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 Honestly the part that kinda annoys me most about the retconned Discovery TOS Enterprise bridge is... even if you had to have a big shiny reflective dark tron design, would it have killed you to make the displays yellow/red/orange/green like TOS instead of BLUE BLUE ALL COMPUTERS ARE BLUE IN THE FUTURE. They clearly actually thought about it, added the tiny displays up the top of the bridge as a 'tribute', and then went back to doing their own drat thing. Oh god I'm turning into one of those trekkies. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 12:13 on Aug 19, 2019 |
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Aug 19, 2019 12:08
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I wonder if they have to go in and mask out crew reflections in non fx shots on those sets.
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Aug 19, 2019 13:01
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Grand Fromage posted:Okay except the education. Yeah it's like they were right on everything but they thought it would all be positive. In reality if anyone from the 70s saw today they would think we were living in a dystopia...
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Aug 19, 2019 13:17
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If Insurrection was an episode of TNG, I would've skipped it on rewatch. But goddamn, does the Sirtis/Frakes commentary make it worth it. I'd pay real money for cast members to do these for all the TNG movies. Throw in a little extra to get them sloshed.
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Aug 19, 2019 13:38
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MikeJF posted:I was imagining slightly more. Do what the designers might've done if they'd hada access to modern set and displays. Like, just a quick scribble You've just described exactly what I was trying to say. Completely 1:1 between your post and my daydreams. If I was going to make any extreme change it might be to add the TMP/TWOK weapons console nook. But that thing's existence i think only really makes sense depending on the ship's mission profile. I always thought that the TOS connie was only lightly armed, mostly a long range explorer on a mission of peace. And then the refit occurs during a more militarized time in starfleet, what with all the extra phaser banks and retrofitting the huge torpedo launchers etc. Which actually makes the history of the refit very interesting because over a ten year period you see that military bent get more and more extreme as the relations with the klingons gets worse. 1701 refit started it's career with very luxurious fittings and large areas given over to recreation, but 1701-A is all barebones steel plate. Hell, the A doesn't even get the redesigned cargo/shuttle bay, suggesting they'd cut back the refit program significantly. But I digress. MikeJF posted:
The cliche blue computers are annoying because the first thing you'd think would be "this would give me so much contrast to display key information in different colours", but no, nothing. HorseLord fucked around with this message at 13:53 on Aug 19, 2019 |
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Aug 19, 2019 13:42
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All this talk of bridge design.. Nothing can be worse in recant memory then the design of the command deck/room/whatever on the ship in Netflix's Another Life. its pretty much a long room with nothing in it bar an out of place small round "bar" style table and a few wall mounted bucket seats which are placed nowhere near any of the controls in the room. There is a place for "manual control" but that is just a nondescript "glass bubble" type thing at the front of the ship. Its about a zero effort as it gets for set design/dressing etc, I've seen better done in any 80's low budget sci flicks you could mention probably.
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Aug 19, 2019 14:14
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I do really like the corridor that runs around the outside of the Discoprise bridge. It’s a nice design touch that spaces out the bridge.
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Aug 19, 2019 14:15
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I think that was matt jeffries original intent, he spoke a lot about how equipment was mounted all stupid inside bomber planes, and how if you had any sense you'd make it so that if anything was broken you could just replace it from the other side. That way the operator wouldn't have to get out of his chair. What makes me laugh a little is that they put the empty space next to spock's science console. In a lot of shots in TOS they'd remove the console that was there in order to fit the camera there, but accidentally zoom out just enough to notice that they'd done so. So the missing console is now official canon.
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Aug 19, 2019 14:53
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The shiny reflective black floor is making me angry
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Aug 19, 2019 15:14
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They change it when some Yeomans realize Kirk is looking up their skirts
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Aug 19, 2019 15:23
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The D is obviously the best bridge but BSG's was also great, a different take that looked old and militaristic and battered but was great on camera. They did a great job of updating it for the Pegasus too. And I also have to give the show massive props for actually keeping the new ship around for a while! They didn't blow it up right away! Amazing! I went to a con where Eddie Olmos was speaking, and you could tell he loved the show. At the end of his talk, he said "so say we all" and we all smiled, some repeated it back, it was cute. Then he said it again, a bit tougher, "so say we all" and then we all chanted it back. Then he yelled at us "so say we all!" and the whole room stood up and saluted "so say we all!" because suddenly here was Adama yelling at you and it loving owned
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Aug 19, 2019 16:25
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Alan_Shore posted:The D is obviously the best bridge Absolutely not. worf is getting a bad back from leaning over his station all day, and the helm is so far from the command chairs that riker has to walk halfway across the room just to put his feet on it.
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Aug 19, 2019 16:29
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Alan_Shore posted:The D is obviously the best bridge Funny way of spelling Enterprise-A.
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Aug 19, 2019 16:37
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Imagine where you'd want to be stationed for 8 hours. The D is pure luxury. Plus standing and walking are healthy!
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Aug 19, 2019 16:40
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"Muse" was a good episode of Voyager. I like the episodes where they infiltrate pre-warp civilizations.
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Aug 19, 2019 16:42
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I want the D. I want it so bad
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Aug 19, 2019 17:11
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Tighclops posted:I want the D. I want it so bad Separated or unseparated?
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Aug 19, 2019 17:13
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The Enterprise-A bridge layout is probably technically better but I still prefer the TMP/TWOK bridge layout. I'm irrationally fond of the circular displays and the mix of video/non-video display elements, and I'm definitely a fan of physical, tactile controls. Also it's a little annoying how many of the video displays on the -A bridge are showing the exact same loop, and while I appreciate the LCARS concept for TNG, I don't entirely care for its ST6 incarnation.Alan_Shore posted:The D is obviously the best bridge but BSG's was also great, a different take that looked old and militaristic and battered but was great on camera. They did a great job of updating it for the Pegasus too. And I also have to give the show massive props for actually keeping the new ship around for a while! They didn't blow it up right away! Amazing! The Pegasus sets were all redresses of leftover sets from a failed Lost in Space reboot pilot. BSG wouldn't have been able to afford them otherwise.
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Aug 19, 2019 17:21
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I love the giant sweeping curved helm from the Enterprise-A and the general vibe of the place.Alan_Shore posted:The D is obviously the best bridge but BSG's was also great, a different take that looked old and militaristic and battered but was great on camera. They did a great job of updating it for the Pegasus too. And I also have to give the show massive props for actually keeping the new ship around for a while! They didn't blow it up right away! Amazing! Love Galactica's CIC but disagree on Pegasus, it always felt a bit cheap how small and empty and unstructured it was. It was just like a little alcove off a corridor with a table in it. I know it was meant to be more automated and all, but it just felt silly how much littler it was. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 17:31 on Aug 19, 2019 |
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Aug 19, 2019 17:27
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skasion posted:Separated or unseparated? Oh god, don't start a separation debate
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Aug 19, 2019 17:30
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Alan_Shore posted:Imagine where you'd want to be stationed for 8 hours. Sat in a chair instead of leaning on a wooden rail?
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Aug 19, 2019 17:50
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HorseLord posted:I always thought that the TOS connie was only lightly armed, mostly a long range explorer on a mission of peace. They had enough firepower to destroy gods and go toe-to-toe with just about any enemy ship. The TOS Connie was definitely not "lightly armed."
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Aug 19, 2019 17:50
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Aug 19, 2019 17:52
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Son of Sam-I-Am posted:They had enough firepower to destroy gods and go toe-to-toe with just about any enemy ship. The TOS Connie was definitely not "lightly armed." Oh yeah, it can dump a very large amount of energy into all two of it's phasers, which it can only fire while sitting perfectly still or going in a straight line, because the helmsman has to stop doing his actual job in order to fire them. The refit has 12 in pairs of 2 on the saucer alone, a double barreled torpedo launcher, and a dedicated full time gunner to operate it all. Just about all we can say is that we never saw another TOS era starfleet ship class for which to compare to. We do know the spindly neck and engine pylons are massive obvious vulnerabilities that make it unsuitable for a battleship, and that even post-refit it's outgunned by poo poo like the perennial cannon fodder Miranda class (hello rear torpedo launchers). Plus I think if you were going to build a class of ships with warfare as a primary concern you wouldn't build only twelve of them and send them all off in random directions far from anything of strategic value. Starfleet's real fighting classes would've been patrolling the klingon border. HorseLord fucked around with this message at 18:02 on Aug 19, 2019 |
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Aug 19, 2019 17:54
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Risk is our business
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Aug 19, 2019 17:55
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HorseLord posted:Oh yeah, it can dump a very large amount of energy into all two of it's phasers, which it can only fire while sitting perfectly still or going in a straight line, because the helmsman has to stop doing his actual job in order to fire them. The refit has 12 in pairs of 2 on the saucer alone, a double barreled torpedo launcher, and a dedicated full time gunner to operate it all. Weapons are the job of the Navigator, the Helmsman can keep flying the ship in circles while Nav shoots. There were at least four banks of twin phaser emitters in fore and at least one bank of twin aft phasers. The fore torpedo launcher had six tubes and there was an aft launcher as well. HorseLord posted:Just about all we can say is that we never saw another TOS era starfleet ship class for which to compare to. We do know the spindly neck and engine pylons are massive obvious vulnerabilities that make it unsuitable for a battleship, and that even post-refit it's outgunned by poo poo like the perennial cannon fodder Miranda class (hello rear torpedo launchers). Do we know the Miranda outgunned Enterprise? We never saw a fair face-off. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 18:05 on Aug 19, 2019 |
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Aug 19, 2019 18:02
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MikeJF posted:Voyager has fifteen decks, a hundred fifty people, that's about three people on duty per deck every shift. For a ship a third of a mile long. To be fair, probably big chucks of that are people's quarters. Then they'd be in their workplaces while on shift. Or hanging out in other places like the holodecks or mess hall or a cargo bay or something. The bigger problem is how many shifts they have and just how many people do they need? If there's 2 or 3 shifts then that's only 50-75 people on duty each shift. The bulk of which are probably either on the bridge or in engineering now that I think about it. Now I'm wanting a game like SimTower or Dungeon Keeper but its about a Star Trek ship.
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Aug 19, 2019 18:02
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MikeJF posted:Weapons are the job of the Navigator, the Helmsman can keep flying the ship in circles while Nav shoots. It was the helmsman that fired on the TOS enterprise, he had the aiming periscope. I don't personally buy into the six torpedo tubes dialog (that's in like 1 episode) because it doesn't fit what we're ever shown on screen. It's early TOS weirdness from before canon solidified. Remember the TOS model didn't have weapons (or thrusters, or airlocks, etc) anywhere on it, and torps were first called like charged phaser pulses or bursts or something. But you have to reconcile this with what we saw, phaser beams always shooting from the same location, torps coming from the lower sensor dome, and then the TMP depiction of the ship. I don't see how it's possible to reconcile six tubes being in the bottom of the saucer with how just two took up so much space in the refit. Discovery just slapped two tubes where the refit puts some lower phasers. So I can only think the TOS ship had the weapons we actually got to see it fire. We've descended into fan wank for sure. If I've got any priority here it's to disregard anything in tos that makes the movies not make sense. MikeJF posted:Do we know the Miranda outgunned Enterprise? We never saw a fair face-off. I think it's definitely very close, they compensated for the lack of secondary hull by putting gun placements on the rollbar, plus the rear torpedo launcher, which the refit absolutely didn't have. HorseLord fucked around with this message at 18:27 on Aug 19, 2019 |
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Aug 19, 2019 18:09
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Farmer Crack-rear end posted:The Enterprise-A bridge layout is probably technically better but I still prefer the TMP/TWOK bridge layout. The TMP bridge is simultaneously dingy because of the lighting and sterile due to the lack of any color beyond white, grey, or beige. I can’t stand it. It does improve a little in TWOK, but the A bridge still looks better in every way. The worst bridge has to be the D’s Battle Bridge or the completely barren Stargazer bridge, which I think are the same redressed set.
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Aug 19, 2019 18:54
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davidspackage posted:Oh god, don't start a separation debate This separation debate is tearing us apart!
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Aug 19, 2019 18:55
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HorseLord posted:It was the helmsman that fired on the TOS enterprise, he had the aiming periscope. I don't personally buy into the six torpedo tubes dialog (that's in like 1 episode) because it doesn't fit what we're ever shown on screen. It's early TOS weirdness from before canon solidified. Chekov fired phasers and photon torpedoes in Obsession, albeit probably because he was a named character and Sulu was on a time-travel mission to the Vietnam War  (George Takei was off filming The Green Berets). I do feel like there's another instance of the navigator firing weapons... Balance of Terror maybe?Big Mean Jerk posted:The worst bridge has to be the D’s Battle Bridge or the completely barren Stargazer bridge, which I think are the same redressed set. Yeah, the old movie bridge got redressed again and again and again throughout TNG.
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Aug 19, 2019 19:04
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Alan_Shore posted:I went to a con where Eddie Olmos was speaking, and you could tell he loved the show. At the end of his talk, he said "so say we all" and we all smiled, some repeated it back, it was cute. Then he said it again, a bit tougher, "so say we all" and then we all chanted it back. Olmos is awesome. He came to speak at my university about education and social justice stuff and toward the end he went "Okay how many of you are here because of Galactica?" and talked about it for a while. Then he stayed for a couple hours to meet literally everyone who wanted to talk to him.
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Aug 19, 2019 19:06
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I dunno about you guys, but I am furious
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Aug 19, 2019 19:09
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Nerds didn't like a thing in the past for dubious reasons, therefore-?
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Aug 19, 2019 19:17
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Tighclops posted:Nerds didn't like a thing in the past for dubious reasons, therefore-? I didn't read a single one of the 1,500 unread posts I had in this thread. I just thought that article was funny and wanted to post it in a Star Trek thread.
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Aug 19, 2019 19:19
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lol at Geordi being "the new Spock"
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Aug 19, 2019 19:20
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Frakes looking like the QB of a high school football team circa 1965
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Aug 19, 2019 19:26
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PostNouveau posted:I didn't read a single one of the 1,500 unread posts I had in this thread. I just thought that article was funny and wanted to post it in a Star Trek thread. My bad, I've seen stuff like that posted in an attempt to shut down any thoughtful criticism of modern versions of the thing so the humor is kind of drained away from it for me now It's me I'm the moon-faced assassin of joy from Babylon 5 I'm so sorry
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Aug 19, 2019 19:39
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Farmer Crack-rear end posted:I do feel like there's another instance of the navigator firing weapons... Balance of Terror maybe? Aren't the phasers fired from the "phaser control room" or whatever in Balance of Terror? HorseLord posted:Just about all we can say is that we never saw another TOS era starfleet ship class for which to compare to. We do know the spindly neck and engine pylons are massive obvious vulnerabilities that make it unsuitable for a battleship, and that even post-refit it's outgunned by poo poo like the perennial cannon fodder Miranda class (hello rear torpedo launchers). Enterprise wasn't out-gunned by Reliant. Khan hammered them with the space battle equivalent of a couple of kidney punches with brass knuckles followed by a kick to the balls, and the reason Spock says "they can still outrun us ... and outgun us" is because the Enterprise is only running on partial main power (remember, turbolifts were inoperative below C deck). Timby fucked around with this message at 20:06 on Aug 19, 2019 |
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Aug 19, 2019 20:02
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mfny posted:So I just finished watching What We Left Behind. Was very good, and at points gave me some feels. The Terry Farrell stuff was really awkward though, it sounds like there is still bad blood there and maybe it will never be resolved which is a shame. Not being willing to pay for permission to use Jadzia footage was serious bullshit. mfny posted:All this talk of bridge design.. Anyone else read that as "Neelix's?"
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