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A lot of the story writing problems is Blizzard really really likes leaning hard into the bits of writing they do worst.
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Jun 13, 2019 17:03
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Kurieg posted:My main complaints with wow right now are the story, and the endgame activities. Oh my god M+. It's an amazing idea and honestly should be the future of raiding but blizzard is determined to gently caress it up every step of the way.
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Jun 13, 2019 17:05
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isk posted:Also, for folks looking for a bit of escapism, an inherently adversarial game in a phase that has re-emphasized conflict between players of different factions isn't a great idea right now. Yeah, in the runup to BFA's release when they were running those "FACTION MATTERS" commercials at the same time that Sylv was burning down Teldrassil it was.. really weird. "You should judge your friends for their choice of faction, also one of the factions is now openly facist and evil."
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Jun 13, 2019 17:08
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Gonna be honest, the "badness" of BfA is vastly overstated, I think people are just tired of the game that they've been playing for 15 years that hasn't changed significantly since Legion. Yes, the story is bad, but the story was always bad (most game stories are!) The only reason I quit was because most of my friends moved on to other games. WoW had been on a downward slope for us post-MoP after they eliminated 10 man raiding for the hardest content and no one wants to deal with recruiting 15 randos to make a raid group. Moving to flex raiding also made small group sizes a major pain in the rear end for a lot of the fights in Uldir because they didn't balance it at all for the lower-bounds.
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Jun 13, 2019 17:08
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I'd argue WoW's problems is that it changes too much. Whenever they add a system people like, it's dumped by the way side for some totally untested new thing, and good or bad, that too will get dumped to the way side in the expansion following it. FFXIV has been very good about refining systems while keeping them relevant and evergreen.
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Jun 13, 2019 17:16
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Gorelab posted:A lot of the story writing problems is Blizzard really really likes leaning hard into the bits of writing they do worst. A big part of WoW's writing issues is also that the writers are very low on the totem pole in Blizzard. When they're making a new expansion, higher-ups in the company decide what the themes, major events, and main characters will be. Then they tell the writers to make it work, no matter how nonsensical or contradictory to previous events and characterization they might be.
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Jun 13, 2019 17:16
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Cythereal posted:A big part of WoW's writing issues is also that the writers are very low on the totem pole in Blizzard. When they're making a new expansion, higher-ups in the company decide what the themes, major events, and main characters will be. See here: Garrosh Hellscream.
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Jun 13, 2019 17:18
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Greader posted:How can you tell someone is a WoW refugee? Doubt they get a custom title for it, so is it just the new way to refer to sprouts/people messing up mechanics? when u get a level 60 paladin who’s seemingly never seen dzemael before, doesn’t use flash, and pulls everything with provoke, baby that’s a wow refugee and i don’t say that disparagingly i mean that from a sense of “they’re doing things that would make sense in wow but not here”
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Jun 13, 2019 17:24
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Kaubocks posted:when u get a level 60 paladin who’s seemingly never seen dzemael before, doesn’t use flash, and pulls everything with provoke, baby that’s a wow refugee Pulling with taunt doesn't make sense in WoW and never happens, those people are just new to MMOs WoW tanking is very similar to FF14 in that all classes have a spammable ranged attack to aggro mobs
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Jun 13, 2019 17:32
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Firebert posted:Pulling with taunt doesn't make sense in WoW and never happens
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Jun 13, 2019 17:36
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Minrad posted:it generates bonus threat, you do it before doing your ranged attack or charging in No you don't, many of the ranged pull abilities already generate bonus threat. It's a completely unnecessary use of a global especially since threat is barely even a mechanic in WoW compared to FF14. Taunt is to tank swap in raids or to grab something that has broken threat somehow
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Jun 13, 2019 17:39
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Firebert posted:Gonna be honest, the "badness" of BfA is vastly overstated, I think people are just tired of the game that they've been playing for 15 years that hasn't changed significantly since Legion. i didn't start playing wow until legion, then fell off immediately in bfa because of it being very not good
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Jun 13, 2019 17:42
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Minrad posted:I'd argue WoW's problems is that it changes too much. Whenever they add a system people like, it's dumped by the way side for some totally untested new thing, and good or bad, that too will get dumped to the way side in the expansion following it. FFXIV has been very good about refining systems while keeping them relevant and evergreen. my favorite example of this is wintergrasp, a pvp zone that has no reason to be deserted except blizzard doesn’t want you to go to old zones ever again I don’t think that’s ever really happened in ff xiv except maybe diadem which is deserted not from dev fiat but because it’s poo poo
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Jun 13, 2019 17:43
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DizzyBum posted:I sometimes worry I'm in some sort of "FFXIV bubble" because I enjoy the game so much, but then I hear horror stories from WoW vets and I feel better about my decision. WoW was a very good game for quite awhile. I played it constantly up through the release of cataclysm and then still came back to it a few times right up until one of the MoP patches which is when ff14 hit I want to say. The thing about FF14 is that by and large, it's an awful lot like a tweaked wotlk-era WoW. All of the old things I liked about WoW are still there, but usually smartly adjusted in a way that makes it better. The biggest thing for me being that FF14 gives you some control over how you gear up, and also let's me get reasonably comparable gear to the top end raiders. By far the biggest thing that has kept me from ever going back to WoW is it's descent into gacha bullshit all over the place and getting rid of Valor Points (weekly capped tomestone equivalent).
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Jun 13, 2019 17:47
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I thought about playing WoW again a few months ago because I used to have a ton of fun with it. Minrad's late nite Naxx runs in WotLK were exquisite. Then I remembered you have to create an alt with a whole new character name if you want to be a different class. I just can't commit to one class anymore on an MMO. FFXIV's job system has spoiled me. Propagandist fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Jun 13, 2019 |
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Jun 13, 2019 17:48
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UHD posted:my favorite example of this is wintergrasp, a pvp zone that has no reason to be deserted except blizzard doesn’t want you to go to old zones ever again They literally just brought Wintergrasp back to the PvP battlegrounds queue a couple of month ago lol Also it was largely a failure at the time because of how largely tilted all of the server populations were to one side or another, you would routinely get matches that were like 40 horde vs. 5 alliance players so they were forced to add scaling that made the underrepresented faction mini-raidbosses in strength
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Jun 13, 2019 17:52
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DizzyBum posted:I sometimes worry I'm in some sort of "FFXIV bubble" because I enjoy the game so much, but then I hear horror stories from WoW vets and I feel better about my decision. WoW tries to reinvent the wheel every expansion, for no discernible reason. This involves actively throwing out systems that worked and learning nothing from why they worked. Thus, Azerite.
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Jun 13, 2019 17:57
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UHD posted:my favorite example of this is wintergrasp, a pvp zone that has no reason to be deserted except blizzard doesn’t want you to go to old zones ever again See also : Garrisons, Artifact Weapons
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Jun 13, 2019 17:59
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Firebert posted:They literally just brought Wintergrasp back to the PvP battlegrounds queue a couple of month ago lol I haven’t played wow after legion so I had no idea blizzard did anything with it 
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Jun 13, 2019 17:59
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Shame about the weapons, I liked how some of them talked poo poo about your actions or opponents. The mage one got snippy when you would create food/water, something like "you can alter reality and you're making food....really?"
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Jun 13, 2019 18:00
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Captain Oblivious posted:WoW tries to reinvent the wheel every expansion, for no discernible reason. This involves actively throwing out systems that worked and learning nothing from why they worked. They're turning the neck into basically an artifact weapon in the next patch or so but, I've already gotten out. I'm quite glad they're finally giving Worgen a better model but it'd take some story and mechanics changes for me to even think about getting back in.
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Jun 13, 2019 18:00
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I vastly prefer WoW combat, and in general WoW has QoL systems YoshiP might think of in 5 years (or their terrible 1.0 code base makes them impossible to do in the first place), on the other hand WoW in the meantime abandoned a lot of systems I would have considered superior, for implementations that are more grindy or random for the sake of it. So for me it comes down to which is the lesser (MMO-) evil, and gameplay in FF14 is still good enough, while the game looks better and lets me play all the jobs on one character at least.
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Jun 13, 2019 18:08
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Firebert posted:No you don't, many of the ranged pull abilities already generate bonus threat. It's a completely unnecessary use of a global especially since threat is barely even a mechanic in WoW compared to FF14. Taunt is to tank swap in raids or to grab something that has broken threat somehow ??? You do, dude. This is getting really off topic but it's powerful enough that they've nerfed the bonus threat generation you get after taunting mobs this expansion because tanks were using it to trivialize an affix in Mythic+ that made tanks generate less threat normally. Also pulling mobs with taunt is pretty standard for any tank to pick poo poo up when their ranged attack is on cooldown or specifically for Brewmaster (because their taunt increases enemy move speed and they have no real long range pull) Veng Dunters (their one ranged pull has a longish cooldown) or Prot Warrior (they have one ranged pull but it does minimal damage/threat). It's not a waste of a global because taunts have been off the GCD for probably a decade now. https://www.wowhead.com/news=287430/taunt-on-the-patch-8-1-ptr Minera fucked around with this message at 18:24 on Jun 13, 2019 |
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Jun 13, 2019 18:21
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orcane posted:I vastly prefer WoW combat, and in general WoW has QoL systems YoshiP might think of in 5 years (or their terrible 1.0 code base makes them impossible to do in the first place), on the other hand WoW in the meantime abandoned a lot of systems I would have considered superior, for implementations that are more grindy or random for the sake of it. So for me it comes down to which is the lesser (MMO-) evil, and gameplay in FF14 is still good enough, while the game looks better and lets me play all the jobs on one character at least. Yeah I'd say WoW's combat systems are really the only thing I preferred substantially, just because it felt like there was a lot more happening despite not having much more complexity (besides like half your buttons being useless 90% of the time).
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Jun 13, 2019 18:22
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In practice switching between jobs in FFXIV and switching between characters in WoW isn’t really all that different, but I really like having a different appearance for every class. If FFXIV had a job-specific Fantasia option, I’d be all over that. I still love WoW’s core gameplay (demon hunter is a wonderful class and would sadly never work in FFXIV) and I’m cautiously optimistic about about some stuff in 8.2, but I’ve been unsubbed for most of BFA. I recently went back in to catch up on what I missed, but 8.2 is probably coming out around the same time as Shadowbringers, and that’s some tough competition. That said, I’m getting very worn down by the verbosity of FFXIV’s quests, so even though I really like the look of a lot of the ShB content, maybe I’ll do neither and have a summer free of the MMO curse. Nah, probably not. I’ll just multibox! They’re kinda similar games sometimes - I can probably pull off playing both at the same time!
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Jun 13, 2019 18:32
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Make Fantasias unlock race/appearance 'slots' you can swap at will in the glam dresser (that you can also assign to glam plates, of course. alongside haircuts please yoshi the collar clipping is killing me )
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Jun 13, 2019 18:34
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Edmond Dantes posted:alongside haircuts please yoshi the collar clipping is killing me ) Hairstyles in Glamour Plates would rule so much *edit - Magil Zeal posted:Personally I like FFXIV's battle system a lot, when I tried to go back and play some WoW it just felt like button mashing for the sake of it. Maybe that's just due to being that many years older than I was when I last seriously raided in WoW (which was vanilla). The slower, steady pace of XIV suits me just fine. I agree with all this. FFXIV's slower GCD means each action is more important and it gives players more time to make intelligent decisions. I'm good with skipping some mobs in a dungeon but those tend to be in old content (Halitali, Toto-Rak, etc.). isk fucked around with this message at 18:45 on Jun 13, 2019 |
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Jun 13, 2019 18:42
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Personally I like FFXIV's battle system a lot, when I tried to go back and play some WoW it just felt like button mashing for the sake of it. Maybe that's just due to being that many years older than I was when I last seriously raided in WoW (which was vanilla). The slower, steady pace of XIV suits me just fine. But the one thing that annoys me in other MMOs and MMO-likes is the idea of skipping content. Like, I don't play a game so I can go into a dungeon and sneak past mobs, exploit geometry and/or pathfinding so I can not use my abilities. Maybe it's a weird thing to get hung up on but it really bothers me, and I vastly prefer FFXIV's dungeon content approach where you do fight every group of mobs, maybe you pull 2-3 packs together and AoE them but that still leaves plenty of room to use your abilities correctly to make it go faster. I feel really awesome when the tank pulls together a big pack and I bust out bane/demi-Bahamut to make it evaporate. The idea that it could be more efficient to just skip that altogether annoys me to no end, at least partly because if you can skip content then if you get matched into that content with other players you're going to be expected to skip it. It's not really an option at that point, and if content exists to be skipped then why is it there? Anyhow that's my rant.
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Jun 13, 2019 18:43
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God, hairstyle choices in glamour plates is something I've wanted since before glamour plates existed.
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Jun 13, 2019 18:48
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Magil Zeal posted:Personally I like FFXIV's battle system a lot, when I tried to go back and play some WoW it just felt like button mashing for the sake of it. Maybe that's just due to being that many years older than I was when I last seriously raided in WoW (which was vanilla). The slower, steady pace of XIV suits me just fine. The overabundance of trash and the expectation that you should learn the correct routes to skip as much as possible is the most recent reason why I bounced off of WoW, again. I wish I had a screenshot of The MOTHERLODE!!!'s first like 5 seconds where the screen is practically filled with nameplates of enemies. There's the expectation that you aren't going to be fighting all of them, but then why even put them there?
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Jun 13, 2019 18:59
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Magil Zeal posted:Personally I like FFXIV's battle system a lot, when I tried to go back and play some WoW it just felt like button mashing for the sake of it. Maybe that's just due to being that many years older than I was when I last seriously raided in WoW (which was vanilla). The slower, steady pace of XIV suits me just fine. That drove me nuts in GW2. I made a mesmer because it's got a really unique class identity and I wanted to dazzle and confound the enemy with my clones and illusions. Everyone else, however, just wanted me to glitch through geometry and portal them through dungeons to completely skip them. There were cases where people wanted to sneak through a maze by chaining stealth abilities; that was ok since it felt like a valid strategy. By glitchy portalling and such, ugh. TERA had a similar problem (along with other, older MMOs) where dungeons were not scaled properly, so every time I'd queue for a dungeon, the other veteran players I'd be paired up with were so overpowered they could one-shot every enemy, even the bosses. I want a challenge, y'know, like the game advertised with its true action combat! I want to bob and weave through complex boss mechanics, not trounce them effortlessly! Beating monsters in one punch is incredibly boring... I understand there can be exceptions where skipping is good (a dungeon focused around sneaking, wanting to skip objectively bad content to get to the good stuff later on, speedrunning teams, etc.) but I want to experience the journey and have a challenge, not just skip to the end and be left with nothing to do.
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Jun 13, 2019 19:03
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Mister No posted:The overabundance of trash and the expectation that you should learn the correct routes to skip as much as possible is the most recent reason why I bounced off of WoW, again. I wish I had a screenshot of The MOTHERLODE!!!'s first like 5 seconds where the screen is practically filled with nameplates of enemies. There's the expectation that you aren't going to be fighting all of them, but then why even put them there? I feel like the only one of FFXIV's dungeons that compares is Aurum Vale (especially the first room), and that was a 1.0 holdover anyway. The other 1.0 dungeons are similar, actually. There's an abundance of dead-ends and skippable encounters. Almost every other dungeon (especially post-2.x) sends you through every single enemy.
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Jun 13, 2019 19:05
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Minrad posted:There were some number changes in the E3 Titania build I think Yeah shorter cooldown on Gnashing Fang and stronger No Mercy is what a lot of people were asking for
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Jun 13, 2019 19:13
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RE: Sub chat, while squeenix still doesn't publish numbers the new lucky bancho data crawl is out and puts it at over a million active subscribers currently. https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/c08439/new_luckybancho_data_1m_active_characters/er2pei1/
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Jun 13, 2019 19:20
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Minrad posted:RE: Sub chat, while squeenix still doesn't publish numbers the new lucky bancho data crawl is out and puts it at over a million active subscribers currently. That jump between data crawls is insane.
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Jun 13, 2019 19:28
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gotta say with the almbums on spotify now, heavensward takes the cake for my favorite one. they nailed that whole expansion.
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Jun 13, 2019 19:30
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Wowfugees  Or at least stop making GBS threads up PF with requests for mogstation stuff.
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Jun 13, 2019 19:51
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Man I love coming to the FFXIV thread for WoW chat. The job system and story are the main reasons I’ve played this game as long as I have as they’re leagues better than any other MMO I’ve ever played.
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Jun 13, 2019 19:58
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Cat Army
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Leal posted:Wowfugees no buy me /2legit
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Jun 13, 2019 19:58
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Mister No posted:The overabundance of trash and the expectation that you should learn the correct routes to skip as much as possible is the most recent reason why I bounced off of WoW, again. I wish I had a screenshot of The MOTHERLODE!!!'s first like 5 seconds where the screen is practically filled with nameplates of enemies. There's the expectation that you aren't going to be fighting all of them, but then why even put them there? Yeah, its one of the things that most glaring when I started playing again. I cannot stand massive amounts of trash in dungeons and WoW has so much of it. 99/100 times it feels like FFXIVs dungeon queues are more controlled just because of how tanking is and the lack of trash every loving millimeter, in the off case people die its usually because of a gently caress up like standing on poo poo and not because you pulled 3 patrols. In wow those few moments of trash hell can lead to the party breaking up because people are just that much more impatient, whereas deaths in FFXIV are usually in boss encounters and a good healer can mitigate the issue.
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