FINAL FANTASY XIV: Shadowbringers - Remember that we once posted

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > The MMO HMO > FINAL FANTASY XIV: Shadowbringers - Remember that we once posted

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Mister No: Jul 15, 2006; Yes.

I said come in! posted:

I think there's a timer, if you don't beat the adds and then the boss you instantly die once she finishes her cast.

Yeah it's definitely a timed/cast bar thing, I was just wondering which way you were dying. I just did that quest like 2 or 3 days ago as a healer and don't remember having trouble on that part outside of me trying to eek out some extra damage by standing in AoEs (which killed me). Make sure your weapon is up to date, I guess. I wish I could help more.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 20:31

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# ? Jun 10, 2024 21:14

Orcs and Ostriches: Aug 26, 2010; The Great Twist

Vermain posted:

Actually, just out of curiosity, are there FFLogs of runs with disparities like this? I've been browsing through Ex Primal runs, and while AST looks like it's doing pretty miserable, I've seen runs with SCH's pulling around 5-5.3k. Dummy DPS for WHM is around 6.4k with a Ronkan weapon if you use Assize perfectly on rotation, so a 3k disparity seems strangely high, unless AfMisery/Assize is inflating the numbers on add phases.

I haven't seen any fflogs, but watching streams I've seen parses like that. I've seen WHMs in the 7s, on Titania. Misery padding isn't going to do much on there.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 20:32

Cabbit: Jul 19, 2001; _{Is that everything you have?}

Givin posted:

Not a fan of red mage AE now. poo poo builds too slow.

You must be doing something wrong, there's no way in hell it's slower than brainlessly mashing Scatter was and they straight up reduced the cost of Moulinet by ten mana. You're not hard casting Impact, are you? AOE spell order is the reverse of single target: Veraero II and Verthunder II are the fast spells and Impact the slow one you dualcast.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 20:36

How Wonderful!: Jul 18, 2006; I only have excellent ideas

I recently took a research detour with my dissertation to read the Scottish minister Robert Kirk's late-17th century book The Secret Commonwealth, which was one of the main sources for 19th and 20th century representations of faeries and sith and all the Good People etc.

Playing through Il Mheg immediately after finishing it was pretty striking, and I totally recommend reading it if you liked that zone's vibe of whimsical menace. It's pretty short and its public domain so you can read it for free online if you'd like, or you can buy a more recent edition put out by the NYRB in 2006.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 20:37

Vermain: Sep 5, 2006

Orcs and Ostriches posted:

I haven't seen any fflogs, but watching streams I've seen parses like that. I've seen WHMs in the 7s, on Titania. Misery padding isn't going to do much on there.

I can see hitting 7k with raid buffs, but SCH should be able to remain within spitting distance of that. I wouldn't be surprised if AST got a buff, since I've yet to see any logs where they're hitting even 4k. It feels like they need to hardcast a lot more than the other healers to deal with AoE, since they have no other way to trigger Horoscope Helios (unlike WHM and Confession or SCH and Recitation + Indom), Earthly Star is still on a 60s CD, and Celestial Opposition is anemic for a 120s CD action.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 20:39

Oxyclean: Sep 23, 2007

Meiteron posted:

An entire list of all the leitmotifs is beyond my effort in a break at work but I can get a little bit into how leitmotifs are organized in all the various pieces in the game. There are a few important ones which are constantly reused:

FFXIV: Realm Reborn has it's own unique motif which is most clearly portrayed in Torn From the Heavens. Here's a link to the song and you can hear it starting very early, at 0:35:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJSM4tAeEAA

There's obviously the crystal prelude and even the battle theme intro stuck in there too, which will show up everywhere.

The Realm Reborn motif shows up everywhere in 2.0 music; dungeons, boss fights, area zones. They also tend to call back to this when you're reaching some major climax in the story, even beyond 2.0. You can hear it by warping to Little Ala Mhigo and walking outside, if I'm remembering my zone music correctly; it shows up as part of the musical climax of Praetorium's theme, it shows up in Baelsar's Wall as the last dungeon of HW, and it shows up in the last fight against the Savage version of Omega (whose track is called simply From The Heavens and is an even more epic version of the linked song above).

Meanwhile if you're looking for leitmotifs in the later expansions it's pretty easy to track them. You want to listen to the trailer song (Heavensward, Stormblood, Shadowbringers) and you want to listen to the vocal credits song (Dragonsong, Revolutions, Tomorrow and Tomorrow respectively), because the primary leitmotifs of the expansion are usually most fully expressed there and spread between other songs in the expansion. SB also includes a third song - The Measure of His Reach, which as the Ala Mhigan anthem also shows up in many SB songs.

Stormblood's theme was maybe overused in it's expansion, but Revolutions sneaks into some surprising places - Nightbloom, the first phase for Tsukuyomi, does a dramatic rendition of it, appropriate for what's essentially the final plot thread of SB that gets tied off before they start work on building to Shadowbringers.

Additionally there are mini-motifs for every zone. Each expansion has had a very solid link between an area and the dungeons contained within the area. As an example, you might have a strong theme for an area like Azim Steppe, then a chiller piano version of the same theme for the Steppe's night time track, and then a more dramatic version for Bardam's Mettle, which is the dungeon located in the same area. You can see the same thing in effect for Yanxia, and while Yanxia has two dungeons they both interpret Yanxia's theme, in dramatically different ways; however, it's still the same leitmotif for both.

There are other notable songs that have strong thematic connections but maybe don't get spread too much into different tracks:

Thunderer was used for Behemoth and Twintania in 2.0 along with the fight against Lahabrea, but now it shows up mostly when you're dealing with Ascians in the story and it's pretty safe to consider it an Ascian theme. Meteor is a slower, menacing theme that was originally the theme of Nael van Darnus, and is referenced in the more active song, Tempest, when you fight Nael in second coil. Since then it's been expanded to more of the Garleans as a "this is a bad Garlean leader doing menacing things" theme. Garleans get a bunch of themes, actually - The Emperor's Wont, Steel Reason, Imperial Will, and Meteor, although there's not really a motif that connects any of them.

Alexander ended up with a pretty strong set of leitmotifs as well - all you need to do for this one is listen to Locus and Metal, which are either referenced or sampled directly for most of the other tracks.

The Four Lords primal fights in SB all had a motif between the three as well. Listen to Amatsu Kaze, Byakko's theme, when the first active vocal section kicks in at about 1:00, and note the melody. Now listen to Sunrise, Suzaku's theme, and at about 0:28 when the english lyrics kick in you can hear a rock guitar in the background playing the same motif! It also shows up in From the Dragon's Wake, Seiryu's theme, although it's a lot more subtle there - you have to listen to the shamisen (the kind of twangy japanese string instrument) and you can pick it up at certain places.

TL;DR: motifs can usually be organized first by expansion, and then by zone, with notable recurring pieces for specific adversaries and events. Start from expansion trailer themes and work outwards.

Awesome, thanks.

I definitely noticed the expansion crossing themes - a few months ago I re-watched the Heavensward trailer and it really struck me how each and every segment was familiar.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 20:41

kitten emergency: Jan 13, 2008; get meow this wack-ass crystal prison

the sequence of events from the back half of the last zone through the credits are some of the hypest loving poo poo i've ever experienced in an mmo or even in a final fantasy game. a+++ 10/10

# ? Jul 5, 2019 21:01

PunkBoy: Aug 22, 2008; You wanna get through this?

Badger of Basra posted:

End of MSQ spoilers:

I had been wanting some FFX stuff in this game for a while and now they put the whole finale in Zanarkand

Between a city from a memory, Ronso, and enemies called Sin Eaters, they gotta be leading towards more FFX stuff, right? I think someone even calls tech stuff machina instead of magitek at one point.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 21:06

Astroniomix: Apr 24, 2015

A group of Alagan bits gets refereed to as "machina" at one point, yes.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 21:25

Schubalts: Nov 26, 2007; People say bigger is better.

But for the first time in my life, I think I've gone too far.

Algid posted:

The only problem it has is that guns are equipped on the back so you end up having a pistol floating there. Aside from that it's definitely the best gun.

There's a setting to hide weapons when you don't have them drawn/unsheathed. I used it for my maid glam for NIN, so it looked like the daggers were being pulled from secret pockets in the skirt.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 21:33

LaserShark: Oct 17, 2007; It's over, idiot. You're gonna die here and now, and the last words out of your mouth will have been 'poop train.'

So I got back into this last week and made a new character on Zarela. Still working through the main quest, and when double XP had me 15 levels ahead of the MSQ, I decided to take a break from NIN and level up ARC. Now I've got a Scholar at 40, and while I'm really liking it (I usually don't do healers), I'm sure there's room for improvement. Anything I should keep in mind?

# ? Jul 5, 2019 21:35

FactsAreUseless: Feb 16, 2011

I said come in! posted:

I can't beat the quest Will of the Moon, I feel like a stupid idiot. I get to phase 4 of the fight, defeat the two adds that spawn and then instantly die. I am playing as a dragoon, I don't know what to do at all.

Dodge AOEs, kill adds ASAP, hope like crazy. It's honestly a brutal duty, and doing it as a healer seems impossible. I can't imagine. Be glad you're DPS.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 21:44

Draxion: Jun 9, 2013

Save your cooldowns, except for Life of the Dragon (you want that to be ready with the Geirskogul to trigger it up). You can Dragon Sight yourself alone now, use Litany, make sure your damage buff is up. I repeat do not use them on earlier phases, you don't need them then and you definitely do here. Eat food beforehand, it can help. If you can't do it with that, go get 400 gear for poetics at Rhalgr's Reach. It might sync down? But should help anyways.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 21:50

Mister No: Jul 15, 2006; Yes.

Maybe you'll be the reverse of me, and have problem on this duty, but on the next big one you'll pass it no problem. gently caress that one, with three wipes at another OHKO move, it felt like it took ten hours what with the 5 minute lead-in before it even starts.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 21:51

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

I'm looking to level Bard next but I was wondering if anyone has numbers on Soul Voice/Apex Arrow? What does it max out at?

# ? Jul 5, 2019 21:53

Pigbottom: Sep 23, 2007; Time is never wasted when you're wasted all the time.

Harrow posted:

Could someone tell me about 5.0 White Mage? I'm trying to decide whether to level that or Scholar after Gunbreaker.

This might help: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_Oi5_e3Qbw

# ? Jul 5, 2019 22:03

Bussamove: Feb 25, 2006

Man, tanks in lovely gear pulling wall to wall is really interesting with the new healing stuff. But it gave me lots of chances to really find the nuances of AST healing. :v:

The predictable party wide damage in stuff like the 77 dungeon really lets me go buck wild with my oGCD AoE heals though. Horoscope into a pre-cast aspected Helios into Aspected Horoscope to negate all the damage, CelOpp to just regen through this one, Earthly Star for this one. Oh its a burn phase time for Divination and Sleeve Draw to stack damage. People might bitch about losing (entirely non-existent because there was exactly One True Card Combo) complexity but man do I enjoy new AST.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 22:07

Oscar Wilde Bunch: Jun 12, 2012; Grimey Drawer

Oxyclean posted:

Awesome, thanks.

I definitely noticed the expansion crossing themes - a few months ago I re-watched the Heavensward trailer and it really struck me how each and every segment was familiar.

I think Alex had one of the best progressions. From Locus and Metal to Locus + Metal = Brute Justice, then to the Orchestral Version in Moebius.

The Allagan Empire, Unbreakable, becomes He Who Continues the Attack for the ARF solo duty. Then the Hard version.

There's also a lot of good ones in the beast tribe progressions. The slower major key versions that you get with the allied tribes to the sort of minor faster versions for the home areas of the enemy tribes. My favorite of those is Ixali. From the more aggressive Flightless Wings, To the Ehcatl 9's Far from Home, then the more grand sounding version Grounded for their homeland.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 22:38

World War Mammories: Aug 25, 2006

soken is very good at his job

# ? Jul 5, 2019 22:41

Oscar Wilde Bunch: Jun 12, 2012; Grimey Drawer

World War Mammories posted:

soken is very good at his job

Dude's basically pumping out 6 feature length film scores every 2 years.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 22:45

YoshiOfYellow: Aug 21, 2015; Voted #1 Babysitter in Mushroom Kingdom

What impresses me beyond just all his work being solid is his huge range of styles he can compose. We've got Titan butt-rock, Lakshmi Bollywood, and Amh Araeng lo-fi hip hop beats to study to and like a million things besides and they are all fantastic.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 22:48

EponymousMrYar: Jan 4, 2015; The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

World War Mammories posted:

soken is very good at his job

Don't forget the people who take what he makes and use it to the max (and vice versa.) The people who put together the Cutscenes, the dungeon designers etc.

The final MSQ dungeon is a crazy amount of Team Effort executed really well.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 22:48

Draxion: Jun 9, 2013

YoshiOfYellow posted:

What impresses me beyond just all his work being solid is his huge range of styles he can compose. We've got Titan butt-rock, Lakshmi Bollywood, and Amh Araeng lo-fi hip hop beats to study to and like a million things besides and they are all fantastic.

Moggle Mog's got basically a Danny Elfman song, it's wild.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 22:53

World War Mammories: Aug 25, 2006

EponymousMrYar posted:

The final MSQ dungeon is a crazy amount of Team Effort executed really well.

the unorthodox location names in there really struck me. what a ride

Draxion posted:

Moggle Mog's got basically a Danny Elfman song, it's wild.

well, moggle mog bears quite a resemblance to this is halloween :v:

# ? Jul 5, 2019 23:05

pumpinglemma: Apr 28, 2009; DD: Fondly regard abomination.

Going to be honest, even just at the end of ARR, one of the reasons I most want to catch up with the MSQ is so I can binge the soundtrack on Spotify without spoilers.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 23:09

Nessus: Dec 22, 2003; After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!

The problem with all these other composers is that they ain't eating enough chicken.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 23:15

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

Nessus posted:

The problem with all these other composers is that they ain't eating enough chicken.

Well everyone knows chicken tenders are ready to fry.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 23:20

Vermain: Sep 5, 2006

Nessus posted:

The problem with all these other composers is that they ain't eating enough chicken.

True creative genius begins with genuine adoration for the kneesock aesthetic.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 23:26

Leal: Oct 2, 2009

The Knights Most Heavenly building has a loving second floor?! :supaburn:

# ? Jul 5, 2019 23:27

Vermain: Sep 5, 2006

Leal posted:

The Knights Most Heavenly building has a loving second floor?!

I've been running LotA for the better part of six years, and I learned there's an actual stairwell down to the lava section maybe 3 months ago. I legit thought you could only get down there by jumping off the ledge.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 23:29

Rhonne: Feb 13, 2012

I finished the MSQ finally. I loved it. Best expansion to date.

"Tis good to see you awake, G'raha Tia" :unsmith:

# ? Jul 5, 2019 23:41

Blueberry Pancakes: Aug 18, 2012; Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!

I wonder if he's going to let his tail out. It has to be cramped, wherever he's keeping it.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 23:41

Ibblebibble: Nov 12, 2013

Meiteron posted:

An entire list of all the leitmotifs is beyond my effort in a break at work but I can get a little bit into how leitmotifs are organized in all the various pieces in the game. There are a few important ones which are constantly reused:

FFXIV: Realm Reborn has it's own unique motif which is most clearly portrayed in Torn From the Heavens. Here's a link to the song and you can hear it starting very early, at 0:35:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJSM4tAeEAA

There's obviously the crystal prelude and even the battle theme intro stuck in there too, which will show up everywhere.

The Realm Reborn motif shows up everywhere in 2.0 music; dungeons, boss fights, area zones. They also tend to call back to this when you're reaching some major climax in the story, even beyond 2.0. You can hear it by warping to Little Ala Mhigo and walking outside, if I'm remembering my zone music correctly; it shows up as part of the musical climax of Praetorium's theme, it shows up in Baelsar's Wall as the last dungeon of HW, and it shows up in the last fight against the Savage version of Omega (whose track is called simply From The Heavens and is an even more epic version of the linked song above).

Meanwhile if you're looking for leitmotifs in the later expansions it's pretty easy to track them. You want to listen to the trailer song (Heavensward, Stormblood, Shadowbringers) and you want to listen to the vocal credits song (Dragonsong, Revolutions, Tomorrow and Tomorrow respectively), because the primary leitmotifs of the expansion are usually most fully expressed there and spread between other songs in the expansion. SB also includes a third song - The Measure of His Reach, which as the Ala Mhigan anthem also shows up in many SB songs.

Stormblood's theme was maybe overused in it's expansion, but Revolutions sneaks into some surprising places - Nightbloom, the first phase for Tsukuyomi, does a dramatic rendition of it, appropriate for what's essentially the final plot thread of SB that gets tied off before they start work on building to Shadowbringers.

Additionally there are mini-motifs for every zone. Each expansion has had a very solid link between an area and the dungeons contained within the area. As an example, you might have a strong theme for an area like Azim Steppe, then a chiller piano version of the same theme for the Steppe's night time track, and then a more dramatic version for Bardam's Mettle, which is the dungeon located in the same area. You can see the same thing in effect for Yanxia, and while Yanxia has two dungeons they both interpret Yanxia's theme, in dramatically different ways; however, it's still the same leitmotif for both.

There are other notable songs that have strong thematic connections but maybe don't get spread too much into different tracks:

Thunderer was used for Behemoth and Twintania in 2.0 along with the fight against Lahabrea, but now it shows up mostly when you're dealing with Ascians in the story and it's pretty safe to consider it an Ascian theme. Meteor is a slower, menacing theme that was originally the theme of Nael van Darnus, and is referenced in the more active song, Tempest, when you fight Nael in second coil. Since then it's been expanded to more of the Garleans as a "this is a bad Garlean leader doing menacing things" theme. Garleans get a bunch of themes, actually - The Emperor's Wont, Steel Reason, Imperial Will, and Meteor, although there's not really a motif that connects any of them.

Alexander ended up with a pretty strong set of leitmotifs as well - all you need to do for this one is listen to Locus and Metal, which are either referenced or sampled directly for most of the other tracks.

The Four Lords primal fights in SB all had a motif between the three as well. Listen to Amatsu Kaze, Byakko's theme, when the first active vocal section kicks in at about 1:00, and note the melody. Now listen to Sunrise, Suzaku's theme, and at about 0:28 when the english lyrics kick in you can hear a rock guitar in the background playing the same motif! It also shows up in From the Dragon's Wake, Seiryu's theme, although it's a lot more subtle there - you have to listen to the shamisen (the kind of twangy japanese string instrument) and you can pick it up at certain places.

TL;DR: motifs can usually be organized first by expansion, and then by zone, with notable recurring pieces for specific adversaries and events. Start from expansion trailer themes and work outwards.

I believe the first dungeon to be a rearrangement of its zone theme was Keeper of the Lake, and it ruled. Silver Tears continues to be one of my favourite dungeon themes.

The Maker's Ruin shows up a decent amount when you're being heroic (Ultima Weapon phase 1 and Warriors of Darkness), returning in dramatic form for Heartless, O12's theme which pumps up the heroics even further.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 23:45

Rhonne: Feb 13, 2012

(post game spoiler) You can show G'raha your toy of him.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 23:55

The Big Bad Worf: Jan 26, 2004; Quad-greatness

Is there a good resource out there to get caught up on plot stuff? Not only has it been years since I played ARR, but back then I also played with a squad that very thoroughly encouraged racing to the end rather than enjoying the journey. I'd like a refresher on some stuff that strikes a balance between a 10 minute summary of an entire game vs an 8 hour complete collection of cut scenes.

# ? Jul 5, 2019 23:56

Edmond Dantes: Sep 12, 2007; Reactor: Online
Sensors: Online
Weapons: Online

ALL SYSTEMS NOMINAL

(First trial spoilers)
Yo, did Feo just use me to steal the loving crown

# ? Jul 6, 2019 00:14

Heroic Yoshimitsu: Jan 15, 2008

How is playing a healer with a controller? I would think it'd be hard to target certain people who need help quickly, I know targeting specific enemies is troublesome for me right now.

# ? Jul 6, 2019 00:14

Mordiceius: Nov 10, 2007; If you think calling me names is gonna get a rise out me, think again. I like my life as an idiot!

https://twitter.com/sleepybasilisk/status/1146732835186679808?s=21

# ? Jul 6, 2019 00:16

Edmond Dantes: Sep 12, 2007; Reactor: Online
Sensors: Online
Weapons: Online

ALL SYSTEMS NOMINAL

Heroic Yoshimitsu posted:

How is playing a healer with a controller? I would think it'd be hard to target certain people who need help quickly, I know targeting specific enemies is troublesome for me right now.

Surprisingly easy, since you can use up/down in the d-pad to scroll up/down your party list; since you actually 'lock' target with A (or X), you can even be targeting your tank, then scroll down to a DRG who just ate an AoE and pop a heal without 'locking' them so you can just go back to your tank with B

# ? Jul 6, 2019 00:18

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# ? Jun 10, 2024 21:14

Cythereal: Nov 8, 2009; I love the potoo,
and the potoo loves you.

Edmond Dantes posted:

(First trial spoilers)
Yo, did Feo just use me to steal the loving crown

More like saved you from it, yeah. You're the Warrior of Darkness, not the Fey King.

# ? Jul 6, 2019 00:26

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > The MMO HMO > FINAL FANTASY XIV: Shadowbringers - Remember that we once posted

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