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quick takes from the West Coast Riesling Society shindig in SF today: ojai felt like the most honest, true-to-california riesling. not the best riesling as compared to germany, alsace, etc, but they really nailed the "riesling grape in California" idea better than any of the other CA producers in the room teutonic 2018 "candied mushroom" is not what you normally think of riesling but it was the best wine in the room. loads and loads of ripe peach + pits, a little bit of grandma perfume hiding in the wings, great balance. really compelling wine. Tatomer 2013/2012 (forget the vineyard but clay soils) and 2016 steinhugel I think? were best classic riesling examples, 2016 was nuts on for delicious kabinett style and 2013 was in a gorgeous oily spot really neat event, and I hope it sticks around. pretty sure it'll end up going the way of Brumaire if it does continue, and fill up with a million people who want to wait in line over and over to get smashed, but thems the breaks
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Jun 2, 2019 05:20
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idiotsavant posted:quick takes from the West Coast Riesling Society shindig in SF today: This sounds like an awesome event. Teutonic's shop in Portland is super close to my work, I should walk over there some day and pick some stuff up. Probably my favorite thing I drank this weekend was Le Clos des Roches from Les Champs de l'Abbaye. It had a pretty noticeable tar/rubber/asphalt funky nose (which I guess might go away with aeration?) and was super earthy and delicious.
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Jun 3, 2019 23:53
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It was super fun even with the uneven quality; you don't get too many tastings for the odder grapes out other than like 7% Solution. BTW for podcasts: I just found https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/disgorgeous and it's loving amazing and tops my list of best 2019 wine podcasts
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Jun 10, 2019 02:29
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idiotsavant posted:It was super fun even with the uneven quality; you don't get too many tastings for the odder grapes out other than like 7% Solution. BTW for podcasts: I just found https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/disgorgeous and it's loving amazing and tops my list of best 2019 wine podcasts I listened to the first episode and was dying at work from the Sancerre slander. I had actually coincidentally tried the exact same vintage from Sébastien Riffault this weekend and really dug it! I really like the "drink some wine" style of podcast more than the interview or profile driven ones that I'm not nerdy enough about the process to understand so thanks for the rec. Side note: If anyone is ever in Portland (Oregon) I would definitely check out Enoteca Nostrana. It's a newish wine bar next to a long established Italian restaurant here and I think they use the prestige/pocketbook of the more well known older brother to stock a bunch of really interesting stuff, particularly French/Italian. They do 100ml pours and every night from 10-midnight wine is all half-price. The food is pretty good too, although anything beyond the bar snacks/olives/bread was more than I wanted to pay while I was spending all my money on wine. 
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Jun 11, 2019 03:53
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yeah it's way more of a "drink wine & bullshit" podcast vs some of the other more deep-divey ones, but it's some nerd-rear end humor and interesting wines - the first ep i've listened to was season 3 ep 61, and Trousseau is the Shadow of grapes re: sonic the hedgehog. it's fun to listen to a wine podcast and not have to give too much of a poo poo about all the nitty gritty wine details, but to still have enough that it's interesting to listen to
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Jun 11, 2019 05:22
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Listened to the show; but I'm not sure I need more shows in that format. Got skewered pretty hard from their characterization of the path of the sour-beer nerd -> orange-wine nerd, as well as them making GBS threads on Sancerre. I've also had Riffault's Les Quarterons that they praised in that episode, but that was a wine I had to dump. I could only describe it as heavily light-struck, but there's no hops in wine so I'm not sure that even applies here.
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Jun 11, 2019 08:11
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Was stocking up for a bachelor party and got 3 bottles of J. Rogét Brut. 1 per day. I've actually drank worse sparkling wine than that. Good time.
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Jun 17, 2019 17:42
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I've been trying some '04 Burgundies *for science* and the results have been pretty promising actually. The upside of the '04 vintage is that since it has been generally terrible across the board, one can get wines from more expensive vineyards for relatively cheap. This bottle cost $50. I had a Vougeraie Charmes-Chambertin Les Mazoyeres and it's started to reach the transition from primary fruit to savory components and has a really nice nose. The palate is has decent complexity and the finish is solid.
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Jun 17, 2019 19:29
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2004 is one of those vintages that got poor scores from Robert Parker & friends so everybody assumes it's bad when it actually produced excellent delicate and refreshing wines which are still holding on thanks to their acidity. 2011 Napa and 2014 Italy come to mind as being in the same camp, really outstanding vintages that lack "concentration" but are abundant in "deliciousness," the latter of which thankfully doesn't have much value to most people with money in the wine world.
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Jun 17, 2019 19:50
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I also had a nice '04 Burgundy this weekend, but not a real Burgundy. It was a Defaix Chablis Les Lys. Fresh but fat, yellow fruit, citrus, stone, chalk and some Burg mystery. Defaix uses lots of batonnage and other fattening techniques, so it ends up similar to a Côte d'Or, or at least a value alternative at ~$42, off the shelf with age - which is good because then I can return a bad one. Maybe his style is over the top in hot vintages. But I also had a Cote de Lechet 2005 and it wasn't too far behind, but lacking a bit in freshness and complexity.
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Jun 17, 2019 20:26
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Drinking Pittnauer Mash Pitt. Smells like a citra dry-hopped sour beer, and the cloudy appearance and taste is not far off either. This is phenolic and estery. I get spice, citrus, funk and tropical fruits. High acidity, salty and bitter. There are some cidery saisons that taste like this. There is for sure more than a little brett in this, and I don't think most wine nerds would like this, but it's interesting enough that I don't regret the purchase; even if this was not quite what I was expecting.
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Jun 18, 2019 21:04
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Anyone going to ASEV tomorrow? My first time going, I don't really know what to expect. Hoping it's not dreadfully dull
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Jun 19, 2019 01:04
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Any recommendations for shops to visit in New Jersey? I like the idea of snooping around for '04 bottles of higher valued vineyards and getting to enjoy on the cheap(ish).
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Jun 19, 2019 01:54
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gently caress yes, Joe Canal's in NJ. I'm not sure of the location but it's in a strip mall next to a big lots! and across from an office depot and the buyer is loving insane. She has baller single-grower champagne, Roija going back to like the 1800's or some poo poo, and a badass madeira section. Bunch of LDM portfolio stuff, it's sick. It's a total crap-rear end NJ liquor warehouse in a strip mall and then you walk in and you're like "oh that's 1950's Lopez de Heredia and a full wall display of Ulysses Collin oh and a whole pile of l'ancien uh what the gently caress is happening here"
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Jun 19, 2019 03:53
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E: nvm sorry
simplefish fucked around with this message at 04:42 on Jun 21, 2019 |
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Jun 21, 2019 04:39
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idiotsavant posted:gently caress yes, Joe Canal's in NJ. I'm not sure of the location but it's in a strip mall next to a big lots! and across from an office depot and the buyer is loving insane. She has baller single-grower champagne, Roija going back to like the 1800's or some poo poo, and a badass madeira section. Bunch of LDM portfolio stuff, it's sick. Uh. Was this south or north jersey? Turns out there's several Joe Canal's near big lots.
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Jun 25, 2019 20:10
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Relative wine noob here. I recently got introduced to Rioja tempranillo at a friend's party and really enjoyed it. As Riojas aren't that commonly sold where I live (Australian and Chilean wines are more commonly found in stores here), is there a varietal or blend that has a similar taste that I should be looking for? Thanks!
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Jun 26, 2019 01:04
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Rioja can vary in style really drastically. Do you recall anything else about the wine? The vintage? The words Crianza, Reserva, or Gran Resera on the label? The producer? The price? Most inexpensive Riojas don't really have a distinctive character, they tend to be moderate in just about every trait that defines wine, so that isn't super helpful in defining your tastes other than "very medium."
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Jun 26, 2019 08:57
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Maybe the simplest answer is to try some Australian Cabernet Sauvignon and see if it's close to what you liked or not. It should have some wood character that the Rioja had, maybe some of the dark, plum-like fruit as well. It won't be exactly the same, but perhaps you'll like it as well. I find nice Rioja has some very particular tastes, raisins and button mushrooms is the best I can describe it, which I don't really find anywhere else.
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Jun 26, 2019 10:31
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anakha posted:Relative wine noob here. I think you should still be able to pick up a bottle of Campo Viejo or something at the very least if you're in Australia
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Jun 26, 2019 10:53
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Kasumeat posted:Rioja can vary in style really drastically. Do you recall anything else about the wine? The vintage? The words Crianza, Reserva, or Gran Resera on the label? The producer? The price? My friend tells me it was a 2013 Ramon Bilbao Reserva. Hope that helps.
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Jun 26, 2019 14:17
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anakha posted:My friend tells me it was a 2013 Ramon Bilbao Reserva. Hope that helps. I'm not familiar with that producer, but Reservas tend to show a moderate amount of the "typical" Rioja character that's often absent from non-Reserva wines, which is from a long period of aging in oak barrels with significantly less fruit that you might find in a New World wine with lots of oak aging. It's a fairly distinctive style, but you'll find the most similarity in other Old World wines which have seen significant oak aging and are at least five years old, all of which are likely going to be more expensive than any Rioja you find. If you're in a relatively small wine market, it's very unlikely you'll able to find any of the very few New World wines which can have a similar profile, except maybe Silver Oak Cabernet from Alexander Valley, California, which is expensive. Don't get fixated on Tempranillo, because it's actually a very neutral grape—you'll find it in styles that taste absolutely nothing like your Rioja. It's the winemaking that's going to be much more important than the grape, which unfortunately is a little harder to predict than what grapes are in a bottle, but styles that will be relatively likely to be similar are: - Ribera del Duero and Toro (other Spanish appellations typically based on Tempranillo, though they tend to be darker and more powerful) - Bordeaux, particularly right bank - Sangiovese-based wines from Italy, including Brunello and Chianti Classico and countless others - Grenache-based wines from France, particularly more expensive and aged examples - Aglianico-based wines from Italy, including Taurasi
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Jun 26, 2019 19:17
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Thanks a lot for the clarification and suggestions.
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Jun 26, 2019 23:45
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Kasumeat posted:- Grenache-based wines from France, particularly more expensive and aged examples
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Jun 27, 2019 06:39
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got off on a technicality posted:Mourvedre would be closer no? Consider Domaine Tempier, Chateau Simone $150+ wine is not typically a good recommendation for an alternative to a $20 bottle, but if money is no object, sure.
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Jun 27, 2019 10:50
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Kasumeat posted:$150+ wine is not typically a good recommendation for an alternative to a $20 bottle, but if money is no object, sure. I see Domaine Tempier Bandol on sale all over winesearcher for low $40s and available in Australia for low 50s AUD 
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Jun 28, 2019 01:04
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got off on a technicality posted:I see Domaine Tempier Bandol on sale all over winesearcher for low $40s and available in Australia for low 50s AUD ??? There is only one listing of it with some age which is $45 for a half bottle, and that's for their rather ordinary entry level bottling. Anyways this is likely as moot point as if you're in a place where the only New World options are Chile and Australia the odds of finding Tempier are pretty low, unless you happen to be in France.
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Jun 28, 2019 05:09
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If you can find them, R. Lopez de Heredia make my favorite Riojas, Cubillo and Tondonia are terrific.
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Jun 29, 2019 22:33
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CVNE's "Cune" and "Imperial" brands seem to get good distribution; Both the Reservas and Gran Reservas are pretty good value over here. Muga Reserva is a pretty safe bet too. Still, for me those are more of a special occasion kind of wines; most often I grab a bottle of Coto de Imaz Reserva, which is a good deal cheaper, and while I get this is not high praise, seems like some kind of lab experiment in producing a wine around the preconceptions a Norwegian consumer might have of Spanish wine. It's full bodied, just a tiny bit sweet and overloaded with new american oak. It even has a screw top over here. It's cozy, which is a priority for me when it comes to red wine.
thotsky fucked around with this message at 13:47 on Jun 30, 2019 |
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Jun 30, 2019 13:19
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Sextro posted:Uh. Was this south or north jersey? Turns out there's several Joe Canal's near big lots. Don't remember, maybe just call them up & ask? also kinda disagree that Tempranillo is "neutral". Maybe if you let it ripen to a ridiculous degree and put it in new oak for a long time, but idk man, there's a lot of tangy hoisin funk to it idiotsavant fucked around with this message at 06:43 on Jul 1, 2019 |
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Jul 1, 2019 06:38
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idiotsavant posted:also kinda disagree that Tempranillo is "neutral". Maybe if you let it ripen to a ridiculous degree and put it in new oak for a long time, but idk man, there's a lot of tangy hoisin funk to it It sounds to me like you're talking about the typical tertiary character that develops in pretty much every red wine with significant aging, particularly in barrel? I've certainly never encountered anything like that in any young or New World tempranillos. I can't think of a single less distinctive red grape. The fruit is usually pretty close to dead centre on the red-black spectrum. Its tannins are moderate. Its acidity is moderate. Its alcohol is moderate. To quote verbatim a Master Sommelier who I asked how to identify the grape in a blind tasting when it hasn't seen significantly oak aging: "you don't."
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Jul 1, 2019 15:39
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PatMarshall posted:If you can find them, R. Lopez de Heredia make my favorite Riojas, Cubillo and Tondonia are terrific. And we mustn't forget their whites either, Gravonia and Tondonia Blanco are superb wines. Not a guaranteed crowd-pleaser, but two of my all-time favourites (well, three if you count Tondonia Reserva and Tondonia Gran Reserva separately).
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Jul 1, 2019 22:24
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Kasumeat posted:It sounds to me like you're talking about the typical tertiary character that develops in pretty much every red wine with significant aging, particularly in barrel? I've certainly never encountered anything like that in any young or New World tempranillos. I can't think of a single less distinctive red grape. The fruit is usually pretty close to dead centre on the red-black spectrum. Its tannins are moderate. Its acidity is moderate. Its alcohol is moderate. To quote verbatim a Master Sommelier who I asked how to identify the grape in a blind tasting when it hasn't seen significantly oak aging: "you don't." Mayyyyyyyyybe a secondary characteristic (ie due to winemaking) maybe? I’ve heard some people describe it as hoisin sauce, I think of it as tangy ranch dressing but if it was wine. Which is why I say maybe secondary cause Temp can be a pH rocket and maybe a little elevated VA emphasizes the tanginess. Idk, I’m pretty middle-of-the-road when it comes to tasting ability but it never seems that neutral of a grape to me.
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Jul 1, 2019 23:24
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Y’all gimme your takes on chilled reds. Just found out by accident that actually, my 2018 red blend is definitely going into clear glass and getting released in the spring ‘cause it’s straight murder when it’s somewhere between “cold” and “kinda cold”. Serving it chilled feels a little like cheating ‘cause it quiets the wine down some while letting the fruit just blast; otoh it’s so loving juicy & good & slammable
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Jul 2, 2019 21:38
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Pretty much all reds I drink go in/out of the fridge to keep it somewhere around 14-15C (never actually measured my ideal temp). Sometimes I think letting it heat up to room temp in the glass opens up flavors, but it has probably more to do with oxygen. Juicy styles can be white wine temp. Cool wines are cool.
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Jul 2, 2019 22:29
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Nah, temp has a bigger effect than oxygen cause different things will become volatile at different temps. Warmer temp = easier for stuff to volatize = more smells. Some can be good, some can be bad or not great
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Jul 2, 2019 22:58
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idiotsavant posted:Nah, temp has a bigger effect than oxygen cause different things will become volatile at different temps. Warmer temp = easier for stuff to volatize = more smells. Some can be good, some can be bad or not great Ok. The wine heats up quickly with a small pour in a big glass anyway, so it's not like I'm missing out.
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Jul 2, 2019 23:05
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gently caress yes chill some red wine. I've been all about some chilled California valdiguie recently.
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Jul 3, 2019 03:38
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I prefer red wine at 16-18. I would not complain if it was 20, but when wines get to like 23 degrees or whatever is room temp during summer they can be kind of gross. Sort of mealy/chalky.
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Jul 3, 2019 12:30
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Pretty much everyone drinks reds too warm and whites too cold. And for the right red wine, chilling them down a bit beyond average for reds is exceptional and anyone who disagrees can go kick rocks.
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Jul 3, 2019 15:37
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