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MiddleOne posted:Hundreds is what they have. Yeah, and that sort of all out war wouldn't happen because it would mean the end of both India and Pakistan with hundreds of millions of people dead.
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Aug 11, 2019 22:55
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MiddleOne posted:Hundreds is what they have. Yeah but they won't fire the whole arsenal at some hills in Kashmir
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Aug 11, 2019 22:56
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I CANNOT EJACULATE WITHOUT SEEING NATIVE AMERICANS BRUTALISED!
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suck my woke dick posted:Yeah but they won't fire the whole arsenal at some hills in Kashmir I'd presume they'd try to take out each others military bases and capitals.
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Aug 11, 2019 23:03
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Hamelekim posted:I mean realistically unless they use hundreds of nukes it won't be much of an issue. Over 1000 nukes were tested above ground and we don't seem worse for wear. Hundreds of nukes going off in densely populated cities causing a pile of days long firestorms all at once is a bit different than periodically testing nukes in remote unpopulated areas.
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Aug 12, 2019 01:24
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They have about 300 something nukes between the both of them and they are smaller bombs than the height of the cold war. Main problem is the firestorms they leave behind.
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Aug 12, 2019 01:29
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I mean are we talking risks for people sitting on their asses in America or Europe, or people living in India and Pakistan in and around the main cities? Cuz hundreds of nukes between the two countries is plenty to destroy hundreds of millions of lives within a day, before any risk of another country deciding to launch nukes. But it's barely going to tilt up the beeping on a sensitive geiger counter over in Europe and will do nothing to America until the economic ramifications have time to propagate. fishmech fucked around with this message at 01:41 on Aug 12, 2019 |
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Aug 12, 2019 01:36
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suck my woke dick posted:Hot take: ethnic cleansing is historically the least worst outcome of losing an all-out war against your neighbours. Most wars where territory is taken don't result in an ethnic cleansing, they just result in the people of the annexed territory having to deal with being under the dominion of their new ruler. I always thought that usually the humans within an area are more valuable than the physical land they occupy. The idea of different peoples being incompatible with foreign rule is a newer one that so far as I can tell is mainly based around proactively attempting to head off dissent before it happens, at least so far as any of it makes sense (which it usually doesn't). But wow, that red text.
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Aug 12, 2019 01:37
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Grouchio posted:I also don't expect anything other than conventional warfare in Kashmir out of this. based on what?
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Aug 12, 2019 04:49
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Kawasaki Nun posted:based on what? Because if he worried about nuclear war he’d not be able to go outside, so assume the best!
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Aug 12, 2019 06:27
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Kawasaki Nun posted:based on what? ehh, the kargil war is at least a precedent
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Aug 12, 2019 06:34
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Dante80 posted:Are they also revoking the ban on settlement of Indians in J&K? Why? Pakistan has been settling people in its own parts of Kashmir for decades. But yeah, all the shenanigans about the "permanent resident" status are gone.
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Aug 12, 2019 08:21
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RaffyTaffy posted:They have about 300 something nukes between the both of them and they are smaller bombs than the height of the cold war. The main problem is the greatest humanitarian crisis in history combined with the systemic shocks of suddenly removing India and Pakistan from the global economy.
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Aug 12, 2019 18:26
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Helsing posted:While I tend to scoff at people bemoaning the loss of American global leadership this is certainly one particular situation where I'd rather have Barrack or even Bill in the White House rather than Donald.
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Aug 13, 2019 02:15
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Global Carbon emissions would lower by 30% though.
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Aug 13, 2019 02:34
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Methane’s a pretty potent greenhouse gas and the amount made by all the decaying bodies of humans and animals that didn’t vaporize would probably cancel that out and then some.
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Aug 13, 2019 20:12
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aren't there like several stages of escalation that happen before nuclear brinksmanship, i.e., a conventional shooting war which escalates to total war? i think indian tanks would have to be pushing on islamabad for a nuke to fly but idk
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Aug 13, 2019 20:25
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HelloSailorSign posted:Methane’s a pretty potent greenhouse gas and the amount made by all the decaying bodies of humans and animals that didn’t vaporize would probably cancel that out and then some. Counterpoint Radioactive Rakshasa Mutants
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Aug 13, 2019 20:41
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cargo cult posted:aren't there like several stages of escalation that happen before nuclear brinksmanship, i.e., a conventional shooting war which escalates to total war? i think indian tanks would have to be pushing on islamabad for a nuke to fly but idk Conventional war maybe, but the majority of cases theorized where the Soviets or US would have launched didn't have tanks anywhere near Moscow or Washington. Do India and Pakistan have anything like the US/Soviet Hotline?
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Aug 13, 2019 20:51
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cargo cult posted:aren't there like several stages of escalation that happen before nuclear brinksmanship, i.e., a conventional shooting war which escalates to total war? i think indian tanks would have to be pushing on islamabad for a nuke to fly but idk Or Islamabad is convinced India is about to, or already has launched nukes against them.
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Aug 13, 2019 20:55
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RaffyTaffy posted:They have about 300 something nukes between the both of them and they are smaller bombs than the height of the cold war. It's not a certainty that a nuclear attack on a city will generate a firestorm (which is a specific phenomenon and not just a whole bunch of fires happening at once), nor is it certain that said firestorms would inject enough soot into the upper atmosphere to block a significant amount of sunlight.
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Aug 13, 2019 21:27
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islamabad, from the south or east, may be the most defensible capital of any country with a coast. the pakistani government is not in any danger of being displaced whatsoever
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Aug 13, 2019 23:32
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https://twitter.com/devjyotghoshal/status/1161284598397116417?s=21 Good thread on the Kashmir lockdown.
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Aug 14, 2019 01:31
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cargo cult posted:aren't there like several stages of escalation that happen before nuclear brinksmanship, i.e., a conventional shooting war which escalates to total war? i think indian tanks would have to be pushing on islamabad for a nuke to fly but idk In theory yes. In practice hot wars between nuclear powers just kind of don't happen anymore because nobody wants to find out where the line is. Instead it's a lot of posturing, shadowy bullshit, proxy wars, and the like. The only way to actually find out where that line is is to actually cross but no major power wants "everybody dies, nobody wins" as the outcome for a war.
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Aug 14, 2019 02:18
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Note that during the escalations in Feburary both Xi and Putin both went "please don't go to nuclear war this would mess up everything." Tensions died down around that time.
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Aug 14, 2019 02:40
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nvm old news
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Aug 14, 2019 03:03
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i say swears online posted:islamabad, from the south or east, may be the most defensible capital of any country with a coast. the pakistani government is not in any danger of being displaced whatsoever Clarify please.
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Aug 14, 2019 03:11
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Darth Walrus posted:https://twitter.com/devjyotghoshal/status/1161284598397116417?s=21 so what is happening. from what i remember it was a muslim majority state of india that was given sorta special status and pakistan and india have fought over it. now that Modi the monster has complete control, he is closing off the state and probably ethnically cleasning it because he really hates muslims. am i right?
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Aug 14, 2019 03:12
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Dapper_Swindler posted:so what is happening. from what i remember it was a muslim majority state of india that was given sorta special status and pakistan and india have fought over it. now that Modi the monster has complete control, he is closing off the state and probably ethnically cleasning it because he really hates muslims. am i right? The ethnic cleansing hasn't started yet, but it feels like it's only a matter of time. You don't put one of your most fractious districts on lockdown unprovoked unless you're planning something huge.
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Aug 14, 2019 03:15
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Darth Walrus posted:The ethnic cleansing hasn't started yet, but it feels like it's only a matter of time. You don't put one of your most fractious districts on lockdown unprovoked unless you're planning something huge. i feel like if we had obama or clinton or even a fucker like W as president, we wouldnt be seeing this poo poo. cooler national heads would have prevailed and quietly forced modi to the table or to not pull something like this at all. but instead we have a facist moron who destroyed our ability to use soft power to solve these issues.
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Aug 14, 2019 03:25
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Dapper_Swindler posted:i feel like if we had obama or clinton or even a fucker like W as president, we wouldnt be seeing this poo poo. cooler national heads would have prevailed and quietly forced modi to the table or to not pull something like this at all. but instead we have a facist moron who destroyed our ability to use soft power to solve these issues. Clinton didn't want to use the UN troop at all during the Rwandan genocide.
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Aug 14, 2019 03:55
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tino posted:Clinton didn't want to use the UN troop at all during the Rwandan genocide. i mean Hillary but very true.
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Aug 14, 2019 04:02
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Mr Luxury Yacht posted:Do India and Pakistan have anything like the US/Soviet Hotline? Yes, Also one thing that complicates it is that India supposedly has a no first use policy, which is good. Whether the new government would intend to honor that if they got in a shooting war with Pakistan and somehow despite the larger military lost the conventional fight who knows. On the other hand Pakistan has repeatedly stated that if they were invaded and their conventional forces defeated they would resort to nuclear weapons to avoid defeat. The question would be if India stopped at seizing Kashmir alone if that would trigger their policy. Jack2142 fucked around with this message at 07:03 on Aug 14, 2019 |
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Aug 14, 2019 06:51
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Baron Porkface posted:Clarify please. it's inland and surrounded by mountains on three sides
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Aug 14, 2019 06:53
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Dapper_Swindler posted:so what is happening. from what i remember it was a muslim majority state of india that was given sorta special status and pakistan and india have fought over it. now that Modi the monster has complete control, he is closing off the state and probably ethnically cleasning it because he really hates muslims. am i right? The Indian part of state was made of three major parts: Ladakh (a scarcely populated area taking up most of the north, now administratively separated, Shia and Buddhist), Jammu (mostly Hindus) and Kashmir proper (overwhelmingly Muslims). The prince of Jammu & Kashmir tried to remain independent instead of joining either India or Pakistan. However, when Pakistan forced the issue, he decided to turn to India for protection, and so negotiated terms of accession that would give him a special status. India then fought with Pakistan to recover the state's territory, but didn't fully succeed before a cease-fire happened. Since then, Jammu & Kashmir has been split in two by the "Line of Control", separating the Indian-controlled zone and the Pakistani-controlled zone. Then Pakistan sold off part of its own zone to China (Aksai Chin), resulting in another line, the "Line of Actual Control", between India and China. The deal with the former princely state was basically that it had special temporary exemptions from the rest of India's laws until the territory was reunited (Pakistani-controlled zone gained back by India). Then the population could be submitted a referendum to see if they want to join India or Pakistan. In the meantime, it was forbidden for non-native people to buy land in there, so that when the day came, it'd be only the "legit" population that would vote. Of course, Pakistan was never bound by this, and had no problem settling people into Azad Kashmir and especially in Gilgit-Baltistan.
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Aug 14, 2019 08:06
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https://m.hindustantimes.com/india-news/restrictions-removed-from-jammu-kashmir-to-be-in-lockdown-on-i-day/story-uipRlSPJMkNLV5RqioETIJ.html Restrictions have been lifted in Jammu, but remain in effect in Kashmir.
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Aug 14, 2019 20:24
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Well, looks like things are indeed going to start escalating sooner than later https://mobile.twitter.com/arabnews/status/1162007827516465153
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Aug 15, 2019 15:28
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https://twitter.com/rajnathsingh/status/1162276901055893504 This is India's Defense Minister pretty plainly stating they're going to scrap "No First Use" of nuclear weapons.
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Aug 18, 2019 03:13
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https://twitter.com/sardesairajdeep/status/1163464967821103105?s=19 I wonder what dumb thing Trump will say tommorow about this. Two Pakistani civilians were killed by Indian troops firing over the Line of Control recently too.
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Aug 19, 2019 20:06
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OhFunny posted:https://twitter.com/rajnathsingh/status/1162276901055893504 Jesus it's the following discussion but instead of it being delusional loonies arguing for first-use of nuclear weapons it's a loving defense minister. Jesus christ.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cU-ITKrCr0I
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Aug 19, 2019 20:34
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Saw this pop up on my feed. How big a problem is this? https://twitter.com/NonWhiteHat/status/1163662091997331457
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Aug 20, 2019 05:09
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