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Who do you wish to win the Democratic primaries? This poll is closed. |
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| Joe Biden, the Inappropriate Toucher |
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18 | 1.46% |
| Bernie Sanders, the Hand Flailer |
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665 | 54.11% |
| Elizabeth Warren, the Plan Maker |
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319 | 25.96% |
| Kamala Harris, the Cop Lord |
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26 | 2.12% |
| Cory Booker, the Super Hero Wannabe |
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5 | 0.41% |
| Julian Castro, the Twin |
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5 | 0.41% |
| Kirsten Gillibrand, the Franken Killer |
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5 | 0.41% |
| Pete Buttigieg, the Troop Sociopath |
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17 | 1.38% |
| Robert Francis O'Rourke, the Fake Latino |
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3 | 0.24% |
| Jay Inslee, the Climate Alarmist |
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8 | 0.65% |
| Marianne Williamson, the Crystal Queen |
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86 | 7.00% |
| Tulsi Gabbard, the Muslim Hater |
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23 | 1.87% |
| Andrew Yang, the $1000 Fool |
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32 | 2.60% |
| Eric Swalwell, the Insurance Wife Guy |
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2 | 0.16% |
| Amy Klobuchar, the Comb Enthusiast |
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1 | 0.08% |
| Bill de Blasio, the NYPD Most Hated |
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4 | 0.33% |
| Tim Ryan, the Dope Face |
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3 | 0.24% |
| John Hickenlooper, the Also Ran |
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7 | 0.57% |
| Total: | 1229 votes | ||
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Calibanibal posted:As a "Warren is still running out of money" true believer, I think she's lying about the numbers. You're like a "joke" account or whatever but just to respond to this point generally: uh, isn't this something they have to report to the FEC, and have to report accurately? It's not like she can tell us one number and the FEC another, that's not even what Beto did in March when he tried to fake us all out. Which is how it was exposed. The FEC data showed he got a few huge shadowy donations not a ton of money from actual people.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:07
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Phone posted:having a bad tweet and going back on it: ACTIVELY DOING THE HARM RIGHT NOW Cerebral Bore posted:I know that you've posted a lot of dumb poo poo ITT, but literally arguing that the bipartisan consensus support for the forever war isn't actually harmful is on a whole new level. She didn't have a bad tweet and go back on it, she's built her entire enterprise on selling snake oil and has years and years of peddling dangerous poo poo like "don't take your anti-depressants". This isn't a dumb one-off statement, it's her entire brand. And yes of course Biden did actual harm as a Senator, decades of it in fact. Which is why no one is defending Biden or disagreeing with the idea that he sucks and his campaign should go down in such a disastrous plume of flame that it permanently destroys his reputation as a beloved elder statesmen. Everyone itt agrees Biden is the loving worst. The baffling thing is the folks inexplicably defending another very bad candidate like Williamson. Z. Autobahn fucked around with this message at 19:09 on Jul 8, 2019 |
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Jul 8, 2019 19:07
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Z. Autobahn posted:The difference between propagating anti-vaxx views vs imperialism is that your average American watching Joe Biden wax on about the Iraq war can't go out and pilot a drone to bomb a wedding, but they can hear Williamson and choose not to vaccinate their kids or take their anti-depressants. Biden's views are disqualifying because they reveal why he'd be an awful President, but Williamson's views are dangerous *right now* even with her out of power, in a way that is unique and awful just to her. The other candidates reveal the harm they'd do later, but Williamson is the one who is actively doing the harm RIGHT NOW. I think that's the thing a lot of people just refuse to internalize. VitalSigns posted:Half the candidates agree with her on vaccines so fire them into the sun too, just because a lot of people are terrible doesn't mean we should tolerate it GonadTheBallbarian fucked around with this message at 19:10 on Jul 8, 2019 |
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Jul 8, 2019 19:08
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VH4Ever posted:It's not like she can tell us one number and the FEC another, that's not even what Beto did in March when he tried to fake us all out. Which is how it was exposed Yes she can, and as this thread's resident "Warren is still running out of money" true believer, I do believe that this is what occurred. The question is, does the FEC care? Or are they happy to back up Warren's bullshit?
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Jul 8, 2019 19:10
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Apparently the definition of 'harm' doesn't include, say, murdering a million foreigners, it's only 'harm' if ordinary Americans saw you extolling murdering millions of foreigners on a debate stage and they all built their own trillion dollar Air Force and flew off to do it themselves individually.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:11
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VitalSigns posted:Apparently the definition of 'harm' doesn't include, say, murdering a million foreigners, it's only 'harm' if ordinary Americans saw you extolling murdering millions of foreigners on a debate stage and they all built their own trillion dollar Air Force and flew off to do it themselves individually. I think that's the thing a lot of people just refuse to internalize.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:12
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VitalSigns posted:Apparently the definition of 'harm' doesn't include, say, murdering a million foreigners, it's only 'harm' if ordinary Americans saw you extolling murdering millions of foreigners on a debate stage and they all built their own trillion dollar Air Force and flew off to do it themselves individually. I don't know how much simpler to explain this than there's a difference between someone promising to do harm if you elect them, and someone actively doing harm, right now, even without being elected. The former is an argument not to vote for that person, the latter is an argument to not even let that person on the stage. Literally no one has ever claimed Biden didn't do harm in his career. Of loving course he did. But if he goes down in the campaign (which he likely will), then he'll retire in failure and be remembered as The Creepy Dude Who Sucked. Williamson, even when she loses, is gaining millions and millions of followers who she is going to peddle dangerous harmful pseudoscience to it. It's not that Williamson is "worse" than Biden. It's that she presents a specific and unique public health risk that Biden doesn't. Z. Autobahn fucked around with this message at 19:15 on Jul 8, 2019 |
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Jul 8, 2019 19:13
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The elementary school near my apartment is at very little risk of coming down with a sudden case of the drones
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Jul 8, 2019 19:13
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Z. Autobahn posted:She didn't have a bad tweet and go back on it, she's built her entire enterprise on selling snake oil and has years and years of peddling dangerous poo poo like "don't take your anti-depressants". This isn't a dumb one-off statement, it's her entire brand. This is “bodycams will solve the police brutality and accountability problem!” levels of delusion. Never mind the forest for the trees, this is missing the Sahara desert for the individual protons in a single grain of sand.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:14
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To be fair, a pandemic wiping out the United States would beneficial to the health and safety of the roughly 7 billion other people that live on the planet which puts Williamson's foreign policy platform far ahead of Joe Biden's. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jul 8, 2019 19:14
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Z. Autobahn posted:I don't know how much simpler to explain this than there's a difference between someone promising to do harm if you elect them, and someone actively doing harm, right now, even without being elected. The former is an argument not to vote for that person, the latter is an argument to not even let that person on the stage. Biden is doing harm constantly by going around and normalizing horrible poo poo, you utter doofus.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:15
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Its a convincing argument that not a single one of these candidates should be "let on stage"
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Jul 8, 2019 19:18
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Cerebral Bore posted:Biden is doing harm constantly by going around and normalizing horrible poo poo, you utter doofus. if you're going to willfully misread him over and over again, at least do us a favor and call him a coward repeatedly like that other guy
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Jul 8, 2019 19:19
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Calibanibal posted:The elementary school near my apartment is at very little risk of coming down with a sudden case of the drones It's very sad that not a single one of the kids at your neighborhood school is on Santa's Nice list.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:19
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Cerebral Bore posted:Biden is doing harm constantly by going around and normalizing horrible poo poo, you utter doofus. The poo poo that Biden is normalizing is already normalized and widespread in a way that anti-vaxx/anti-depressant isn't. Biden isn't a new voice suddenly introducing Americans to the concept of imperialism, he's one lame cog in a massive machine. If Biden got hit by a bus tomorrow, it would impact the normalization of imperialism .01%. But Williamson is spreading a much more fringe set of beliefs and in a way that none of the other candidates are.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:19
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MrFlibble posted:I think that's the thing a lot of people just refuse to internalize. Because realizing that your country, every couple decades, just goes on a tangent and kills a few million people kind of sucks rear end. You could say it's a big deal, or that it "feels bad" even. Z. Autobahn posted:I don't know how much simpler to explain this than there's a difference between someone promising to do harm if you elect them, and someone actively doing harm, right now, even without being elected. The former is an argument not to vote for that person, the latter is an argument to not even let that person on the stage. The continued normalization of literal mass murder abroad is actively doing harm right now. We are currently facing an administration that wants to glass Venezuela and Iran, and a significant portion the glorious opposition party (and most of the current presidential candidates) can't help themselves but to continue to talk like this is no big deal. Necessary, even. Presidential. But if we want to keep it on the level of health risks, Biden's proposed plans for the American healthcare system are more of a danger to us* than any amount of stupid crystal bullshit ever will be. * I say us, but idk maybe you're rich and "affording doctors" or "everyone around me is sick as hell and spreading the flu everywhere because they all have to work still" aren't a big deal. Not judging. e: Z. Autobahn posted:The poo poo that Biden is normalizing is already normalized and widespread in a way that anti-vaxx/anti-depressant isn't. Biden isn't a new voice suddenly introducing Americans to the concept of imperialism, he's one lame cog in a massive machine. If Biden got hit by a bus tomorrow, it would impact the normalization of imperialism .01%. But Williamson is spreading a much more fringe set of beliefs and in a way that none of the other candidates are. So the continued legitimization of mass murder isn't a big deal because it's already a part of the bipartisan foreign policy consensus? Williamson is a grifter who sucks but Jesus lmao. Marxalot fucked around with this message at 19:26 on Jul 8, 2019 |
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Jul 8, 2019 19:23
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Z. Autobahn posted:The poo poo that Biden is normalizing is already normalized and widespread in a way that anti-vaxx/anti-depressant isn't. Biden isn't a new voice suddenly introducing Americans to the concept of imperialism, he's one lame cog in a massive machine. If Biden got hit by a bus tomorrow, it would impact the normalization of imperialism .01%. But Williamson is spreading a much more fringe set of beliefs and in a way that none of the other candidates are. It’s a good thing that disneyland has never had a measles outbreak and made national news. It’d be real hosed up if there was several outbreaks going on at once and a very public battle that was demanding local government intervention getting slapped down by the courts. Glad those things aren’t going on!!
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Jul 8, 2019 19:25
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Is there a handy list of normalized and fringed evils, so I know who to let on stage and who to forbid from stage?
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Jul 8, 2019 19:26
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I believe we should just evaluate Marianne Williamson to be 70 good, 30 bad as a compromise
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Jul 8, 2019 19:27
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More: https://twitter.com/ActorAaronBooth/status/1148292573590675457 LOL @ Bullock being 7th in fundraising and yet not qualifying for the debates.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:27
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Marxalot posted:But if we want to keep it on the level of health risks, Biden's proposed plans for the American healthcare system are more of a danger to us* than any amount of stupid crystal bullshit ever will be. Sure. But if Biden loses, he doesn't get to do his terrible healtchare plan. If Williamson loses, she's still propagating harmful pseudoscience. That's the difference. Marxalot posted:The continued normalization of literal mass murder abroad is actively doing harm right now. We are currently facing an administration that wants to glass Venezuela and Iran, and a significant portion the glorious opposition party (and most of the current presidential candidates) can't help themselves but to continue to talk like this is no big deal. Necessary, even. Presidential. This is a better analogy, but the specifics are still different. There's a difference between being a cog in a massive status quo and being a torchbearer bringing dangerous fringe ideas to the masses. If Biden dropped out of the race tomorrow, we'd still be talking about American imperialism, because it's so much larger than Biden and because his individual ability to move the needle on it is meaningless. If Willliamson dropped out tomorrow, we'd stop talking about anti-vaxx/anti-depressant rhetoric, because she's the sole vector. Marxalot posted:So the continued legitimization of mass murder isn't a big deal because it's already a part of the bipartisan foreign policy consensus? Williamson is a grifter who sucks but Jesus lmao. Of course it's a big deal! Biden sucks and is loving awful! Literally no one is defending Biden, the weird thing is that half y'all are defending Williamson.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:29
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Z. Autobahn posted:If Willliamson dropped out tomorrow, we'd stop talking about anti-vaxx/anti-depressant rhetoric, because she's the sole vector.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:30
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sigh lol "stop talking about it in the context of the Democratic primary"
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Jul 8, 2019 19:31
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Z. Autobahn posted:I don't know how much simpler to explain this than there's a difference between someone promising to do harm if you elect them, and someone actively doing harm, right now, even without being elected. Normalizing endless war in the eyes of the public is actively doing harm, right now, even without being elected, because it results in other people being elected who will do harm.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:33
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Z. Autobahn posted:Sure. But if Biden loses, he doesn't get to do his terrible healtchare plan. If Williamson loses, she's still propagating harmful pseudoscience. That's the difference. JFC, just look at this idiot horseshit. So apparently Biden is just one anonymous cog in the machine of little importance, despite having been a Senator and VP and still having great pull in the Democratic party, but the entire fortunes of the anti-vax movement apparently hinges on one kooky crystal lady and without her it would just go away. E: Z. Autobahn posted:sigh lol "stop talking about it in the context of the Democratic primary" Good to know that something stops being harmful once it's no longer discussed in the Dem primary.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:33
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Z. Autobahn posted:sigh lol "stop talking about it in the context of the Democratic primary" So anti-vaxx ISN'T a public health crisis?
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Jul 8, 2019 19:34
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Z. Autobahn posted:The poo poo that Biden is normalizing is already normalized and widespread in a way that anti-vaxx/anti-depressant isn't. Biden isn't a new voice suddenly introducing Americans to the concept of imperialism, he's one lame cog in a massive machine. If Biden got hit by a bus tomorrow, it would impact the normalization of imperialism .01%. But Williamson is spreading a much more fringe set of beliefs and in a way that none of the other candidates are. And if Williamson got hit by a bus tomorrow, Jenny McCarthy would still exist. Can you actually show a correlation between Williamson being in a debate, and an increase in deaths, I don't think you can. Cerebral Bore posted:JFC, just look at this idiot horseshit. So apparently Biden is just one anonymous cog in the machine of little importance, despite having been a Senator and VP and still having great pull in the Democratic party This is always the excuse for everything bad Democrats do, "well someone else was doing it too" so magically no one is responsible and we can keep electing any of them without anything changing so therefore we can keep electing all of them.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:35
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VH4Ever posted:More: This is just the 8 candidates that have reported numbers, Booker and Klobuchar and O'Rourke etc haven't released their numbers yet and they'll most likely be ahead of Bullock
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Jul 8, 2019 19:38
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Wrap it up "Warren is still running out of money" true believers. She's swimming in a money pool Scrooge McDuck style.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:39
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Z. Autobahn posted:your average American watching Joe Biden wax on about the Iraq war can't go out and pilot a drone to bomb a wedding no, they just have to join the military and train to do so, propagating the war machine
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Jul 8, 2019 19:42
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Is Williamson even campaigning on an anti-vax platform in the primary? Because if she isn't, then Zbahns argument immediately goes from mostly nonsense to blatant nonsense.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:45
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Not gonna break these up into multiple quotes so I'll just respond in orderZ. Autobahn posted:Sure. But if Biden loses, he doesn't get to do his terrible healtchare plan. If Williamson loses, she's still propagating harmful pseudoscience. That's the difference. Biden's healthcare plan is indistinguishable from that of everyone but Bernie and possibly Warren if we're feeling charitable about her intentions today. Uhhhhhhhhh... Because it's extremely telling when certain posters respond to someone posting a Williamson tweet that says "man, did you know that war kind of sucks? We shouldn't do that!" with a whole bunch of "wow this lady is a psychopath how could you people ever listen to that???" while also completely excusing the exponentially worse policies, takes, and legislative history of their preferred hawkish candidates. Because holy hell it really should make certain people think twice when you realize the anti-vaxx crystals lady tends to have better politics (even if somewhat accidentally) than most of the people in the Democratic primary. Marxalot fucked around with this message at 20:05 on Jul 8, 2019 |
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Jul 8, 2019 19:45
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Cerebral Bore posted:Is Williamson even campaigning on an anti-vax platform in the primary? Because if she isn't, then Zbahns argument immediately goes from mostly nonsense to blatant nonsense. From what other posters have said, apparently she hasn't mentioned it at all and has actually said that anti-vaxx is bad. I dunno, I'm not interested enough in the crystals lady to really dig. But I will bring up this blast from the past! https://www.ozy.com/rising-stars/tulsi-gabbard-a-young-star-headed-for-the-cabinet/62604 It's former goon favorite Tulsi Gabbard hating them gays quote:About 10 years ago, Gabbard violated some of the tenets that now make her so popular as a Democrat with an EMILY’s List endorsement to boot — she was neither pro-choice nor pro-gay-marriage, and in fact fell in line with her erstwhile Republican father. “She’s definitely distanced herself since,” says Jacqueline Lasky, professor of state politics at the University of Hawaii. “She wouldn’t have been successful otherwise.” (Nationally, there’s little talk about it; Kennedy told me he “didn’t really know” about Gabbard’s early conservative stances.) Hawaii bloggers and reporters widely have Gabbard on record as referring to the agendas of “homosexual extremists” at one point; when I ask her, she replies, “That thing I said ages ago?” Yes, I say. “Honestly, I’d have to go back and look,” she says. After repeated follow-ups, the congresswoman replies with a note about her sponsorship of the Equality Act (adding sexual orientation to categories of prohibited discrimination) and of her support for equal treatment of gay service members’ spouses. Her days of shooting browns have taught her to keep her homophobia out of the legislature though. #staywoke
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Jul 8, 2019 19:49
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The fact that it takes a crystal mom kook to say obvious truths in the political arena like "the Iraq War was a lie and all those people died for nothing" or "you can't address the refugee crisis without addressing the decades of American foreign policy that is much of the underlying cause" is really an indictment of the Democratic Party and the way that money and institutional power has created a groupthink echochamber where the truth isn't allowed to be uttered. There's a reason that the only person willing to stand up and tell truths about foreign policy has no connection to the donor or patronage networks of the Democratic Party, because anyone who relies on those networks is required to lie as a condition for being permitted to continue their political career.
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Jul 8, 2019 19:52
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VH4Ever posted:More: I know he's governor of Montana, I mean who the gently caress is Steve Bullock. Edit: I think the bigger issue for me is that the same posters who are always complaining about double standards want to give the wine aunt a pass on the "Defeat Trump With Love" plan because she might be anti-imperialist based on a tweet. Anecdote isn't evidence but all my wine aunts talk a good game but are the epitome of NIMBYism, white feminism, and white savior liberalism. Tibalt fucked around with this message at 20:04 on Jul 8, 2019 |
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Jul 8, 2019 19:58
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nothing at all suspicious about a guy polling at 5 percent leading the pack in funding.
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Jul 8, 2019 20:01
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Tibalt posted:Who the gently caress is Bullock. bul·lock /ˈbo͝olək/ noun noun: bullock; plural noun: bullocks another term for steer late Old English bulluc, diminutive of bula (see bull). The verb (late 19th century) is by association with a bullock's use as a draft animal.
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Jul 8, 2019 20:02
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Marxalot posted:Because it's extremely telling when certain posters respond to someone posting a Williamson tweet that says "man, did you know that war kind of sucks? We shouldn't do that!" with a whole bunch of "wow this lady is a psychopath how could you people ever listen to that???" while also completely excusing exponentially worse policies, takes, and legislative history. Because holy hell it really should make certain people think twice when you realize the anti-vaxx crystals lady tends to have better politics (even if somewhat accidentally) than most of the people in the Democratic primary. I'm not going to waste my time responding to the disingenuous bullshit from other posters, but I'd just like to point out that I haven't advocated or supported these policies or folks like Biden or Buttigieg once. I'm pissed off that so many here treat this issue as no big deal, that a compromised immune system is just a loving joke and that calling out clear ableism is just being "a tedious liberal". These are the same folks who advocate for such horrors as bleach enemas for children with autism, so when the issue is taken lightly, you're going to be push back. There's a massive difference between giving a clearly uninformed answer on vaccination mandates and making a living off of selling books advocating for anti-vaxx, anti-mental health beliefs. That folks are more than happy to trade a few self-evident truth bombs for those too young or immunocompormised to be vaccinated or for those who require medication for their mental health is really loving telling. I shouldn't have to add a five page thesis on why Biden loving sucks to the chorus to be taken seriously on this issue here.
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Jul 8, 2019 20:07
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Solkanar512 posted:I'm not going to waste my time responding to the disingenuous bullshit from other posters, but I'd just like to point out that I haven't advocated or supported these policies or folks like Biden or Buttigieg once. I'm pissed off that so many here treat this issue as no big deal, that a compromised immune system is just a loving joke and that calling out clear ableism is just being "a tedious liberal". You don't get to say poo poo like this when you're pretending that people ITT are actually supporting some anti-vax agenda.
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Jul 8, 2019 20:08
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VH4Ever posted:More: Warren raising more than Sanders seem pretty relevant....
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