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Technically: Lighting, staging, lenses, direction, editing, grading. Acting, kinda. Really: planning for the above. You can tell when each loving shot was painstakingly planned, see the first Raiders or Matrix. Every shot is thought out, perfectly lit, staged, blocked, with the right lens and camera motions to tell the story, be interesting, pretty, and guide your eye, your brain, and your heart where the director wants it. Every shot that includes an fx or stunt is designed around the limitations and requirements for that stunt/fx. Similarly, stunts and fx are there to tell the story and heighten audience involvement. Contrast that with later Matrix / Raiders sequels. Haphazard, unplanned, and the fx doesn’t work because they just kinda guessed it could be done when production started, rather than careful planning around the limits from day 1. Stunts are more of a set piece than part of the story.
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Sep 15, 2019 16:56
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Yeah, lenses are often overlooked. Knowing when to use a wide-angle versus a close-up or how you frame the shot can make a huge difference in how the scene plays out. All you have to do is compare the first Jurassic Park to its sequels: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKALxKbjOaE I guess you can add frame rate too. Just look at motion smoothing and watch how everything looks absolutely horrible regardless of lighting and composition. Our brains really like 24fps and know LOTR was good whereas the Hobbit looks like rear end.
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Sep 15, 2019 17:27
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Also, worth ingesting basically all the film video essays and information you can find on YouTube. It helps you start to realize that movies are definitely a sum of their parts and that there's a WHOLE lot of parts to it. Every Frame a Painting is the often recommended channel to start with in this thread but there's dozens of great stuff out there covering all facets of the movie making process.
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Sep 15, 2019 17:40
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Krispy Wafer posted:Our brains really like 24fps and know LOTR was good whereas the Hobbit looks like rear end.
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Sep 15, 2019 18:29
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You've gotta be really careful about which video essays you watch. There's so much awful garbage made by idiots out there. I only have a handful of ones that I find reasonably intelligent and consistently well-thought-through.
feedmyleg fucked around with this message at 19:25 on Sep 15, 2019 |
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Sep 15, 2019 18:35
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feedmyleg posted:You've gotta br really careful about which video essays you watch. There's so much awful garbage made by idiots out there. I only have a handful of ones that I find reasonably intelligent and consistently well-thought-through. Thx for listing them 
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Sep 15, 2019 19:02
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Every Frame a Painting’s archive is good
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Sep 15, 2019 19:13
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Seriously, just watch every episode of Every Frame a Painting and you'll walk away smarter. I haven't found any others that are consistently good, so I'm also up for suggestions.
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Sep 15, 2019 19:20
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I really like hbomberguy's spinoff essays called Dragline (he does it with a friend of his and she is also cool and good)
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Sep 15, 2019 19:30
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Though it's not as technical, I enjoy Lindsay Ellis's videos. They are so well researched, they feel like a series of different graduate theses Patrick H Willems has good stuff here and there as well.
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Sep 15, 2019 19:35
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Wolfcrow is a good nuts and bolts channel that will sometimes delve into things like “why does Satyajit Ray movies look so good” amongst the reviews of digital cameras and tutorials on how to achieve certain lighting or do a camera move or trick or just explainers on what a certain moviemaking thing is (such as low-key lighting, the 180 rule, etc.), our own K Waste has the Spoiler Alert series for ruminations on films and shorts and art pieces and the cross points of all those things, Lessons From The Screenplay can be a helpful tool for writers (even if I find their observations a little rudimentary at times), One Hundred Years of Cinema is, well, what it says on the tin, and D4Darious is a great “how to make poo poo look good for cheap” channel.
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Sep 15, 2019 19:42
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couldcareless posted:Though it's not as technical, I enjoy Lindsay Ellis's videos. They are so well researched, they feel like a series of different graduate theses She could really benefit from a ruthless editor though, all of her videos could be cut by 2/3rds and nothing would be lost. Lady needs to learn the value of concision.
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Sep 15, 2019 20:00
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i felt really dumb because i didn't know how single camera setups worked until this week. it seems like an insane amount of work.
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Sep 15, 2019 20:39
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It is but it allows you to be a lot more flexible in how you shoot, light, and edit everything than if you're working with a multicam setup.
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Sep 15, 2019 23:12
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That was all super helpful, thanks everyone!
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Sep 16, 2019 00:33
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surf rock posted:That was all super helpful, thanks everyone! Also it wasn't explicitly mentioned but art direction and production design play a large part as well. If you're shooting a bedroom, for instance, people often just want to use what's available. But the reality is that most beautiful movies take care with every single detail (props, color theme, etc) of the sets. BonoMan fucked around with this message at 01:04 on Sep 16, 2019 |
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Sep 16, 2019 01:02
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My expertise, such as it is, is sound design (for film and games) and music. Any good youtube channels about the former, specifically for film?
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Sep 16, 2019 01:43
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These are good intro videos for film roles https://youtu.be/wXcc79AmkyU https://youtu.be/NAvn7CNpdB8 Maybe they have more?
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Sep 16, 2019 02:27
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Rupert Buttermilk posted:My expertise, such as it is, is sound design (for film and games) and music. Any good youtube channels about the former, specifically for film? I don't know about YouTube channels, but honestly, look at the Oscar nominees in film sound design for several years, pick a few to watch, and take notes every time you notice something amazing. (The Star Wars prequels suck, but some of Ben Burtt's sound design on them is absurdly good.)
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Sep 16, 2019 02:41
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Timby posted:I don't know about YouTube channels, but honestly, look at the Oscar nominees in film sound design for several years, pick a few to watch, and take notes every time you notice something amazing. (The Star Wars prequels suck, but some of Ben Burtt's sound design on them is absurdly good.) Ben Burtt is a legend. Sure, he happened to work on someone of the most iconic blockbusters ever, but dude is still REALLY loving great. Edit: this reminds me of one of my favourite moments, thanks to the sound design; the ending/climax of 'Raiders... '. Right after Belloq opens the ark, and whatever his name is ("Toht?") starts laughing, you hear this low-pitched warbling, coming in and out like some sort of weird nightmare wave, right before everything goes to hell for the nazis. I love that, and it sends chills down my spine, mostly because I try and think what could possibly be causing THAT kind of sound, in the universe of the movie I mean. It sounds like it wouldn't be out of place on the Death Star, but in 1930's, on Earth? What the hell? That's why I love it. Rupert Buttermilk fucked around with this message at 02:52 on Sep 16, 2019 |
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Sep 16, 2019 02:47
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Here's a fun sound edit, makes you think about every little thing added https://youtu.be/_li_d_YviZ4 https://youtu.be/hNO-Vc75its
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Sep 16, 2019 05:22
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Question about editing that came to me when I watched Lord of the Rings recently. Elijah Wood was talking about how many different takes they did for a specific scene and it made me think how that looks like in practice when editing the final movie. When the editor (or in this case I think Peter Jackson+editor?) sits in the editing room, how do they view all the different takes for a specific scene? Are there multiple monitors set up for easy access, do they go through all takes on a single screen and decide which one to use? Are they all somehow integrated (visible) in the cutting software? Going back to that comment Elijah made, I had this picture in my head of Peter Jackson sitting somewhere and looking at the timeline in the cutting software. Where does he look at the alternate takes before making his final decision and adding that take? Hope I explained it somewhat coherently.
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Sep 29, 2019 04:10
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FeastForCows posted:Question about editing that came to me when I watched Lord of the Rings recently. Elijah Wood was talking about how many different takes they did for a specific scene and it made me think how that looks like in practice when editing the final movie. Generally there will be a script supervisor or someone similar that will mark a preferred take on set as it happens. But even then the editor will potentially view the rest and also make a decision. If they are still having trouble with the scene they can go back and watch all the takes in the AVID or whatever. And it's just on a single monitor. No need for multiple monitors (I mean beyond a standard multi monitor setup for editing) because you're never going to view more than one at a time. In the software, AVID or Premiere or whatever, you categorize footage into "bins" ... it's essentially a file folder structure of organization but doesn't actually move the footage... it's a meta-tagged way of doing it in software. So you'd say "ah Bob just not feeling it... lets view all the takes" and he'd just go into the "bin" for whatever day/scene/setup/take that was and they'd just watch each clip. Does that make sense? Did I overexplain it?
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Sep 29, 2019 04:23
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I imagine every director does things slightly differently, some already have a very set idea of how the scene plays out and are just looking at the best takes and performances, while others might be willing to completely rebuild the scene from the ground up based on what they've captured. (Like, "Hey, this scene is really about this character breaking down so let's focus the audience's attention on that.") And time's a factor, and how much an actor's performance varies from take to take, etc. Interestingly enough Lord of the Rings is a neat example- the Extended Edition for Fellowship has this feature where you can look at a bunch of the different elements of the Council of Elrond scene, with lots of different angles, and you can see how that was constructed.
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Sep 29, 2019 04:41
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BonoMan posted:Does that make sense? Did I overexplain it? Yes and no. Thanks!
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Sep 29, 2019 05:23
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Have a look at a video tutorial on starting a project in Avid. You'll basically see how it goes. Edit: Except for the part where film is scanned first and turned into digital files for the editor. That's largely outdated now in all-digital productions, but would have happened in LOTR. Actually, takes are usually viewed on or near the set while they're still shooting, before work starts in the edit suite. Those are called 'dailies'. In the film world they'd be copies produced while the film is being processed overnight. They'd still be viewed one take at a time. The tutorials will probably be for single screen setups, but professional editors working on feature films will probably use three screens. Two for the editing program and one dedicated to full screen playback. You can organize the editing program any way you want, but the basic setup is to have the video and sequence files organised on the left screen and the project timeline and in-program video screens (you'll see what I mean in the tutorials) on the left screen. Anyone sitting in, like the director, will usually just be watching the full-screen video monitor. Teenage Fansub fucked around with this message at 09:10 on Sep 29, 2019 |
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Sep 29, 2019 08:39
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I don't think it's worth its own thread, but I know lots of people love this movie so if it'd open a wider discussion people are into, I will. I saw Seven for the first time recently. To be clear: I think it's VERY GOOD. So even though I'm about to meh all over it, and it's gonna sound like I dislike it, I honestly did. However, Seven is often regarded as being one of the best movies of all time by a lot of people. To me? It was VERY GOOD, but I wouldn't hold it up as one of the greatest movies of all time. If somebody asked me about it, I'd tell them to go see it, but it wouldn't be in my top 10. It was creepy as hell, the visuals were great, Morgan Freeman kicked rear end as did R.Lee Ermey. I never got a feeling of suspense of: "WE HAVE TO STOP THIS GUY" 'cos there was nowhere near enough evidence at any of the crime scenes to start a chase. When they accidentally went to his apartment, that was a bit of a fluke. A good one, but a fluke nonetheless. I also never had a great feeling of mystery. The story was kinda impenetrable in the sense that it didn't invite you to participate in its ideas or the plot, instead it just took you on a ride. So I haven't exactly walked away thinking about any of the ideas in the movie. The sin of Envy felt like an excuse and forced as well. Which made me feel kinda cold. I wouldn't say I rolled my eyes when the sin of Envy was revealed but I did think it was awful convenient. To me, Seven was a very well executed (pun intended?) series of events with some great acting and cinematography. However, to me it's lacking in depth and...well brains. Not that the movie was dumb, however it didn't raise any great ideas, pose any great questions it just did a cool story. So what am I missing with Seven that makes it worthy of being ONE OF THE BEST MOVIES EVER?
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Oct 1, 2019 06:57
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Se7en is not one of the best movies ever.
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Oct 1, 2019 11:21
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H13 posted:So what am I missing with Seven that makes it worthy of being ONE OF THE BEST MOVIES EVER? Missing the fact that no one considers it one of the best movies ever.
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Oct 1, 2019 11:42
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imdb voters consider it one of the top 20 of all time, just below, uh.... the second lord of the rings and inception 
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Oct 1, 2019 11:45
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The best movie of all time is actually Boondock Saints
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Oct 1, 2019 12:44
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Seven gets a ton of praise for it's atmosphere and production design more than anything else. At least it certainly did at it's premiere. It was pretty ultra dark which wasn't done much at the time (at least for more "realistic" storylines) from it's credit style (which ushered in a new era of stylistically designed credit sequences) to the cinematography and just grim as gently caress production design. And that was the wrapping paper on a really good, but not monumentally great (as you mentioned), storyline. I don't think people consistently consider it one of the best movies ever, but probably one of the more influential - if just for tone and production design - of the time. That's very easy, especially this many years on, to kind of roll into a "best movie of all time" memory ball. BonoMan fucked around with this message at 13:29 on Oct 1, 2019 |
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Oct 1, 2019 13:26
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H13 posted:The sin of Envy felt like an excuse and forced as well. Which made me feel kinda cold. I wouldn't say I rolled my eyes when the sin of Envy was revealed but I did think it was awful convenient. never thought i'd see the day when someone talked poo poo on the "what's in the box???" scene. se7en is a very good movie but i don't know that i've heard anyone call it one of the best ever.
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Oct 1, 2019 13:40
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peer posted:imdb voters consider it one of the top 20 of all time, just below, uh.... the second lord of the rings and inception There's this. Also Cinefx rated it as one of the top movies of the 90s. And most people I speak to will say it's the scariest thriller that they've ever seen and that they couldn't sleep after seeing it. For emphasis: I thought it was very good. I thoroughly enjoyed it and would highly recommend it to anybody. The acting was great and there was a good level of tension throughout the movie. It was unpredictable, disturbing and hosed up. I also thought it was pretty unique that basically all the victims died off-camera and there were no flashbacks as they deconstructed the crime scene or anything. BonoMan posted:It was pretty ultra dark which wasn't done much at the time (at least for more "realistic" storylines) from it's credit style (which ushered in a new era of stylistically designed credit sequences) to the cinematography and just grim as gently caress production design. This is a valid point, but I figure Fincher did better with Fight Club and that had a better influence. Still, I'm glad to hear that I'm not alone in my opinion of: "It was great! But not top 10..."
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Oct 1, 2019 14:16
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When it came out, I thought it was just another find-the-serial-killer procedural, so I wasn't interested. My ultra-conservative Christian parents thought the same thing, but they like bland crap, so they went and saw it before I did. It was SUCH a mindfuck for them, holy poo poo! There's very little gore in the movie, but my mom insisted there was a scene where John Doe force-fed gluttony. (There isn't. It's only described by a coroner, after the fact.) Their reaction made me run out to see it immediately. I love this movie.
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Oct 1, 2019 15:00
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H13 posted:
I'm not quite sure what you're saying here?
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Oct 1, 2019 17:50
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H13 posted:There's this. The main thing you’re missing, and that the people in this thread are ignoring, is most people have seen like 100 movies in their whole life and remember 15 of them, they don’t obsessively watch a dozen a week. Silence of the Lambs and Se7en popularized the gimmick serial killer sub genre that has dominated television for the subsequent 30 years
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Oct 1, 2019 19:04
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BonoMan posted:I'm not quite sure what you're saying here? I thought what you were alluding to is that Seven may influenced a lot of movies to be grim, dark, rainy and grimy in a vaguely sorta realistic way not so much in a comic book way. It's an interesting point, but I figure Fight Club did that better and had more of an influence.
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Oct 2, 2019 01:41
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I don't think that Se7en is one of the best movies ever made, but I do think it's the best-shot movie of the '90s.
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Oct 2, 2019 01:51
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H13 posted:I thought what you were alluding to is that Seven may influenced a lot of movies to be grim, dark, rainy and grimy in a vaguely sorta realistic way not so much in a comic book way. It's an interesting point, but I figure Fight Club did that better and had more of an influence. I see what you're saying, but I think with Seven being 4 years earlier and also by Fincher (and the tones/atmosphere being very similar) I don't think I could comfortably say that people were inspired by Fight Club but *not* by Seven. I'd have to go with the first one made.
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Oct 2, 2019 02:14
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