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Who do you wish to win the Democratic primaries? This poll is closed. |
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| Joe Biden, the Inappropriate Toucher |
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18 | 1.46% |
| Bernie Sanders, the Hand Flailer |
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665 | 54.11% |
| Elizabeth Warren, the Plan Maker |
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319 | 25.96% |
| Kamala Harris, the Cop Lord |
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26 | 2.12% |
| Cory Booker, the Super Hero Wannabe |
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5 | 0.41% |
| Julian Castro, the Twin |
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5 | 0.41% |
| Kirsten Gillibrand, the Franken Killer |
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5 | 0.41% |
| Pete Buttigieg, the Troop Sociopath |
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17 | 1.38% |
| Robert Francis O'Rourke, the Fake Latino |
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3 | 0.24% |
| Jay Inslee, the Climate Alarmist |
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8 | 0.65% |
| Marianne Williamson, the Crystal Queen |
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86 | 7.00% |
| Tulsi Gabbard, the Muslim Hater |
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23 | 1.87% |
| Andrew Yang, the $1000 Fool |
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32 | 2.60% |
| Eric Swalwell, the Insurance Wife Guy |
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2 | 0.16% |
| Amy Klobuchar, the Comb Enthusiast |
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1 | 0.08% |
| Bill de Blasio, the NYPD Most Hated |
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4 | 0.33% |
| Tim Ryan, the Dope Face |
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3 | 0.24% |
| John Hickenlooper, the Also Ran |
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7 | 0.57% |
| Total: | 1229 votes | ||
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Jaxyon posted:"I'm literally repeating a Trump smear" is a policy disagreement? Jaxyon posted:Warren: I'm a subject matter expert on helping the working class, I created a federal agency to protect consumers, I have plans for literally everything under the sun and am probably 2x as competent as almost any other politician. So are you now saying that if someone repeats an attack Trump made they're a sexist? Edit: of course I know how this works, no matter what policy differences anyone has with Warren you'll just declare them fake and keep suggesting they're sexist.
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Jul 9, 2019 22:20
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Majorian posted:It's a really bad plan, op. Indeed, a lot of her plans are pretty bad, when you delve into the nitty-gritty. Her plan to save me $20/month on my rent ten years from now is inspirational.
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Jul 9, 2019 22:20
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waffling on little issues like "healthcare" and "climate change" and "israel" is...inherently disqualifying, and makes you an equivocating triangulator, not a "policy wonk", no matter how many harvard and yale public policy grads you hire for astronomical sums
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Jul 9, 2019 22:20
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pretty good for bernie tbh since the news has spent the last two months or so in lockstep saying that bernie has no plans or policy ideas
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Jul 9, 2019 22:20
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Typo posted:I think the obvious solution would be for Bernie to adopt some of Warren's policies, that way you get best of both worlds: warrne's popular policies and bernie's electability personally i prefer bernie's plan of cancelling all student debt and paying for it with a financial transaction tax over warren's idea of canceling up to $50000 of student debt and paying for it with ???
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Jul 9, 2019 22:22
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I will be disappointed if Bernie’s Sword doesn’t have a gimmick twitter account by the end of the day.
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Jul 9, 2019 22:22
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Trabisnikof posted:Edit: of course I know how this works, no matter what policy differences anyone has with Warren you'll just declare them fake and keep suggesting they're sexist. I specifically came here to post in response to the guy repeating Trump smears. But by all means, go ahead and tell me what I'm going to be posting in the future, that's really intellectually honest.
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Jul 9, 2019 22:23
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My Trump smear detector went off and I immediately knew somebody was attacking Warren
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Jul 9, 2019 22:27
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Shear Modulus posted:personally i prefer bernie's plan of cancelling all student debt and paying for it with a financial transaction tax over warren's idea of canceling up to $50000 of student debt and paying for it with ??? Warren''s plan has a cap on what it cancels but also doesn't cancel debt for rich people, and uses a wealth tax vs a stock market transaction tax, bernie's cancels it for everyone including those who don't need it cancelled but also doesn't cap the cancellation. Bernie's is clearly better but both are pretty good, but definitely we're making calm and rational criticisms of policy by pretending aspects of policy don't exist for people we don't like, and as a internet liberal I don't see gender so that couldn't possibly be it, ever.
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Jul 9, 2019 22:27
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Jaxyon posted:I specifically came here to post in response to the guy repeating Trump smears. You specifically came here to get mad about somebody saying something that's objectively true and you don't seem to have the capacity to learn from your mistakes, so it's a pretty strong conclusion and hence entirely defensible from a standpoint of intellectual honesty.
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Jul 9, 2019 22:28
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Cerebral Bore posted:You specifically came here to get mad about somebody saying something that's objectively true and you don't seem to have the capacity to learn from your mistakes, so it's a pretty strong conclusion and hence entirely defensible from a standpoint of intellectual honesty. Nah, it's not. But by all means feel free to support the claim.
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Jul 9, 2019 22:28
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TBF it's pretty ballsy to Kramer into a thread and start pulling some kinda amateur psychoanalysis out of your rear end combined with passive-aggressive complaining about other posters instead of even trying to make a proper argument and then start accusing others of intellectual dishonesty, but it's still really, really stupid.
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Jul 9, 2019 22:36
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is it really that ballsy that's like over half the posts in here
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Jul 9, 2019 22:39
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Jaxyon posted:Warren''s plan has a cap on what it cancels but also doesn't cancel debt for rich people, and uses a wealth tax vs a stock market transaction tax, bernie's cancels it for everyone including those who don't need it cancelled but also doesn't cap the cancellation. rich people dont have college debt, excluding them from forgiveness is pointless. its just as silly as saying that trump's kids shouldnt get free public college, no billionaire would be caught dead sending their kids to a public school
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Jul 9, 2019 22:42
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Jaxyon posted:Warren''s plan has a cap on what it cancels but also doesn't cancel debt for rich people, and uses a wealth tax vs a stock market transaction tax, bernie's cancels it for everyone including those who don't need it cancelled but also doesn't cap the cancellation. Means tested plans never last, and are incredibly easy to make cuts to by future governments
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Jul 9, 2019 22:42
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Jaxyon posted:But by all means, go ahead and tell me what I'm going to be posting in the future Badly? https://twitter.com/ForecasterEnten/status/1148371588049489921 I see guys like Harry Enten are still on their bullshit. Nice. e: Shear Modulus posted:rich people dont have college debt, excluding them from forgiveness is pointless. its just as silly as saying that trump's kids shouldnt get free public college, no billionaire would be caught dead sending their kids to a public school the whole point is to eventually declare any household income of over 40k a year "the rich" and cut the subsidies off there entirely Marxalot fucked around with this message at 22:48 on Jul 9, 2019 |
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Jul 9, 2019 22:46
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Eiba posted:I think basically anyone can beat Trump if they don't suck as bad as Clinton... and I think even Clinton could probably have a good shot if she tried again. Trump is, despite his incumbency, incredibly unpopular. I don't think anyone has a particularly bad chance against Trump. trumps popularity is within 4 points of obama at the same period of their presidencies. want an unpopular president? go check out how bush 2’s numbers were doing near the end there. the caveat being that this all doesn’t loving matter because bush 2 has 110% been rehabilitated by all of the peaceniks in the democratic party.
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Jul 9, 2019 22:47
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Cerebral Bore posted:TBF it's pretty ballsy to Kramer into a thread and start pulling some kinda amateur psychoanalysis out of your rear end combined with passive-aggressive complaining about other posters instead of even trying to make a proper argument and then start accusing others of intellectual dishonesty, but it's still really, really stupid. You know, if just one of these times, the response was like "yeah, there's some sexism involved with people's dislike of Warren and that's something we need to take into account, even if that's not the only reason" I'd shut up. But I don't think I've ever seen that happen. So I keep bringing it up.
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Jul 9, 2019 22:48
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Shear Modulus posted:rich people dont have college debt, excluding them from forgiveness is pointless. its just as silly as saying that trump's kids shouldnt get free public college, no billionaire would be caught dead sending their kids to a public school I suspect there's people in this very thread whose parents make >$100k but have student debt
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Jul 9, 2019 22:48
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Jaxyon posted:You know, if just one of these times, the response was like "yeah, there's some sexism involved with people's dislike of Warren and that's something we need to take into account, even if that's not the only reason" I'd shut up. yeah, there's some sexism involved with people's dislike of Warren and that's something we need to take into account, even if that's not the only reason
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Jul 9, 2019 22:49
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Jaxyon posted:Nah, it's not. But by all means feel free to support the claim. That's particularly ironic coming from someone who throws accusations of sexism every into other post. Jaxyon posted:You know, if just one of these times, the response was like "yeah, there's some sexism involved with people's dislike of Warren and that's something we need to take into account, even if that's not the only reason" I'd shut up. What are the allowable non-sexist reasons to dislike Warren according to you? Because every time someone brings one up you still accuse them of sexism.
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Jul 9, 2019 22:50
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Typo posted:I suspect there's people in this very thread whose parents make >$100k but have student debt in fact warren's plan with its phaseouts basically seems to exclude doctors and only doctors, who are the ones with the biggest piles of student debt and who are the ones who get paid enough to go over the phaseouts when their careers finally begin at age 35 or whatever
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Jul 9, 2019 22:51
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Jaxyon posted:You know, if just one of these times, the response was like "yeah, there's some sexism involved with people's dislike of Warren and that's something we need to take into account, even if that's not the only reason" I'd shut up. The extreme sexism of not uncritically accepting your hagiography of your preferred candidate.
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Jul 9, 2019 22:52
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Marxalot posted:
that corncob ratio tho
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Jul 9, 2019 23:01
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Jaxyon posted:You know, if just one of these times, the response was like "yeah, there's some sexism involved with people's dislike of Warren and that's something we need to take into account, even if that's not the only reason" I'd shut up. warren sucks
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Jul 9, 2019 23:02
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Cerebral Bore posted:The extreme sexism of not uncritically accepting your hagiography of your preferred candidate. My preferred candidate is Bernie, but by all means, go with the "actually the person who wants to bring sexism up is the real sexist."
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Jul 9, 2019 23:03
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Jaxyon posted:My preferred candidate is Bernie, but by all means, go with the "actually the person who wants to bring sexism up is the real sexist." no it isn't lmao
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Jul 9, 2019 23:03
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Lightning Knight posted:I will be disappointed if Bernie’s Sword doesn’t have a gimmick twitter account by the end of the day. by the logic of the arthurian legend this makes h ross perot the lady of the lake
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Jul 9, 2019 23:05
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Jaxyon posted:Warren: I'm a subject matter expert on helping the working class, I created a federal agency to protect consumers, I have plans for literally everything under the sun and am probably 2x as competent as almost any other politician. The issue is that there's a perception that Warren's plans are somehow more realistic/detailed, when in reality the truth is generally the opposite (Sanders' plans are mostly actual existing bills that are generally equal to or objectively superior to Warren's). And it certainly doesn't help that Warren has thrown out least a couple outright stupid or bad plans that should cast doubt on her broader values or competency. Jaxyon posted:I rarely post in this thread, but liberals and leftists don't ever seem to want to talk about unconscious bias as it pertains to themselves, it's always something other people do. We're the ones actually comparing the actual policies. You don't seem to be contesting the actual facts here, and instead just seem upset that people are using them to argue against Warren. I actually understand that it might seem like people are disproportionately focusing negatively on Warren, but that's because Warren is the only other candidate competing for the left-leaning Democratic vote and the only non-Bernie candidate that people in D&D are generally willing to support or defend. Speaking personally, I'm concerned because my parents were Sanders supporters in 2016 and seem to like Warren this time around, and it's very easy for me to imagine a lot of older left-leaning Dems (who mostly get their information from network television and newspapers) supporting her instead of him. Only one person can win the primary. It is entirely reasonable to aggressively argue why Warren is the inferior choice, especially in light of the fact that their polling is relatively close and the average layperson isn't really capable of telling the difference. For most of us, we view Sanders as just barely passing the line where him getting elected would carry some potential for significant change. We don't think Warren crosses that threshold, while you probably think she does. This is because you have different values and priorities (and this is really what's at the center of all these intraleft disputes). Ytlaya fucked around with this message at 23:08 on Jul 9, 2019 |
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Jul 9, 2019 23:06
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Jaxyon posted:My preferred candidate is Bernie, but by all means, go with the "actually the person who wants to bring sexism up is the real sexist." It's extremely telling that you don't feel comfortable even disputing what I said and instead fall back on "well actually" and even more passive-aggressive accusations.
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Jul 9, 2019 23:07
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Some real interesting crosstabs on that answer. Sanders does better among the poor than among the rich, while Warren does worst among the poor and gets way more support from the rich, who appear to love her policies far more than those of any other candidate.  It increasingly seems like all but two groups think that Sanders and Warren are the same policy-wise. And the two groups who feel they're different are internet socialists and the comfortably wealthy, two groups that don't have much in common other than their strong focus on the class issues that Sanders and Warren are both largely defined by.
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Jul 9, 2019 23:12
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Cerebral Bore posted:It's extremely telling that you don't feel comfortable even disputing what I said and instead fall back on "well actually" and even more passive-aggressive accusations. It's extremely telling that whenever I bring up sexism I get 15 repsonses about how that couldn't possibly at all ever have anything to do with it and none that say "well probably a bit" without me literally prompting it.
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Jul 9, 2019 23:15
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Jaxyon what the hell I said the magic words you liar.
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Jul 9, 2019 23:16
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Jaxyon posted:It's extremely telling that whenever I bring up sexism I get 15 repsonses about how that couldn't possibly at all ever have anything to do with it and none that say "well probably a bit" without me literally prompting it. I've said it quite a few times ITT, and I know Helsing and I are not the only ones. I think you're just not quite as good at reading other people's posts here as you think you are.
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Jul 9, 2019 23:19
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Main Paineframe posted:Some real interesting crosstabs on that answer. Sanders does better among the poor than among the rich, while Warren does worst among the poor and gets way more support from the rich, who appear to love her policies far more than those of any other candidate. Income: <50K: Sanders: 20 Warren: 25 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Jul 9, 2019 23:23
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she really should have run in 16
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Jul 9, 2019 23:24
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Berke Negri posted:she really should have run in 16 Indeed - and Bernie wanted her to run in 2016. He wouldn't have run then if she had taken the leap.
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Jul 9, 2019 23:27
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warren was building political capital by not running in 2016
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Jul 9, 2019 23:28
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Jaxyon posted:It's extremely telling that whenever I bring up sexism I get 15 repsonses about how that couldn't possibly at all ever have anything to do with it and none that say "well probably a bit" without me literally prompting it. It's extremely telling that you suddenly want everyone who doesn't prefer your candidate to preface any post talking about her absolutely inferior policies/record with "While some people who hold the view that she's not The Best Candidate are complete pieces of poo poo, I however..."
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Jul 9, 2019 23:28
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Jaxyon posted:Warren: I'm a subject matter expert on helping the working class, I created a federal agency to protect consumers, I have plans for literally everything under the sun and am probably 2x as competent as almost any other politician. I posted quotes of her claiming native american heritage. her quotes. it's not a smear, it's something she really honestly did
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Jul 9, 2019 23:32
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