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Mercrom posted:The Epstein stuff is just about the rich and powerful being able to do whatever they want to the poor and helpless. Wait, is epstein the poor and helpless that got murdered in this or like, is he the powerful and rich that got literally murdered for being caught hurting the poor?
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# ? Aug 14, 2019 19:25 |
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# ? May 25, 2024 12:16 |
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:Wait, is epstein the poor and helpless that got murdered in this or like, is he the powerful and rich that got literally murdered for being caught hurting the poor? He got killed for potentially threatening people more rich and powerful than himself, ya dumdum.
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# ? Aug 14, 2019 19:41 |
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:Wait, is epstein the poor and helpless that got murdered in this or like, is he the powerful and rich that got literally murdered for being caught hurting the poor? Holy gently caress you guys are insufferable.
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# ? Aug 14, 2019 19:41 |
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Cerebral Bore posted:He got killed for potentially threatening people more rich and powerful than himself, ya dumdum. Presumably the women and victims that put Epstein in jail pose a much greater threat. There's no particular reason to think Epstein would cooperate with the investigation in the first place.
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# ? Aug 14, 2019 19:55 |
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Mercrom posted:I don't see what's "funny" about it. Russiagate and the Epstein stuff has very little in common. Conservative liberals want one to be true and not the other. Same but inverted for the c-spam communists. They reaffirm two completely different world views. Russiagate involves no power dynamics, and it blames the un-meritocratic success of Trump and his crony capitalist friends on foreign influence. The Epstein stuff is just about the rich and powerful being able to do whatever they want to the poor and helpless. What I think is funny is that I was repeatedly told by a number of different posters that the investigations into Trump and his campaign was going to facilitate a much larger national conversation about elite corruption and entanglements with foreign intelligence agencies. I argued that Russiagate would have the opposite effect and actually obfuscate those conversations. Now we have a scandal that really does implicate many high level politicians and public figures in some kind of blackmail or entrapment scheme that appears to involve foreign and or domestic intelligence services and yet some of the same posters who were utterly convinced that Trump was actively colluding with Putin have rediscovered the merits of skepticism. Meanwhile, more than a few media personalities are already trying to obscure the nature of this scandal by.... saying it must be a Russian op! (Also, saying that "Russiagate involves no power dynamics" is a bizarre statement that makes me think you must have some very specific or narrow idea of what constitutes a 'power dynamic')
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# ? Aug 14, 2019 19:57 |
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Owling Howl posted:Presumably the women and victims that put Epstein in jail pose a much greater threat. There's no particular reason to think Epstein would cooperate with the investigation in the first place. Are you somehow unfamiliar with the multiple sources who have come forward to describe how Epstein used secret cameras to amass an extensive trove of blackmail material on powerful people?
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# ? Aug 14, 2019 19:58 |
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Owling Howl posted:Presumably the women and victims that put Epstein in jail pose a much greater threat. There's no particular reason to think Epstein would cooperate with the investigation in the first place. Even if we assume that this is true, with Epstein being arrested we had a situation where a lot of very rich and powerful motherfuckers suddenly had a whole lot to lose, and that particular demographic hasn't exactly been known for cold hyperrationality when they feel threatened.
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# ? Aug 14, 2019 20:04 |
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Helsing posted:Are you somehow unfamiliar with the multiple sources who have come forward to describe how Epstein used secret cameras to amass an extensive trove of blackmail material on powerful people? have you heard of the multiple sources attesting to a piss tape?
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# ? Aug 14, 2019 20:24 |
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Grevling posted:Holy gently caress you guys are insufferable. First time reading OOCC posts huh? Been there.
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# ? Aug 14, 2019 20:57 |
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:Wait, is epstein the poor and helpless that got murdered in this or like, is he the powerful and rich that got literally murdered for being caught hurting the poor? Hahahaha ohmygod
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# ? Aug 14, 2019 20:58 |
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Helsing posted:(Also, saying that "Russiagate involves no power dynamics" is a bizarre statement that makes me think you must have some very specific or narrow idea of what constitutes a 'power dynamic') I don't understand what you mean by it either. I mean that the central conflict of Russiagate is between two powerful states. Secondarily it's between powerful politicians. I haven't heard a version of the conspiracy theory where Putin controls the entire US government.
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# ? Aug 14, 2019 21:00 |
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:have you heard of the multiple sources attesting to a piss tape? The piss tape's hypothetical existence is based on vague rumors and hearsay and originated in a dossier of oppo research put together by someone hired to destroy Trump. The Epstein blackmail tapes existence is supported by journalist interviews with Ghislane Maxwell as well as affidavits from multiple Epstein victims and actual police reports from raids on his properties. The fact you'd casually equate these things just emphasizes how out of your depth you are. Mercrom posted:I don't understand what you mean by it either. I mean that the central conflict of Russiagate is between two powerful states. Secondarily it's between powerful politicians. I haven't heard a version of the conspiracy theory where Putin controls the entire US government. Russiagate has been a conflicts between a heterogeneous set of players so of course power dynamics were involved. Questions like whether a sitting President can be indicted were literally central to the investigation, and the entire scandal happened in the shadow of a war between various forms of media trying to shape the future of their industry.
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# ? Aug 15, 2019 15:19 |
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Helsing posted:the entire scandal happened in the shadow of a war between various forms of media trying to shape the future of their industry. thats a good way of putting it
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# ? Aug 15, 2019 15:24 |
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:have you heard of the multiple sources attesting to a piss tape? Hello, which one of the many fine people recorded as having totally innocent fun times with Jeffrey at his family friendly island are you?
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# ? Aug 15, 2019 15:24 |
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Helsing posted:Russiagate has been a conflicts between a heterogeneous set of players so of course power dynamics were involved. Questions like whether a sitting President can be indicted were literally central to the investigation, and the entire scandal happened in the shadow of a war between various forms of media trying to shape the future of their industry.
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# ? Aug 15, 2019 20:15 |
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Perry Mason Jar posted:First time reading OOCC posts huh? Been there. OOCC and RussiaGate truthers in general have become irrevocable victims of hypernormalisation guys. It’s not worth it. Helsing posted:What's really funny is that the same crew of posters who kept insisting that the Russiagate investigation would totally facilitate a larger discussion about elite corruption and entanglement with foreign intelligence agencies are suddenly extremely eager to downplay one of the most explosive scandals in American history, a scandal that actually does threaten to blow the lid off some of the kinds of actions that the Russiagaters were supposedly hyper concerned and vigilant about. The denialism is insane with these people. There’s literal evidence of a goddamn pedophile rape island for the elite hardwired with video and audio equipment in it. Then there’s the black book. The Igor stuff. The broken neck bones typically found in homicide strangulation. The non-guard working the night Epstein died. The big loving murdercop in the prison. The court depositions/documents from the victims about Epstein and his network. Epstein loving an underage girl in the goddamn prison right before he died. The 4chan post from the prison. Epstein getting off essentially Scott free a decade ago. No guys, Epstein killed himself because prison sucks. He was a lone predator. -liberals/MSM
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# ? Aug 16, 2019 00:24 |
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Helsing posted:What's really funny is that the same crew of posters who kept insisting that the Russiagate investigation would totally facilitate a larger discussion about elite corruption and entanglement with foreign intelligence agencies are suddenly extremely eager to downplay one of the most explosive scandals in American history, a scandal that actually does threaten to blow the lid off some of the kinds of actions that the Russiagaters were supposedly hyper concerned and vigilant about. I would have a greater chill about it if the dividing lines were not so ruler loving straight. The demographics aren't 100% exact, but they're much closer than they're far apart and the transparency of the bullshit is infuriating. After a suspicious cell transfer and during a camera malfunction he had no way of knowing it was going on, a guy with information that could bring down 400 of the fortune 500 and considerable Mossad connections (and presumably CIA connections foremost) tied a length of something we don't know what it is to a doorknob that doesn't exist in SHU units and sat down so hard he broke his neck in three places. Also trust the exact three-letter agencies tangential to this event when they say the parts they redacted out of the Mueller report are the really big proof of Russian interference and we need to get really excited about it.
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# ? Aug 16, 2019 06:03 |
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I think our intelligence agencies want his honeypot.
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# ? Aug 16, 2019 17:00 |
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There may or may not be a pisstape, but Hope Hicks talking about the piss tape now is a lie. I haven't see this debunked yet and goddamn everything. https://twitter.com/soychicka/status/1151885738738356224?s=20
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# ? Aug 16, 2019 18:02 |
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quote:Conspiracy Theories About Jeffrey Epstein’s Suicide Harm Kids
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# ? Aug 16, 2019 19:39 |
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Good article!
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# ? Aug 16, 2019 21:17 |
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Oh no the kids might question authority this is terrible
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# ? Aug 16, 2019 22:07 |
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Epstein trained for years to be able to kneel with enough force to shatter multiple bones in his neck
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# ? Aug 16, 2019 22:17 |
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeQUlr4Xc3s&t=6s
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# ? Aug 16, 2019 23:38 |
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Willie Tomg posted:I would have a greater chill about it if the dividing lines were not so ruler loving straight. The demographics aren't 100% exact, but they're much closer than they're far apart and the transparency of the bullshit is infuriating. Is it OK if we believe in Russiagate and Epstein murder?
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# ? Aug 17, 2019 05:26 |
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be careful, there's this utterly insane conspiracy theory going around that jeffrey epstein committed suicide
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# ? Aug 17, 2019 10:42 |
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So I've been thinking about this Epstein thing, largely along the same lines as Ice Phisherman's posts on it in USPOL and it raises some... possibilities: This guy cultivated his honeypot on his own or it evoled out of things that create tribal identity amoung the rich to become a billionaire and it has fallen apart and he has committed suicide (or one of the marks offed him.) This guy cultivated his honeypot on his own to become a billionaire or it evoled out of things that create tribal identity amoung the rich and a state actor is taking advantage of his demise (or caused it) to snag it. This guy cultivated his honeypot with the help of a state and a state actor (the same or another state) is taking advantage of his demise (or caused it) snag it. When I think, well who has it now? I mean all we've gotten in the new is leaked names, plane manifests, etc. Who has the hard stuff the things like images, video, etc. I mean a Billionaire isn't going to give power of attorney to a blackmailer over a name appearing on a loving flight manifest. Given that it's the FBI that searched his homes and it's been reported they found large numbers of images (though the news only reports images of the victims), I'd assume the US has it all now?
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# ? Aug 17, 2019 21:32 |
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https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/1163112167421468673?s=21
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# ? Aug 18, 2019 19:22 |
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There is a difference between conservative political romantism and revolutionary political romantism even if they work together and are both loving terrible.
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# ? Aug 18, 2019 20:15 |
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Oh gently caress off Glenn.
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# ? Aug 18, 2019 21:07 |
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lol at the idea of lecturing Glenn Greenwald, who is actually, materially, threatened by a bona fide Nazi dictatorship for uncovering its crimes, about fighting fascism.
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# ? Aug 18, 2019 21:52 |
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I will never get the huge boner for the libertarian.
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# ? Aug 18, 2019 22:18 |
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he's really good at getting people to talk about him. in this case that take is just terrible though, one of the worst tweets ive ever seen
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# ? Aug 19, 2019 00:43 |
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BrandorKP posted:I will never get the huge boner for the libertarian. He hasn't been a libertarian for many years now. Stuff like this kinda reinforces my perception that 90% of the bizarre hate boner people have for that guy is due to people going off some vague baseless perception that he's a right-winger*. It's always been obvious that the real source for the negative sentiment is that he pushes back against the US government and security state, and all the other criticism people levy at him (which is generally a mix of valid and dumb things) is just dug up to justify that initial negative reaction. Since any remotely honest look at the guy comes out with him looking better than the vast majority of other media figures who don't receive a fraction of the same negative attention, it's obvious that this isn't just some organic thing. * the kind of amusing thing about this is that these people seem to be looking at literally the only good thing in libertarian ideology (reflexive distrust and skepticism towards the US security state and foreign policy) and using that association to tar those opinions as somehow being right-wing
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# ? Aug 19, 2019 01:41 |
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it's a complete non sequitur response to people protesting fash in their communities though. it really comes off like he has no idea what he's talking about
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# ? Aug 19, 2019 02:06 |
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Ytlaya posted:He hasn't been a libertarian for many years now. Why would people who think that someone who appears as a fairly regular guest on the show of noted fascist Tucker Carlson might be right winger indeed.
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# ? Aug 19, 2019 02:09 |
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Ytlaya posted:He hasn't been a libertarian for many years now. I don't think that's it. I think it's the fact that he's a journalist who defends free speech ideologically, which has become right-wing thing because everything political has to be binary. He's kind of like Sam Harris who took up the now right-wing pet cause of criticizing religion and now surrounds himself with fascists partly because people like Glenn Greenwald on the left keep saying he's advocating nuclear genocide of the middle east.
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# ? Aug 19, 2019 11:12 |
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Zas posted:it's a complete non sequitur response to people protesting fash in their communities though. it really comes off like he has no idea what he's talking about Based on listening to Greenwald a little bit recently, he's talked about how Bolsanaro won in Brazil because people (including many of Greenwald's own gay/poor/brown friends) were so disillusioned by the reigning neoliberal order that in their desperation they turned to the one guy who was promising Change. I can't speak to how accurate that is for the Brazilian situation, but I think it's pretty clear he's extending that view to the USA--that the Nazi Chuds are just the inevitable, and perhaps genuinely desperate and downtrodden, fruit of the evil soil of neoliberalism. I think that's a pretty blinkered view in a lot of ways; for the most part Trump's people are the same old middle class GOP assholes who voted for Romney and Bush. And I wouldn't call those racist scumbags the "least powerful" constituency; they're all part of the same system that's, you know, putting people in concentration camps. In any event I can hardly blame someone for getting more worked up over the dudes talking about wanting to murder them than Google having contracts with the DOD or whatever the gently caress Glenn's on about. Greenwald's major problem from what I can tell is he has no real broader political philosophy so he just kind of goes off on his particular bugbears; those bugbears are valid targets but his dumb rear end contrarianism causes him to then dismiss anything he's not currently mad at.
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# ? Aug 19, 2019 11:19 |
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OJ MIST 2 THE DICK posted:Why would people who think that someone who appears as a fairly regular guest on the show of noted fascist Tucker Carlson might be right winger indeed. Well of course it would be too easy to go after a target like Tucker Carlson,
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# ? Aug 19, 2019 12:01 |
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# ? May 25, 2024 12:16 |
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VitalSigns posted:Well of course it would be too easy to go after a target like Tucker Carlson, Yeah, Glenn will never actually poo poo on a fellow rich media personality. He's not really fighting Bolsonaro in any real sense in any case, he just whines from his ivory tower, similar to the #resistance because bourgeois 'journalism' is a waste of time.
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# ? Aug 19, 2019 12:57 |