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That Old Tree posted:A player from the UKGE fiasco did a brief interview that firmly contradicts watsizface's diarrhea story. The hypothetical 4-6 hours down the drain only happens if the troubling theme was absolutely within the theme of your game (in which case you should have flagged it first so that the player could opt out) or if the player is so troubled by it that they can't meaningfully say "this is what is bothering me". But if they are that upset in the moment, that's something which needs addressing much more urgently than keeping your game going. And if in the long run they find themselves able to specify what the problem was - leaving you unable to edit your game in a way which is safe for them - then either they need to bow out so the campaign can continue without them or you need to run a different game, and it'd be better to find out about that sort of fundamental incompatibility sooner rather than later.
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Jun 9, 2019 18:31
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Mormon Star Wars posted:The DM was the person in charge of preventing this from happening. This should be archived for when the argument comes up of "it was a one-time thing and they're a cool guy, just let it slide" for problem players. Every time is just one time, and then you wind up with something like that.
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Jun 9, 2019 18:58
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Mormon Star Wars posted:In addition to backing up the other accounts, there is this "what the gently caress" moment: Upon reading this, my first question was "how many times has this guy done something like this and it's gone unreported because nobody felt comfortable enough doing so?" Because I have serious doubts that a normal, well adjusted GM of 10 years just spontaneously decides to run a game where surprise """"""implied"""""" gang-rape is supposed to be a hilarious jape with absolutely zero prior precedent.
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Jun 9, 2019 19:00
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Kai Tave posted:Upon reading this, my first question was "how many times has this guy done something like this and it's gone unreported because nobody felt comfortable enough doing so?" Because I have serious doubts that a normal, well adjusted GM of 10 years just spontaneously decides to run a game where surprise """"""implied"""""" gang-rape is supposed to be a hilarious jape with absolutely zero prior precedent. If someone casually and joyfully drops “a light touch of hostel” into a game, I wouldn’t feel out of line saying “from session 1”
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Jun 9, 2019 19:41
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Important announcement regarding a critical issue with GAMA and the man to fix the problem if he should become a director https://forum.rpg.net/index.php?threads/louis-desy-jr-running-for-gama-origins-director-at-large-seat.847846/ (note, I take no responsibility for injuries or damage from laughing, spitting up of drinks or excessive popcorn consumption)
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Jun 9, 2019 20:30
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And he's already been perma'd. Shockingly 'they banned Larry Correia' was not found to be a critical issue. Not that they ever spelled Larry's name right.
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Jun 9, 2019 20:33
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Mods chiding people for telling an alt-righter to gently caress himself. 
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Jun 9, 2019 22:09
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Terrible Opinions posted:Mods chiding people for telling an alt-righter to gently caress himself. 
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Jun 9, 2019 23:29
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“Nazi punks gently caress off” is, technically, a group attack
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Jun 10, 2019 00:13
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Terrible Opinions posted:Mods chiding people for telling an alt-righter to gently caress himself.
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Jun 10, 2019 00:18
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Berkshire Hunts posted:“Nazi punks gently caress off” is, technically, a group attack To be fair, the mods have said it's perfectly okay to make group attacks on Nazis and a pretty broad interpretation of that. They banned defending Trump and gamergate and all sorts of other right-wing extremist things. And even in that thread, telling the wanker to gently caress off just got a warning, where doing it to anyone else would have had a ban. rpg.net has all sorts of peculiarities of moderation and some historical issues of wtf but for how much they are hated by gamergaters, and the way rpgsite members rush back to their fash site to post about how outrageous it is they were banned for rape-apology or transphobia or gamergate apologia or whatever else, they're doing something right. It might not be perfect, and I like here more than there, but they're better than anywhere but here for talking about pretendy-fun-time-elf-games without having to deal with the fash and shitheads arguing their bullshit. quote:Yup. And sticking by this policy for over a decade sure has done wonders to keep the bigots and fascists out, hasn't it? https://forum.rpg.net/index.php?threads/new-ban-do-not-post-in-support-of-trump-or-his-administration.835849/ As I said above, there's a bunch of criticisms you can level, but enabling the fash is not one of them, not for the last five+ years. SA-Trad Games has absolutely been the best site for this (and to varying degrees leading to virtually nothing across the rest of SA), but they come second to that, and then that's it, everywhere else allows dogwhistles and 'just my opinion' through to full fash-support at the rpgsite. PST fucked around with this message at 01:02 on Jun 10, 2019 |
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Jun 10, 2019 00:53
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It's pretty clear they just don't want a helldump thread, and would rather people just hit report and let the alt-right chest-beaters sink into the ocean unacknowledged.
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Jun 10, 2019 00:56
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Kai Tave posted:Upon reading this, my first question was "how many times has this guy done something like this and it's gone unreported because nobody felt comfortable enough doing so?" Because I have serious doubts that a normal, well adjusted GM of 10 years just spontaneously decides to run a game where surprise """"""implied"""""" gang-rape is supposed to be a hilarious jape with absolutely zero prior precedent. As soon as I read that he'd been a con GM for years I wondered how he'd had this supposedly spotless record because there's no loving way this was the first and only time. Then I read that and "oh, that's why", and in the rest of that post they're still seemingly mystified as to how someone who's never been reported just went off the rails suddenly and without warning.
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Jun 10, 2019 01:04
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Elector_Nerdlingen posted:As soon as I read that he'd been a con GM for years I wondered how he'd had this supposedly spotless record because there's no loving way this was the first and only time. I posted previously in the thread how he'd run a teenagers+older woman game at dragonmeet, it's definitely not the first time he's done something along those lines, this is just the first time he's been called out for it, and then went to a rape defender and fash-ally to lie about it.
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Jun 10, 2019 01:14
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Elector_Nerdlingen posted:As soon as I read that he'd been a con GM for years I wondered how he'd had this supposedly spotless record because there's no loving way this was the first and only time. Not only that but how telling is the first paragraph where it says "I immediately knew who it was". Like, how is someone super squeaky clean, but when you're told "Someone made a rape game" you leap to "Oh yea, that'll be Larry".
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Jun 10, 2019 01:39
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Spiteski posted:Not only that but how telling is the first paragraph where it says "I immediately knew who it was". Like, how is someone super squeaky clean, but when you're told "Someone made a rape game" you leap to "Oh yea, that'll be Larry". Nope, that's not what it says. quote:In the seconds following reading the advisory, my immediate thoughts were both that I know the gm in question, and that it couldn’t have been true. While there are some hitches here and there, the post is largely okay. "This shouldn't have been possible, and we'll try to make changes to prevent it happening again." Its major problem is too much personal rumination over his own shock, which really isn't important or useful right now. Like, sure, if you think he's lying or deluded, fine I guess. I wouldn't be surprised if there was plenty of evidence of this dude always being a creep in some corner of the internet, but I think it's also dangerous to pretend like only total idiots can be taken-in by a secret creeplord.
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Jun 10, 2019 02:08
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That Old Tree posted:Nope, that's not what it says. Ah I definitely got the wrong meaning of that sentence then. It very much reads to me like he didn't get a name in the memo, but knew who it was. I stand corrected
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Jun 10, 2019 02:19
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That Old Tree posted:While there are some hitches here and there, the post is largely okay. "This shouldn't have been possible, and we'll try to make changes to prevent it happening again." Its major problem is too much personal rumination over his own shock, which really isn't important or useful right now. I don't think the con organizers were complicit or anything no, and they handled this about as well as it's possible to handle it. I just have serious personal doubts that this was actually a sudden swerve on the GM's part instead of simply the first time someone actually went public with it. Normal people don't run games like this, so on reflection if I was that con organizer I would be wondering just how often something like this had been going on and slipping underneath the radar until now.
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Jun 10, 2019 03:32
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Putting aside the shock value, the revelation of how deep the dude was in the system actually does make their response a little more impressive given how much easier it would have been to "defend the institution." Still, this is like the definition of some "wolves guarding the henhouse" poo poo.
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Jun 10, 2019 05:35
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Mormon Star Wars posted:Putting aside the shock value, the revelation of how deep the dude was in the system actually does make their response a little more impressive given how much easier it would have been to "defend the institution." Yeah, in all of this I feel it's important to note that this response is probably the most thorough, comprehensive, and unflinching one I've seen arise from a gaming convention...or hell, any sort of convention...over something like this. No foot-dragging, no "well actually," no lovely faux apologies, just a sincere apology and immediate ejection of the diarrhea rape GM and a promise to take steps to prevent this sort of thing from happening again. You can compare this to practically anything similar that's happened in the last, oh, year or so and these guys come out way ahead of the rest of the bunch.
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Jun 10, 2019 05:46
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Kai Tave posted:Yeah, in all of this I feel it's important to note that this response is probably the most thorough, comprehensive, and unflinching one I've seen arise from a gaming convention...or hell, any sort of convention...over something like this. No foot-dragging, no "well actually," no lovely faux apologies, just a sincere apology and immediate ejection of the diarrhea rape GM and a promise to take steps to prevent this sort of thing from happening again. You can compare this to practically anything similar that's happened in the last, oh, year or so and these guys come out way ahead of the rest of the bunch. Makes the various conventions that have refused to eject people who physically harmed people look really bad.
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Jun 10, 2019 06:41
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homullus posted:so you'll keep buying that rich dick even if the butcher is giving you the shaft Well, you have to leave the butcher a tip. In regards to the rape GM, this is definitely one of the best responses I've seen from a convention. That said, the organizer who made the blog post seems completely oblivious to the fact that people are going to assume the staff might protect the offender if he's in a position of authority. He keeps harping on the fact that the desk was so close, and yet no one came to the desk to make a complaint. Which is kind of sad, because this is one of the few cases where it apparently would actually have helped, instead of just being empty words to try to absolve himself of guilt. Hopefully in the future people will be more willing to come forward now that the con staff have shown they're willing to actually eject bad actors.
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Jun 10, 2019 07:42
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They do need to make sure that their room captains aren't running games at the same time they're supposed to be watching the room, not just because of this specific case, but because of the split attention, and that people might not want to interrupt someone who's doing something else, even if the thing you're interrupting them for is also part of their job.
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Jun 10, 2019 08:07
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Angrymog posted:Makes the various conventions that have refused to eject people who physically harmed people look really bad. Ok someone's gonna have to explain this. I worked as a bouncer for several years and the idea that someone hurts someone and is neither bounced out the door nor banned from future attendance is completely foreign to me.
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Jun 10, 2019 08:10
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Elector_Nerdlingen posted:Ok someone's gonna have to explain this. I worked as a bouncer for several years and the idea that someone hurts someone and is neither bounced out the door nor banned from future attendance is completely foreign to me. Bill Webb of Frog God Games got drunk at PaizoCon 2017, which is apparently SOP for him, harassed a female guest and injured a con staff member who was trying to get him away from her. He was asked to leave but allowed to stay long enough to sober up because his kids were at the convention with him. But as far as I recall, he was not banned from future attendance. So gently caress Paizo, again.
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Jun 10, 2019 08:26
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Lemniscate Blue posted:Bill Webb of Frog God Games got drunk at PaizoCon 2017, which is apparently SOP for him, harassed a female guest and injured a con staff member who was trying to get him away from her. The kids thing turned out to be semi-bullshit, because his wife was apparently there too.
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Jun 10, 2019 08:55
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Right, but... do these places not employ security people? Am I picturing the whole setup wrong? There's a venue (that has booze for sale?), and someone has assaulted someone else inside the venue. That's what's happened, right? Do the venue's (either directly employed or contracted) trained and licensed bouncers / crowd controllers / security guards / local equivalent not arrive and either eject or arrest the person responsible? E: Because ooooh boy where I am the injured staff member would have a good case for "I was injured through the negligence of my employer", the venue would be in danger of an ungodly fine and maybe losing its liquor license, and just... well it sounds like once of those how not to do it case studies. Elector_Nerdlingen fucked around with this message at 11:13 on Jun 10, 2019 |
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Jun 10, 2019 11:08
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The "security" was probably cops at the high volume entrances/exits and volunteers staffed throughout the rest of the con. Volunteers probably made up a vast majority of the "security" and they probably get away with as few paid officers as legally possible. e: as these things are often in hotels, the liquor was probably bought at a hotel bar which are usually just outside the hallways that lead to the giant conference/ball rooms that conventions actually take place in
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Jun 10, 2019 14:12
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Cons are entirely low-key bacchanalias and as long as you brown-bag your drink and live in a reasonable doubt world the staff can get away with playing dumb.
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Jun 10, 2019 14:59
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PST posted:To be fair, the mods have said it's perfectly okay to make group attacks on Nazis and a pretty broad interpretation of that. They banned defending Trump and gamergate and all sorts of other right-wing extremist things. And even in that thread, telling the wanker to gently caress off just got a warning, where doing it to anyone else would have had a ban. RPGnet used to have a problem with people doing poo poo like "Oh, I don't hate homosexuals, I'm just telling you that the Bible says they'll spend eternity in a lake of fire. Don't persecute me for my religious beliefs!" The moderation policies that got rid of that poo poo unfortunately set up a weird environment that allowed sealioning and "I'm not touching you" style trolling to survive.
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Jun 10, 2019 15:17
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Halloween Jack posted:RPGnet used to have a problem with people doing poo poo like "Oh, I don't hate homosexuals, I'm just telling you that the Bible says they'll spend eternity in a lake of fire. Don't persecute me for my religious beliefs!" The moderation policies that got rid of that poo poo unfortunately set up a weird environment that allowed sealioning and "I'm not touching you" style trolling to survive. Sealioning gets shot down pretty quickly there now, and people are banned for it specifically. Which is then funny when they go running to the fash rpg site to add to their long screed all about rpg.net, during which they'll be complaining at how the 'SJWs' have invented the term 'sealioning' without seeing the irony.
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Jun 10, 2019 16:57
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Halloween Jack posted:(It came up during the "Knights of the Scarlet Woman" fiasco on ENWorld.)
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Jun 10, 2019 17:36
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Aw, I looked at the trap, Ray.
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Jun 10, 2019 17:41
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PC Show on E3 right now has notable scumbag Mike Mearls on stage to talk about Baldur's Gate 3. Guess he finally got out from under the rock he crawled under.
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Jun 10, 2019 19:43
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Do you not see any problem with endlessly reacting to new fash tactics?
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Jun 10, 2019 21:53
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Darwinism posted:Do you not see any problem with endlessly reacting to new fash tactics? As opposed to what, letting them just poo poo places up?
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Jun 10, 2019 22:07
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PST posted:As opposed to what, letting them just poo poo places up? The problem is that even if RPGnet gets great, eventually, at every fash tactic there's still the timeframe where that tactic functions. But it's more important that people don't say rude things to fash than it is to actually combat fash voices.
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Jun 10, 2019 22:08
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Darwinism posted:The problem is that even if RPGnet gets great, eventually, at every fash tactic there's still the timeframe where that tactic functions. But instead it's more important that people don't say rude things to fash. While I think they have a bunch of issues of moderation there, the complete 'gently caress you' to the fash, trump and all of that side of poo poo isn't one of them, so they've been really proactive about just telling fash to gently caress off at the first sign.
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Jun 10, 2019 22:10
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Honestly I read it more as the standard centrist, "I don't think any opinions invalidate you from my company," sort of thing where it's fine to associate yourself with the giant not-quite-closeted bigot so long as he doesn't say anything too bad, which is not the same as intolerance of bigotry at all I'm not saying RPGnet is the worst or anything but they're definitely like the liberal centrist of forums
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Jun 10, 2019 22:25
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Darwinism posted:Honestly I read it more as the standard centrist, "I don't think any opinions invalidate you from my company," sort of thing where it's fine to associate yourself with the giant not-quite-closeted bigot so long as he doesn't say anything too bad, which is not the same as intolerance of bigotry at all RPGnet literally bans saying you support Trump
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Jun 10, 2019 22:28
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