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Who do you wish to win the Democratic primaries? This poll is closed. |
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| Joe Biden, the Inappropriate Toucher |
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18 | 1.46% |
| Bernie Sanders, the Hand Flailer |
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665 | 54.11% |
| Elizabeth Warren, the Plan Maker |
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319 | 25.96% |
| Kamala Harris, the Cop Lord |
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26 | 2.12% |
| Cory Booker, the Super Hero Wannabe |
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5 | 0.41% |
| Julian Castro, the Twin |
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5 | 0.41% |
| Kirsten Gillibrand, the Franken Killer |
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5 | 0.41% |
| Pete Buttigieg, the Troop Sociopath |
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17 | 1.38% |
| Robert Francis O'Rourke, the Fake Latino |
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3 | 0.24% |
| Jay Inslee, the Climate Alarmist |
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8 | 0.65% |
| Marianne Williamson, the Crystal Queen |
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86 | 7.00% |
| Tulsi Gabbard, the Muslim Hater |
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23 | 1.87% |
| Andrew Yang, the $1000 Fool |
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32 | 2.60% |
| Eric Swalwell, the Insurance Wife Guy |
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2 | 0.16% |
| Amy Klobuchar, the Comb Enthusiast |
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1 | 0.08% |
| Bill de Blasio, the NYPD Most Hated |
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4 | 0.33% |
| Tim Ryan, the Dope Face |
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3 | 0.24% |
| John Hickenlooper, the Also Ran |
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7 | 0.57% |
| Total: | 1229 votes | ||
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Gyges posted:It is very true that not a single unionized worker in any other campaign is unhappy.
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Jul 20, 2019 04:55
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Id say it blows my mind that none of the people who are outraged that a union is doing one of the things a union does expressed even a fraction of the displeasure when it was revealed that Warren had unpaid non-volunteer workers but I'd be lying
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Jul 20, 2019 04:57
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twice burned ice posted:gently caress this clown "I'm rich so nobody owns me" is an eye-watering bullshit argument that goes back to at least the 18th century... and more likely to Aristotle.
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Jul 20, 2019 05:02
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When Warren was a Republican, many Democrats from the rural parts were racists and the party wasn’t 100% behind civil rights. Saying that Warren is a capitalist is fair. Suggesting she was a Republican because she thought Democrats were Marxist-Leninists is speculation. But this weird “if Warren really cared about gay people she would’ve joined the Democrats of Oklahoma” is weird when we’re talking about the party Richard Shelby hadn’t left yet.
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Jul 20, 2019 05:04
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Pembroke Fuse posted:"I'm rich so nobody owns me" is an eye-watering bullshit argument that goes back to at least the 18th century... and more likely to Aristotle. The money owns them or they wouldn't have it.
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Jul 20, 2019 05:04
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https://twitter.com/NuclearRek/status/1151974561111576581
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Jul 20, 2019 05:05
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MSDOS KAPITAL posted:Fixing most of the problems with American federal government at this point is going to require just ignoring parts of the Constitution and getting enough people and states to go along with it, or short of that civil war. That goes for the electoral college as much as anything else. Given the number of "ifs" in this plan (imagine convincing Dems to break the regs on a convention)... I'm going to say that Civil War 2 is the more likely outcome.
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Jul 20, 2019 05:18
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generic one posted:Aaaaannnd there it is! Right on time! And there it is, what? What is your argument, exactly? That Bernie isn't perfect? No poo poo, sherlock. Bernie has always been the compromise candidate. And don't defend what, exactly? Bernie's campaign is still in negotiations, as it should be, and the union is holding their feet to the fire, as they should be, because that is what a union is supposed to do. I simply replied to your absolutely imbecilic point of "hah, if it had been other campaigns, you'd be raising hell." Which is an absolutely moronic point because EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THE OTHER CAMPAIGNS ARE DOING WORSE! There isn't any other campaign with a union, or paying 15 an hour across the board, or negotiating to make sure that people get 15 an hour while not getting a bump in health insurance costs. That is why your point is so specially stupid, which either indicates intentional poo poo posting or just a bottom of the barrel level of intelligence. Your "hah, if it was someone else you'd be freaking out" isn't the gotcha you think it is when every other campaign treats their workers worse without being described as being "roiled" in labor proble,s/
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Jul 20, 2019 05:25
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joepinetree posted:Your "hah, if it was someone else you'd be freaking out" isn't the gotcha you think it is when every other campaign treats their workers worse without being described as being "roiled" in labor proble,s/ The thing that bothers me about these Warren folks is that they are almost never willing to just directly make their case for why they prefer their candidate over Sanders. It's always these weird implications, or attempts to make Sanders supporters look hypocritical or something. So we end up with these bizarre roundabout discussions where the opposing side doesn't really have any argument and is just trying to make Sanders and Sanders supporters look bad in various oblique ways. The only way I can understand it is that they're basically "trolling" the left. They're 100% confident that their choice is the best one and, as a result, don't feel any need to defend their own choice to the left, and these weird posts insinuating various things are just these weird malicious attempts to mock people.
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Jul 20, 2019 05:36
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Ytlaya posted:The thing that bothers me about these Warren folks is that they are almost never willing to just directly make their case for why they prefer their candidate over Sanders. I think she’s more likely to serve a second term than Bernie. I guess this is a “women live longer than men” thing because they’re both aging boomers but it’s just my belief. There are certain problems that aren’t solved by jailing a CEO, where at best it’s a good first step. Bernie has talked less about what he’d do as President to some things and more about how as a Senator he wanted to criminalize certain amoral behaviors. It’s cool he wanted to jail some pharma CEOs, but even guillotining the Sackler family doesn’t solve the opioid crisis. This is a situation where many people are victims and aren’t even aware of it, and it’s transformed fire departments into OD revival specialists who also sometimes pour water on a blaze. It’s one of the biggest domestic issues and I wish he’d have more vision of what he would do if he won. I think Warren, like Merkel, is a good foil to Putin and a lesser extent Xi. I understand Bernie is better aligned with this forum on Middle East policies, but that part of the world is not my personal top priority for foreign policy. I am probably fatigued from the past twenty years of US intervention there and concede any administration that doesn’t have Bolton is an improvement. The last issue is probably the opposite position of most Bernie people on Warren. There are occasional moments Bernie stakes out positions on things that I’m just not there yet. Most examples would be considered Cool And Good by most people here, and on some issues I tilt closer to some neoliberal positions than most here. I accept these differences though because no candidate is perfect and I have to be willing to compromise on some things to get what I want elsewhere. So that’s kind of why, if I lived in a primary state, I’d vote for Warren. As I live in a caucus state, my realpolitik rear end will go with whichever the underdog is because it’s more important to block Biden/Harris/etc.
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Jul 20, 2019 06:02
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Bernie’s enemies will be crushed before our eyes.
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Jul 20, 2019 06:12
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Man, every time I check in with this thread everyone is always acting like the fight is between Bernie and Warren even though Biden is way in the lead. I guess it's just wishful thinking, I mean I know I certainly wish that was what was happening.
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Jul 20, 2019 06:55
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Craptacular! posted:even guillotining the Sackler family doesn’t solve the opioid crisis Space Cadet Omoly posted:Man, every time I check in with this thread everyone is always acting like the fight is between Bernie and Warren even though Biden is way in the lead.
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Jul 20, 2019 08:43
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Cool to see all these people who defended unpaid exploited labor on other campaigns as "opportunities for more aspiring staffers" turn on a dime and pretend to care about labor when a candidate they don't like is negotiating with a union that their preferred candidate won't even allow.
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Jul 20, 2019 08:59
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Negotiation between the union and management is a boring and necessary thing that happens regularly when you have a functioning labor movement. I know it's hard to grasp when just having unions at all seems like an impossible battle to the death, but that's how it's supposed to work.
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Jul 20, 2019 09:29
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Craptacular! posted:I think she’s more likely to serve a second term than Bernie. I guess this is a “women live longer than men” thing because they’re both aging boomers but it’s just my belief. The reason why Bernie's the best candidate to help with the opioid crisis is because people suffering from addiction to opioids need Medicare For All if they're going to survive. There's really nothing in any of the other candidates' plans that are better-geared towards addressing this crisis than that. quote:I think Warren, like Merkel, is a good foil to Putin and a lesser extent Xi. I understand Bernie is better aligned with this forum on Middle East policies, but that part of the world is not my personal top priority for foreign policy. I am probably fatigued from the past twenty years of US intervention there and concede any administration that doesn’t have Bolton is an improvement. The Middle East is not my top foreign policy priority, either - in fact, I think more people here would agree than you realize. But foreign policy in general is an area where Bernie excels. I really don't see Warren putting together an international coalition to tackle issues like climate change or nuclear nonproliferation like Bernie could. And Merkel's been a terrible foil for Putin, I'm sorry to tell you dude. She's been pretty much unable to stop him in any meaningful way.
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Jul 20, 2019 09:48
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 Man I hope Bernie joins RHCP onstage to sing All Around The World "Born in the north and sworn to entertain ya 'Cause I'm down for the state of Pennsylvania" speaks for itself "I try not to whine but I must warn ya 'Bout the girls from California" Kamala and Marianne must be stopped "Alabama baby said hallelujah Good god girl I wish I knew ya" Something about abortion restrictions I guess Almost too relevant to his campaign
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Jul 20, 2019 10:24
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Craptacular! posted:I think she’s more likely to serve a second term than Bernie. bernie should only run one term anyway. he should elevate someone like nina turner and she should be our next president (followed by AOC).
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Jul 20, 2019 10:30
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Gyges posted:It is very true that not a single unionized worker in any other campaign is unhappy. The Castro campaign is represented by the Campaign Guild of America. Speaking of, do you know why Bernie 's people aren't? Apparently they're affiliated with UFCW Local 400, a union for supermarket employees. Does anyone know how that works, wxa tly? I mean, I k ow, theoretically, unless there's a contract saying otherwise, any group can ask any union to represent them, but wouldn't you pick one affiliated with your industry or profession?
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Jul 20, 2019 13:46
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Epicurius posted:The Castro campaign is represented by the Campaign Guild of America. The Campaign Guild was started by ex-Bernie 2016 staffers, with whom he had a falling out (he abused his 2016 staffers even worse than the current ones)
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Jul 20, 2019 14:37
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Epicurius posted:The Castro campaign is represented by the Campaign Guild of America. You go with who you think will give you the best representation and fight the hardest for you. Last job I had was a desk job in a government office but i was repped by the International Union of Operating Engineers, and I assure you my job had nothing to do with construction or heavy equipment operation.
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Jul 20, 2019 14:41
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The Booker rabbit hole goes deeper than we thought.
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Jul 20, 2019 15:49
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joepinetree posted:This is nonsense. Every other campaign has unpaid positions. No other campaign is unionized. If the worst that we could say about, say, the Warren campaign was that after an increase in hours, salaried people were making a little less than 15 an hour and were asking for more and waiting for the campaign's response, I'd say that'd be pretty good. Instead, on one hand we have a very matter of fact, straight reporting that the Warren campaign uses a loophole to have unpaid staff positions, and on the other, labor "troubles roil" the Sanders campaign because he is only a lot better than every other campaign, rather than perfect. The Castro and Warren campaigns are also unionized, though I don't think they've finished negotiating collective bargaining agreements yet. Neither got very much coverage, presumably because they both did it months after the Sanders campaign announced it. BENGHAZI 2 posted:"Negotiations are underway" is not a story, it's the system working as intended Sure, but who actually cares about the headline? People who support unions are going to understand that this is a normal process and that Bernie isn't engaging in any anti-labor practices. People who oppose unions, on the other hand, are going to stampede to Bernie. It might actually end up being a net gain for him. The only people who are going to get into that headline are liberal false allies who pretend to be pro-labor but are nowhere to be seen when the time comes to actually help workers, the ones who think unions should only exist as an arm of the Democratic party machine and already hate Bernie.
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Jul 20, 2019 16:04
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Epicurius posted:The Castro campaign is represented by the Campaign Guild of America. It’s pretty common if the workers think that the union will be better for them. Lots of non-steel workers unionized under USW and lots of non-teamsters under ITU. Since I don’t assume to know better than the workers, I don’t see any issues here.
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Jul 20, 2019 16:15
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Main Paineframe posted:
No poo poo that's what I'm saying
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Jul 20, 2019 16:34
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Question to the people who talk labor: isn’t working these sorts of poo poo Jobs a ladder for people with a terrible employment history? If you have huge, gaping holes in your history I can see opting to do some kind of unpaid campaign job simply to show the next employer you did something. This has always kind of been my quiet concern with the labor/union politics, it seems designed to benefit those who already are in the system by denying opportunity to people who fell through the cracks in some way. (Edit: I guess in Bernie’s ideal world a jobs guarantee is supposed to address this, but man I feel there’s better ways to address poverty.) Majorian posted:And Merkel's been a terrible foil for Putin, I'm sorry to tell you dude. She's been pretty much unable to stop him in any meaningful way. Europe’s situation to Russia is sort of like the US with Saudi Arabia, except worse because at least the US can do a lot to use less Saudi oil. Ideally, Europe can say disapproving things about the Saudis where our hands are magically tied, and we watch their backs regarding Russia. Hasn’t worked out well lately, though. Craptacular! fucked around with this message at 16:54 on Jul 20, 2019 |
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Jul 20, 2019 16:42
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Craptacular! posted:Question to the people who talk labor: isn’t working these sorts of poo poo Jobs a ladder for people with a terrible employment history? If you have huge, gaping holes in your history I can see opting to do some kind of unpaid campaign job simply to show the next employer you did something. I'm sure those without a union wont be exploited.
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Jul 20, 2019 17:07
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Craptacular! posted:Question to the people who talk labor: isn’t working these sorts of poo poo Jobs a ladder for people with a terrible employment history? If you have huge, gaping holes in your history I can see opting to do some kind of unpaid campaign job simply to show the next employer you did something. Not really. Either you’re talking about the kinds of positions reserved for insiders already (the internship for the governor’s kid) or the volunteer positions that employers don’t care about and aren’t being restricted anyway. Campaigns don’t generally accept just randos for positions that they actually need filled, but they do for volunteers. Like the Obama 2008 campaign had a special volunteer team doing tech work. You already had to have a tech job to get on the volunteer team, they weren’t hiring the unemployed when they could get a google engineer instead.
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Jul 20, 2019 17:11
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I'm curious what the politics for the forum will turn to if/when Bernie isn't the Dem candidate in 2020.
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Jul 20, 2019 17:17
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A complete clusterfuck.
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Jul 20, 2019 17:19
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shrike82 posted:I'm curious what the politics for the forum will turn to if/when Bernie isn't the Dem candidate in 2020. Rationalizations for voting for Trump
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Jul 20, 2019 17:22
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The atmosphere here feels like 2016 "show me the map". Does Bernie not getting the nomination put a bullet in electoralism?
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Jul 20, 2019 17:26
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shrike82 posted:I'm curious what the politics for the forum will turn to if/when Bernie isn't the Dem candidate in 2020. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2pwS7oTU-sE
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Jul 20, 2019 17:27
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One reason I think Trump is going to win again is that the economic effects of his dumbshit policies haven’t come through yet, we’re still in the Obama economy so people’s checkbooks are either status quo ante or doing slightly better. Everything else is just stuff that pisses off people who are left of center, and that’s the major reason a lot of people voted for Trump in the first place, so mission accomplished! This is operating on the presumption that we’re going to have a candidate who isn’t making a competent economic argument, so basically anyone not named Bernie or Warren.
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Jul 20, 2019 17:31
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MSDOS KAPITAL posted:Au contraire I think guillotining the Sackler family would probably solve a lot of problems, as we'd apparently live in a society where we guillotine entire families when they harm the rest of us with their aristocratic bullshit. Now, I know, usually the death penalty does not work well as a deterrent but, in this case, I suspect we might find an exception, and I think it's worth the price in human lives (opioid oligarch lives, that is) to find out. I demanded the abolition of capital punishment in the National Constituent Assembly! But you who never thought this mercy pardonable, by what fatality are you reminded of your humanity to plead the cause of the greatest of criminals? You ask an exception from the punishment of death for him who alone could render it legitimate! A dethroned king in the very heart of a Republic not yet cemented! A king, whose very name draws foreign war on the nation! Neither prison nor exile can make his an innocent existence. It is with regret I pronounce the fatal truth: Louis must perish rather than 100,000 virtuous citizens! Louis must perish because our country must live.
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Jul 20, 2019 17:35
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shrike82 posted:I'm curious what the politics for the forum will turn to if/when Bernie isn't the Dem candidate in 2020. A non-stop fight over if you’re allowed to say the nominee is bad or if that’s helping Trump to point out when they gently caress up.
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Jul 20, 2019 17:36
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Craptacular! posted:When Warren was a Republican, many Democrats from the rural parts were racists and the party wasn’t 100% behind civil rights.
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Jul 20, 2019 17:42
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Main Paineframe posted:The Castro and Warren campaigns are also unionized, though I don't think they've finished negotiating collective bargaining agreements yet. Neither got very much coverage, presumably because they both did it months after the Sanders campaign announced it. yeah - the Sanders campaign unionized (with United Food and Commercial Workers) in March and agreed to their current contract at the beginning of May. Castro's unionized (with the Campaign Workers Guild) at the beginning of May and has no contract yet, Warren's unionized (with IBEW) at the beginning of June and has no contract yet
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Jul 20, 2019 17:42
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Ytlaya posted:I think Warren supporters are overrepresented on this forum and in political internet spaces in general, since her support among younger people disproportionately comes from more well-off whites. Lol the posts itt are 5:1 Bernie over Warren dude.
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Jul 20, 2019 17:43
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Trabisnikof posted:A non-stop fight over if you’re allowed to say the nominee is bad or if that’s helping Trump to point out when they gently caress up. It's this. The 2016 GE here was defined by a circling of the wagons and radiating buckshot everywhere any time Hillary was criticized using the justification of "you're lowering enthusiasm" and there's 0 reason to expect different if someone else comes ahead this time.
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Jul 20, 2019 18:04
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