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"oh no a time thing happened"
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Sep 20, 2019 20:23
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MikeJF posted:It also means that if anyone makes a future Star Trek series with a more optimistic view, you either gotta deal with 'all this is just gonna go to poo poo' hanging over your head if you do the 25th/26th or so centuries, or you gotta jump ahead to post-3000 and then spend time at the start shovelling over the Disco dystopia. MikeJF posted:"oh no a time thing happened"
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Sep 20, 2019 20:29
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MikeJF posted:"oh no a time thing happened" poo poo, it's entirely possible that DiscoS3 is all about BEING the time thing. They gently caress around in the future for a season, then go back to the "present" to change things so that dystopia 27th century never happens.
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Sep 20, 2019 20:29
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What on Earth do they mean by modern ideas of what a bridge would look like I wonder
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Sep 20, 2019 20:32
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I maintain each series is only canon to itself. Even like q in DS9, it's like "that's the DS9 Q", he has characteristics in common with TNG q but it's sort of a discrete thing. It'll be true for TNG Picard and Picard Picard as well.
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Sep 20, 2019 20:33
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Ramadu posted:What on Earth do they mean by modern ideas of what a bridge would look like I wonder BSG
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Sep 20, 2019 20:33
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As time goes on it becomes more apparent that the question should not have been "why didn't voyager live up to the other shows potential?" and instead "why was DS9 the only show that really lived up to its potential?"Ramadu posted:What on Earth do they mean by modern ideas of what a bridge would look like I wonder Incredibly unpleasant to be around Edit:muchlikemyposting!
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Sep 20, 2019 20:40
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Minidust posted:I haven't seen Discovery but is their scenario somehow more committal that the various one-off "futures" shown in All Good Things and other time travel episodes? I'd figure anything that happens could be written off the same way as the 3-nacelled Enterprise D, for any story told in a post-Picard setting. It's felt like all of the six or seven showrunners they've had have felt super-restrained by the 23rd century setting that was originally selected by Fuller, and that they're really just wanted to make a show in a new era where all the ships can be extra pointy. I've assumed that the leap to the 30th century at the end of Season 2 is a permanent shift to a new setting. Especially since they ended with the 23rd century characters going 'and let's all swear never to mention Discovery or the magic teleporting mushroom drive ever again'. (Literally, at the end of the season they said, and I quote, "to ensure the Federation never finds itself facing the same danger, all officers remaining with knowledge of these events must be ordered never to speak of Discovery, its spore drive, or her crew again." It was basically like that simpsons episode where Principal Skinner turns out to be someone else and everyone decides to forget it, but with a whole show.) MikeJF fucked around with this message at 20:46 on Sep 20, 2019 |
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Sep 20, 2019 20:43
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Man, I'm usually not one of those guys that starts running around saying, "Nope, I'm not gonna watch this" when let's face it, I will because it's new Star Trek. But I don't think I can watch this crap anymore. It's just become a boot stomping on a bumpy face, forever.
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Sep 20, 2019 20:46
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gonna repeat my lovely worn-out mantra that star trek should not be about the loving federationRamadu posted:What on Earth do they mean by modern ideas of what a bridge would look like I wonder probably like where they have holograms floating in front of them that they frantically manipulate and swoosh/swipe around with their hands
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Sep 20, 2019 21:01
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Pick posted:I maintain each series is only canon to itself. Even like q in DS9, it's like "that's the DS9 Q", he has characteristics in common with TNG q but it's sort of a discrete thing. It'll be true for TNG Picard and Picard Picard as well. Speaking of non-TNG Q, how did "What if Q had a son?" get out of the writer's room?
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Sep 20, 2019 21:11
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I just don't get who they're making Discovery for. Star Trek fans won't like it because it feels like generic military sci-fi at best and lovely Star Trek fanfic at worst, and people who aren't invested in Star Trek but like military sci-fi would watch the show if it wasn't called Star Trek anyway, so what gives?MikeJF posted:It's felt like all of the six or seven showrunners they've had have felt super-restrained by the 23rd century setting that was originally selected by Fuller, and that they're really just wanted to make a show in a new era where all the ships can be extra pointy. I've assumed that the leap to the 30th century at the end of Season 2 is a permanent shift to a new setting. Especially since they ended with the 23rd century characters going 'and let's all swear never to mention Discovery or the magic teleporting mushroom drive ever again'. I think this was also how they got around Spock (as well as Amanda and Sarek) never mentioning Burnam, ever. Though I actually didn't have much problem with that because Spock didn't mention his fiance or half-brother until they were staring him in the face too. jng2058 posted:poo poo, it's entirely possible that DiscoS3 is all about BEING the time thing. They gently caress around in the future for a season, then go back to the "present" to change things so that dystopia 27th century never happens. This is exactly what I'm expecting, like how the final scene of S1 Discovery had people acting like they were in Starfleet, this will be a whole season of poo poo from a butt and then they'll decide to go back in time to make sure this future never comes to pass. I want to remain hopeful for Picard and I know it's different showrunners and writers but drat, optimism is hard.
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Sep 20, 2019 21:15
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Humerus posted:I just don't get who they're making Discovery for. Star Trek fans won't like it because it feels like generic military sci-fi at best and lovely Star Trek fanfic at worst, and people who aren't invested in Star Trek but like military sci-fi would watch the show if it wasn't called Star Trek anyway, so what gives? "Star Trek has been our most popular franchise and we need to attract people to our new streaming platform, go make a new one but make sure it's prestige television because that's the new buzzword"
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Sep 20, 2019 21:19
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I don't know if it's dumber than when they called Enterprise just Enterprise thinking you could trick people into watching it if you didn't have Star Trek in the title or whatever.
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Sep 20, 2019 21:21
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The dumbest thing was when they put Star Trek in the title, as though Star Trek fans didn't know Enterprise was a Star Trek show, and the only thing keeping them from watching it was ignorance/
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Sep 20, 2019 21:27
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Enterprise was too nutless to stick to any of the guns it brought, which is kind of loving pathetic for a show ostensibly about the boldest era of humankind
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Sep 20, 2019 21:31
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I'm not hating on it but having watched TNG season 5 up to 8th episode (I watched the Unification episodes way in advance because reasons) I'm surprised how... campy even TNG is, while I had the impression that it's way more "serious" than the original series. To a degree I get the vibe that Star Trek doesn't lend itself well to a cohesive universe with an actual canon because there's just too much... silly poo poo around. I'm not saying you can't form some sort of in-universe sense of the world, or that a series should be solely focused on creating a cohesive narrative. Just as a kid catching episode or two occasionally the overall picture I got of the show was way more serious. Obviously age changes one's point of view and episodic nature of the show is largely due to how it was network TV and longstanding cohesive story narrative between episodes wasn't really a thing until certain "modern" shows. I'm not saying the show is worse for it but I did expect it to be slightly more cohesive/serious with some splashes of campiness/episodic content around. I do wonder how DS9/rest of the shows are in comparison. I didn't hate Discovery even with its many faults but TNG is just so comfortable to watch in comparison. edit: I feel extremely skeevy for pointing this out but I have to air it since I actually tried google but found no results. Am I insane or are some of the uniforms slightly *too* skintight at times in TNG? I feel like the remastered episodes surface some details that were probably not intended to be visible during original airtime. Dessel fucked around with this message at 23:28 on Sep 20, 2019 |
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Sep 20, 2019 23:19
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Dessel posted:I'm not hating on it but having watched TNG season 5 up to 8th episode (I watched the Unification episodes way in advance because reasons) I'm surprised how... campy even TNG is, while I had the impression that it's way more "serious" than the original series. To a degree I get the vibe that Star Trek doesn't lend itself well to a cohesive universe with an actual canon because there's just too much... silly poo poo around. I'm not saying you can't form some sort of in-universe sense of the world, or that a series should be solely focused on creating a cohesive narrative. Just as a kid catching episode or two occasionally the overall picture I got of the show was way more serious. Obviously age changes one's point of view and episodic nature of the show is largely due to how it was network TV and longstanding cohesive story narrative between episodes wasn't really a thing until certain "modern" shows.
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Sep 20, 2019 23:27
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Dessel posted:edit: I feel extremely skeevy for pointing this out but I have to air it since I actually tried google but found no results. Am I insane or are some of the uniforms slightly *too* skintight at times in TNG? I feel like the remastered episodes surface some details that were probably not intended to be visible during original airtime. There's some serious dick n'balls on display in some TNG episodes. TNG is often campy. DS9 is not entirely un-campy but is more serious than TNG in general.
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Sep 20, 2019 23:31
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Dessel posted:edit: I feel extremely skeevy for pointing this out but I have to air it since I actually tried google but found no results. Am I insane or are some of the uniforms slightly *too* skintight at times in TNG? I feel like the remastered episodes surface some details that were probably not intended to be visible during original airtime. The early uniforms were made of some spandex blend and were so tight that Stewart’s doctor (chiropractor?) told him it could cause permanent spinal injury if he kept wearing it. The season 3-onwards uniforms were much looser and made of wool, but they apparently stank to high heaven from all the soaked-in sweat odors.
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Sep 20, 2019 23:33
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Nessus posted:It depends what you mean by campiness. All the series are relatively lighthearted by modern standards but by modern standards of dramatic television, a show with only one rape, torture, or cannibalism scene per season would be considered fluffy and un-serious. Yeah this is definitely part of it but not all. Like the fact that Riker is bringing on board a videogame that literally mind controls people, where are Starfleet's security protocols at? (I do recognize modern shows have much dumber logical fallacies in them). I do have to underline that even though I'm surprised about the "mild campiness" of the show it's part of the charm of watching it in 2019 since it is so very optimistic about humanity and the world/universe surrounding us when we're constantly surrounded by world and media portraying cynicism and structural problems in our society and doing it in a very bleak manner. There is value in that kind of portrayal but TNG is so refreshing compared to that.
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Sep 20, 2019 23:42
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Incredibly bad security is a staple of all of Trek.
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Sep 20, 2019 23:46
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I can just about believe that the feds would have terrible security since they don’t seem to have anything like the modern surveillance state and generally seem to give citizenry a fairly ridiculous degree of freedom to do whatever. However when the actual totalitarian control freak alien empires don’t bother putting security cameras in their overfull prison cells...
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Sep 21, 2019 00:10
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TNG was written before the world of constant barrage of scams and deceit that we live in. If you only worked as a TV writer back then, you may not get that much exposure to organizations that very much care about not being compromised. Even now the easiest way to compromise a company is to just call up Jim from accounting and say "I'm from IT, I need your password for a secret project" and he'll just give it to you. TNG characters act like how 90s TV writers think.
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Sep 21, 2019 00:29
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Man, gently caress Discovery. I even hate the rumors about it. I don't understand how anyone thinks this Picard show is going to be any good with their track record of Discovery's already
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Sep 21, 2019 00:36
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Jesus, people are so desperate to hate Discovery that people are panicking over unsourced, half-remembered rumours now?
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Sep 21, 2019 00:45
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Comrade Fakename posted:Jesus, people are so desperate to hate Discovery that people are panicking over unsourced, half-remembered rumours now? I don't think people who dislike discovery are desperate for material to hate it, the 2 seasons seem to be doing a wonderful job already.
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Sep 21, 2019 00:47
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The Outrageous Okona guy is basically dash rendar
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Sep 21, 2019 00:55
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jng2058 posted:poo poo, it's entirely possible that DiscoS3 is all about BEING the time thing. They gently caress around in the future for a season, then go back to the "present" to change things so that dystopia 27th century never happens. Nah, that should be the next series. Those two Temporal investigations guys from from the DS9 Tribbles episode? They used to roll their eyes when they heard Kirk was involved with shenanigans, but he'd be a vacation right now! Even though their department has quintupled in size and now has a respectable fleet of prototype chronoships, they can barely keep up with the damage Discovery has done, and what spare time there is left is consumed by those four Lower Decks animated shitheads. Each week watch as our gang goes back in time to fix the problems no one else can (except for those fuckers who keep causing them). These cops go by the book, except they all agree to ignore one rule...contrary to standard procedure, they start investigating the most recent time distortion, set phasers for eviscerate, and blow the holy bejeezus out of the Discovery assholes. This way, they aren't depriving themselves of the chance to do it again to those cocksuckers the next time they're called to the job. Coming soon on CBS All Access, and we're really leaning into it..."Star Trek: We Are So, So Sorry" Subtitle: "We're Fixing Our Mistakes...In Canon" Second subtitle: "We're coming for you next, Voyager and JJTrek"
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Sep 21, 2019 00:56
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Admiralty Flag posted:Second subtitle: "We're coming for you next, Voyager and JJTrek" That was an actual episode of Voyager, where a future time cop tried to blow up the ship because they hosed around with time so often and he just hated them so much. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 01:09 on Sep 21, 2019 |
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Sep 21, 2019 01:07
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Big Mean Jerk posted:The early uniforms were made of some spandex blend and were so tight that Stewart’s doctor (chiropractor?) told him it could cause permanent spinal injury if he kept wearing it. The season 3-onwards uniforms were much looser and made of wool, but they apparently stank to high heaven from all the soaked-in sweat odors.
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Sep 21, 2019 01:35
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MikeJF posted:That was an actual episode of Voyager, where a future time cop tried to blow up the ship because they hosed around with time so often and he just hated them so much. My very very favorite thing about Voyager is that maybe the best and most memorable episode is a lengthy lesson about the foolishness of trying to use time travel to correct your own mistakes and then in Endgame Janeway does exactly that, fancy space weapons and all, end story, no regrets. I like to think it hosed things up somehow and she's constantly looping through time trying to get things back even as good as the original bad timeline.
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Sep 21, 2019 04:11
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Grand Fromage posted:Incredibly bad security is a staple of all of Trek. Probably the most realistic thing about the show.
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Sep 21, 2019 05:46
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Remember how apparently anyone on the ship can just open a communications line with the captain at any time, they're just on the honor system.
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Sep 21, 2019 06:16
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Known criminal Quark can apparently just walk onto the Defiant any time he wants.
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Sep 21, 2019 06:21
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Kanine posted:The Outrageous Okona guy is basically dash rendar What the gently caress Mods?
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Sep 21, 2019 06:47
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Sep 21, 2019 08:12
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Dessel posted:(I do recognize modern shows have much dumber logical fallacies in them That's not a logical fallacy  Grand Fromage posted:Incredibly bad security is a staple of all of Trek. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EzhgEGeKcbo
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Sep 21, 2019 13:31
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Honestly they should just shut down Star Trek. Spaceflight isn't in our future, or if it is not for thousands of years.
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Sep 21, 2019 14:11
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Star Trek Security: set phasers to stern warning
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Sep 21, 2019 14:23
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