to me, but I'm also not going to buy into this invented narrative that because I can get a $35 'Patek Philippe', that must be the absolute cost basis of the real thing and I'm just being a ~clever shopper~ by buying it from some guy selling them off a blanket in the alley Furthermore, when the majority of furniture manufacturing just exists to sit around trying to produce cheaper knockoffs of the few remaining design houses, it essentially eliminates design space and leaves a nonexistent mid-range market. Why pay someone to make an original, affordable design, when you can just cut out your designers and try to imitate what everyone else has already made? The Bloop posted:You gave zero examples that are likely to affect the comfort of sitting in the chair Sure, the stamping, grinding, and finish process of the seat and edges. Also, buying furniture and replacing it 30 times is a colossal waste of resources and leaves landfills full of cheap, disposable junk. This thread is full of people who have never actually taken the time to look at, evaluate, or compare originals, but are immediately taking stances on this perceived idea of what the product must be like. PRADA SLUT fucked around with this message at 17:35 on May 13, 2019 |
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May 13, 2019 17:32
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Even in a simple stamped metal chair, cutting corners for cost-saving measures mean things like using 20ga material instead of 18 gage, which is a 28% reduction in material thickness. No way that chair is gonna be as durable or stable. Your heavy friend sits in it and awhoops they're on the ground now. I'd also think there isn't gonna be as rigorous a check through the tolerances on tooling and jigs that they use to make these, introducing slop and defects into the chair. One leg didn't get a proper press and is splayed out now you got a wiggly chair which I know gets on my fuckin' nerves real quick. Jig isn't lined up now after making 3000 pieces and you have a misaligned overlap that's gonna catch on your pants. Best case a shop gorilla spots it and either hammers it in or grinds it down quick leaving an ugly dent or grind mark. The press that cuts the pieces out of sheet is a bit dull and leaves a bit of a torn edge, and you can catch your hand on a burr, possibly giving you a bad cut. Of course, these are things that I thought could happen in a knockoff, and I'm sure there are varying qualities of knockoffs at different prices that might show none, some, or all of them. There is a tipping point for diminishing returns on paying for quality. It's almost like it's.... subjective? There's also obviously diminishing returns on paying for quality, and I don't think I'd pay $300 for that chair, only because I don't like them and would rather spend $300 on something else  I don't like having to go out and buy a new chair because the cheap ones keep breaking. I want one that works and will stay working. Here's a 4 piece replica set that looks ugly as poo poo
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May 13, 2019 17:38
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PRADA SLUT posted:This thread is full of people who have never actually taken the time to look at, evaluate, or compare originals, but are immediately taking stances on this perceived idea of what the product must be like. I make furniture (in very small quantities, for personal use). I absolutely have an idea of how much work it is to make high-quality original furniture, and thus why said high-quality original furniture is so expensive. You may complain that shoppers' price ranges are unrealistically anchored by cheap knockoff furniture, but I think it's honestly just as much that their price ranges are dictated by their incomes. Plenty of people simply can't afford the furniture you're trying to convince them to buy. That doesn't mean they don't care about interior design, just that the non-knockoff, non-Ikea part of the market is closed to them.
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May 13, 2019 17:39
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Yeah I'm not seeing (apart from like metal burrs or something that may or may not even be there) where the cheap knockoff version of that metal chair would be inherently less comfortable to sit on? Are the ergonomics and or physical dimensions of the chair fundamentally different? If not then shouldn't they just be identical in terms of comfort on initial use? I do agree that quality sacrifice would be more apparent in fit and finish quality and overall longevity, but having a hard time seeing why comfort would be different for that specific type of design.
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May 13, 2019 17:44
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Here's an idea: How about more companies put efforts into designing and producing original products at varied price points such that it promotes design availability for everyone and moves the industry toward new innovative ideas? It's not like we ran out of design space 80 years ago.
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May 13, 2019 17:46
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