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Suspicious posted:Backstabbing is not something I'd recommend for a first playthrough. You have to design your combat approach around it and it's very micromanage-y.
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Jun 11, 2019 02:57
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2E martial classes don’t really do anything except hit more often as they level up, and only to a point even then. Inquisitor is the best of the kits as its abilities are extremely useful through all three games. Second choice would actually be the good-aligned monk class, which has its fair share of direct fire damage abilities (though your character won’t have much use for weapons beyond a certain point). But I’d actually argue that pure class sorcerer is the ideal first game character. Can’t gently caress up stats, though you can choose bad spells (just make sure you stock on direct damage and, eventually, protection-stripping abjuration), and you get all the satisfying power bloat of wizardry without ever having to worry about keeping a spell book
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Jun 11, 2019 04:11
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Monks are loving awful in BG1. Close to actual uselessness. Also, the evil kit is better, but playing an evil character is not something I'd recommend. Inquisitor and Berserker are the two best kits for warrior classes by a mile.
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Jun 11, 2019 04:37
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Archer is also good, though it gets less so in BG2. Still pretty solid all the way through though.
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Jun 11, 2019 04:40
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AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:I disagree as it is really straightforward, fun and exciting, and can help you win really tough fights a lot easier than otherwise. It takes some getting used to but that is the case with anything you are learning new. How is it straightforward? You have to constantly run out of sight range, stealth, position yourself directly behind your target (not always easy), attack, run away out of sight range again to repeat. If you're solo it's not so bad, but while managing a party at the same time? Yeesh. VS. Cast dispel with your PC then beat everyone up.
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Jun 11, 2019 04:56
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Alright, I'm out of practice and wizards are killing the gently caress out of me. I forget how much of a dick those halflings in the Planar sphere are! The way I would deal with wizards in BG1 was to fire off a Magic Missile and interrupt whatever buffs the enemy was casting. I'd keep interrupting the douche until my meat shields had eaten THEIR meat shields and then send Minsc to cut the wizard in half. In BG2 however, the wizards have sequencers so the moment they spot you, they have 2 or 3 protections up. Then they'll use dimension door or something else so I can't target them with Breach. And then they'll use Chaotic Commands so I lose control of my party. And suddenly I'm reloading. With all that in mind. What are some good ways to stop wizards buffing themselves to the point of not-fuckwithable, and ruining their day before they ruin mine?
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Jun 11, 2019 05:00
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first time through bg? fighter/mage multiclass or berserker bg1, dual to mage in sod / bg2 f/m multi is uber powerful and gives you a taste of all the cool stuff. wade into battle invulnerable and punch holes in gods. berserker/mage is even more powerful at the downside of being more fiddly before you get your powers back. for that reason i'd probably suggest fighter/mage multi 2e DND is a setting ruled by magic users. Suggesting a cleric or a ranger or archer is interesting but doesn't give you a 'true experience' imo. BG combat lives and dies by mage duels. lets go over some of the other options and why you shouldn't pick them in my opinion: inquisitor - this was my first character in bg2. Dispel is such a crutch that it warps the game into 'dispel -> hack and slash' x1000. It's very powerful but it's still a martial class at heart. Makes the game boring and easy as opposed to fun and easy (f/m). sorcerer - it is so hard to gently caress up spell selection, this isn't anything you'd want to thrust onto a new player. there are many different ways to play mages and I wouldn't want anyone to be pigeonholed into a particular playstyle they know nothing about. anything + thief - I learned how to backstab last week after playing for years. Doing this as a novelty is fun, the entire trilogy? No thanks. Use Imoen and Jan as your thieves. cleric - lol the most milquetoast option possible. it's perfectly fine but thematically boring, the greatest warrior in the land casts chaotic commands and heal spells on rest so their teammates can do all the real fighting. archer - it's absurdly powerful in bg1 which made my bg2 archer feel like a wimp. there's a great mod to improve archer kit in bg2 and add some more high level bows which is fantastic to not be lashed to tuigen.
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Jun 11, 2019 05:02
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H13 posted:Alright, I'm out of practice and wizards are killing the gently caress out of me. I forget how much of a dick those halflings in the Planar sphere are! Grab Keldorn and just have him dispell every thing.
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Jun 11, 2019 05:03
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H13 posted:Alright, I'm out of practice and wizards are killing the gently caress out of me. I forget how much of a dick those halflings in the Planar sphere are! In BG2 they mostly use shadow door. They're invisible, but still probably in the same spot. Detect Invisibility or glitterdust should make them visible. Then you should be able to Breach away. Chaotic commands prevents characters from being affected by mind altering spells like confusion. Use it if you think Chaos or confusion will be ised on your party.
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Jun 11, 2019 05:08
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breach is a good generalized protection stripper as you mention. detect invisibility is a level 2 wizard spell and has a low cast time. bumrush with haste to move up on a wizard quickly once their protection is down. if you can find a ring of the ram it goes through all protection and can be used to interrupt if you're additionally hindered in any way. inquisitors are incredible not just because they have dispel magic but also because they have true sight (detect invisibility) and both are insta cast.
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Jun 11, 2019 05:09
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Chaotic Commands is the second worst spell name that doesn't tell you what it does at all. The worst of course turn undead
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Jun 11, 2019 05:11
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You can also cast Insect Plague on one of your own dudes. It'll jump to enemies without affecting party members.sweet geek swag posted:Archer is also good, though it gets less so in BG2. Still pretty solid all the way through though. I kinda wouldn't recommend them to new players, though, because to make them work in BG2 you need specific knowledge of item locations to get around weapon immunities.
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Jun 11, 2019 05:45
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Anyone have any thoughts on the Icewind Dale 2 NPC project? IW2 is the one infinity game I have yet to beat; was also holding out hope they'd do an EE. It looks pretty cool and I think I remember trying the one for IW1 which wasn't too bad.
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Jun 11, 2019 06:12
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chaosapiant posted:Anyone have any thoughts on the Icewind Dale 2 NPC project? IW2 is the one infinity game I have yet to beat; was also holding out hope they'd do an EE. It looks pretty cool and I think I remember trying the one for IW1 which wasn't too bad. I don't, but it's pretty easy to add new characters to IWD2, so anyone who sucks you can kick to the curb and slot in a your own created characters.
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Jun 11, 2019 06:17
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Clerics own and are one of my fav classes to play. Provided it's the Helm or Lathander kit or a dual/multiclass.
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Jun 11, 2019 06:27
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bike tory posted:Clerics own and are one of my fav classes to play. Provided it's the Helm or Lathander kit or a dual/multiclass. I really wish there was a alternative to having evil clerics "convert" the undead instead of chunking them. There's nothing more fun then having a cleric turn undead and 8 vampires just evaporate aside from doing the same to a lich.
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Jun 11, 2019 06:55
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I told you guys they were good villains, people are already getting fired up about killing them.
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Jun 11, 2019 07:11
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Yeah clerics are great. They're not ridiculously overpowered at any point on the level curve, but they don't need to be dead-weight babied at any point either. A single cleric can hard-counter a ton of the worst nonsense in the series. Spiders, mind flayers, all kinds of undead, just get chunked with no recourse by you having a cleric in the party, and they don't need to bust the levelling curve with solo runs or understaffed parties to do it either.
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Jun 11, 2019 16:39
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Has, or does, anyone in this thread read or like the Drizzt saga of books by RA Salvatore? I have a soft spot for them and read all the way through up to the Transitions quadrilogy. Has anyone read past that and actually still enjoy the books?
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Jun 11, 2019 17:05
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chaosapiant posted:Has, or does, anyone in this thread read or like the Drizzt saga of books by RA Salvatore? I have a soft spot for them and read all the way through up to the Transitions quadrilogy. Has anyone read past that and actually still enjoy the books? I read the prequels when I was young (where he's still in the Underdark and part of Drow society, I think they were written after the original Icewind Dale trilogy), and one of the later books. RA Salvatore is still writing Drizzt books, a new one is coming out in August. I remember liking it when I was 15, but I don't really want to risk reading any of them now.
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Jun 11, 2019 17:42
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Suspicious posted:How is it straightforward? You have to constantly run out of sight range, stealth, position yourself directly behind your target (not always easy), attack, run away out of sight range again to repeat. If you're solo it's not so bad, but while managing a party at the same time? Yeesh.
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Jun 11, 2019 17:44
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chaosapiant posted:Anyone have any thoughts on the Icewind Dale 2 NPC project? IW2 is the one infinity game I have yet to beat; was also holding out hope they'd do an EE. It looks pretty cool and I think I remember trying the one for IW1 which wasn't too bad.  Vichan posted:I've given up on IWD2:EE being made so I'm just going to play the GOG copy of the original I seem to have acquired at some point. Are there any mods worth having? How is the NPC project? Wizard Styles posted:The NPC Project is good, much better than the BG1 one because the IWD2 project was just one modder so the mod is a lot more cohesive than its BG1 counterpart. Vichan posted:Alright, sweet. I'll try it out as soon as I can decide on which NPCs to put in my party! Wizard Styles posted:You'll definitely want to bring Nord and Hildury for story reasons. Since they're both frontline characters everything else will probably kind of fall into place. All roles can be covered by one character that's pretty low key and one that isn't so it kinda just depends on what sort of overall feel you want to go for.
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Jun 11, 2019 19:10
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I was once jonesing so hard for D&D after a BG run that I read the first Salvatore Drizzt book, cover to cover, with all the relish of eating a boiled shoe. Everything about it, plot, characterization, prose, was on the level of a particularly bad fanfic. Bitter medicine. Learn from my mistakes, goons. I still haven’t replayed any NWN1 module
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Jun 11, 2019 19:27
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I was actually going to ask if there was some goon recommended FR books that I should check out.
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Jun 11, 2019 20:13
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I read the Underdark and the Icewind Dale trilogies as a a teen and thought it was the bee's knees. I tried rereading them a couple of years ago to try and satisfy a DnD craving and didn't make it through the books. It is not particularly good writing and it completely put me off on reading anything else from Salvatore.
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Jun 11, 2019 20:14
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I thought the Paul S Kemp Erevis Cale books were pretty good back when, dunno if they hold up though.
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Jun 11, 2019 20:27
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I'm still very fond of both the first two Drizzt trilogies as well as the Cleric Quintet. Their popcorn fiction for a popcorn setting and they're fun.Wizard Styles posted:Quoting myself for maximum Thanks! I'll check it out then. Hopefully the classes are well balanced, but it's 3.0 so it should be fine either way. Man though, this game really needed an EE. 
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Jun 11, 2019 20:42
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thumper57 posted:I thought the Paul S Kemp Erevis Cale books were pretty good back when, dunno if they hold up though. Yeah, if you're into the BG style story of a character starting lowly and progressing gradually to epic level poo poo, the Paul S Kemp Erevis Kale books are where you want to be. I think there's an introductory book that was part of an anthology series and then two trilogies. The best stand alone pulpy adventure story is City of Ravens by Richard Baker in my mind.
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Jun 11, 2019 20:46
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I think I know the answer to this, but can a sorcerer be used in dual classing? Or just mage?
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Jun 11, 2019 20:50
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chaosapiant posted:I think I know the answer to this, but can a sorcerer be used in dual classing? Or just mage? Just mage.
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Jun 11, 2019 20:51
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Walrus Pete posted:Just mage. That's what I thought. Thinking of potential next-runs when my current evil playthrough is done, and a Kensai/Sorcerer seems like it would amazing. Edit: Anyone ever do a Kensai/Thief run? That seems like another synergistic dual class that can lay traps and cut down dudes with swords.
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Jun 11, 2019 20:52
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chaosapiant posted:That's what I thought. Thinking of potential next-runs when my current evil playthrough is done, and a Kensai/Sorcerer seems like it would amazing. Kensai/Thief is pretty much the ultimate form of the Fighter/Thief. King of backstabbing, and once you get Use Any Item you become even more ultimate.
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Jun 11, 2019 20:59
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I was so into the Drizzt books as a kid. I think I read the IWD trilogy on the recommendation of the librarian at my local library, right after I slogged through LOTR for the first time. I don't know why my parents decided that LOTR was the best intro to the fantasy genre for a 10yo, it is very dense and boring and even now I struggle to read it. By comparison the light pulpy fantasy in the Drizzt books was a breath of fresh air and I loved it. It also hit all the right buttons for a nerdy boy at the onset of puberty, especially the prequels, because I immediately loved the idea of the dark, brooding but noble hero surrounded by people who don't understand him. A little later Drizzt was also the first time I was exposed to the idea of a Mary Sue and it served as a decent critical literary awakening for me. IWD and the Dark Elf trilogies are the only Salvatore books I've read, so I'm not sure if it's changed, but the prose in them is not terrible. Mediocre certainly, but it's very readable. Were it not for the dated gender roles I would probably still recommend the IWD trilogy as a decent intro YA high fantasy for bookish kids, especially nerdy white boys. At the very least Salvatore avoids leaning on deus ex machina constantly in his plots, which is loving irritatingly common in YA fantasy. The Dark Elf trilogy though... I agree reads just barely above the level of your average fanfiction series.
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Jun 11, 2019 21:02
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chaosapiant posted:That's what I thought. Thinking of potential next-runs when my current evil playthrough is done, and a Kensai/Sorcerer seems like it would amazing. Currently on this run, at level 6 or 7 Kensai in BG1, planning to dual class over at 9, with Grandmaster in quarterstaff and 2 pips in two-handed weapon style. Can't wait to explode things in BG2.
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Jun 11, 2019 21:15
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I was a Drizzt super fan when I was young and went to see RA Salvatore speaking/signing engagements several times. I think the books were best enjoyed when they were released. The internet was very young and there wasn't a wiki for every object in the Forgotten Realms. The prose was always light but at least the Underdark setting seemed much more exotic and thrilling then. Salvatore is a very likable guy in person. I remember him telling a funny story about how he received hate mail for years because he killed off Chewbacca in one of the Star Wars books(under direct orders from Lucasfilm).
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Jun 11, 2019 21:17
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I think rather than calling Salvatore's work fanfictiony, I would say that he narrates as if it is a D&D campaign. So really good descriptions of action but everything else is a bit thin and obvious.
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Jun 11, 2019 21:26
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sweet geek swag posted:I think rather than calling Salvatore's work fanfictiony, I would say that he narrates as if it is a D&D campaign. So really good descriptions of action but everything else is a bit thin and obvious. This is a good take. His action sequences were always pretty drat well told, and as they are basically action books, that's a good thing. I also genuinely love whichever book it was that had Wulfgar as a tavern guard and a drunk. I think it was "Spine of the World".
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Jun 11, 2019 21:40
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I was on an ill-advised Forgotten realms reading binge as a teenager from '94 to '96 or so, and I also was a Salvatore fan at the time. Almost all of them were way worse than his. The one standout from that time, however, was the Finder's Stone trilogy by Kate Novak and Jeff Grubb, especially the first two books, Azure Bonds and The Wyvern's Spur. Azure Bonds also ties into the goldbox game of the same name. I'm not saying they're great literature, but if you want decently entertaining D&D pulp other than Salvatore, they'd be my first recommendation.
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Jun 11, 2019 21:43
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chaosapiant posted:This is a good take. His action sequences were always pretty drat well told, and as they are basically action books, that's a good thing. I also genuinely love whichever book it was that had Wulfgar as a tavern guard and a drunk. I think it was "Spine of the World". Spine of the World was the first DnD/Salvatore book I ever read and its so goddamn weird and goofy with its massive swings in tone I can't help but remember it without grinning, reading the other books in order after that was very strange as it didn't feel like it belonged in the same series. Still have that old copy I bought sitting around in my closet somewhere.
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Jun 11, 2019 22:41
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chaosapiant posted:Has, or does, anyone in this thread read or like the Drizzt saga of books by RA Salvatore? I have a soft spot for them and read all the way through up to the Transitions quadrilogy. Has anyone read past that and actually still enjoy the books? I read and really liked the Icewind Dale trilogy and the Dark Elf trilogy back when I was in middle school, but I started the next series, Legacy and Starless Night, finished Starless Night and just kinda went, I'm done? I still have a soft spot for the other two, but it's been so long since I read them. I did pick up the Cleric quintet recently though, and thought the first three were pretty fun. Four's a bit of a slog though.
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Jun 11, 2019 23:13
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