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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Is it true that even the Paradox devs don’t understand how the Vicky 2 economic system works? it was true until groogy and wiz decided to tear into the code for the final improvement patch. that led to an understanding of things such as sphering, which magically makes goods appear out of thin air. this is why sphering large parts of china blows up the economy - each sphered tag produces 50% more stuff, in total, than an unsphered tag.
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Jul 1, 2019 20:07
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I seem to recall stories about trying to figure out the V2 economy code being a hazing ritual at Paradox.
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Jul 1, 2019 20:30
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I'm also going to hold the unpopular opinion that I want Victoria 3 to actually be a game. Vicky 2 may be hilarious in how it captures the impenetrability of the era but it's not like it'll stop existing. I want to actually screw around in the most fascinating century of history without feeling completely unsatisfied with it all, and having zero effective control does that.
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Jul 1, 2019 22:36
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Vicky 3 should have no hype, no dev diaries, no trailers theirs just an announcement and it appears in your library like a cursed tome. When asked how it works the devs give what's a best contradictory information or outright lies at worst.
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Jul 1, 2019 22:44
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Serious post tho I still say they should remove armies as things you click around and instead set up an in-depth pre-planning mechanic to represent how hard it was to really mobilize a countries full military and how shifts in diplomatic policy can blow up decades of preparation
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Jul 1, 2019 22:45
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Agean90 posted:Serious post tho I still say they should remove armies as things you click around and instead set up an in-depth pre-planning mechanic to represent how hard it was to really mobilize a countries full military and how shifts in diplomatic policy can blow up decades of preparation Strongly disagree.
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Jul 1, 2019 22:50
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Vicky 2 owns because the Paradox devs realized that only Marx's theory of capitalist imperialism were the framework that could produce a workable colonial mechanic https://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/269733/How_Paradox_plunders_history_for_great_gameplay_mechanics.php
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Jul 1, 2019 23:03
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:Vicky 2 owns because the Paradox devs realized that only Marx's theory of capitalist imperialism were the framework that could produce a workable colonial mechanic https://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/269733/How_Paradox_plunders_history_for_great_gameplay_mechanics.php Shame the guy is a full-on Thatcher 'the free market is king' neo-liberal capitalist, but even he has to admit Marx' historiography has some salient points.
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Jul 1, 2019 23:26
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Redeye Flight posted:I'm also going to hold the unpopular opinion that I want Victoria 3 to actually be a game. Vicky 2 may be hilarious in how it captures the impenetrability of the era but it's not like it'll stop existing. I want to actually screw around in the most fascinating century of history without feeling completely unsatisfied with it all, and having zero effective control does that. If you felt unsatisfied that seemed to be a you problem. Vicky 2 was the most satisfying of the paradox games marred by its insane jankiness. I hope they don’t make like CK2 or something like that.
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Jul 1, 2019 23:30
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CharlestheHammer posted:If you felt unsatisfied that seemed to be a you problem.
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Jul 1, 2019 23:38
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Jazerus posted:it was true until groogy and wiz decided to tear into the code for the final improvement patch. that led to an understanding of things such as sphering, which magically makes goods appear out of thin air. this is why sphering large parts of china blows up the economy - each sphered tag produces 50% more stuff, in total, than an unsphered tag. sphering by the UK decimated my burgeoning industrial econony as Afghanistan, so we fell into anarchy and a war with Iran
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Jul 2, 2019 00:01
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Redeye Flight posted:I'm also going to hold the unpopular opinion that I want Victoria 3 to actually be a game. Vicky 2 may be hilarious in how it captures the impenetrability of the era but it's not like it'll stop existing. I want to actually screw around in the most fascinating century of history without feeling completely unsatisfied with it all, and having zero effective control does that. Unpopular here, but thankfully what the devs will actually do.
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Jul 2, 2019 00:08
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Yeah sadly it’s probably what they are gonna do and people will be shocked when it’s a bad game.
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Jul 2, 2019 00:23
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I disagree that you don’t have control. I’ve never really felt that things were out of my hands and I was just watching but I tend to play midsized countries like Persia or Mexico and not like Madagascar or something. Although I did have one game where I almost hit great power as Haiti which was pretty hands off but I was studying for exams so that’s what I wanted.
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Jul 2, 2019 00:28
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Game becomes really hands on when you just abuse the market and horde key goods and play market speculator. Advanced V2 strats: buy up a 2k stockpile of (insert valuable RGO here) and then occupy the largest sources of it (bonus if they're your direct competitors). Warning: may (will probably) completely break the economy depending on the scale, scope, timing, and frequency of application. @Groogy can you explain how capitalist investment in foreign markets works? I know it's possible and happens, but it seems really obtuse to tell and somewhat rare overall? ThatBasqueGuy fucked around with this message at 02:53 on Jul 2, 2019 |
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Jul 2, 2019 02:45
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TheHoosier posted:sphering by the UK decimated my burgeoning industrial econony as Afghanistan, so we fell into anarchy and a war with Iran the sphered country doesn't see any of the benefits from the extra magic production, only the sphere master. well, most of the time - getting sphered by a medium power rather than the UK or france is usually a more equitable relationship and you might recapture some of the bonus production via pop purchases on the internal market.
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Jul 2, 2019 03:13
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What is the current mod of choice to run Vicky2? I remember when it was PDM but I have no idea what's happened in the intervening years.
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Jul 2, 2019 04:16
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JosefStalinator posted:What is the current mod of choice to run Vicky2? I remember when it was PDM but I have no idea what's happened in the intervening years. Historical Project Mod
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Jul 2, 2019 04:21
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JosefStalinator posted:What is the current mod of choice to run Vicky2? I remember when it was PDM but I have no idea what's happened in the intervening years. If you just want more countries but don't want to make the economy even more complicated like PDM, New Nation Mod adds a whole bunch of events and countries everywhere and is a good compromise between an overhaul and working well
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Jul 2, 2019 06:25
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CharlestheHammer posted:Yeah sadly it’s probably what they are gonna do and people will be shocked when it’s a bad game. There is zero chance the fans of Vicky 2 will like Vicky 3 regardless of quality imo. I wouldn't blame PDX for not making V3 because no matter what they are going to get absolutely tanked by reviews even worse than Imperator.
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Jul 2, 2019 08:35
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Eh gently caress it
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Jul 2, 2019 08:47
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Is it true that even the Paradox devs don’t understand how the Vicky 2 economic system works? Only three people have ever understood the Vicky 2 economic system. The Prince Consort, who is dead—a German professor, who has gone mad—and I, who have forgotten all about it.
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Jul 2, 2019 09:09
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Fellblade posted:There is zero chance the fans of Vicky 2 will like Vicky 3 regardless of quality imo. There’s also the fact that these days any decision to make a game at paradox requires at least 5 years post-release development of DLC’s. So yeah they could make Vicky 3 but if they can’t come up with an outline for 5 year plan it’s unlikely to get funded. Edit: imperator seems to be in a vulnerable spot and I totally expect it to be dropped if the first two dlc’s fail to meet expectations.
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Jul 2, 2019 09:49
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Fellblade posted:There is zero chance the fans of Vicky 2 will like Vicky 3 regardless of quality imo. if they made a good, finished game and called it victoria 3 it would review just fine. but maybe that's not on the table
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Jul 2, 2019 10:31
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Angry Salami posted:Only three people have ever understood the Vicky 2 economic system. The Prince Consort, who is dead—a German professor, who has gone mad—and I, who have forgotten all about it. 
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Jul 2, 2019 10:55
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Fellblade posted:There is zero chance the fans of Vicky 2 will like Vicky 3 regardless of quality imo. AAAAA! Real Muenster fucked around with this message at 14:13 on Jul 2, 2019 |
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Jul 2, 2019 14:09
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HOI4 had a similar problem honestly, in that HOI3 had its absolute diehard fans (for some incomprehensible reason) that trashed HOI4 for being Not The Game They Wanted. HOI4 sold well anyway (and is also good).
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Jul 2, 2019 14:18
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Eh, I doubt V3 would hit the perfection of V2, but who cares you can always just play V2. As long as V3 has lots of QoL features and runs better than V2 i'd purchase it no matter what. I'd love a V2 remastered, but there's no way that's on the table.
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Jul 2, 2019 14:43
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Drone posted:HOI4 had a similar problem honestly, in that HOI3 had its absolute diehard fans (for some incomprehensible reason) that trashed HOI4 for being Not The Game They Wanted. Difference being most people that liked HoI3 did so in spite of its flaws, and most people that like V2 like it because of them. So that's much harder.
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Jul 2, 2019 15:21
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Zeron posted:the perfection of V2 Did you just ignore all of the bugs I just brought up in the economy? I have more if you want. I can make all the money disappear in the world. And if you tell me that's just the game being realistic/historical....
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Jul 2, 2019 15:26
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Groogy posted:Did you just ignore all of the bugs I just brought up in the economy? I have more if you want. I can make all the money disappear in the world. It's literally a perfect game. And its bugs don't detract from that. Sorry.
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Jul 2, 2019 15:41
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Yeah it's got plenty of flaws no denying, but it all comes together into a fantastic whole. It's more than the sum of it's parts. Also i'm very biased.
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Jul 2, 2019 15:48
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This thread has two personalities... nicest boardgamer you'll ever meet, and twisted loving simulationist.
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Jul 2, 2019 15:50
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Groogy posted:Did you just ignore all of the bugs I just brought up in the economy? I have more if you want. I can make all the money disappear in the world. It's cool as hell groog
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Jul 2, 2019 15:59
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Average Bear posted:This thread has two personalities... nicest boardgamer you'll ever meet, and twisted loving simulationist. What's the difference? Also V2 is very fun despite its bugs. And a hypothetical V3 would do fine if it was a well polished game. I:R is being 'review bombed' because it's a garbage fire.
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Jul 2, 2019 16:04
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What everybody loved about Victoria is the jank and the weirdness and the idea that the game is so Byzantine even its developers don't understand it (see the Dominions series, which gets the same effect in each release by just tweaking their ancient spaghetti codebase) but I can't help but feel that 'gently caress it up, but on purpose' is bad advice to give to Paradox
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Jul 2, 2019 16:17
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Groogy posted:Did you just ignore all of the bugs I just brought up in the economy? I have more if you want. I can make all the money disappear in the world. You don't understand groogs, love is about accepting flaws and finding your lover perfect for them, not in spite of them
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Jul 2, 2019 16:17
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Groogy posted:Did you just ignore all of the bugs I just brought up in the economy? I have more if you want. I can make all the money disappear in the world.
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Jul 2, 2019 16:40
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Groogy posted:Did you just ignore all of the bugs I just brought up in the economy? I have more if you want. I can make all the money disappear in the world. More or less. The Great Depression is inside the V2 timeline, after all.
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Jul 2, 2019 16:51
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"The world economy collapses and every large nation turns into a blood-drenched hellscape" is relatively accurate for the early 20th century so yeah can't complain that much.
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Jul 2, 2019 17:21
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