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luxury handset posted:they look very much like old (relatively, for america) purpose built apartment buildings, probably 6 or 12 units in the foreground and less so in the structures behind the new blue structure For the Greater Boston area, they were built post 1900 and up until World War 2 to allow for immigrant families to have housing, their purpose was to bring affordability and were the symbol of affordability for a long time in the area. But as time passed and Boston's real estate market got super hot, they have been passed down from Grandma/pa to the next family member who would be stupid to sell it off because...$$$$$. Something like the most triple deckers per square mile was in Somerville at some point.
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Aug 15, 2019 01:00
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This is a fun thing happening right now
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Aug 15, 2019 06:07
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If this works I imagine this is going to start happening a lot more whenever any transit projects are proposed. It already happens a lot in California through CEQA from what I understand. They really need to amend these laws.
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Aug 15, 2019 17:33
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Buses are so slow in Manhattan that if you are a healthy adult, it's usually faster to get out and walk. The only reason I take them is that I usually have my kid with me.
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Aug 15, 2019 17:37
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BarbarianElephant posted:Buses are so slow in Manhattan that if you are a healthy adult, it's usually faster to get out and walk. The only reason I take them is that I usually have my kid with me. I’ve always wondered why buses don’t have the right of way like emergency vehicles. Like, don’t give them the right to blow through an intersection, but making everyone else pull over for them would make them incredibly popular.
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Aug 15, 2019 17:44
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Solkanar512 posted:I’ve always wondered why buses don’t have the right of way like emergency vehicles. Like, don’t give them the right to blow through an intersection, but making everyone else pull over for them would make them incredibly popular. Ostensibly it's illegal to drive or especially park in the bus lane, in practice the design of the lanes allows cars to drive and park in them and enforcement is way below the level it would need to be to stop this happening. On a more theoretical level, it's because poor people take the bus and the threat of losing lane space or parking is the greatest human rights issue of our time to drivers.
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Aug 15, 2019 17:48
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Solkanar512 posted:I’ve always wondered why buses don’t have the right of way like emergency vehicles. Like, don’t give them the right to blow through an intersection, but making everyone else pull over for them would make them incredibly popular. there's really no way to enforce this as it only takes a handful of people not pulling over to keep the bus delayed. the better thing is to have a bus lane and keep it clear, but that's a big ask in many urban areas for lack of space, especially one as crowded as manhattan
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Aug 15, 2019 17:52
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There are also way too many buses (at least in the same places with a lot of traffic) to make that practical. Letting through emergency vehicles often requires stopping, pulling over and even jumping curbs so if that starts happening on a regular basis, any savings in time will be more than offset by the increased fatal road rage incidents.
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Aug 15, 2019 23:17
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Just make your city hostile as gently caress to cars. Extended one way streets, taxi/bus only areas where everyone gets fined automatically from traffic camera recordings, no unpaid parking anywhere, not enough parking in town period
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Aug 15, 2019 23:26
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I CANNOT EJACULATE WITHOUT SEEING NATIVE AMERICANS BRUTALISED!
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sat on my keys! posted:Ostensibly it's illegal to drive or especially park in the bus lane, in practice the design of the lanes allows cars to drive and park in them and enforcement is way below the level it would need to be to stop this happening. In NYC at least there's actually less than zero enforcement, as the police C O N S T A N T L Y park in bus lanes and bike lanes when they should be ticketing people for it.
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Aug 15, 2019 23:52
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showbiz_liz posted:In NYC at least there's actually less than zero enforcement, as the police C O N S T A N T L Y park in bus lanes and bike lanes when they should be ticketing people for it. And then Twitter banned the account calling them out for it. Free @placardabuse.
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Aug 16, 2019 01:38
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quote:"I was trained by lawyers who were schooled in civil rights," said Schwartz. "This is just like white lawyers representing black people in the South having crosses burned on their lawn."  We had an old guy on a similar mission to oppose a bike lane. He spent tens of thousands of his own money to get traffic studies done showing how apocalyptic the change would be. After he lost, he left the neighborhood and moved to Florida.
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Aug 16, 2019 01:44
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suck my woke dick posted:Just make your city hostile as gently caress to cars. Extended one way streets, taxi/bus only areas where everyone gets fined automatically from traffic camera recordings, no unpaid parking anywhere, not enough parking in town period ...sooooo no changes at all.
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Aug 16, 2019 02:12
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luxury handset posted:there's really no way to enforce this as it only takes a handful of people not pulling over to keep the bus delayed. the better thing is to have a bus lane and keep it clear, but that's a big ask in many urban areas for lack of space, especially one as crowded as manhattan I would say just have cops on motorcycles riding along with, or ticket people with cameras attached to the front of the bus. But I do get the points about problems in crowded cities. I think it might work better on commuter routes (city-suburb) where there should be enough room for cars to pull over in the breakdown lane of the freeway.
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Aug 16, 2019 04:11
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Bubbacub posted:
When I first moved to San Francisco I was sitting in a committee meeting and there was a small business owner who lost his poo poo about a proposal to remove 4 parking spots. He went off at this lady from the city about how a revolution was coming and the people would take to the streets and overthrow the city government because there was a war on parking being held by the city that would only be resolved when the people took back the power by force.
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Aug 16, 2019 04:15
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El Mero Mero posted:When I first moved to San Francisco I was sitting in a committee meeting and there was a small business owner who lost his poo poo about a proposal to remove 4 parking spots. small business owners are all, loving insane
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Aug 16, 2019 04:22
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if city councils could call a national convention there would be a 28th amendment to the consitution by now
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Aug 16, 2019 15:26
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pointsofdata posted:if city councils could call a national convention there would be a 28th amendment to the consitution by now There would be 10 million amendments writing zoning restrictions for specific lots into the constitution https://twitter.com/BrooklynSpoke/status/1162016063720218624?s=20
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Aug 16, 2019 15:38
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Badger of Basra posted:There would be 10 million amendments writing zoning restrictions for specific lots into the constitution ah, i see you are familiar with the alabama state constitution
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Aug 16, 2019 16:21
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Badger of Basra posted:There would be 10 million amendments writing zoning restrictions for specific lots into the constitution One of the things that made me realize that death is certain is how modest cycling infrastructure improvements only seem to happen in my region after someone dies. A big chunk of those projects are whittled down or axed due to complaints from the "but parking and driving are natural rights!" crowd. There are so few political arenas in America where they're not dominant, too. Benevolent Dictator 2020, etc, etc.
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Aug 16, 2019 17:51
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Badger of Basra posted:There would be 10 million amendments writing zoning restrictions for specific lots into the constitution My impression with Colorado Springs is that it’s long been infested with surburbanite chud boomers who hate things like necessary taxes to pay for road maintenance and street lighting, as well as change in general. Someone hating bike lanes because they think it’s a point scored for their political adversaries is not surprising.
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Aug 16, 2019 19:45
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Weirdly Phoenix, which is one of the most insanely suburban old chuddy cities ever, seems like one of the places now most determined to keep expanding light rail networks and public transit. I think it's because the city is now completely hemmed in by mountains and Indian reservations, so its run out of room to sprawl and has no choice but to densify. Converting traffic lanes to other uses causes so many people to freak out, even though the city has the most insanely overbuilt roads I've ever seen.
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Aug 16, 2019 19:55
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It's telling that cars even have a special part of the legal code for killing people. If you kill someone because you were distracted by a text message, that's negligent homicide. But if you do the exact same crime in a car, that's vehicular homicide.
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Aug 16, 2019 20:20
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Squalid posted:Weirdly Phoenix, which is one of the most insanely suburban old chuddy cities ever, seems like one of the places now most determined to keep expanding light rail networks and public transit. They're having a referendum right now to unapprove the light rail line they already voted for, so don't get so optimistic.
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Aug 16, 2019 20:51
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Badger of Basra posted:There would be 10 million amendments writing zoning restrictions for specific lots into the constitution I mean, the Supreme Court already legalized zoning restrictions.
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Aug 17, 2019 01:21
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Squalid posted:Weirdly Phoenix, which is one of the most insanely suburban old chuddy cities ever, seems like one of the places now most determined to keep expanding light rail networks and public transit. When I visit family out there I am always impressed with how rapidly I start to hate everything when driving on those hellscape roads.
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Aug 17, 2019 03:18
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My hometown is essentially a series of strip malls and residential-only neighborhoods connected by 4-6 lane freeways, plus a tiny downtown core that was totally neglected until a couple decades ago. There are also a few colleges, which each have a block or two of walkable shopping streets, but there aren't nearly enough of them. Sometimes I look at Google Maps and remember how awful it was to be a kid there. My neighborhood was 4 square blocks with 4-lane roads on each side, and as a latchkey kid my main form of after-school entertainment was walking a mile up the narrow sidewalk to the nearest strip mall. I never want to live anywhere again where you can't pop down to the store on foot for a pint of milk. And "scampering across a 4-lane road and through a sea of parking spaces to a gas station" doesn't count. An illustrative screenshot: 
showbiz_liz fucked around with this message at 17:33 on Aug 17, 2019 |
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Aug 17, 2019 17:29
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showbiz_liz posted:My hometown is essentially a series of strip malls and residential-only neighborhoods connected by 4-6 lane freeways, plus a tiny downtown core that was totally neglected until a couple decades ago. There are also a few colleges, which each have a block or two of walkable shopping streets, but there aren't nearly enough of them. Sometimes I look at Google Maps and remember how awful it was to be a kid there. My neighborhood was 4 square blocks with 4-lane roads on each side, and as a latchkey kid my main form of after-school entertainment was walking a mile up the narrow sidewalk to the nearest strip mall. Love how the majority of the town center is parking lots
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Aug 17, 2019 18:43
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showbiz_liz posted:My hometown is essentially a series of strip malls and residential-only neighborhoods connected by 4-6 lane freeways, plus a tiny downtown core that was totally neglected until a couple decades ago. There are also a few colleges, which each have a block or two of walkable shopping streets, but there aren't nearly enough of them. Sometimes I look at Google Maps and remember how awful it was to be a kid there. My neighborhood was 4 square blocks with 4-lane roads on each side, and as a latchkey kid my main form of after-school entertainment was walking a mile up the narrow sidewalk to the nearest strip mall. this is an example of an 'edge city', tho most urban planning terms are more descriptive than anything and not really all that rigorous https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edge_city basically "what if suburbs started developing their own downtowns built entirely on automotive travel modes at the intersections of major national/regional roadways". turns out it sucks a lot that same impulse you have of how it's bullshit to grow up in the suburbs? this is the reason millenials are piling into cities
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Aug 17, 2019 22:42
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you had sidewalks? and commercial zoning? places you could go? on your own? lucky 
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Aug 18, 2019 01:27
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https://twitter.com/jboehm_NEWS/status/1166546655778234368?s=20 Phoenix is going to stick with the light rail expansion that the Koch brothers forced them to have a vote on (they had already voted to approve it once).
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Aug 28, 2019 04:42
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Badger of Basra posted:https://twitter.com/jboehm_NEWS/status/1166546655778234368?s=20 good and cool. I think there have been several similar anti-transit propositions that have been forced in the last decade, but they all got defeated? People of Phoenix surprisingly not dumb
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Aug 28, 2019 05:14
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LOL there are like 3 people who are listed as supporters of the proposition while the list of opponents include 30+ organizations that span the AFL-CIO and other unions to the AARP to the Chamber of Commerce. https://ballotpedia.org/Phoenix,_Arizona,_Proposition_105,_End_Light_Rail_Expansion_Initiative_(August_2019)
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Aug 28, 2019 05:24
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In Hasan Minaj's piece where he covered the Phoenix vote, he mentioned its 4 out for every 1 in spent on public transit. Has there been any kind of study or modeling on how much infrastructure you need to have built up before the amount of stimulus the investment makes starts to drop off? I know the US is lightyears away from whatever that number is, just wondering if someone took the time to figure it out.
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Aug 28, 2019 22:40
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Dameius posted:In Hasan Minaj's piece where he covered the Phoenix vote, he mentioned its 4 out for every 1 in spent on public transit. Has there been any kind of study or modeling on how much infrastructure you need to have built up before the amount of stimulus the investment makes starts to drop off? tons - this is one of the primary mechanisms by which agencies can justify their funding requests to government decision makers, who then often have to ask the public thing is there's no specific number, transportation and land use numbers can't be simulated in a lab, and can only be gleaned through study of real world conditions in which there are a hundred thousand relevant factors to consider if you googled any specific project or city you would probably find public documents going over the cost/benefit of various proposals e: here's a recent one i found https://www.phoenix.gov/oepsite/Doc..._06-21-2018.pdf Mr. Fall Down Terror fucked around with this message at 22:56 on Aug 28, 2019 |
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Aug 28, 2019 22:52
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This vote also inspired me to look again at what Phoenix is doing planning wise and there was something. . . odd about their proposed transit expansion plans. Looking at it I gradually realized what felt off -- there's no central hub. This is a transit system designed for the modern polycentric sprawly city. Looks more like a grid than a spiderweb. Hope we'll get to see how it works once complete and the annual Koch funded vote to kill it won't eventually succeed! Looking at the existing system too I also noticed more than 50% of the area around the train line is still parking area. Doesn't seem like the city has relaxed parking minimums? I wonder if there's any plan to eventually change that. I don't know how public transit can ever be truly competitive with the car if they don't permit density to increase.  It's hard to see in this Google Maps 3D screecap but the train line is in the middle of the street. SRSLY Phoenix why even build a train if you're going to put it someplace that looks like that
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Aug 28, 2019 23:27
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Squalid posted:Looking at it I gradually realized what felt off -- there's no central hub. This is a transit system designed for the modern polycentric sprawly city. Looks more like a grid than a spiderweb. Hope we'll get to see how it works once complete and the annual Koch funded vote to kill it won't eventually succeed! so long as you don't need to make more than two transfers to get to your destination (ideally, just one) then it's as workable as a traditional hub and spoke system Squalid posted:Looking at the existing system too I also noticed more than 50% of the area around the train line is still parking area. Doesn't seem like the city has relaxed parking minimums? I wonder if there's any plan to eventually change that. I don't know how public transit can ever be truly competitive with the car if they don't permit density to increase. they could have already changed it. one of the assumptions that is often baked into upzoning proposals is that there's this great tide of growth just being held back by the dam of low density zoning. but what if we create an overlay district to eliminate setbacks and parking minimums and... the market doesn't really respond, because land is still cheap? it's a little hard to see, but it looks like that parcel (set of lots? what?) is zoned A-1 and is in Transit Overlay District 2 overlay map: https://www.phoenix.gov/pddsite/Documents/PZ/pdd_pz_pdf_00319.pdf more detailed zoning map, showing that the lot is subdivided: https://www.phoenix.gov/pddsite/Documents/PZ/pdd_pz_pdf_00324-f9.pdf per code: https://www.codepublishing.com/AZ/Phoenix/ in 627 A-1 Light Industrial District it looks like there are form based restrictions on parking lot area and design and no minimums, but really the worst part here is the setbacks (min 75 feet) turns out parking mins in phoenix are based on use and not zone, defined in Section 702.A.3.K. i can't really tell what the use is from the outside but the building looks closed off these mins are overridden by the TOD-2 district, which actually has a reduction in parking minimums quote:Reduction To Commercial Parking Requirements: so overall it looks like the current land use is non-conforming, grandfathered, and on the verge of being torn down and redeveloped anyway, given that on the detailed zoning map it looks like that entire lot has already been subdivided, i'm guessing for townhomes 
Mr. Fall Down Terror fucked around with this message at 00:00 on Aug 29, 2019 |
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Aug 28, 2019 23:57
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okay that makes sense. Also looking at some other areas on google maps I noticed their images of Phoenix are from 2017, and there's definitely been an increase in density along parts of the network since then. It's just been concentrated in downtown and the area north. It's just spreading slooowly. Years ago I read the book Cities in the Wilderness by Bruce Babbitt, who was governor of Arizona from 1978 – 1987. The book is about land use and natural preservation in the USA, and reading it I was surprised that even back in the eighties Babbitt was already grappling with Phoenix's sprawl and plotting how to densify the city. Unfortunately I've forgotten all of the details, but that kind of long term planning probably explains why the city has been so willing to fight for public transit expansion.
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Aug 29, 2019 00:22
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Squalid posted:This vote also inspired me to look again at what Phoenix is doing planning wise and there was something. . . odd about their proposed transit expansion plans. That map has got to be like 10 years out of date, I've never heard of half of those future routes and the south phoenix route we just voted on is the closest thing to getting built, IIRC. glendale voted down extending the light rail to their entertainment complex: https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/glendale/2017/10/23/glendale-city-council-kills-plans-downtown-light-rail/781004001/ This has a recent map including the tempe streetcar project: https://www.valleymetro.org/sites/default/files/uploads/event-resources/190808_nweii_public_meeting_presentation_final.pdf The hub is absolutely downtown phoenix, the current and near-future spokes are all massive park and rides at malls. Tempe/ASU is going to get good synergy with their streetcar project though. Downtown phoenix has been rear end for years though, and there's tons of empty/abandoned lots that people are probably waiting to sell for a fortune. It's happening, but not all at once and in the most desirable areas first. There's an old greyhound racing park that they just... put a permanent swap meet in the parking lot and let the building rot. Land was land here, and there's lots of it, until the light rail put a value gradient on the map for people migrating here that would rather not have a car.
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Aug 29, 2019 00:39
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hifi posted:That map has got to be like 10 years out of date, I've never heard of half of those future routes and the south phoenix route we just voted on is the closest thing to getting built, IIRC. glendale voted down extending the light rail to their entertainment complex: https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/glendale/2017/10/23/glendale-city-council-kills-plans-downtown-light-rail/781004001/ That map is almost exactly 10 years old, but I think it still reflects the long term aspirations of Phoenix planners. Notice that the more recent map is still just filling out the same planned routes on the old map. Nobody's building those lines through Scottsdale or out to Peoria in the next decade, but in the broad strokes they represent how things could look in the far future. That Gendale line might be dead for now, but I wouldn't be surprised to see the issue revisited unless uber or driverless cars somehow magic away Phoenix traffic. I think the Tempe streetcar highlights the polycentric vision of the future of Phoenix held by planners. A little loop around one of the edge cities. . . Still yeah you're basically right downtown will still be the hub of the system for the foreseable future, or at least it will be in 2023 when there's finally more than one line
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Aug 29, 2019 01:09
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