|
Did they consider people that lived in the other parts Roman still?
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 03:29
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 10, 2024 12:14 |
|
|
No. They were very upset at barbarian westerners claiming to be Roman.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 03:32
|
|
|
Grand Fromage posted:No. They were very upset at barbarian westerners claiming to be Roman. Ah, but you forget the simple fact that Irene is a lady, and ladies can't be Emperor, and therefore the true Emperor is King Karl, and what if he married Irene, and then the entire empire would be reunited under his rule, and the Pope's all for it.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 03:52
|
|
|
FreudianSlippers posted:The idea of Greece is an modern construct Modern Greece first emerged about 200 years ago, so that's something to keep in mind. 500 years ago is still after the question of the one true Rome really loses a lot of its relevance. Jeez, apparently Macedonia changed its name to North Macedonia last year. That feels like it only complicates things further.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 05:53
|
|
|
SlothfulCobra posted:Jeez, apparently Macedonia changed its name to North Macedonia last year. That feels like it only complicates things further. Nah it's actually part of an agreement between them and Greece to stop slapfighting over loving Alexander. It's good progress.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 05:57
|
|
|
At what point did the Greeks stop watering down their wine? Do they still?
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 08:27
|
|
|
Ancient wine was like cordial in that if you drank it straight you're gunna have a bad time
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 10:58
|
|
|
Ancient wine was probably no stronger than modern wine. It might have tasted shittier but who knows. What was stronger was the cultural contempt for inebriation. Drinking parties were for entertainment and company first. When people started to get wasted (and they did), that was a sign that you had stayed too long for your moral health. See the end of Plato’s Symposium for a good example of what not to do (Alcibiades). In order to achieve that effect it was important to water the wine down or the party would break up into drunken foolery quite quickly.Eubulus’ Dionysus posted:For sensible men I prepare only three kraters: one for health (which they drink first), the second for love and pleasure, and the third for sleep. After the third one is drained, wise men go home. The fourth krater is not mine any more – it belongs to bad behaviour; the fifth is for shouting; the sixth is for rudeness and insults; the seventh is for fights; the eighth is for breaking the furniture; the ninth is for depression; the tenth is for madness and unconsciousness. Kraters tend to be pretty fuckin big. I can’t imagine a party knocking off ten of them in one night, even if 2/3 of what they were knocking off was water.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 12:05
|
|
|
skasion posted:Ancient wine was probably no stronger than modern wine. Yeah, it's not like people today are making weak wines on purpose - there are physical/biological limits to how much alcohol you can ferment before it kills off the yeast doing the fermenting, which is why you need distillation to make booze stronger than about 14%. If anything their wine would be slightly weaker since they wouldn't have scientific breeding of yeast strains. (Hmm, interesting point - did they have separate yeast cultures back then, i.e. a 'mother', or did they just rely on whatever strains happened to be chilling out on the grapes?)
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 13:43
|
|
|
Here's an interesting video on recent research into ancient wine production: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWVY2g0JyjI There's a lot more stuff on this channel, well worth a look. e: In particular, watch this one. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_fkpZSnz2I Zopotantor fucked around with this message at 15:49 on Aug 3, 2019 |
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 15:46
|
|
|
I’m assuming that’s just for rich people and writing to make you sound like upper class. People probably got shitfaced on the regular because what else you gonna do?
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 19:09
|
|
|
LingcodKilla posted:I’m assuming that’s just for rich people and writing to make you sound like upper class. People probably got shitfaced on the regular because what else you gonna do? I mean, he wouldn't have to warn against the fourth through tenth containers if it didn't happen regularly. People preach moderation today and we still have plenty of extremely drunk people
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 19:14
|
|
|
The idea of being an ancient alcoholic and getting DTs is terrifying to me
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 19:16
|
|
|
I’ve drank wine watered down 3:1. The result is a drink that looks like wine but tastes like water with a slight wine aftertaste. A pint glass holds the alcohol content of a single 6 oz. serving of undiluted wine. This was important because wine was the most common drink apart from water in these regions and was believed to help purify the water (which it really didn’t). Roman taverns sold wine by the sextarius (roughly 1 pint) already watered down, and it was common to pop in for a drink or two while out and about in the city to refresh yourself on a hot day.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 19:55
|
|
|
cheetah7071 posted:I mean, he wouldn't have to warn against the fourth through tenth containers if it didn't happen regularly. People preach moderation today and we still have plenty of extremely drunk people What's plenty anyway?  This is based on recent data of American drinking patterns. The standard drink is the same alcohol in a 12 ounce serving of standard 5% abv beer, 5 ounces of (undiluted) average 12% abv wine, or 1.5 ounces of 80 proof spirits. skasion posted:What was stronger was the cultural contempt for inebriation. Was it really though? In modern America, 60% of the population is consuming 3 regular beers worth of alcohol a month or less, with half of that group consuming 0 and another 1/6 of that group consuming approximately a single one per year.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 20:31
|
|
|
There was a Greek cultural complex about how only barbarians drink drunk, because they are unreasoning savages unlike us. That obviously wasn’t literally true even among the elite and there was a lot of is-ought fudging involved, see the above example of Alcibiades who gets wasted at one party and staggers into another to say very embarrassing things about his past attempts to get it on with Socrates. but while nobody of note in modern America is really out there praising getting shitfaced, also nobody of note is invested in calling drunkenness un-American. So yeah I would say that is stronger.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 20:37
|
|
|
skasion posted:while nobody of note in modern America is really out there praising getting shitfaced
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 21:28
|
|
|
skasion posted:There was a Greek cultural complex about how only barbarians drink drunk, because they are unreasoning savages unlike us. That obviously wasn’t literally true even among the elite and there was a lot of is-ought fudging involved, see the above example of Alcibiades who gets wasted at one party and staggers into another to say very embarrassing things about his past attempts to get it on with Socrates. but while nobody of note in modern America is really out there praising getting shitfaced, also nobody of note is invested in calling drunkenness un-American. So yeah I would say that is stronger. Un-American specifically, no, at least not much since prohibition ended. Ungodly? Unchristian? (and often considering being American to mean being Christian?) Very yes. poo poo there's still a pretty sizable amount of counties with alcohol sales banned, and many more individual towns that ban it even if the rest of a county doesn't. That's not the mark of a culture that doesn't have something against being drunk.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2019 21:36
|
|
|
As much as Prohibition didn't work, the Temperance Movement still permanently changed American drinking culture to be much more.. well.. temperate, heh.. than it had been before.
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2019 02:15
|
|
|
SlothfulCobra posted:Jeez, apparently Macedonia changed its name to North Macedonia last year. That feels like it only complicates things further. It's an improvement over FYROM, The Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia.
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2019 02:18
|
|
|
hailthefish posted:As much as Prohibition didn't work, the Temperance Movement still permanently changed American drinking culture to be much more.. well.. temperate, heh.. than it had been before. The bigger thing was it ended the pub as where our politics happened.
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2019 04:42
|
|
|
hailthefish posted:As much as Prohibition didn't work, the Temperance Movement still permanently changed American drinking culture to be much more.. well.. temperate, heh.. than it had been before. It encouraged binge drinking.
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2019 10:03
|
|
|
This data is pretty dubious. Basically they surveyed people, and used that to calculate the distribution of drinking patterns, but the total volume of drinks was about half what alcohol sales would actually suggest. So the researches then based the actual volume of drinks on alcohol sales. So if you said you drink one drink a week, they recorded that as two. And if you said you drink forty drinks a week, they said you drink eighty. http://whatifpost.com/no-10-of-adults-dont-have-more-than-ten-drinks-a-day.htm
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2019 10:04
|
|
|
I’ve bought alcohol that no one drank. It’s for cooking, you Philistines.
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2019 10:14
|
|
|
it's for sitting in the cabinet to look at and remind you every time you grab some gin that at some point you definitely thought you were gonna be Into Whiskey
|
|
#
?
Aug 5, 2019 03:19
|
|
|
If you have whiskey you're looking to get rid of I'll PM my mailing address
|
|
#
?
Aug 5, 2019 03:21
|
|
|
Grand Fromage posted:If you have whiskey you're looking to get rid of I'll PM my mailing address Pr..professor?
|
|
#
?
Aug 5, 2019 03:31
|
|
|
So I know that Tom Holland's In the Shadow of the Sword has lacunae, but I enjoyed reading about the Late Antique milieu and the early years of the Caliphate in a way that doesn't uncritically repeat the Hadith traditions. Does anyone have a recommendation for a different narrative history of the period?
|
|
#
?
Aug 5, 2019 10:01
|
|
|
Since I don't think anyone mentioned it, particularly severe varicose veins can cause dangerous blot clots, that's why you want to treat it ahead of time - at least according to a buddy who has chronic reappearing VV.
|
|
#
?
Aug 5, 2019 11:21
|
|
|
Friar John posted:So I know that Tom Holland's In the Shadow of the Sword has lacunae, but I enjoyed reading about the Late Antique milieu and the early years of the Caliphate in a way that doesn't uncritically repeat the Hadith traditions. Does anyone have a recommendation for a different narrative history of the period? I enjoyed In God’s Path by Robert G. Holland.
|
|
#
?
Aug 5, 2019 16:08
|
|
|
Tias posted:Since I don't think anyone mentioned it, particularly severe varicose veins can cause dangerous blot clots, that's why you want to treat it ahead of time - at least according to a buddy who has chronic reappearing VV. When I was in middle school the older dude who owned the card shop I hung out in after school was a patient of my dad’s. Bad VV issues which culminated in a lot of (relatively minor, in-patient) surgery after one burst when he was getting out of the shower and he showed up at my dad’s office (which was like half a block away - very small town) with a towel around his calf dripping blood. Take it with a grain of salt because it’s a 14 year olds memories of poo poo that happened over 20 years ago, but my tldr from it had always ben that VV can be more than just old ladies being embarrassed to wear shorts. I can’t imagine what that shop owner described would be fun in classical era.
|
|
#
?
Aug 5, 2019 16:39
|
|
|
euphronius posted:Basically Rome was the 1990s Chicago Bulls and Sparta was St Bonaventure. Does that mean Carthage was the Utah Jazz?
|
|
#
?
Aug 6, 2019 17:37
|
|
|
skasion posted:Ancient wine was probably no stronger than modern wine. It might have tasted shittier but who knows. What was stronger was the cultural contempt for inebriation. Drinking parties were for entertainment and company first. When people started to get wasted (and they did), that was a sign that you had stayed too long for your moral health. Then you have ancient Egypt where getting shitfaced was not only socially acceptable but a big part of their religion (in order to stop Sekhmet from destroying the world the egyptians held a party once year where you had to drink until you passed out).
|
|
#
?
Aug 6, 2019 17:58
|
|
|
I know this is history but the dead languages thread in SAL has ironically been dead for over a year. Duolingo is supposedly coming out with a Latin beta in September but I am very impatient. I am also poor. Are there any good websites or free/cheap resources to start learning Latin now?
|
|
#
?
Aug 6, 2019 18:24
|
|
|
Get a copy of Wheelock and start memorizing some declensions and conjugations to be ready
|
|
#
?
Aug 6, 2019 18:28
|
|
|
Alhazred posted:Then you have ancient Egypt where getting shitfaced was not only socially acceptable but a big part of their religion (in order to stop Sekhmet from destroying the world the egyptians held a party once year where you had to drink until you passed out). Man egyptian religion is so cool. Is there a good book that deals with egyptian life middle kingdom?
|
|
#
?
Aug 6, 2019 18:35
|
|
|
BIG FLUFFY DOG posted:I know this is history but the dead languages thread in SAL has ironically been dead for over a year. Look at the duolingo forums for answers to that question (I'd quote them but I'm too lazy to redo all the links): https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/8319291/Does-anyone-know-any-free-websites-for-learning-Latin (scroll down to slogger's comment and then keep going down). The Wheelock comes up a lot as well as Fr. Coulter's page: http://frcoulter.com/latin/index.html
|
|
#
?
Aug 6, 2019 18:49
|
|
|
JesustheDarkLord posted:Get a copy of Wheelock and start memorizing some declensions and conjugations to be ready If youre American I can recommend this, if you're British and intend to study elsewhere too, bear in mind British and American textbooks list the cases in a different order. It's not a massive deal but it did make memorising stuff trickier for me. British options are Ecce Romani (which is what I did at school, hence Wheelock throwing me a little later in life) or the Cambridge course.
|
|
#
?
Aug 6, 2019 19:12
|
|
|
Since someone mentioned it ITT I started listening to the audiobook of 'In the Shadow of the Sword' and really like the writing style and narrator. Since the goon who mentioned it used a $10 word lacunae instead of "flaws", though, I didn't immediately realize that the book was controversial until I started reading about it. Being a western atheist and ignorant of the subject, I have no idea whom to believe on this matter. Whether the author or the critics are the ones pushing an agenda, or whether criticism is inevitable for an unbeliever writing about the origins of Islam.
|
|
#
?
Aug 6, 2019 19:19
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 10, 2024 12:14 |
|
|
Benagain posted:Man egyptian religion is so cool. Is there a good book that deals with egyptian life middle kingdom? I enjoyed Akhenaten: Dweller in Truth. It's set in the New Kingdom, but it's the closest I know of.
|
|
#
?
Aug 6, 2019 19:23
|
|
