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peepsalot posted:With the whole multiple chiplet design AMD are going with, it seems like it would make sense to put some HBM in the package to provide huge cache of high bandwidth RAM. I wonder if anything like that is in the plans for future gen chips. HBM is high latency, but with corresponding REALLY high throughput. Basically ideal for GPUs and deep learning stuff. The latency is worse than DDR, and substantially more awful than any kind of cache. They'd be better off trying to figure out some kind of multi-level through silicon via L4 eviction cache that's still 5x as fast as main memory and just make that a module that the IMU talks to via like 12 dedicated IF lines. You can do some pretty stupid stuff when you have 3-5x the effective memory bandwidth for the first 1GB of system memory.
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Aug 14, 2019 22:27
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With the mention of RAM, I am curious about something: Given that it is (for realz this time) coming end of 2019 or more likely 2020, how likely do folks here think that something like an X570 motherboard would be compatible with DDR5, if Zen3 or such winds up supporting it? I saw it as, supposedly, having the same number of connectors as DDR4 in a recent article...but would that be enough, or is there some hidden thing in the mobo that would still nope the gently caress out of it?
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Aug 14, 2019 23:14
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Too bad there doesn't appear to be any L4 cache on the IO die. Wanna bet that this'll happen when the IO die will go 7nm?
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Aug 14, 2019 23:16
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dorkanoid posted:... not really worth it. That’s 2019 CPU overclocking in a nutshell. The only potential is now in optimising RAM bandwidth and latency because that can yield some surprising performance gains but it’s definitely not fun to play with primary, secondary, tertiary timings and a bunch of voltages. I hope future IMCs and memory training algorithms improve the way that turbo boost did with Zen, getting close to but staying within the stability limits so theres no performance left on the table.
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Aug 14, 2019 23:18
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CrazyLoon posted:With the mention of RAM, I am curious about something: Given that it is (for realz this time) coming end of 2019 or more likely 2020, how likely do folks here think that something like an X570 motherboard would be compatible with DDR5, if Zen3 or such winds up supporting it? I saw it as, supposedly, having the same number of connectors as DDR4 in a recent article...but would that be enough, or is there some hidden thing in the mobo that would still nope the gently caress out of it? DDR, DDR2, DDR3, and DDR4 DIMMs all have different pin counts and notch positioning. They are all mutually incompatible at the physical interface layer. Even if it turned out that DDR5 didn't need more pins for signalling, I'd expect the notch position to move, since that has clearly been a purposeful decision with each generation so far.
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Aug 14, 2019 23:50
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CrazyLoon posted:With the mention of RAM, I am curious about something: Given that it is (for realz this time) coming end of 2019 or more likely 2020, how likely do folks here think that something like an X570 motherboard would be compatible with DDR5, if Zen3 or such winds up supporting it? I saw it as, supposedly, having the same number of connectors as DDR4 in a recent article...but would that be enough, or is there some hidden thing in the mobo that would still nope the gently caress out of it? A current X570 motherboard will most likely not be compatible with DDR5 mostly due to physical reasons - the position of the notch in the RAM modules has moved around with each version of DDR.
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Aug 14, 2019 23:52
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Those notches are just a scam by Big Memory. Just dremel it off and your old sticks will fit in perfectly. 
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Aug 14, 2019 23:57
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CrazyLoon posted:With the mention of RAM, I am curious about something: Given that it is (for realz this time) coming end of 2019 or more likely 2020, how likely do folks here think that something like an X570 motherboard would be compatible with DDR5, if Zen3 or such winds up supporting it? I saw it as, supposedly, having the same number of connectors as DDR4 in a recent article...but would that be enough, or is there some hidden thing in the mobo that would still nope the gently caress out of it? DDR5 is 2021-2022 at the consumer level.
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Aug 15, 2019 00:56
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Is there gonna be a 3700 non X?
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Aug 15, 2019 01:10
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Silicon Lottery posted their binning results for the 3700X, 3800X, and 3900X: They are planning to stop binning/offering the 3700X and 3800X because everyone is buying the 3900X instead.
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Aug 15, 2019 01:21
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pofcorn posted:Is there gonna be a 3700 non X? I kind of doubt it. AMD's not really in the habit of slicing their stack up as thinly as Intel, and there's only $80 of space between the 3600X and 3700X. People who want eight cores and don't want to pay $330 for them are probably getting a 2700 or 2700X already, since they're like 80-85% of the speed of a 3700X for 60-75% of the price.
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Aug 15, 2019 01:37
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First, let me preface this by apologizing if this is not the right place to ask. I could not find a general quick answer thread in Haus. I also tried to Google this but there is an infinite amount of dumb poo poo to sift through. I figured this would be the best place to ask as someone here is likely to have experience with the board I used in my build. I have the Gigabyte Aorus Gaming 7 Wifi. I just purchased a 1TB Samsung EVO NVMe M.2 drive and the board has one PCIe 3.0 x 4 and one PCIe 2.0 x 4 slot. The 3.0 slot has the post at 120 and I need to move it but I can't get the loving thing to twist out to reposition it in the 80 slot so I can actually seat the M.2 drive in the faster port. Same goes for the PCIe 2.0 M.2 slot as well, it is in the correct position but it is so tight I can't get proper leverage on it to budge it out without risk of seriously loving up my motherboard. The post is not a hex shape either so I can't use the stand-off tool that came with the board to move it, it has teeth around the entire post almost like a gear. Anyone have any tips to get the ding dang thing out so I can move it to use the faster M.2 slot.
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Aug 15, 2019 02:09
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Did your motherboard come with a screw kit? The stand-offs on the ends are likely non-removable because the THERMAL GUARD(tm) is mounted on it, so instead of removing the one on the board you just add another one from the kit. From the manual: Follow the steps below to correctly install an M.2 SSD in the M.2 connector. Step 1:Get a screw and a standoff from the included M.2 screw kit. Locate the M.2 connector where you will install the M.2 SSD, use a screwdriver to unfasten the screw on the heatsink and then remove the heatsink. Step 2:Locate the proper mounting hole for the M.2 SSD to be installed and then tighten the standoff first. Insert the M.2 SSD into the M.2 connector at an angle. Step 3:Press the M.2 SSD down and then secure it with the screw. Replace the heatsink and secure it to the original hole
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Aug 15, 2019 02:29
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Actuarial Fables posted:Did your motherboard come with a screw kit? The stand-offs on the ends are likely non-removable because the THERMAL GUARD(tm) is mounted on it, so instead of removing the one on the board you just add another one from the kit. I thought that is what the problem might have been but I couldn't find the M.2 screw kit. I saved the box and all the screws. I will look again. Thanks, I thought I was going crazy. Edit: I found them, I accidentally through them back in the box for the Tomahawk board for my 2600X build. I feel profoundly stupid now, as I should. theSpokeyDokey fucked around with this message at 03:21 on Aug 15, 2019 |
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Aug 15, 2019 03:04
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theSpokeyDokey posted:I thought that is what the problem might have been but I couldn't find the M.2 screw kit. I saved the box and all the screws. I will look again. Thanks, I thought I was going crazy.
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Aug 15, 2019 03:10
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My Gigabyte x570 Aorus Elite also only came with the risers and screws that were already in stalled on the mobo. Which was actually two, because one was used for the drive and one was used for the included heat sink that I doubt my drive even needed. Still would prefer to get a matching heatsink if/when I put a second drive in down the line.
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Aug 15, 2019 03:18
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Khorne posted:Gigabyte often packs their board with individually packaged risers. You will have a bag with just one little riser in it. Then another bag with one little screw in it. Yeah it took me a minute to realize what I was looking at when I actually found them. It came with two risers and two screws, all of which was in their own little baggie.
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Aug 15, 2019 03:23
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peepsalot posted:Or is there some reason that this sort of idea doesn't really make sense?
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Aug 15, 2019 09:47
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Does anyones 3 series Ryzen chip blast the GPU fans at 100% during boot? (or not) Re this posted one month ago. https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/ccsi10/gpu_fans_spin_to_100_on_bootwake_with_ryzen_3600/ I've noticed the same with 3 different boards. Asus (X470), MSI (X570), and Gigabyte (X570) with 3700x's. Seems very... Beta BIOS? GRINDCORE MEGGIDO fucked around with this message at 17:27 on Aug 15, 2019 |
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Aug 15, 2019 13:52
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Any chatter about passively cooled chipset boards dropping in the near to mid term future? It seems the x570 does fine most of the time with the fan off. A chunk of heatsink should be an easy lift for manufacturers.
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Aug 15, 2019 14:50
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Eletriarnation posted:I kind of doubt it. AMD's not really in the habit of slicing their stack up as thinly as Intel, and there's only $80 of space between the 3600X and 3700X. People who want eight cores and don't want to pay $330 for them are probably getting a 2700 or 2700X already, since they're like 80-85% of the speed of a 3700X for 60-75% of the price. There was rumors of 3700 and 3900 non-X last week and today: https://twitter.com/TUM_APISAK/status/1161873349485584384
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Aug 15, 2019 15:29
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For OEMs, not surprising.
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Aug 15, 2019 15:33
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A low-wattage 3900X variant makes sense, but there's not much further down to go from the 65W 3700X before you have a mobile chip. It wouldn't be that weird to release a 45W desktop 3700 though I guess, Intel does have their S- and T-series. OEM also makes sense, considering that they might want the cachet of eight-core at a lower price point but wouldn't want to ship a last-gen chip for marketing reasons. Of course, anyone who wants a lower-powered 3700X today can just lower the power limit. The range is impressive, I took the limiter off of mine and it uses 165W running 16 threads of Prime95. Eletriarnation fucked around with this message at 15:40 on Aug 15, 2019 |
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Aug 15, 2019 15:35
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So riddle me this... Ryzen Master doesn't work here since forever, complaining about virtualization based security, telling me to disable this. AFAIK, a Windows 10 fresh install automatically enables it. I'd need to go out of my way to completely disable virtualization, right?
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Aug 15, 2019 16:49
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As far as I could tell, yes. I decided to just not use Ryzen Master instead.
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Aug 15, 2019 19:28
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What are the drawbacks to turning off Geardown mode? My ram is XMP 3600 CL15 and I had to turn geardown off to have an odd number cas latency. It booted just fine with it off, and I've yet to notice any instability.
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Aug 15, 2019 19:49
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Hmmm, ASRock released a BIOS for the X399 Taichi like three days ago, after months of nothing. Only says "Update AMD AGESA ThreadRipperPI-SP3r2 1.1.0.2", which doesn't mean anything regarding the upcoming TRs, right?
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Aug 15, 2019 20:21
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Sub Rosa posted:What are the drawbacks to turning off Geardown mode? My ram is XMP 3600 CL15 and I had to turn geardown off to have an odd number cas latency. It booted just fine with it off, and I've yet to notice any instability. Keeping it on might give you more stable memory with even CL. I know my ram kit will bsod as 3600cl16 without it.
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Aug 15, 2019 20:39
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When I upgraded my 2600X to a 3600X the other week I put the 2600X on eBay. The guy who bought it says it doesn't work and we'd already had a bit of a chat during the buyng process of the merits/debits of buying a Rzyen over an Intel dor gaming before he even received it, so he seems OK. When he replied on Tuesday to say it didn't work and to ask would I accept giving him a refund I said I would test it and if it worked fine (it was in mint condition, boxed) when I got it back I said said "Sure, l'll check that you haven't broke it before I refund you though". I tactfully asked him if he would mind telling me which model motherboard he was trying to run it in on the same message that I used to say I'd refund him if it was OK. I even explained the difference between a 1600, 2600 and 3600 and there being three releases sometimes involving a BIOS flash at each stage, depending on the board you're coming from and the one CPU you're going to. I was really pleasant and took time to explain. He's just sent it back without either telling me which board he tried to use and any acknowledgement that he'd read my quick lowdown on different generations/BIOS. It arrived today but, because I was at work, it's at the depot half a mile away. I'll pick it up tomorrow. Why do people that are enthusiastic about building their own PC's not even entertain the idea of flashing a BIOS? What's actually annoyed me is that it went for quite a high price second-hand. Not far from Amazon price. Actually, I've just checked and it's higher than Amazon price UK. I wonder if he's jst realised that he bidded too high for it and wants a new one instead. *large sigh* The 3600X is absolutely marvellous for a small gaming rig. I don't even know if I want to sell the 2600X for around £100 when I pick it up tomorrow and I know I'll only get about £100 for it. It just seems like too good a processor to go through all the palaver of selling it again for only £100. *sigh* Presuming that the guy realised he paid too much for it, why can't people just stand by their mistakes? It's just one of those situations where I really don't want to get wound up by it but I can't help getting would up by it. Should I be really, really, really nice to my mum and build her a mini-ITX Ryzen PC? It might be the only way to make me feel like it's turned out into a nice situation. I'm actually serious, here. And I can't justify having another PC at my place. apropos man fucked around with this message at 23:04 on Aug 15, 2019 |
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Aug 15, 2019 22:58
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Setup the new 3600 in an Aorus Master board and I'm very happy with the experience so far. Compared to my last pc, the now dead X99 Strix + 6800k it's been a hassle free experience. Performance isn't really very different but it runs a whole lot cooler and was free so no complaints.
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Aug 15, 2019 23:13
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Eletriarnation posted:A low-wattage 3900X variant makes sense, but there's not much further down to go from the 65W 3700X before you have a mobile chip. It wouldn't be that weird to release a 45W desktop 3700 though I guess, Intel does have their S- and T-series. OEM also makes sense, considering that they might want the cachet of eight-core at a lower price point but wouldn't want to ship a last-gen chip for marketing reasons. It could also just be a bargain-binned version of the 3700X with a 65W TDP. Like, 3700X may not actually be the worst 8C chips they have sitting around, and 3900 may be literally a pair of 3600 chips (or one 3600 chip and a chip that failed the 3600 bin). Same voltage and same TDP but you get less clocks due to lower silicon quality, type deal. AMD seems to have binned these things to within an inch of their life, they have figured out the exact product that will let them sell each die at the optimal price, +/- 75 MHz (as determined by SiliconLottery data). If they have 8C chips that failed the 3700X bin, why not mark them down and sell them? And I think it's pretty likely those chips exist - they have 6C chips that clock lower than 3700X, so there are probably 8C chips that don't clock that well either. And obviously there's nothing stopping them from just slapping two 3600-grade chiplets on a 3900, they have those for sure too. Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at 23:28 on Aug 15, 2019 |
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Aug 15, 2019 23:19
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Beaucoup Haram posted:Setup the new 3600 in an Aorus Master board and I'm very happy with the experience so far. It's probably the same as my 3600X, in terms of speed. I honestly think it's the fastest PC I've ever owned, which either: 1) isn't saying much, as there are faster CPU's out there 2) is saying a lot, in terms of how much it cost all-in compared to how much I've spent building systems in the past I've got a cheap 1TB Sabrent Rocket drive in there, some CL16 Corsair Vengeance 3200 RAM that I've had a couple of years. The GPU needs an upgrade but I'm looking. The thing just feels amazingly slick and snappy. I don't think I've had a zippier desktop PC in 20 years or whatever. So happy with it.
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Aug 15, 2019 23:23
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I wouldn't commit to it, but the X designation certainly implies they intended a non-X at some point. It could be that yeilds are good enough they don't see a need to release one. They could also just be waiting for sales to drop off before releasing a lower prices model.
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Aug 15, 2019 23:26
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apropos man posted:Why do people that are enthusiastic about building their own PC's not even entertain the idea of flashing a BIOS? Because there’s lots and lots of models that don’t have BIOS flashback and in many cases (B350 boards, non-MSI B450 boards) he’d have to pull the same thing on another guy to get a compatible CPU to do the update. “Hm, this isn’t compatible with my board after all” isn’t uncommon. I’ve sold two CPUs ever and had it happen once.
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Aug 16, 2019 04:45
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Craptacular! posted:Because there’s lots and lots of models that don’t have BIOS flashback and in many cases (B350 boards, non-MSI B450 boards) he’d have to pull the same thing on another guy to get a compatible CPU to do the update. Did AMD stop doing the BIOS flash kit thing where they send you a 2-core bristol ridge? Regardless, and while I realize this isn't a solution that will work for your mom, a USB SPI programmer with a SOIC clip is literally like $5 on ebay. It's just a flash chip, you extract the ROM from the BIOS and then you clip on and you flash it down. There is no board on the market that isn't using some SPI-flashable thing afaik, and in 95% of cases where it's not a removable DIP chip (all kits I've seen also do these) it's a SOIC. Again, not going to work for your mom, but vs paying $40 to have your computer store do it for you, or paying an extra $50 for the new version of the board with the updated bios, it's worth a thought. Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at 07:28 on Aug 16, 2019 |
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Aug 16, 2019 07:23
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Paul MaudDib posted:Did AMD stop doing the BIOS flash kit thing where they send you a 2-core bristol ridge? I think they do, but you have to prove to them that you own a board that needs to be flashed, then they send it to you. That could take days or weeks, when you can just order a CPU from Amazon and return it.
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Aug 16, 2019 07:31
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Paul MaudDib posted:Did AMD stop doing the BIOS flash kit thing where they send you a 2-core bristol ridge? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5nwOZkXDhI They still have that program, and they supposedly send you a 2C/4T Athlon 200GE nowadays, presumably because the Bristol Ridge chips are not going to be supported by the BIOS version that supports Zen 2. It does require that you send proof of ownership of both the board and the Zen 2 CPU, which could take a while if you're impatient. EDIT: https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/bvfo57/list_of_b350_b450_x370_and_x470_motherboards_with/ That's a user-made list of AM4 motherboards that supposedly support BIOS flashback, which would allow you to update the BIOS even if the motherboard does not have a working processor (or memory, or video card). It'd still require you to have a different computer to download the new BIOS and copy it into a flash drive, but at this point I'm thinking that's far less of an issue. gradenko_2000 fucked around with this message at 08:39 on Aug 16, 2019 |
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Aug 16, 2019 07:52
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How will I know out if a motherboard will work out of the box with a 3600? Just from manufacturers website? Or is there a list compiled somewhere?
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Aug 16, 2019 08:34
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peepsalot posted:With the whole multiple chiplet design AMD are going with, it seems like it would make sense to put some HBM in the package to provide huge cache of high bandwidth RAM. I wonder if anything like that is in the plans for future gen chips. A little bit of HBM would be perfect for a mobile APU (or any high-performance APU but the desktop market for such a thing can just buy a real graphics card)
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Aug 16, 2019 08:40
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I still don't get this aversion to chipset fans. The fucker runs hot, it's operating at 64GT/s for poo poo's sake.
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Aug 16, 2019 08:51
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