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There are actually returns in each bedroom upstairs, but clearly not adequate. Just curious, what are current codes for when a home requires a second unit? We tried the "close multiple downstairs vents" in the winter and that just leads to the heater tripping the over heat protection switch on really cold days, so we have to leave pretty much everything open. I could try that in the summer now though, I suppose.
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Jul 13, 2019 19:11
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See how the insulation is around that room.
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Jul 13, 2019 20:50
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Does her bedroom have more windows than the others? I find that's where I gain/lose most of my heat in the summer/winter.
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Jul 13, 2019 22:59
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Nope, same double casements as all but the master. But it is a corner, so it has twice as many exterior walls. Plus a 1ft or so overhang along the back of the house.
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Jul 14, 2019 03:40
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Woke up very warm this morning and heard a loud humming coming from the HVAC, not my favorite way to wake up. Blower fan seems to be having a bad time. Worried the fan seized, I opened the unit up checked that the fan still spins (it does). I turned the power back on to hear things up close and everything seemed to kick back on just fine. Couple hours later and the buzz is back, so I go check again. The fan blades are moving very slowly while the unit hums. Capacitor is maybe bad? It's rated 7.5 uf @370v, but multimeter says 7.38, which is within 5%, but maybe just low enough to not work? Anything else I should check?
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Jul 14, 2019 18:34
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borkencode posted:Couple hours later and the buzz is back, so I go check again. The fan blades are moving very slowly while the unit hums. Capacitor is maybe bad? It's rated 7.5 uf @370v, but multimeter says 7.38, which is within 5%, but maybe just low enough to not work? Is the motor more than slightly warm to the touch? That cap is probably fine; the tolerance is usually +-5%. If you have a clamp ammeter, you can check the current being pulled on the motor wires and compare it to the specifications. It sounds likely that a new motor is in your future.
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Jul 14, 2019 18:58
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Motor did seem slightly warm to the touch, even after sitting idle for a couple hours in my 65 degree basement. Don't have a clamp meter currently (no pun intended), but the motor is embedded in the fan assembly so I can't tell the specs anyway.
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Jul 14, 2019 19:50
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Very similar symptoms to when my motor crapped out over the winter, including being warm-to-hot to the touch
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Jul 14, 2019 20:23
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borkencode posted:Woke up very warm this morning and heard a loud humming coming from the HVAC, not my favorite way to wake up. Replace the capacitor. They can die without changing much in value, as there are other properties that the capacitor has. Also, unlike most motor repairs it's cheap, fast and easy, and it matches your symptoms. If there's a separate starter that's another thing to look at, but motors of that size are usually cap start motors.
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Jul 15, 2019 00:23
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Ran to grainger this morning and bought a new capacitor. Thought it was going to work for about 20 seconds, as the fan started spinning a bit faster before slowing down again. Looks like a new motor is in my future.
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Jul 15, 2019 18:35
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brugroffil posted:Nope, same double casements as all but the master. But it is a corner, so it has twice as many exterior walls. Plus a 1ft or so overhang along the back of the house. I'd look into putting a small ductless mini split unit into that room. A heatpump based one if they work well in your climate. It'll set you back a fair amount of money, but would be the easiest long term solution I think. You can try to increase the insulation in the walls of that room, or increase the airflow, but overcoming the heat gain/loss from that room is going to be tough. A portable A/C or heater could work as well depending on the season and would be less expensive. I'm not an HVAC professional, but I don't think there is a code of when a house needs a second system or not. It's usually a function of sizing. I have a new construction house, my neighbors have a 3000 sq ft 2 story house that runs off a single large unit. My house has 2 smaller systems, one for each floor. (2.5 and 2 ton). My neighbor did have the HVAC company out several times until they could the the balance the system somewhat close.
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Jul 15, 2019 19:58
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Motronic posted:But yes, without zoning and/or a separate upstairs system this is likely to always be at least somewhat of a problem. I'm going to guess with 80s construction you have insufficient and/or one centrally located return downstairs. Or like my house where I have one centrally located return WHICH IS A BOXED IN JOIST. When I saw that I was very 
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Jul 16, 2019 20:15
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beep-beep car is go posted:Or like my house where I have one centrally located return WHICH IS A BOXED IN JOIST. When I saw that I was very You mean where they take two joists and slap some tin on the bottom, creating a duct? Super common.
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Jul 16, 2019 22:37
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A plenum 
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Jul 16, 2019 22:44
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Got the new motor installed and ac is working again, not sure if I’m more excited about it not being 78 degrees in my bedroom, or that I won’t have to go back to grainger for a fourth day in a row.
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Jul 18, 2019 15:51
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We just had a new Trane heat pump installed in our home. The air handler is a TAM9 and located in the unconditioned attic. The one part of the return duct turns down to the attic floor and pulls air from the ceiling of the main floor. When in the attic, I noticed that I could see a little of the air filter just behind the register. When I looked at it from the main floor side after removing the air filter, I can see that they didn't seal the round duct to the square portion that holds the filter. They're coming out Monday to fix it. Should I be worried about running the system until then since the return is pulling in unfiltered air from the attic? I also noticed cool air is blowing out of the heat panel where the breakers are located on the air handler. The technician said this is normal. Is this true?
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Jul 19, 2019 17:04
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MRC48B posted:You mean where they take two joists and slap some tin on the bottom, creating a duct? Exactly that. Seems...leaky
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Jul 19, 2019 19:23
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dear something awful forums hvac thread: If I am using a TXV, I don't use the piston thing provided with the condenser, correct?
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Jul 20, 2019 03:40
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Correct. They are both refrigerant flow regulating devices and you only want one.
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Jul 20, 2019 03:43
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More questions: *I was thinking of running my lineset in the following way: From condenser through existing hole in the foundation into crawlspace About 2' up to the 'ceiling' of the crawlspace Along a joist for 6' Back down 2' to the evap coil I don't have an intuitive feel for what oil-traps in the lineset are used for, is there any issue with my 2' up then 2' down path? *The TXV antenna-like connection that attaches to the suction side for pressure measurement, there appears to be a port for this inside of the evap housing on the suction manifold. There doesn't appear to be a port through the side of the casing already to feed this so I should just (carefully) drill a hole myself then reseal it? I was originally planning on doing the brazing work myself but looking at the equipment (nitrogen, torch, pipe cutter, deburring tool etc) Im thinking to suppress my DIY instincts and just call in a tech instead. Looks like I will still be fabricating the transition ductwork though.
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Jul 20, 2019 14:52
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Oil traps on suction lines are typically only specified if there is a large vertical separation between condenser/compressor and evaporator. I can't imagine why you would have problems with your setup as described. IANA Mechanical Engineer, Follow the installation documentation for your unit. quote:*The TXV antenna-like connection that attaches to the suction side for pressure measurement, there appears to be a port for this inside of the evap housing on the suction manifold. There doesn't appear to be a port through the side of the casing already to feed this so I should just (carefully) drill a hole myself then reseal it? I'm assuming you are referring to the TXV equalization line, not the bulb. That line is supposed to be connected right at or after the bulb. If you have a prexisting port on the suction line AFTER the coil, that should work. quote:I was originally planning on doing the brazing work myself but looking at the equipment (nitrogen, torch, pipe cutter, deburring tool etc) Im thinking to suppress my DIY instincts and just call in a tech instead. Brazing isn't hard, but it's like TIG welding in that it takes practice and experience to do it well.
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Jul 20, 2019 15:15
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Not sure if I should ask here or the plumbing thread...or both? Looking for recommendation on electric tankless water heaters. I'm under contract for a house, and one of the first things I'd like to do is ditch the rented electric water heater for a tankless/on-demand one. My local electric utility, in partnership with a state-wide not for profit group, offers rebates on a lot of efficiency purchases, including things like dryers, fridges, and hot water heaters. There is a short list, though. Here's their website with the brands/models that they offer rebates for: https://marketplace.efficiencyvermont.com/electric-water-heaters/?filters=type%3Dtankless The house will be occupied mostly by me, maybe a second person from time to time (I might do short term room rentals for some extra cash, or a girlfriend who spends a lot of time there.) But no more than that, no kids, and I don't plan to do things like run the shower and washing machine at the same time, so I don't need a TON of flow. I know a natural gas on-demand heater might be more efficient overall, but the house (despite being in the NG service area) is all electric, and I'd rather not spend the hundreds of dollars it would probably be to get the gas pipe from the road to the basement (at least not yet...I probably will in a few years when I get sick of an electric stove and demand gas.) And that 220V line from the old water heater will just be sitting there, ready to go.
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Aug 22, 2019 16:17
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DrBouvenstein posted:Looking for recommendation on electric tankless water heaters Not recommended. The electric tankless heaters use a ton of electricity (usually 2-4 40amp breakers), so you would not be able to reuse your existing wiring or breaker. You'd need to have at least a 200 amp service as well. Generally, they don't work that well, cost more to operate, and are more trouble than they are worth. You could look into the hybrid/heat-pump tank models listed on that page. I love mine, but they would only be advisable in a basement if you're in Vermont. If money saving is your goal, paying to run the gas line (assuming it's around a few grand or so) is likely to be your best bet, though it may be many years before it pays back.
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Aug 22, 2019 16:28
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The existing 220v line won't work. In fact, most whole house services won't be enough for a tankless electric. If you're serious about it you need to call an electrician first because your biggest expense will be getting that upgraded. Also your utility service itself may be insufficient,  efb
angryrobots fucked around with this message at 16:38 on Aug 22, 2019 |
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Aug 22, 2019 16:30
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B-Nasty posted:Not recommended. Ahh, blast. I only have 150 amp (better than the average homes around here that are just 100...I guess having all electric heat means a higher amp service, but still not enough for tankless.) It would be in a basement, so I guess I can do more research on a hybrid heat pump model...but yeah, maybe just hold off and save for the gas line install. I have no idea of the cost, but at my last house I inquired how much it would be to run an existing gas line in the house about ten feet over and two feet up from the basement for a potential gas stove install and I was quoted $350...so I can only imagine having to go 20+ feet, and from the underground lines to my basement (which I imagine requires digging up part of my yard) would easily be a couple grand or more.
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Aug 22, 2019 16:45
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DrBouvenstein posted:I inquired how much it would be to run an existing gas line in the house about ten feet over and two feet up from the basement for a potential gas stove install and I was quoted $350...so I can only imagine having to go 20+ feet, and from the underground lines to my basement (which I imagine requires digging up part of my yard) would easily be a couple grand or more. Still probably cheaper than what I was quoted: $25,000 and I also had to get 10 of my neighbors to sign up. I had to refrain from laughing, since my electric company also does the gas, so I'd rather put in solar for that amount and not pay those crooks anything ever again. Even for a few grand, the payback would probably be a long time depending on how you heat your house. If you have a modern, efficient heat pump, those can run toe-to-toe with natural gas as far as cost to operate. All-electric is also, in most areas, better environmentally as well - if you care about that.
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Aug 22, 2019 16:55
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Yeah I had my gas service point moved upstream about 10ft and that cost £700. Pretty much that was the blanket cost for any moderate amount of work. Fortunately the electricity folks upgraded my 60A/230V house feed to 100A for free.
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Aug 22, 2019 17:25
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but filed under "your mileage may vary" when we were looking at a house that did not have city gas (which we wound up passing on for other reasons) I called up our gas company - National Grid - and they said they'd run up to 100' of gas line from the street to the house and install a meter for free. It never hurts to ask, and quotes are (usually) free.
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Aug 22, 2019 17:45
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beep-beep car is go posted:but filed under "your mileage may vary" when we were looking at a house that did not have city gas (which we wound up passing on for other reasons) I called up our gas company - National Grid - and they said they'd run up to 100' of gas line from the street to the house and install a meter for free. It never hurts to ask, and quotes are (usually) free. drat, got it in one. I inquired last week just to know if I wanted to go that route in the future, and my gas company is the same; 100' free of charge from the road to the house, provided I then become a customer and get some kind of NG appliance and hook it up within 6 months.
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Aug 26, 2019 20:38
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Hopefully this is the right place to ask this: A few weeks back we found out that our air handler had a primary drain blockage (?) because a leak came through a hallway ceiling. We’d just bought the home a few months earlier and the inspector hadn’t seen that the overflow pan had rusted through because there’d been some rockwool in the area of the rust through... we got the line flushed/cleaned, a shutoff switch installed (the tech installed a new fitting on the primary drain and the switch/float goes into it), and we got the secondary pan replaced so it’ll overflow properly via the second drain line. Tonight I noticed water coming out the overflow drain line outside, go into the attic, and see water in the secondary pan. So clearly the switch/float isn’t working or is wired in wrong. I also still see water dripping out of the primary drain at about the normal rate so it doesn’t seem to be fully blocked? My question now is, if water is coming out both and the main drain still seems to be flowing decently, could it be something else? Going to have a HVAC company back out tomorrow but it just seems odd.
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Aug 27, 2019 04:59
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Good afternoon goons! My 3 year old A/C unit stopped blowing cold air the other day so I had a tech come out to take a look at it from the company that installed it. He found that there was some blockage around the outside unit from not cleaning it this year, but that wasn't the culprit that caused all of the freon to be gone. He found a leak that was covered under the 10 year parts warranty but said that I will have to pay for the seven pounds of refrigerant they put in to the tune of ~$700-800. I'm trying to understand why I should have to pay for the refrigerant when a part 30% into its lifespan fails and that's not covered under warranty. Apparently the folks in the office aren't available this afternoon to talk but told me to call them when they open in the morning. I wanted to be better prepared than I am to have this discussion as I'm pretty fuming mad at this. Thoughts? Thanks in advance.
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Aug 29, 2019 18:04
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TraderStav posted:Good afternoon goons! My 3 year old A/C unit stopped blowing cold air the other day so I had a tech come out to take a look at it from the company that installed it. He found that there was some blockage around the outside unit from not cleaning it this year, but that wasn't the culprit that caused all of the freon to be gone. He found a leak that was covered under the 10 year parts warranty but said that I will have to pay for the seven pounds of refrigerant they put in to the tune of ~$700-800. I'd be pretty fuming too. Pull out those warranty docs from both the manufacturer and anything you got from the installer. Also, I'm assuming this is an R410A system based on age. While prices have admittedly increased recently, a 25lb jug is going for about $110. https://www.refrigerantguys.com/R410A-25lb-genetron-freon-refrigerant-p/111016.htm $700-800 is a huge ripoff, especially during the course of a warranty service call.
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Aug 29, 2019 18:25
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Motronic posted:I'd be pretty fuming too. Pull out those warranty docs from both the manufacturer and anything you got from the installer. Thanks, that helps a lot. I'll do that tonight.
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Aug 29, 2019 18:35
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Motronic posted:I'd be pretty fuming too. Pull out those warranty docs from both the manufacturer and anything you got from the installer. Based on the model number he wrote on my invoice (rcf4821stamca), this is the model I have, which says R-410A refrigerant https://www.gemaire.com/rheem-rcf4821stamca-4-ton-21-multi-position-cased-aluminum-coil-standard-efficiency-r410a-rcf4821stamca
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Aug 29, 2019 18:46
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TraderStav posted:Thoughts? Thanks in advance. Standard "warranty" bullshit for the industry. Parts aren't the expensive part, the labor is, which is why many dealers push the labor warranty as well. I had a evap coil replaced and the part was like 400 bucks. Labor 1100. 110 a pound is really high though. I'd try to negotiate that down to half that if possible. See if they'll work with you.
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Aug 29, 2019 18:53
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skipdogg posted:Standard "warranty" bullshit for the industry. Parts aren't the expensive part, the labor is, which is why many dealers push the labor warranty as well. I had a evap coil replaced and the part was like 400 bucks. Labor 1100. They classify the refrigerant as Labor, so that's consistent with what I'm hearing. I'll find someone with an EPA license to buy them that 25gallon tank to replace what they gave me. I'm just hoping the tech was an idiot and misquoted me. Highway robbery.
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Aug 29, 2019 18:55
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TraderStav posted:They classify the refrigerant as Labor, In that case I bet you have a parts only warranty - that's why I said to check the docs you have) from the manufacturer AND them. Sounds like they're just burying everything on one line item. Warranty on that unit is in fact parts only. So unless you have a labor warranty from the installer.......
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Aug 29, 2019 19:02
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Motronic posted:In that case I bet you have a parts only warranty - that's why I said to check the docs you have) from the manufacturer AND them. Sounds like they're just burying everything on one line item. I had 1 year labor, 10 year parts apparently. I'll dig out the docs when I get home, so am at a bit of a disadvantage at the moment. The link you posted to the refrigerant is extremely helpful though. I'm intending to challenge this more on the unfair rate they are charging me rather than the covering it outright. It's ~$4.40 a gallon for the raw supply based on that price. If they charged me $15-20 I'd consider that a not completely exploitative markup. They have to cover a lot of fixed costs, including regulation compliance and such. But a 25X markup is ridiculous.
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Aug 29, 2019 19:06
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Through what legal fuckery is refrigerant "labor". Can I argue that the guy putting the refrigerant in is just an organic "part" of the units normal operation?
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Aug 29, 2019 19:43
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I think they treat labor as "not parts".
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Aug 29, 2019 19:46
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