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https://twitter.com/RebeccaBuck/status/1136961934014767105 Goddamn boomers all have a terminal case of brain worms
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Jun 7, 2019 13:22
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skeleton warrior posted:“You can’t take election results as meaning what voters want” is a hell of a take Counterargument: Trump is President.
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Jun 7, 2019 13:23
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https://twitter.com/NYMag/status/1136921751009603584 https://www.cabanforqueens.com/issues/ Goons should check Caban out. She is going to do great things for Queens and fix what is broke with the Justice System there. she has endorsements from all the Progressive groups and AOC. Going to do some solid work there and I cant wait to see more.
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Jun 7, 2019 13:25
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skeleton warrior posted:Based upon every loose wacko with an agenda I’ve seen in a local primary they neither “completely control primaries” nor are they successful in putting pressure on forcing out challengers. This is you literally lying to yourself to make yourself feel better.
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Jun 7, 2019 13:30
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empty whippet box posted:Let me be clear here, I literally think the DNC and biden are actively trying to lose the 2020 election so that trump is elected again. I really can't make any kind of sense of the dumb poo poo and awful positions Biden is taking any other way. Is this a troll account or is this guy just an idiot? This is the same nine dimensional chess stuff that the Q True Believers think. Calibanibal posted:Centrists are strong,. We're showing up. We're going to vote blue no matter who, and we're going to return to the pre- Trump era of professionalism and bipartisanship. And you can't stop us. My problem with centrists is that my entire life has been governed by centrists and people right of them. Yes life is good, for the most part, but it could be so much better if only we had people that actually represented me running the show. You’ve all had your time, now step the gently caress back and let someone else try. I don’t want the status quo, and the only reason people think “we need time to change things” is because nobody has ever tried because everyone is just concerned about keeping their job. That’s why people like AOC are a refreshing change of pace because they actually stand for something and don’t give a drat about decorum. It’s to be seen if when the time comes they’d choose voting for the right thing vs voting for the thing that lets them keep their job, but so far I’m hopeful. And as for bipartisanship, yeah, gently caress that. Centrists seem to have this idea that are “both sides” need to be respected, and no, gently caress that to hell. gently caress Republicans, every last one of them. If there are any good ones they should have left the party. It’s blatantly obvious that they will gently caress over everyone and everything to get what they want, but people like you still think you can reason with them. Edit: I’m not saying I want a one party state. I’m saying I want the entire republican establishment figuratively gutted top to bottom and in its ashes the Democratic Party can split into a progressive and centrist wing. Boris Galerkin fucked around with this message at 13:43 on Jun 7, 2019 |
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Jun 7, 2019 13:41
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Prester Jane posted:Counterargument: Trump is President. Counter-counter argument: after all of this poo poo including child death camps, Trump still has a 45% approval rate Edit: Prester Jane posted:This is you literally lying to yourself to make yourself feel better. How is this lying to myself? The average Democratic voter isn’t a leftist who wants what I want, they’re a FYGM who wants “progress” but would rather not pay more taxes or make room for minorities or even really care. Getting actual progress in the framework of “as soon as you make any steps the right will come out in a 1994/2010 wave while the left decides it wasn’t good enough and stays home” does not make me feel better skeleton warrior fucked around with this message at 13:46 on Jun 7, 2019 |
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Jun 7, 2019 13:42
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the brain worms are strong. https://twitter.com/AaronBlake/status/1136959625591439361
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Jun 7, 2019 13:42
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skeleton warrior posted:Counter-counter argument: after all of this poo poo including child death camps, Trump still has a 45% approval rate Look at those goalposts zoom, drat. You were arguing that results of American relations are reliable indicator of the American Body politic. Trump's election points out the absurdity of that position quite handily.
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Jun 7, 2019 13:46
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 https://mobile.twitter.com/laurenarankin/status/1136804378382258176 https://mobile.twitter.com/AmyAddante/status/1135651817436655616
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Jun 7, 2019 13:47
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Prester Jane posted:This is you literally lying to yourself to make yourself feel better. "There's a huge silent majority of true leftist voters just waiting in the wings to be unleashed!" seems like a much less likely prospect. I can actually point to examples contrary to it, like Russ Feingold was well to the left of Clinton but did almost 4% worse in the same election. Can you point to similar evidence? And no I'm not saying this is cool and good or that centrist views are correct, just that they're more popular than you give them credit for.
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Jun 7, 2019 13:54
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Prester Jane posted:Look at those goalposts zoom, drat. Why? He only won on a technicality, but you can’t claim that he is unrepresentative of America when he still has 45% support after all he’s done. Meanwhile, insisting that there is no centrist base and no centrist support and it’s all lies by people with no point of view when they regularly trounce the left in primaries is folly.
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Jun 7, 2019 13:56
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Nice fuckin default Microsoft Word formatting, god drat
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Jun 7, 2019 14:01
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skeleton warrior posted:Why? He only won on a technicality, but you can’t claim that he is unrepresentative of America when he still has 45% support after all he’s done. quote:Meanwhile, insisting that there is no centrist base and no centrist support and it’s all lies by people with no point of view when they regularly trounce the left in primaries is folly. And you don't want to do that; because pretending elections are a 1:1 ratio with public will it provides a really easy path for you to feel smug and superior and (most importantly) not have to engage in the actual substance of criticisms that people are leveling at Centrists. Prester Jane fucked around with this message at 14:25 on Jun 7, 2019 |
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Jun 7, 2019 14:02
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Ershalim posted:The man is an idiot, to be sure, but I think this sort of misinformation is performative. It's not that he doesn't know or hasn't been told that tariffs are taxes, it just benefits him and his followers for the base to believe that's true. Like how most people are totally confused about how marginal taxes work, it benefits the people with all the money at the expense of the poor and uneducated. They like that poo poo. trump legitimately thinks amazon is hosing the postal service despite his aides explaining over and over again it's a windfall for USPS. he legitimately believes that tariffs are like a tax on the other country. do you remember when he had a televised meeting with his trade advisor and trump said a memorandum of understanding isn't contract and the trade guy had to explain yes it is it's a binding agreement and then trump said no it isn't and eventually the trade guy got so frustrated he said they wouldn't use the phrase "memorandum of understanding" anymore? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0ROLHtpxL0 people have to stop acting like this is all an act for the rubes. trump is one of the rubes. Groovelord Neato fucked around with this message at 14:42 on Jun 7, 2019 |
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Jun 7, 2019 14:19
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skeleton warrior posted:Why? He only won on a technicality, but you can’t claim that he is unrepresentative of America when he still has 45% support after all he’s done. Please source your 45% approval rating because the latest Gallup poll has him at 40%, the latest Reuters poll at 39%, and the FiveThirtyEight aggregate is 41.6%. I would guess your going by HarrisX which is the new pollster by Scott Rasmussen of Rasmussen fame which is just lol.
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Jun 7, 2019 14:20
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Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:
Can't the physician just lie? But then again I wouldn't be surprised if a video recording was required to allow the great state of Missouri to make its own Serbian film
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Jun 7, 2019 14:29
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zokie posted:Can't the physician just lie? But then again I wouldn't be surprised if a video recording was required to allow the great state of Missouri to make its own Serbian film I would suspect that no, not if they want to maintain their state license they cannot. Nor can you bill for a procedure you did not perform, directly or through any sort of insurance. I mean, of course they could lie, but it would be at great professional risk, and I'd imagine that the state of Missouri as it currently is would be perfectly happy to strip all those doctors of their licenses and just not have anyone able or willing to perform abortions at all. Same end as far as they're concerned.
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Jun 7, 2019 14:41
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Groovelord Neato posted:people have to stop acting like this is all an act for the rubes. trump is one of the rubes. He might be the dumbest man alive, but that doesn't really change the ultimate point: by having him out-front saying stupid poo poo, the rubes get conned either way. If he means it or if he doesn't, the rich people benefit from him saying it at all.
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Jun 7, 2019 14:46
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The presence of loony and vanity primary challengers isn't proof of the process being fair. They will run no matter what. You see it on both sides with there often being nutball challengers to entrenched republican incumbents too. Like here in Texas Rick Perry always had several primary opponents despite having the state party completely under his control. Even overt threats like "if you run Perry's friends in the county will get your business permits revoked and you'll be pulled over daily by the sheriff" aren't going to dissuade someone who thinks they should run on Texas seceding from the US.
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Jun 7, 2019 14:48
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I'll say this about the amount of centrists in the country- when centrists feel too embarrassed by recent events to defend the actions of the Democratic Party this thread sure does get significantly slower. I mean compare/contrast the present (dispirited) centrist defense of Pelosi and Biden's recent actions compared to a year ago when posters were getting literally purged for criticizing Joe Manchin. I think Ice Phisherman is really on to something with there being a collapse of confidence in centrism, because even this thead is no longer a safe space for centrists.
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Jun 7, 2019 14:49
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Ershalim posted:He might be the dumbest man alive, but that doesn't really change the ultimate point: by having him out-front saying stupid poo poo, the rubes get conned either way. If he means it or if he doesn't, the rich people benefit from him saying it at all. the moneyed interests don't want the tariffs. he's a monster they can't control. it used to be they sold something they didn't believe in to get the rubes to elect them while they did their tax cuts and poo poo but now the rubes are elected officials and the wheels are coming off.
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Jun 7, 2019 14:52
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Shifty Pony posted:The presence of loony and vanity primary challengers isn't proof of the process being fair. They will run no matter what. You see it on both sides with there often being nutball challengers to entrenched republican incumbents too. That loon was a local small business owner who ran on accusing the sheriff of cucking him. No lie.
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Jun 7, 2019 14:54
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Groovelord Neato posted:the moneyed interests don't want the tariffs. he's a monster they can't control. it used to be they sold something they didn't believe in to get the rubes to elect them while they did their tax cuts and poo poo but now the rubes are elected officials and the wheels are coming off. I don't believe that's true. I think market instability is good for people who own everything so they can fleece it. If it were truly a problem for the crusty aristocrat class, I imagine they would have pulled the trigger by now. The Mouth Of Sauron will say whatever the hand up its rear end wants it to say. If they want to get rid of Trump, they need only repeat whatever lie they want and people will believe it. Our current situation isn't going to end when Trump is dead. Anyone can be president of the rubes when the truth is irrelevant.
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Jun 7, 2019 14:55
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Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:
Virginia already tried this (or at least proposed it) back in the Cooch era. If I remember correctly, disgust over it forced the state government to walk it back. I hope the lawsuits start flooding in, because forcing something like that on women makes my skin crawl.
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Jun 7, 2019 14:55
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Ershalim posted:I don't believe that's true. I think market instability is good for people who own everything so they can fleece it. why did none of them run on tariffs before?
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Jun 7, 2019 14:57
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Ershalim posted:I don't believe that's true. I think market instability is good for people who own everything so they can fleece it. If it were truly a problem for the crusty aristocrat class, I imagine they would have pulled the trigger by now. The Mouth Of Sauron will say whatever the hand up its rear end wants it to say. If they want to get rid of Trump, they need only repeat whatever lie they want and people will believe it. Our current situation isn't going to end when Trump is dead. Anyone can be president of the rubes when the truth is irrelevant. The rich don't live in a magical parallel dimension, they're affected by economic trends too. They just have more and better tools to respond to them. If we have another global recession a lot of people are going to lose a lot of money and that includes people who have the ear of governments including ours. That ear just leads straight to a second ear right now.
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Jun 7, 2019 15:00
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Groovelord Neato posted:why did none of them run on tariffs before? I'm not sure. I think disaster capitalism on this scale is kind of a new trend that many of them witnessed for the first time in like, the 90s/00s in Russia. People recently came around to modern monetary theory, so maybe from the right they started to realize just how much they could take without the whole thing coming down. I don't deny that there's a class of true-believer dumbasses in some positions of power now, but I don't think that's the reason Trump isn't being removed. I think it's just that the comfortable people have come to the conclusion that they can rock the boat a lot harder than they used to, and are enjoying it. The people in media have got to realize just how strongly they've captured their audience, so they know they can pretty much get them to believe anything they want. Given that, if Trump were truly a liability (to them) they'd ensure he was gone. haveblue posted:The rich don't live in a magical parallel dimension, they're affected by economic trends too. They just have more and better tools to respond to them. If we have another global recession a lot of people are going to lose a lot of money and that includes people who have the ear of governments including ours. That ear just leads straight to a second ear right now. Right, they don't want to CRASH the market. But having it do backflips now and then makes shorts and day trades worth megabucks, doesn't it?
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Jun 7, 2019 15:02
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Covok posted:Can I ask a serious question? What is wrong with centrists? Mentally? As a previous and still learning centrist, most of what you describe is how I’ve felt. Some of us change.
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Jun 7, 2019 15:04
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Centrism is basically synonymous with the Just World Fallacy.
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Jun 7, 2019 15:12
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Ignore the quality of the source just wanted to put this out there https://twitter.com/NewDay/status/1136957726851047424?s=19
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Jun 7, 2019 15:15
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Centrism is basically synonymous with the Just World Fallacy. As is conservatism (but then, centrism and conservatism are also synonyms)
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Jun 7, 2019 15:16
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cr0y posted:Ignore the quality of the source just wanted to put this out there It’s my understanding this situation is surprisingly common and doesn’t usually make the news because it would otherwise be embarrassing? At least if I remember correctly. By this situation I mean military ships almost hitting each other like dumb fucks, not specifically the US and Russia.
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Jun 7, 2019 15:19
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To tangent off this,Paradoxish posted:It's also people who have tied their whole identities up in being the reasonable adult in the room and they don't know what to do when it's no longer reasonable nor adult to pretend that everything is okay. In today's edition of "anecdotes and data" — In my lovely centrist days, my running thesis which everything I wrote attempted to bolster was the idea that by and large, nearly all people are competent and intelligent and act in good faith. People might not all be rocket scientists or brain surgeons, but they get along in this world well enough, often knowing way more about their specific area of personal expertise than we would ever expect; and we ought not assign ourselves (as a "ruling class") so much elitist contempt for everyday people that we discount the desires of the masses as so much mooing and braying. I was much taken by phrasings like Henry Rollins saying stuff like "nobody is actually stupid; you just can't even hack it in this world if you're like cartoon-level dumb. You're gonna be working at a Burger King your whole life but that's just gonna mean you're really hard to kill. Like you might be a dumb mother fucker but you're one tough son of a bitch." So over and over I kept looking for and signal-boosting news stories and glimpses of daily life that glorified these little stories of individuals who are making it as best they can in this world, maybe with a narrow world view but they're doing their best, and all those people doing that individually is what makes the world go around. Anyone who looks at those kinds of people and sneers at them for their provinciality or simplicity is engaging in the kind of Hollywood elitism that I'm sure all those youtubers are going on about all the time to this day. But I guess since joining this thread, it seems like the drumbeat is the exact opposite. I'm sure it's more than anything else just the filtering effect of the news coverage the group gravitates toward and so on, but it's just so hard to ignore just how many completely toxic idiots there are, and what a disproportionate effect they and their narrow-mindedness have on the trajectory of society as a whole. Leaving them to their own devices does not tend society toward decency, as I apparently wanted so badly to believe. It tends it toward superstition, bigotry, tribalism, income inequality, and fascism. So I don't know if that helps define "centrism" at all, but at least it's what correlates to it in my personal experience: a belief in the inherent goodness and well-intentions of people in general, as opposed to a belief that people do need guidance after all. Maybe it's my allergy to the idea of "guidance" in that it seems to imply a Hitler or a Pope or a Politburo, all of which demand a subservience of the individual to the ideology of the elite. I want to believe humans can get by without any of the three. But maybe that's too much to ask of this dumb species after all.
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Jun 7, 2019 15:19
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Barry Foster posted:As is conservatism (but then, centrism and conservatism are also synonyms) Centrism is synonymous with conservatism in the previously academic sense of “I’m uncomfortable with change even if its to my betterment” rather than the relatively recent Regressive form of “let’s drive this poo poo back into the 1850s!”
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Jun 7, 2019 15:23
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haveblue posted:The rich don't live in a magical parallel dimension, they're affected by economic trends too. They just have more and better tools to respond to them. If we have another global recession a lot of people are going to lose a lot of money and that includes people who have the ear of governments including ours. That ear just leads straight to a second ear right now. Yes, they have better tools: Money. And that's why they don't care.
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Jun 7, 2019 15:25
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My point is that centrists can actually be delicately reached or at the very least goaded along while regressives should be cast out of society.
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Jun 7, 2019 15:26
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^^^^ One is quite comfortable with and is the midwife for the other, and I'm genuinely not sure just how persuadeable centrists en masse really are. Being 'sensible' is a helluva drug. See MLK on white moderatesData Graham posted:To tangent off this, There's nothing wrong with being stupid. There's everything wrong with being cruel or spiteful or selfish. Barry Foster fucked around with this message at 15:32 on Jun 7, 2019 |
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Jun 7, 2019 15:28
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7c Nickel posted:"There's a huge silent majority of true leftist voters just waiting in the wings to be unleashed!" seems like a much less likely prospect. I can actually point to examples contrary to it, like Russ Feingold was well to the left of Clinton but did almost 4% worse in the same election. Can you point to similar evidence? Part of the issue is that there IS a wave of increased leftism, but the movement is from the late 90s, when like 80% of the Democratic electorate would be considered centrist by today's standards. The current makeup of the party probably is like 40% Centrist / 35% Progressive / 25% Actual Left nowadays, which means that the center's power is weaker than ever, but the tipping point where they don't have a plurality of the party probably isn't for another 8 years or so, and they're going to "matter" for decades after that even.
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Jun 7, 2019 15:29
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lol https://twitter.com/StevenTDennis/status/1136965290506559488
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Jun 7, 2019 15:30
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Centrism is synonymous with conservatism in the previously academic sense of “I’m uncomfortable with change even if its to my betterment” rather than the relatively recent Regressive form of “let’s drive this poo poo back into the 1850s!” I've taken to understanding centrism as a psychological understanding of sociological problems. If you don't think of people as individuals, and instead think of things in a dichotomy (as most people without nuance view modern discourse: like how everything MUST be either Left or Right) it seems reasonable to see that there could be some kind of compromise between disparate, discrete identities. But in reality, it's myriad people all acting in their own perceived self-interest, so the centrist model fails to account for things like the irrationality of group dynamics. That, and the vast majority of people don't really care about things that don't personally effect them, and centrism is easy and generally blameless. Like how "socially liberal, fiscally conservative" was a super popular non-answer for people in the 00s who didn't want to be bothered.
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Jun 7, 2019 15:30
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