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Martytoof posted:I’m having a very hard time not being afraid of wide open throttle and high revs. Granted it’s like my .. second week on the bike just now. Fortunately you have a rev limiter. Its job is to make sure the bike doesn't explode so you don't have to worry about it. Sometimes, wearing earplugs helps folks (and is generally good practice).
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Sep 9, 2019 20:31
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You aren't going to loop a Ninja 250 if you whiskey throttle it, and that motor is made to run at high revs all day. You might want to get your lean condition sorted before you roll everywhere at 13K RPM for hours on end, but winding it out every now and then won't hurt.
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Sep 9, 2019 20:36
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Oh I mean the hesitation is definitely on my side of the handlebars. I’ve been driving automatic four wheelers for years so to me it’s really bizarre to not hit 4K and immediately upshift. Just something I need to break myself of.
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Sep 9, 2019 20:44
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Martytoof posted:Oh I mean the hesitation is definitely on my side of the handlebars. I’ve been driving automatic four wheelers for years so to me it’s really bizarre to not hit 4K and immediately upshift. Took me forever to get past 10,000 on my first bike, which revved to 17,000. It felt and sounded like the loving world was ending. Now when I ride bikes like that I get bored waiting for the redline, and one day you will too! Or you'll just get a Harley or similar and solve the problem but having a bike that doesn't need revs.
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Sep 9, 2019 20:51
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Get a cheap oem muffler off eBay and sell the akra and run it til redline. They actually lowered the redline on those to "the moon" instead of "and beyond" in the 90s. You can comfortably bury it past 16000 on the regs. It's cool and good, comrade.
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Sep 9, 2019 21:09
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Martytoof posted:Oh I mean the hesitation is definitely on my side of the handlebars. I’ve been driving automatic four wheelers for years so to me it’s really bizarre to not hit 4K and immediately upshift. I've had to train myself not to instinctively shift at 4k on this bike. My little 250 doesn't even show RPMs so I have to go by sound, and the shifting window is much, much wider on this bike. I've found even 2nd gear is more than enough power for just riding around town and on my 250 I would often ride in 3rd. It's wild how different it is.
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Sep 9, 2019 21:21
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I feel like I'm still used to autos and shift way too early. Somewhere in the first month of owning my wr250f, I wanted to see how much more of each gear I was leaving behind. We went out somewhere that was more wide open and had less obstacles where I could pin it and see. Previously I felt like I was shifting within the first half of my throttle usage in each gear. I consciously waited to shift up to see how much more there was. 1st and 2nd wasn't too noticeable but 3-5th felt like warp speed on the second half of the throttle as if it were finding a whole other gear. Second half feels like:  It's still kind of hard for me to push a bike into the high rpms. It feels unnatural and almost abusive to do that to an engine even though I know they were designed for it. Most of my riding is trail riding so I rarely ride high speed or high rpm.
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Sep 9, 2019 21:55
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I took the Triumph up into the mountains for the first time today to really break it in and was thinking about this thread the whole time. I kept glancing at my RPMs thinking every time I went over 5k it was going to blow up. I drive a stick shift truck and by contrast I typically shift at 3-4k and rarely go above that, so when it revs up real high on the bike I instinctively back off of it. This thing does not go below 35 mph. It just refuses to do so. I get really conscious of the speed signals in town. Speaking of which, every time I pass one it clocks me going about 3-5 mph slower than my speedometer says. I don't know if it's because it's expecting a car and my smaller size throws it off, or if it's an issue with the speedometer, or what, because it happens on both of my bikes. Edit: speaking of mountain riding, I discovered a few things. I've taken my Rebel up a couple of times and it handled it surprisingly well, except for the one time I took it on a road that gained some pretty significant altitude, at which I got to the top and the engine just sort of gave up when I stopped (once I coasted back down it was fine.) The Triumph handled that same road just fine, but it didn't power up the hills with quite the ease I was expecting. It's not that it struggled, but it didn't just fly up either, but that could be because it's quite a bit heavier. I'm also noticing what people mean when they say small bikes are more "nimble" - the lean correction on curves is much tighter on the bigger bike, and I feel like I need to lean a lot harder to avoid going into the center of the road on a right hand curve than I do on the 250. Bikes are fascinating. Heath fucked around with this message at 02:28 on Sep 10, 2019 |
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Sep 10, 2019 02:23
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Heath posted:Speaking of which, every time I pass one it clocks me going about 3-5 mph slower than my speedometer says. I don't know if it's because it's expecting a car and my smaller size throws it off, or if it's an issue with the speedometer, or what, because it happens on both of my bikes. This is normal. Unless you drive an older car, your car will most likely post a slower than GPS confirmed speed as well. The faster you go, the more it will be off.
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Sep 10, 2019 02:30
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yeah it depends on your specific country's laws but speedometer accuracy is often specified as something like "must report the actual vehicle speed -0%/+20%". i.e. it cannot tell you that you're going slower than you are, but it's fine if it reads higher. That way at least the errors encourage you to ride slower. Both of my Hondas read exactly 10% high. Well, the Hawk did until I built my own speedometer based on the measured wheel diameter but you know what I mean.
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Sep 10, 2019 03:13
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Yeah, all the Japanese bikes I've owned are about 10% "optimistic" most of my cars have been dead on, far as I can tell.
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Sep 10, 2019 04:26
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That's good to know, I've been feeling like I'm speeding in town but I'm not going that much faster than anyone else. Not riding peoples' asses has been a challenge with this bike though. 
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Sep 10, 2019 04:33
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What is the general advice for dealing with damp roads, wet leaves, and/or streams? I've only been riding for about 2 months, and I can only really get an actual ride in maybe 2-3 times a month because "adulthood." So I've done a little over a 1,000 miles on the road. Yesterday I rode with a friend, and the road I usually take to the meetup location was pretty damp and loads of wet leaves. The cars cleared out most of the leaves, but there were plenty of spots where I was "threading the needle" and it was 10 miles of butt-clenching. The speed limit on the road is mostly 50mph but I went around 25-30mph for most of it. If I have to ride over them, just be as upright as safely possible? Streams are unavoidable, so I have just been taking them as upright as I feel I can, and no trouble so far, but my tires is still touching asphalt while leaves will probably slide without much hesitation.
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Sep 10, 2019 05:26
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Toe Rag posted:What is the general advice for dealing with damp roads, wet leaves, and/or streams? I've only been riding for about 2 months, and I can only really get an actual ride in maybe 2-3 times a month because "adulthood." So I've done a little over a 1,000 miles on the road. Yesterday I rode with a friend, and the road I usually take to the meetup location was pretty damp and loads of wet leaves. The cars cleared out most of the leaves, but there were plenty of spots where I was "threading the needle" and it was 10 miles of butt-clenching. The speed limit on the road is mostly 50mph but I went around 25-30mph for most of it. If I have to ride over them, just be as upright as safely possible? Streams are unavoidable, so I have just been taking them as upright as I feel I can, and no trouble so far, but my tires is still touching asphalt while leaves will probably slide without much hesitation. You only need to worry about this stuff if you’re turning. Going straight is fine. Your traction is still pretty decent on a road that is only wet with water. What that really means is if it’s been raining for a while, or rains regularly don’t worry about just the water. Worry about slippery spots on the road like tar snakes or if wherever you are used road paint that’s slippery when wet. If it’s the first rain in a while, I’d be a little cautious because there’s the possibility the rain is washing away an oil spill or similar. Leaves are 100% fine if you ride over them in a straight line. Where they’ll throw you off is if you’re turning. You expect traction. You get leaves which don’t have traction. Voila! I think it’s worth taking one of your rides a month or part of it at least to practice things like panic braking. That’ll make you more comfortable generally. Heath posted:That's good to know, I've been feeling like I'm speeding in town but I'm not going that much faster than anyone else. Not riding peoples' asses has been a challenge with this bike though. You can’t brake as fast as cars so don't do this.
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Sep 10, 2019 12:58
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I did a little quality highway time yesterday and re: high revving, I think I have come to this conclusion: 8-9k: sound is thoroughly unpleasant. What the gently caress, this engine is going to explode, please make it stop. 10k+: Holy poo poo this sounds like a precision piece of equipment and is, in fact, awesome. I can't really tell you why but that's how I felt. Highway was a little hairy because I'm just really not used to it, but with more time in the saddle it'll be great! I didn't get beat up by the wind as much as I'd expected.
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Sep 10, 2019 13:15
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builds character posted:
I'm trying! This bike wants to go faster than most.
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Sep 10, 2019 16:55
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Besides the fact that you won't be braking as fast as cars, you can't always control how far the car behind you is, but you can control how much room you have to the car in front. Even if you were popping amazing stoppies in an emergency situation, you don't want to get rear ended by the car behind you.
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Sep 10, 2019 18:10
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I had a really stressful work week out of town followed by a very stress relieving ride this morning. I love this thing. Also I hit a big butterfly with my visor. Impact 2/10 Aaaahh 8/10
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Sep 10, 2019 18:37
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I suffered from artificially lowered redline syndrome forever, then i got comfortable with the Ninja and got that ptwin humming. Then i started suffering again when i got the FZ1, because jesus christ first winds out at 84 mph. I'm just happy to tickle powerband a bit now. I've thought about going -1 tooth in the front just to encourage a bit more shifting.
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Sep 10, 2019 20:17
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My second bike was an R1, that did over 90 in first gear, I was following the guy I traded it to (Voltage) on the soon-to-be-mine FZ6, and I remember watching the R1 disappear down a freeway on ramp while I held the throttle wide open and wondered why the FZ wouldn't go any faster because it has a rev limiter that kicks in around 60, instead of around 95 My FE250 is fun because you're constantly shifting to find that powerband on the highway.
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Sep 10, 2019 21:34
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Meh, past the whole high RPM thing I found that I'm just white knuckling freeway rides now. Definitely not a fan, but gotta tame that fear.
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Sep 10, 2019 23:27
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Highways are terrifying on a bike at first, you feel everything and it's all just so FAST. Especially on a smaller bike where you work your way through the gears pretty quick. Just stay away from cars, remember the 3 second following rule, and take it easy, it will feel like nothing after a while. Then you'll have to worry about the opposite problem of getting too complacent and everything feeling slow so you twist the throttle a bit more and glance down only for an "oh poo poo I'm doing like 80 already" moment of realization. Although I think you said you have a 250 right, that was a great choice for starting out and helping keep that sort of thing in check.
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Sep 11, 2019 01:14
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little bikes are the best because you can hit redline in the first three gears before you're even across the intersection
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Sep 11, 2019 02:07
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On highways beware on-ramps and people trying to merge into you. Otherwise they tend to be pretty safe and boring in my xp.
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Sep 11, 2019 03:08
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Same as above, I rode the dyna on the highway couple of times when i wanted to arrive fast, but its just boring and uncomfortable due to the wind. Good thing there is the option to use the old highways usually, which are abit more twistier two Lane roads with less traffic.
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Sep 11, 2019 07:48
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Sagebrush posted:little bikes are the best because you can hit redline in the first three gears before you're even across the intersection After riding my XSR700 for however many months, I decided to take the 125 out for a spin. gently caress it was a lot of work. Constantly shifting, less engine braking. The xsr has made me lazy. Open throttle, consider shifting out of first, maybe go to third. I think I’ve hit 6th twice? Hit 6th on the 125 before I hit the first junction out of my house.
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Sep 11, 2019 12:29
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After some reflection I think I still need to work hard on my shifting and staying loose -- part of the reason I was so stressed out was that I was struggling to maintain 100kph and worried about getting tail'd by cars in a hurry since I was in somewhat rush-hour traffic. I'll start going out a little later now when the highways are a little clearer and work hard on being calm getting up to speed. White knuckling is also hitting me big time because I'm stiff-arming everything and it's a dumb feedback loop where every bump or gust of wind is transmitted to the handlebars and just makes me feel less sure. I'm kind of using this as my bike livejournal so apologies but it's interesting to retroactively pick myself apart and figure out what I need to work on.
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Sep 11, 2019 13:41
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Martytoof posted:I'm kind of using this as my bike livejournal so apologies but it's interesting to retroactively pick myself apart and figure out what I need to work on. Isn't that what this is for? I feel like I pay more attention to my own riding when I read these kinds of things.
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Sep 11, 2019 18:01
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Elector_Nerdlingen posted:Nothing to do with wanting a Yamaha specifically, just wondering what was wrong with what looks like a popular bike near here. I might be bucking the goon hive mind by saying that for a man your size, no, a 500 is not too much bike. I was 6'3" 230 when I learned to ride and started on a Kawi EX500. I live in a crowded part of the USA and needed something that would have some go on the highway. (Although at first it felt like 40mph was fast.) I would just check the HP and keep it under 60.
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Sep 11, 2019 19:32
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I think the hivemind suggests small bikes to keep most people from being scraped off the highway/back of someones vehicle into a bucket because they got on too much bike too early. The US has very basic required motorcycle training/education to get your license, most of which is a very basic safety course with small 250cc bikes and ZERO road riding which sends a lot of people with zero motorcycle experience out into the real world with a moto license, a few hours of putting around in a parking lot, and zero road training. If you've been in a thorough motorcycle course like other countries require, and you've been riding bigger bikes, you should be fine so long as you're not hopping onto a 1200cc race bike. If you've been riding a 600cc bike like an SV650 which you have seat time on, you are already familiar with that style and comfortable with it so its not unreasonable to look for one as your first bike.
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Sep 11, 2019 19:49
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A good starter bike should be describable as "forgiving." That's the operating term. You will make mistakes when you learn to ride. When that happens, you want the bike to forgive your error and let you escape without crashing. One way that a motorcycle can be unforgiving is to have a ton of power, but that's not the only way -- and just having a lot of power by itself doesn't necessarily make the bike dangerous. Let's compare two 500cc bikes, the Kawasaki Ninja EX500 and the Honda NSR500. EX500: about 45hp at the rear wheel from a lightly tuned four-stroke I2, fairly flat torque curve so the power rises steadily to a point and then plateaus. If you twist the throttle a bit more, you get a bit more power. Predicatable. NSR500: 165hp at the wheel from a 15,000 RPM two-stroke V4. No power down low so even a newbie could handle lugging it around at 4k and feeling like it's totally controllable. Then they get a little more confident, see a green light, decide to wind it out, and as they hit 10k OOPS now they have five times as much power as they're used to and their eyes fill with stars as they target-fixate directly into the back of a semi. EX500: Compliant suspension, not particularly racy. Soaks up bumps pretty well. Holds a line in a turn but won't destabilize if you go over a pothole. The tires begin to feel weird and squirmy as you push near the edge of their traction, warning you that they're about to let go. NSR500: Rock-hard racing suspension. Holds a line in a turn like you're on rails. Hit a speed bump or pothole and the force will be transmitted directly into your wrists (hope you don't accidentally twist the throttle!). The tires, which need to be heated to work at all, grip ferociously until they suddenly don't. EX500: Decent brakes but not insane. You'll need to use both at once to get maximum braking performance. You need a fair bit of force and lever travel to get the full effort, but this also means you can modulate force easily. Possible to lock the wheel but unlikely unless you really work at it. NSR500: Single-finger brakes that can lock the front wheel if you sneeze. Great for a focused professional racer who can modulate his grip to the micron. Bad for a new rider who sees a car pull out in front of him and grabs the brake in a panic. EX500: Upright riding position, like sitting in a chair. Easy to see what's going on and look around behind you. Can use your legs as shock absorbers on bumpy roads. You'll get blown off at 100 miles an hour, but at legal speeds you're comfortable. No unusual pressures on the bars. NSR500: Designed to balance your torso weight against the racing wind blast, which means at anything below that speed you're holding yourself up with your core (which is exhausting) or your arms (which is very poor form and affects your steering). Hunched over so it's hard to look behind you because you don't need to on a track. Narrow bars means it's hard to swerve around a squirrel or pothole. Rearsets mean you can't easily lighten up in the seat to avoid sacking yourself on a speed bump. The list goes on but I expect you get the idea. The key is that you get a bike that's easy to ride, one which lets you make mistakes and learn the right techniques without killing you, and the usual newbie recommendations are optimized in many different ways to help you learn safely.
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Sep 11, 2019 22:54
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Sagebrush posted:A good starter bike should be describable as "forgiving." That's the operating term. This is a great post. Thank you.
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Sep 11, 2019 23:23
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I could probably have summarized the whole thing with "there's a reason that fighter pilots are taught to fly in little propeller planes rather than F-15s" but posting way too much information is kind of my thing so
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Sep 11, 2019 23:29
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Your posts are great reads. Also I saw a new XSR700 today and now I want one of those too.
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Sep 11, 2019 23:44
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Sagebrush is a professor and the best host for this thread.
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Sep 12, 2019 00:23
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My dream Aprilia rs250 is probably a perfect beginners motorcycle
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Sep 12, 2019 00:25
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Sagebrush posted:Hit a speed bump or pothole and the force will be transmitted directly into your wrists (hope you don't accidentally twist the throttle!). From personal experience, an accidental power wheelie when you're learning is terrifying and does nothing to make you more comfortable when you're already trying to absorb everything. Like most things when you're learning how to ride (keep your weight off your wrists, look farther ahead, look through turns, if you think you're going too fast for a turn you're probably not and are better off just leaning more rather than hitting the brakes), it's easy to read them and think you understand them, but applying them when you're freaked out is a whole different story.
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Sep 12, 2019 00:43
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MomJeans420 posted:it's easy to read them and think you understand them, but applying them when you're freaked out is a whole different story. mhm, yep. That's why we always encourage newbies to stay on their small bike well past the point where they're "comfortable." It's one thing to go "oh, I know how to brake without locking the wheels" but you need to develop the automatic ability to do it without the task even entering the conscious part of your brain. Just your muscles and your brain stem doing the thing like an instinct. On a slow bike you may have the time to freeze up and go "uhhhhh wait oh right this is how I do it" but fast bikes don't always give you that option. It's the same deal when you're flying a plane. You can know logically every step that you have to take to land the plane, but by the time you've run through "okay, landing configuration, airspeed correct, on the glideslope, aligned with the runway, on centerline, crosswind corrected, begin the flare, protect the nosewheel, increase crosswind correction, hold the nose up, quick with the rudder..." you've already hit the ground. The reactions need to be happening before your conscious brain figures out what's going on. Or when you're sight-reading music. You aren't playing the notes that you're looking at; you're looking a few bars ahead and trusting your fingers to automatically process what you saw a few seconds ago. If you're a huge goon you could compare it to having data in your processor's cache versus on the hard drive. It does work though! It's astonishing what the human body can be taught to do completely on its own. But it does take a shitload of practice.
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Sep 12, 2019 01:16
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Sagebrush posted:Or when you're sight-reading music. You aren't playing the notes that you're looking at; you're looking a few bars ahead and trusting your fingers to automatically process what you saw a few seconds ago. This is a super helpful analogy, thank you.
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Sep 12, 2019 02:56
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Martytoof posted:My dream Aprilia rs250 is probably a perfect beginners motorcycle In case you aren't joking: 1. No they are terrible to learn on for a variety of reasons 2. I'll fight you for the last remaining unmolested one
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Sep 12, 2019 03:52
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