|
Codependent Poster posted:I'm pretty sure the only thing he really wanted them to stick with was Scott and Emma staying together. Maybe, but I would think he'd prefer to have kept Xorn as a Magneto alias and not whatever weird poo poo they had to do to make him his own character.
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 06:22
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 9, 2024 15:56 |
|
|
CubanMissile posted:Maybe, but I would think he'd prefer to have kept Xorn as a Magneto alias and not whatever weird poo poo they had to do to make him his own character. Nah. There's a reason his story ends with Scott getting with Emma, and that's because it represents moving on from how the X-Men were and the same old tired stores into something new. Jean was the old and Emma was the new. Now of course Marvel pretty much ignored that idea, but at least they kept Jean dead and the Emma and Scott relationship for a while.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 06:37
|
|
|
Sorry, that was badly worded. I didn't mean he'd prefer the Xorn thing over Scott and Emma, I meant he'd probably prefer that in general over what they ended up doing with Xorn. The only thing I really didn't like about Morrison's run was the idea of secondary mutations. It gave hacks like Austen too much opportunity to do stupid poo poo. And I agree with danbanana that Wolverine and the X-men handled a lot of his ideas better.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 06:47
|
|
|
Byrne salt. Bitch.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 07:17
|
|
|
How's he supposed to use a bunch of ideas and concepts for Next Men if he doesn't like what's going on in X-men?!
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 08:31
|
|
|
Professor Xavier has been a jerk since the early 80s, so I don't get why he's pinning that on Brubaker specifically (aside from Deadly Genesis being really dumb).
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 10:02
|
|
|
I'm going to guess that this..Moria's 10th? life, is where she "figures it out", and House/Powers ends with her starting her 11th and final life, and her/X/Magneto working towards what she figured out for Mutants, with the ongoing series starting from there.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 10:02
|
|
|
Martinpale posted:I'm going to guess that this..Moria's 10th? life, is where she "figures it out", and House/Powers ends with her starting her 11th and final life, and her/X/Magneto working towards what she figured out for Mutants, with the ongoing series starting from there. This involves marrying Joe McTaggart twice as someone said to me which is urgggh
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 11:30
|
|
|
BrianWilly posted:I am still a bit concerned about the more human elements being sidelined, or at least not really highlighted, by all the big poo poo happening, which is absolutely a danger with Hickman. We still don't know why this whole Krakoan mutant unity thing even works. What about mutants with human friends and family, like Jubilee and Shogo, and Northstar and his husband, and the remaining -- I dunno -- ten or eleven Guthries? Do they just...not see each other again? It feels like a big issue to have to tackle, but with the following issues all probably having to deal with the Mother Mold thing I don't know how we'll have the space to tackle it. I mean I don't really see Krakoa representing mutant isolationism - they are operating embassies and mutants seem to come and go as they please (I imagine ongoing the fact they are citizens of Krakoa will afford them protection so even if they choose to live outside the Krakoan biome they retain citizenship) and remain integrated into the world economy. As was laid out briefly in PoX 2 this is about mutants claiming an equal place as a nation not about secluding themselves. Again though I reckon a lot of this will be dealt with in Dawn of X titles outside the immediate mini
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 11:41
|
|
|
wielder posted:I believe it's meant to indicate those red entries are going to be very important issues. That seems arbitrary tho. Was the Moira reveal more important than all the stuff revealed in PoX1? My best guess is that it's backstory only - everything takes place before HoX1.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 13:12
|
|
|
Web Jew.0 posted:That seems arbitrary tho. Was the Moira reveal more important than all the stuff revealed in PoX1? My best guess is that it's backstory only - everything takes place before HoX1. The Moira reveal is a monumental change to a character who's been around for more than 40 years.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 13:26
|
|
|
Web Jew.0 posted:That seems arbitrary tho. Was the Moira reveal more important than all the stuff revealed in PoX1? My best guess is that it's backstory only - everything takes place before HoX1. Considering that Hickman called it "The most important scene in the history of the X-Men" or whatever, i'm going with...yes. Yes, it was.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 13:27
|
|
|
CubanMissile posted:Maybe, but I would think he'd prefer to have kept Xorn as a Magneto alias and not whatever weird poo poo they had to do to make him his own character. Yeah but he made Magneto-Xorn actually Hitler, of course people were going to change that.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 13:28
|
|
|
Web Jew.0 posted:Was the Moira reveal more important than all the stuff revealed in PoX1? The hype Hickman and Marvel threw at the Moira reveal was literally "the most important moment in Marvel history." Nothing can live up to that, but given what it gives them to play with, it isn't far off. So yeah, that's how I interpreted the red: those are the big reveal issues. Because I am thinking about this so much... I don't have a copy of HoX #2 in front of me, but the "Moira MacTaggert: Trask Hunter" life was... IV? V? Either way, early in her reincarnation cycle, the "lesson" she learned was that the machine rise was inevitable. If that's the case, then shouldn't she- and Chuck and Mags- know that the attack on Mother Mold is rather pointless? And in retrospect, maybe that means that the "break the rules" decision isn't a revelation on how to stop the machine rise, but how to integrate with it. Which, of course, brings us back to X^3, where the Librarian (who very well could be Moira in the far future of IX, X, or XI... or VI!) is welcoming Ascension with the machine-based Phalanx. Of course, the thing that Scott needs to do may not be an attack at all... or at least not with the end goal of destroying Mother Mold. But that machine-society-integration seems directly contradictory with the Krakoa-nature-integration that House of X is supposed to be setting up. Jesus loving Christ, Hickman...
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 13:29
|
|
|
Teenage Fansub posted:Byrne salt. Wasn't the Reed thing something that was played with for the limited run series of FF v X-Men like 20 years ago and it was wrapped up in the same story arc with 'Nope, that was just something Doom planted to gently caress with the rest of the FF'? Or did they go back to that?
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 15:10
|
|
|
Teenage Fansub posted:Byrne salt. You'd think someone who has (had?) a long career writing comics would be able to read them. HoX #2 directly explains Moira's ability to change things via being "passive" or not. Also, his comment about graphs- a visual representation of information- not being acceptable in comics is loving dumb because 1) comics are literally based on visual representations of information and 2) comics have been using timeline graphs for expository reasons since prior to Byrne's career.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 15:17
|
|
|
The Question IRL posted:So in relation to the chart at the end, isn’t that a bit of a retcon? From what I understand the Technarcs, due to their ignorance think that they are create Phalanax but they are in fact just propagating them. Skwirl posted:Professor Xavier has been a jerk since the early 80s, so I don't get why he's pinning that on Brubaker specifically (aside from Deadly Genesis being really dumb). I think Brubaker turned Xavier from a jerk to a sociopath and most writers have followed suit. I guess it's not completely his fault since original 1960s Xavier was a sociopath but we moved on to Professor X being just the type of jerk who gives Wolverine demerits for shedding or gives Jubilee an unfair curfew and I don't like that things regressed. Rick fucked around with this message at 18:03 on Aug 15, 2019 |
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 17:12
|
|
|
Rick posted:From what I understand the Technarcs, due to their ignorance think that they are create Phalanax but they are in fact just propagating them. It does say Technarchs are unaware that they serve the Phalanax. So it could mean what you are saying. I still think that it’s a retcon from the days of Anhilation: Conquest, where Nova defeated the Ultron Phalanax by getting Warlock and another Technarch to show up.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 17:59
|
|
|
I'm expecting the upshot to all the stuff re. the Phalanx in this issue to be that the only thing that can avert humanity's absorption into the Phalanx singularity is mutantkind, and without mutants the universe is fated to become a single robot entity. The idea being, presumably, that regular life-forms can't adapt fast enough to outpace robot evolution. Hell if I know which life that's taking place in, but I'm pretty sure that's what's going on with the X^3 stuff.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 18:12
|
|
|
Neurosis posted:Wasn't the Reed thing something that was played with for the limited run series of FF v X-Men like 20 years ago and it was wrapped up in the same story arc with 'Nope, that was just something Doom planted to gently caress with the rest of the FF'? Or did they go back to that? There's probably an argument to be made that Reed tends to be caught in a similar cycle to Johnny, where he begins a lot of runs as distant and disinterested in his family's lives, and eventually has to refocus on them. Off the top of my head, though, there have been a couple of takes on him where he feels guilty about the accident and like he should've known better--that's a big part of the Waid/Weiringo run, for example--but the FFvXM limited series by Claremont is the only one that goes further. Even there, as you said, it's a particularly low-key Doom scheme.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 18:15
|
|
|
Rochallor posted:I'm expecting the upshot to all the stuff re. the Phalanx in this issue to be that the only thing that can avert humanity's absorption into the Phalanx singularity is mutantkind, and without mutants the universe is fated to become a single robot entity. The idea being, presumably, that regular life-forms can't adapt fast enough to outpace robot evolution. Hell if I know which life that's taking place in, but I'm pretty sure that's what's going on with the X^3 stuff. I mean im not sure the book is portraying "ascension" in a negative light? It seemed to me that the future mutants actively sought it out in order to advance themselves to the next stage of their evolution as a society - might be wrong but they seemed quite happy about the idea of being sublimated into the singularity
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 18:23
|
|
|
Rochallor posted:I'm expecting the upshot to all the stuff re. the Phalanx in this issue to be that the only thing that can avert humanity's absorption into the Phalanx singularity is mutantkind, and without mutants the universe is fated to become a single robot entity. The idea being, presumably, that regular life-forms can't adapt fast enough to outpace robot evolution. Hell if I know which life that's taking place in, but I'm pretty sure that's what's going on with the X^3 stuff. I am wondering if this is going to end up being the reason the celestials created the mutants in the first place.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 18:24
|
|
|
Dan Didio posted:Morrison pretty much said that he expected it to get retconned eventually and not to worry too much about it, because that’s comics. This is the healthiest attitude about comic books I've ever heard in my life.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2019 19:14
|
|
|
But then he goes and writes the final crisis.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 02:36
|
|
|
Dan Didio posted:Morrison pretty much said that he expected it to get retconned eventually and not to worry too much about it, because that’s comics. The ending of his Batman run definitely has a few elements that were a reaction the ending / aftermath of his X-Men run, with all of the toys going back in the box and Bruce Wayne winking at the reader while spruiking the next big event.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 02:46
|
|
|
Neurosis posted:But then he goes and writes the final crisis. And that and New X-Men are both stories about the medium in part, in different ways and at different times.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 02:53
|
|
|
Neurosis posted:But then he goes and writes the final crisis. Don’t know what point you’re trying to make. Final Crisis probably had the most positive ending for any event book.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 03:33
|
|
|
Hickman has made me excited about X-men in a way I haven't been in a long time. I'm reading Uncanny X-Men pre-lude to Age of X-Man to get ready and I had some questions. I heard it explains why Apocalypse is on X-teams in and post House of X. The Jean/Ice-Man in this comic are the young versions right? It is pretty horseshit that rockslide/armor/pixie/anole are getting benched in favor of these guys, because they should have more experience than these two. Has X-23 always been this excited about violence? I remember violence just being a fact of life to her, something she was born to do. In this she is constantly saying stuff like "a megalodon, do I get to stab it?" She just sounds more like Rockslide than Rockslide in this.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 04:01
|
|
|
Fritzler posted:Hickman has made me excited about X-men in a way I haven't been in a long time. I'm reading Uncanny X-Men pre-lude to Age of X-Man to get ready and I had some questions. I heard it explains why Apocalypse is on X-teams in and post House of X. No, the young X-Men were sent back in Death of X, it's the old ones so there's literally no one more experienced than them. Also, I'm not going to recommend reading Uncanny, it's not good and so far doesn't have anything to do Hickman's X stuff,
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 04:11
|
|
|
Anole, Armor, Rockslide, and Pixie having had their X-Men memberships revoked--seemingly from writer indifference--has pissed me off for what, the better part of a decade now? They're such good characters and have had growth and stories and they deserve more loving respect goddammit.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 04:23
|
|
|
Open Marriage Night posted:Don’t know what point you’re trying to make. Final Crisis probably had the most positive ending for any event book. Just that it's ironic because it indicates pretensions that he is making final lasting statements. I'm sure in reality he wasn't under any illusions there wouldn't be more crisis-like events, I'm not accusing him of actual hypocrisy I just found the juxtaposition mildly amusing.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 04:50
|
|
|
Fritzler posted:Hickman has made me excited about X-men in a way I haven't been in a long time. I'm reading Uncanny X-Men pre-lude to Age of X-Man to get ready and I had some questions. I heard it explains why Apocalypse is on X-teams in and post House of X. Ehhhhhh... maybe don't read Uncanny unless you want to kill that enthusiasm.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 05:21
|
|
|
You’ll poo poo your brains out when you realise the dual-meaning of the title ‘Identity Crisis’, then.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 05:27
|
|
|
Cloks posted:Ehhhhhh... maybe don't read Uncanny unless you want to kill that enthusiasm.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 05:37
|
|
|
Fritzler posted:Ok. Second Rec I’ve gotten to not read this. Is Age of X-Man good? I thought that was supposed to be decent and was only reading the part that led to that. I can just jump to age of X-man if that’s good though. Just loving read Age of X-Man, the build up ultimately felt like a whole lot of nothing.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 06:55
|
|
|
If you are really curious about Uncanny, just read a wiki synopsis.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 12:31
|
|
|
The main Age of X-Man story is fine, even if the central conceit of it really makes no sense at all, but most of the other titles are excellent.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 12:44
|
|
|
There's only a couple of the AoXM books on Unlimited right now but they seem fun. What wasn't fun was UXM #11, which was a 60 page slog of the worst kind. I didn't hate the UXM book prior to that- though it was extremely overstuffed and certain parts (I still don't understand what Jaime Madrox was doing) were outright confusing- but #11 was one of the worst things I've read in a long-rear end time and I don't understand how they "relaunched" with that book after Red was so loving good.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 12:54
|
|
|
Personally I am starting to suspect that Hickman is going to be playing with a kind of organic/inorganic dichotomy, between the organic 'tech' of Krakoa and the inorganic tech of the Phalanx. Mutants will end up being the midway step towards a life-based response to AI hives and group consciousness, possibly with some equivalent to the Eternals' Uni-Mind thrown in, or a callback to What If? V2's "What if the Avengers had lost the Evolutionary War?"
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 17:12
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 9, 2024 15:56 |
|
|
Fritzler posted:Ok. Second Rec I’ve gotten to not read this. Is Age of X-Man good? I thought that was supposed to be decent and was only reading the part that led to that. I can just jump to age of X-man if that’s good though. Yeah, just do that. AoXM was okay, but most of the tie ins were actually really fun.
|
|
#
?
Aug 16, 2019 20:42
|
|
