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Max Wilco posted:
You say you’re not super happy with how things are turning out with your Blood Angels, a couple of things; - How long have you been in the hobby? - What makes you happy more-so, the actual act of painting, or playing the game with painted mans? - Do you have a GW store locally that you can go to with your mans and spend some time painting and socialising? —> It sounds like you’re holding yourself to a standard that’s unfair on, well, you. Take this with a grain of salt, but for myself personally, I weigh the difference between investing tens or hundreds of hours in a project, versus what I want to get out of it, what its end goal is. Am I painting this for a competition, or am I wanting to finish an army. What’s the benefit in me staying up super late to work on the details? Is it going to be cumulatively worth it for the time invested? If (and this is not meant as an insult, I simply don’t know) you’re a more recent convert to toy soldiers, I think its easy to fall into the trap of this time these models will be perfect. I certainly did. The hobby, and painting especially is something that simply can’t be learned quickly. It takes hundreds of hours, and there is no end point. Everyone can improve. So the question then is, what’s good enough, for me. And for today. You mention contrast paints versus airbrushing. My honest advice would be to go the Airbrush route. It opens up so, so many opportunities and will in short order become an invaluable tool for you. Especially if speed, consistency and quality are your hallmarks. Contrast paint has its place, but you mention wanting to do Imperial Fists - large areas of flat power armour aren’t ideal for that particular product. You know what is? An Airbrush. In the meantime tho, my advice would be - take it easy man. This is your hobby. Push yourself to do better in your artistic pursuit, but don’t break your brain over it. We’re painting space dollies, not curing cancer. If I can help with more specific points, let me know.
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Sep 13, 2019 06:49
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Edge highlighting sucks balls and will always be that way. No one finds edge highlighting fun. The chance of laying down all the edge highlights in one go where all of the lines are thin and uniform is around 0%. If you want them to be perfect there is going to be a lot of correcting going on. Edge highlighting is one of the more time consuming and stressful techniques. I loving hate doing it, but its really needed on some stuff. I found learning how to use the airbrush incredibly frustrating, but not especially stressful. There is a steep initial learning curve with assembly/dissassembly/cleaning, PSIs to use, paint consistency, distance, aim, tip clogging, etc. It took me around 6 months before I found it useful for anything other than priming and base coats. Honestly, even if you never progress past priming and base coats, an airbrush is still pretty great if you paint large models. I'm starting to enjoy it now that I can actually "paint" with it instead of just apply paint with it. I don't understand why people stress about small details. Most small details are incredibly easy to paint. They can be time consuming, but they are rarely a huge challenge. The only stress I see from them is increased time per model. Just my 2c, but virtually all frustration in miniature painting is the result of having unreasonable expectations. Thinking something will take 1 hour when it takes 6, thinking you're going to dramitically improve from one model to the next, thinking you can pull of a technique you've never tried before in a single attempt, etc. I don't think the stress comes as a result of pushing yourself or trying difficult things, the stress is from not expecting and accepting you are going to continually fai and get better as a result of the repeated failures. The idea that you're going to try something new, absolutely loving nail it immediately, then try something harder and repeat that loop is roflcopter level fo absurdity. Try new poo poo, try hard poo poo, fail miserably, laugh about it, try again, fail less spectacularly.
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Sep 13, 2019 07:12
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I learned my lesson a long time ago, when I picked up watercolours: The primary question you should ask yourself before starting any hobby session, is "How can I have fun this time?" Do you feel really motivated to learn some particular skill? Then practice that. Do you just want to let loose, and slap paint haphazardly on dolls? Then do precisely that. At no point should you beat yourself up over not doing anything, if you can't answer that first question. It's a hobby, and hobbies are supposed to be enjoyable. Take a break, and return if/once you've found a reason to enjoy yourself.
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Sep 13, 2019 11:57
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Max Wilco posted:With all that in mind, I wonder if maybe the issue is that I'm trying too hard, and I get myself frustrated. Mind you, I'm not aiming to win a Golden Demon or anything (hell, I don't even play the tabletop games, so I'm not worried about complaints about my armies being unpainted). I just wanted to paint some stuff up, and maybe make some dioramas or something. I want it to look nice and detailed, but I'm not shooting for 'Eavy Metal-level quality. If you don't play the game, then don't worry about what you paint. Look for cool models that challenge yourself and excite you. Work on making actual dioramas. This is a hobby, not a job, and what matters most is that you are happy.
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Sep 13, 2019 12:33
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inscrutable horse posted:I learned my lesson a long time ago, when I picked up watercolours: The primary question you should ask yourself before starting any hobby session, is "How can I have fun this time?" Do you feel really motivated to learn some particular skill? Then practice that. Do you just want to let loose, and slap paint haphazardly on dolls? Then do precisely that. At no point should you beat yourself up over not doing anything, if you can't answer that first question. It's a hobby, and hobbies are supposed to be enjoyable. Take a break, and return if/once you've found a reason to enjoy yourself. Golden rule right here. Especially for any activity that doesn't involve paying bills or looking after someone/something. I find what helps with me, is doing my best to avoid thinking about the ultimate goal. In this case having a fully painted death guard army. I try to focus on thinking about how I want to spend my time right now. I end up spending way more time painting when thinking this way. Cause mostly it's yay I get 30 minutes to get zen and paint while the wife has the baby for a bit.
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Sep 13, 2019 12:33
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I work best with deadlines. I enjoy the results of painting but not necessarily the process, so having a goal in mind is very important to me. Usually it's NOVA, although I did a lot more last year than this year (studying for my qualifying exam kind of took over my life).
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Sep 13, 2019 12:38
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:I work best with deadlines. I enjoy the results of painting but not necessarily the process, so having a goal in mind is very important to me. Usually it's NOVA, although I did a lot more last year than this year (studying for my qualifying exam kind of took over my life). Oh man I'm the complete opposite, for fun stuff if I have any type of deadline I stress out and end up just not doing it because it makes me feel bad. Deadline are important for me, for things I don't want to do though! So to people reading this, my way doesn't work for everyone, dooo what works for youuuuu!
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Sep 13, 2019 12:42
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:I work best with deadlines. I enjoy the results of painting but not necessarily the process, so having a goal in mind is very important to me. Usually it's NOVA, although I did a lot more last year than this year (studying for my qualifying exam kind of took over my life). Max Wilco posted:Warning: long, rambling post ahead... Airbrushing will certainly take the pain out of basecoating an entire army, though as you stated, there is upkeep on the brush. However, you're going to be saving a ton of time when you get the process down. One of the things you mention is that you're really hating is edge highlighting, so here's a hot take: just don't do it. If you hate it that much, don't bother. Do your shading and some highlighting and call it a day. Your BAs will look more than tabletop ready, so don't kill yourself doing something you hate. Bonus tip: once you start airbrushing, do some preshading/zenthal highlighting and edge highlighting will be superfluous. Something else to consider: If you're feeling burned out, put the BAs down and pick something else up. Just look for a model that you think looks cool and go at it. I'm doing a lot of Warhammer Underworlds stuff lately, and it's a nice palate cleanser from Epic and Warmaster, which is what I'm usually painting. It is also a great opportunity to play with Contrast paints, since I'm dealing with a lot of organic forms. Speaking of Contrasts, they're nice to play with, and some are definitely time savers (flesh colors, Snakebite Leather) but others are so-so in my opinion and are really just thin paints that don't speed up your process at all (BA Red, Cygor Brown.) They are not necessarily a huge time-saver, and like any other tool, you need to experiment with them and learn how they will help your process. Do not expect them to be a magic bullet, and I would avoid them on any sort of flat surfaces (Marine armor, for example.) In your post, you mention that red is a "hard color to paint." I don't find that to be the case - what is your process? Are you using the proper primer/base color? What reds are you using? Do you have a photo? There are a ton of great painters here - I'm sure someone can offer you some advice.
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Sep 13, 2019 13:03
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:Work on making actual dioramas. I'd love to do that but I lack the equipment and space to pull it off. So instead I just try to come up with interesting colour schemes for all the models I want to paint and try my best to just do something different each time.
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Sep 13, 2019 13:54
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Pastry Mistakes posted:Honestly I want it for both bits and full models. I love DIY stuff and am an old crotchety man at heart who would prefer to be able to do everything himself. If I could get modeling software like whatever GW/Forgeworld/etc use I would begin making my own space barbies in a heartbeat. As a first step I figure casting is a good test of skill. Learn fusion 360 or zbrush or any cad/sculpting software and you can make models like GW. There are tons of free tutorials to learn them. And resin/fdm printers are pretty cheap these days so you can print out what you design.
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Sep 13, 2019 15:16
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Max Wilco posted:With all that in mind, I wonder if maybe the issue is that I'm trying too hard, and I get myself frustrated. Mind you, I'm not aiming to win a Golden Demon or anything (hell, I don't even play the tabletop games, so I'm not worried about complaints about my armies being unpainted). I just wanted to paint some stuff up, and maybe make some dioramas or something. I want it to look nice and detailed, but I'm not shooting for 'Eavy Metal-level quality. I'm similar in that I am painting miniatures for games that I dont play. I've been back in the hobby for... Probably between 18 months to maybe 2 years, after a long time away (used to play 40K starting in Rogue Trader era, gave it up around the dying days of 2nd edition, when it had become painfully obvious that they were never releasing a codex: squats (I had moved on to chaos by then, but still...). Played/collected a bunch of other miniature games too back in the day). I am also shooting for "good tabletop" standard, and hoping to get better than I go. I occasionally paint something I'm very happy with, but as soon as I take a picture of it the camera highlights all the flaws I hadn't previously noticed. But the difference is; I enjoy painting. I got back into mini painting because I find it relaxing. The process is fun, even if the end results arent always as good as I would like. I just try and remember that I'm still learning (I might have been back into painting for 2 years, but thats not painting every day or even every week. Some weeks I paint every evening, sometimes months go by where I never touch a brush) so when something doesnt work as well as I like, well, I'll do it differently next time. Plus, if I gently caress something up, its just paint. Its fixable. If I really hated what I've done I can always strip the whole lot off and start again (although I pretty much never do). One of the biggest things for me is learning when to walk away from a model. Sometimes, good enough is. So; some advice. Cut yourself some slack. These arent commissions, you arent on a clock and if there are mistakes you arent dealing with an angry customer. If you need to take a break, take a break. Do something else for a while, or paint something totally different. I know after I got done painting an old halfling bloodbowl team I wanted to paint something as far from that as I possibly could (and also deeply regretted making their team colours yellow and blue. I'd forgotten what a bitch it could be getting a good yellow colour down), so I picked up a few cheap MDF terrain kits (some "TT combat" buildings for the record) which I then really enjoyed building and painting. Painting terrain using house paint tester pots and some big cheap craft brushes is a lot more forgiving that halflings with their stupid tiny faces, while still using a lot of the same basic skills. Also, I tend to have a few entirely different sets of models undercoated and waiting to go at any one time. I'll fairly often sit down with the avowed intention of finishing model A, then find myself pecking at model B, just doing a quick basecoat of the clothes, or hitting the metalics, or while I have the reichland fleshshade on the brush anyway for model A I might as well give the skin a quick wash. Then at a certain point I realise that B is now mainly done, and would only take about 15 minutes to do the last few bits and get ready for basing. I've painted a decent number of models that I found initially daunting by simply doing a little easy bit at a time, instead of worrying about the whole thing.
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Sep 13, 2019 15:24
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inscrutable horse posted:I learned my lesson a long time ago, when I picked up watercolours: The primary question you should ask yourself before starting any hobby session, is "How can I have fun this time?" Do you feel really motivated to learn some particular skill? Then practice that. Do you just want to let loose, and slap paint haphazardly on dolls? Then do precisely that. At no point should you beat yourself up over not doing anything, if you can't answer that first question. It's a hobby, and hobbies are supposed to be enjoyable. Take a break, and return if/once you've found a reason to enjoy yourself. Very true. I got tired of slogging through painting minis. Especially as I never seemed to do anything with them (not that you have to). Then a friend asked about Rangers of Shadowsdeep, a table top skirmish/strategy/RPG-light game. It is scenario driven and suddenly I was back into painting. Not just painting, but terrain building and 3D printing. It has been a fun re-discovery.    
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Sep 13, 2019 16:14
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Nice! Rangers of the Shadow Deep has been the focus of most of my painting the last couple of months! I've built a pile of terrain and so many various minis for baddies and heroes, It's been nice to break away from only doing Orks.
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Sep 13, 2019 16:54
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Gonna preface this with the point that I'm painting Warmaster minis, so they're 10mm compared to most current GW products' 28+mm. Re: Reds Looking back on my White Lions, I decided I didn't really like how they stuck out a little from the official GW sculpts (since I'm using Eureka Minis' Elf Reavers with Axes as proxies), so I stripped them and have been repainting them in the old 4th Edition colors, with reds and greens, because those are the models I think they're based on, and they'll definitely stand out next to the rest of my army. I also figured these guys would be a neat test for contrast paints as well, before going whole hog in. Now, in my area there was a shortage of both Apothecary White and Blood Angels Red, so when I'd gotten the email that the White was back in stock on GW's site, I jumped on that. Not wanting to wait around to start painting, I also picked up Flesh Tearers Red from my FLGS (come to find out, it would be at least three weeks until one of the shops near me would get a restock on BA Red). Now, I was expecting something more like a Wazdakka or Word Bearers, nearly crimson red. However, it came out more like Mephiston Red, and worked really well over not only the Wraithbone primer, but also the Vallejo Grey primer I'd had on other models as well. With a quick highlight of a lighter red (like Wild Rider Red), I don't think you could really tell that it wasn't the "correct Blood Angels red". Re: burnout Especially since you said you aren't painting for playing the games (yet), don't stress out about not getting dudes painted up. I've been working off and on on the aforementioned White Lions a couple of hours a night, usually 3-4 days apart, over the course of the past 3 weeks or so. It's not a race to plow through your backlog as fast as possible, there's no extra achievement that popsin the corner of the screen when you're done, so don't feel the need to try and rush yourself. Like, I've been waiting until I've been pretty stressed at work dealing with people getting mad over video games to grab a six-pack of hard cider on the way home, get everything together at the painting deck, put on some chill tunes, and nurse a cider or two while plowing through the backlog. You don't even need the adult beverages, if that's not something you're into, but the concept is the same. Use painting as a tool for destressing, don't let it become a source for stress. Hell, if you have a local store that does Warham nights, and the players aren't super awful neckbeards to deal with, maybe grab a few models you're in the middle of working on, a few paints, some brushes, and swing down to the FLGS. Paint socially, even if you don't plan on playing.
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Sep 13, 2019 18:21
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Never compare your models to others, also try not to compare your models to your last model painted. If you have to compare do it to something that you painted 5 models back. Some times you will do a really good job and paint a masterpiece, which really sucks when you paint the next model and do a standard decent job. But with a 5 model gap you should be happy. This is general advice from someone who spent many years beating himself up over not being better at art. Batches count as one model for this fyi. Question about process, what is everyone's standard process for getting models game ready? Mine seems to be, clean-up and glue, prime, base colours, dry brush, washes, base metals, metal washes, (a bunch of stuff like glazing and highlighting. This is where I need more of a plan.) And finish up with the basing.
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Sep 13, 2019 18:30
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Xposting from the WHU thread.berzerkmonkey posted:Got some decent pics of noted 60's do-wop band, Garrek and the Reavers
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Sep 13, 2019 18:35
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everyone’s dunked their paintbrush in their coffee at least once right 
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Sep 13, 2019 18:38
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Not me, I just dip my metallic coated brush in the non-metallics water pot.
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Sep 13, 2019 18:40
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jesus WEP posted:everyone’s dunked their paintbrush in their coffee at least once right No. Some people have dunked it in their tea instead.
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Sep 13, 2019 18:41
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lol if you've never drank deeply of your wash mug
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Sep 13, 2019 18:42
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Out of interest, do you have anything on in the background, podcasts, youtube etc while painting? Something to listen to makes painting extremely relaxing for me, without it I don't enjoy painting much at all. It's something to do with Flow State.
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Sep 13, 2019 18:46
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jesus WEP posted:everyone’s dunked their paintbrush in their coffee at least once right That's why I keep to bottles. If I manage to dip my paintbrush into one of those, I deserve everything I'm getting.
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Sep 13, 2019 19:10
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BoneMonkey posted:Never compare your models to others, also try not to compare your models to your last model painted. I Bah. I do this all the time. People need to get thicker skin. Comparing your models to others, finding an 'other' that was painted better, then finding out how they did that is one of the best ways to improve.
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Sep 13, 2019 19:37
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Cat Face Joe posted:lol if you've never drank deeply of your wash mug This is the one that I do. Stopped using a spare coffee mug for paint water real quick.
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Sep 13, 2019 19:52
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This is why I use glass jars for paint water and not any kind of mug or such.
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Sep 13, 2019 19:55
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I pretty much always stick my brushes in my mouth to reform the tip after each rinse so I've already eaten a lot of paint and really could just streamline things by combining a drinking water cup and a paint water cup.
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Sep 13, 2019 19:57
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Cooked Auto posted:This is why I use glass jars for paint water and not any kind of mug or such. I have had to write 'PAINT' in Sharpie on my brush jar because I also tend to drink water out of mason jars.
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Sep 13, 2019 20:01
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I'm gonna shill for the GW water cup - you will never mistake it for a drinking device. It also has the added bonus of a wide base and narrow top, so it's next to impossible to knock over. I like it a lot more than my old water mug or jar.
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Sep 13, 2019 20:14
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berzerkmonkey posted:I'm gonna shill for the GW water cup - you will never mistake it for a drinking device. It also has the added bonus of a wide base and narrow top, so it's next to impossible to knock over. I like it a lot more than my old water mug or jar. I bought one specifically so I wouldn't accidentally drink out of it.
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Sep 13, 2019 21:11
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It's never even occurred to me to have a drink with me when I paint.Mugaaz posted:Bah. I do this all the time. People need to get thicker skin. Comparing your models to others, finding an 'other' that was painted better, then finding out how they did that is one of the best ways to improve. Totally, if you see someone who painted the same/similar model/scheme as you and theirs is better, you can look at it and ask "what did they do that I didn't", and then you do that thing next time. That's said there's definitely a balance to be found between self criticism, hobby funtimes, and actually finishing a drat project.
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Sep 13, 2019 21:35
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The Moon Monster posted:It's never even occurred to me to have a drink with me when I paint. Also, if you see someone used your scheme and did it better, don't be afraid to ask. Chances are, the painter wants to show off and gush, and you get some neat pointers to up your game with at the same time
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Sep 13, 2019 21:47
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Don't be so neurotic. Paint dudes. Take pics of dudes. Post pics of dudes.
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Sep 13, 2019 21:56
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The Moon Monster posted:It's never even occurred to me to have a drink with me when I paint. yes exactly that's what your wash cup is for
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Sep 13, 2019 22:04
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That Miniac dude on YouTube will straight up purposely remove excess paint on his brush by sticking it in his mouth. I think he's one of those people that genuinely believes acrylics are non-toxic. They're certainly less toxic than enamels and oils, but they still not non toxic. The pigments used to make the paints are still pretty harsh. Titanium, Cadmium, Manganese... no thanks.
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Sep 13, 2019 22:09
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Cat Face Joe posted:lol if you've never drank deeply of your wash mug
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Sep 13, 2019 22:11
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Bloody Hedgehog posted:That Miniac dude on YouTube will straight up purposely remove excess paint on his brush by sticking it in his mouth. Coward.
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Sep 13, 2019 22:12
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Just call me Toothsome Tim, the guy who didn't get mouth cancer. But seriously, there seems like there's a higher than average number of hobbyists who die young because they get lax when handling toxic materials. In the garage-kit hobby circles, where people are generally using even more toxic materials than mini hobbyists, I swear no one makes it over 65. On some of the other hobby forums I go to, every other week there's a post about someone dying in their 60's from some horrible disease. And they're usually the types who never bother with respirators when sanding resins, or shooting lacquers, or putting their brush in their mouth every 30 seconds.
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Sep 13, 2019 22:23
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So on a similar topic, would you wear a mask when airbrushing outdoors?
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Sep 13, 2019 22:31
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I wear a painter's mask when spraying acrylics, full respirator with lacquers. Although I try to avoid lacquers as much as possible, and always do rattle-cans outside.
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Sep 13, 2019 22:39
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Bloody Hedgehog posted:That Miniac dude on YouTube will straight up purposely remove excess paint on his brush by sticking it in his mouth. I should probably stop sticking my brush in my mouth, yikes.
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Sep 13, 2019 22:56
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