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Pakistani Brad Pitt posted:Genuine question because not Christian. Is there any place in American Christianity for social justice type Christian politics ala the type who built near every charity and homeless shelter in the company 120 years ago (even if it was a means to an end to evangelize)? Are these people already absorbed into the Democratic party? Lost causes because of abortion or gay rights? Sure, there is a ton of soup kitchen type work done by a bunch of mainline protestant churches that doesn't involve putting the boot in on gays, or racial holy war. But those mainline protestant churches are _old_ , losing population, and not that monied in the first place.
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Oct 9, 2019 23:28
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Pakistani Brad Pitt posted:Genuine question because not Christian. Is there any place in American Christianity for social justice type Christian politics ala the type who built near every charity and homeless shelter in the company 120 years ago (even if it was a means to an end to evangelize)? Are these people already absorbed into the Democratic party? Lost causes because of abortion or gay rights? There are lots of social justice Catholics. Great on economic issues but they generally have a blind spot around abortion.
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Oct 9, 2019 23:28
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Yeah, there are gonna be a lot of angry tweets tonight https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1182060744285798401 https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1182058183063412737
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Oct 9, 2019 23:33
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Pakistani Brad Pitt posted:Genuine question because not Christian. Is there any place in American Christianity for social justice type Christian politics ala the type who built near every charity and homeless shelter in the company 120 years ago (even if it was a means to an end to evangelize)? Are these people already absorbed into the Democratic party? Lost causes because of abortion or gay rights? Quakers (the Society of Friends) are generally pretty good, Nixon notwithstanding
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Oct 9, 2019 23:33
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Pakistani Brad Pitt posted:Genuine question because not Christian. Is there any place in American Christianity for social justice type Christian politics ala the type who built near every charity and homeless shelter in the company 120 years ago (even if it was a means to an end to evangelize)? Are these people already absorbed into the Democratic party? Lost causes because of abortion or gay rights? All of the most charity works driven Christians I’ve met (that weren’t simply trying to evangelize to central Americans but rather engaged in soup kitchen and community work etc.) were either Catholic or Methodist. The Methodists have been undergoing a row due to gay rights recently and the one Methodist I’ve still been in contact with was p upset.
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Oct 9, 2019 23:34
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:There are lots of social justice Catholics. Great on economic issues but they generally have a blind spot around abortion. But put these people in a voting booth, and what lever do they pull at the end of the day? Is abortion enough to override any societal good? Does the calculus change if the Democratic party actually goes full DemSoc in a way that significantly improves the amount of good they do for the poor and downtrodden, instead of paying it lipservice while mostly maintaining the status quo?
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Oct 9, 2019 23:38
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This line of discussion has taught me that the formerly chill Lutheran congregation I grew up in and harbored no ill will towards has gotten CHUD as gently caress and opposes gay marriage. Welp, guess nice Norwegian people signing off key wasn't getting the job done anymore.
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Oct 9, 2019 23:41
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Another day, another impeachable act https://twitter.com/renato_mariotti/status/1182063050540638208
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Oct 9, 2019 23:41
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i would say your average born catholic probably does not pick politics based on their religion and its going to have a lot more to do with ethnic background/region/upbringing overall Catholics went for trump like 50% or something
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Oct 9, 2019 23:43
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Pakistani Brad Pitt posted:But put these people in a voting booth, and what lever do they pull at the end of the day? Is abortion enough to override any societal good? A lot of them pull the lever for Democrats. There are single-issue voter Catholics with abortion but their problem is the single-issue part, not the Catholic part (Catholics can still be garbage for lots of other reasons, not least of which is pedophile priests)
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Oct 9, 2019 23:43
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The Episcopal church is great especially now that the reactionary bigots split off to passive aggressively name their new denomination Anglican, to imply Episcopalians aren't real Anglicans or frankly real Christians also there's a hearty number of good evangelicals even, part of the reason I read Fred Slacktivist Clark sometimes is to remind me they exist he regularly rails against conservative evangelicals for being basically heretics
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Oct 9, 2019 23:46
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The Glumslinger posted:Another day, another impeachable act Is there a reason why the House doesn't just impeach him? Or put up a vote? It seems like sending out subpoenas and requests for documents that the White House will refuse to comply with is just a colossal waste of time.
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Oct 9, 2019 23:46
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Niwrad posted:Is there a reason why the House doesn't just impeach him? Or put up a vote? It seems like sending out subpoenas and requests for documents that the White House will refuse to comply with is just a colossal waste of time. after they refuse the subpoena you sue in civil court, there are an increasingly large number of cases being processed, they just don't happen instantly and are boring until they conclude so this sentiment gets expressed in here over and over and over and over and
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Oct 9, 2019 23:49
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Chef Boyardeez Nuts posted:This line of discussion has taught me that the formerly chill Lutheran congregation I grew up in and harbored no ill will towards has gotten CHUD as gently caress and opposes gay marriage. This is my anecdotal experience growing up in a liberal Jewish family in the upper midwest, and then visiting home now and then. I can't figure out if I was just deluded in my youth about all the nice Lutherans and their church basement lock-ins which were actually fun and where I was always welcome and not evangelized to. My read on the situation is that right-wing media (both radio and Fox News) poisoned everyone's brains and the more socialist friendly Scandinavian elders all died off without passing their values to their children and grandchildren. But maybe that's wishful, naive thinking and they were all just assholes when I wasn't around...
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Oct 9, 2019 23:49
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:So am I the only one whose reaction to the california shutdown is "nationalize all power networks" ? Because this seems like one of those "market failures" I've been told don't exist! They tried private tort remedies and everything~! San Francisco is or at least was considering buying PG&E equipment within city limits and doing just that. Link: https://www.kqed.org/news/11773007/san-francisco-offers-to-buy-pge-electric-grid-in-the-city-for-2-5-billion ought ten fucked around with this message at 23:51 on Oct 9, 2019 |
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Oct 9, 2019 23:49
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Niwrad posted:Is there a reason why the House doesn't just impeach him? Or put up a vote? It seems like sending out subpoenas and requests for documents that the White House will refuse to comply with is just a colossal waste of time. I imagine that they are waiting for enough solid optics to be out that it doesn't look like a partisan move. When the Senate inevitably votes to acquit you want them to do so in the face of overwhelming evidence that he's guilty.
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Oct 9, 2019 23:50
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Niwrad posted:Is there a reason why the House doesn't just impeach him? Or put up a vote? It seems like sending out subpoenas and requests for documents that the White House will refuse to comply with is just a colossal waste of time. Impeaching sends it to the Senate. Putting up a vote does nothing in terms of actual impeachment inquiry ability. Enforcing the subpoenas is the next necessary step
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Oct 9, 2019 23:51
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https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2019-10-08/trump-tax-return-ruling-could-open-a-door-to-indictment Not federal, but a judge just exploded the lawsuit blocking access to Trump's tax returns
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Oct 9, 2019 23:51
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GreyjoyBastard posted:after they refuse the subpoena you sue in civil court, there are an increasingly large number of cases being processed, they just don't happen instantly and are boring until they conclude so this sentiment gets expressed in here over and over and over and over and Why would anyone believe they would turn over the documents after a court demands it?
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Oct 9, 2019 23:51
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Niwrad posted:Why would anyone believe they would turn over the documents after a court demands it? so far the administration has not gone lol no to this sort of thing and the US Marshals have not gone lol no to enforcing it
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Oct 9, 2019 23:54
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Pakistani Brad Pitt posted:Genuine question because not Christian. Is there any place in American Christianity for social justice type Christian politics ala the type who built near every charity and homeless shelter in the company 120 years ago (even if it was a means to an end to evangelize)? Are these people already absorbed into the Democratic party? Lost causes because of abortion or gay rights? Jesuits are legit cool progressive dudes and nuns for the most part I've heard some Lutheran and Episcopalan groups are heavy on it as well.
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Oct 9, 2019 23:55
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Pakistani Brad Pitt posted:But put these people in a voting booth, and what lever do they pull at the end of the day? Is abortion enough to override any societal good? In my experience, if people are single-issue voters on abortion, there is not a damned thing the other side could do or not do that matters. Trump could have a personal abortion doctor he’s recommended all his mistresses to, and as long as he put abortion foes on the SC, he gets anti-abortion single issue voters. But in general, anti-abortion Christians in the US are much much much more about white male supremacy than they are about any sort of charity, and have actively convinced themselves that a government that helps the poor is actually hurting them by turning them away from the church.
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Oct 9, 2019 23:56
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Niwrad posted:Is there a reason why the House doesn't just impeach him? Or put up a vote? It seems like sending out subpoenas and requests for documents that the White House will refuse to comply with is just a colossal waste of time. A. They're still on recess until next Monday B. Why would they impeach him now? The investigation is just getting going and once they vote on the articles of impeachment, the entire process goes to the Senate where Mitch McConnell has control over it.
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Oct 9, 2019 23:57
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Niwrad posted:Is there a reason why the House doesn't just impeach him? Or put up a vote? It seems like sending out subpoenas and requests for documents that the White House will refuse to comply with is just a colossal waste of time. Waiting for impeachment number to go up. Holy poo poo that is loving illegal.
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Oct 9, 2019 23:57
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The horrific nature of this administration is the least satisfying "I told you so" in the world. It's as bad and worse than I thought it would be.
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Oct 10, 2019 00:00
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The Glumslinger posted:B. Why would they impeach him now? He has committed a bunch of crimes and admitted to asking a foreign country to interfere in our election. He'll be out of office or on his 2nd term by the time this one makes it through the courts. And we're also assuming a DOJ led by Bill Barr is going to follow-through with any of this. And yes I know that it'll get shutdown in the Senate. But that's on the Senate and let those dipshits have to take a side before the election.
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Oct 10, 2019 00:01
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pacerhimself posted:The horrific nature of this administration is the least satisfying "I told you so" in the world. It's as bad and worse than I thought it would be. I know, right? Between this and climate change there's absolutely no upside to being right. We get to stand around in the ashes of our civilization and even "I told you this would happen" is just bitter ashes
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Oct 10, 2019 00:02
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FizFashizzle posted:Waiting for impeachment number to go up. the number go up meme annoys me and it's difficult to articulate why edit: can't easily find current status of the other pending subpoena cases because the related news is inundated with the financial documents ruling, but iirc the next scheduled thing was next Monday Goatse James Bond fucked around with this message at 00:04 on Oct 10, 2019 |
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Oct 10, 2019 00:02
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pacerhimself posted:The horrific nature of this administration is the least satisfying "I told you so" in the world. It's as bad and worse than I thought it would be. yeah. shits gonna get so much worse as impeachment and such gets bigger. i mean loving fox shows he is underwater on their polls.
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Oct 10, 2019 00:03
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Mooseontheloose posted:I'm surprised the state of California doesn't just oust the company and take it over. Attempting to do anything serious to combat PG&E has a long, long history of somehow becoming an issue of "Interstate Commerce" or "Freedom of Speech" (I poo poo you not) and getting shot down at SCOTUS level.
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Oct 10, 2019 00:03
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Niwrad posted:He has committed a bunch of crimes and admitted to asking a foreign country to interfere in our election. He'll be out of office or on his 2nd term by the time this one makes it through the courts. And we're also assuming a DOJ led by Bill Barr is going to follow-through with any of this. I mean "now" as in voting on articles of impeachment 9am Monday as opposed to in 1-2 months, when they've actually had time to get some subpoenas through court and interviewed more witnesses
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Oct 10, 2019 00:03
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The Glumslinger posted:I mean "now" as in voting on articles of impeachment 9am Monday as opposed to in 1-2 months, when they've actually had time to get some subpoenas through court and interviewed more witnesses I'm agnostic on when exactly between December ish and the election the House should pull the trigger and the decision depends on a Lot Of Stuf anyway
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Oct 10, 2019 00:06
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I'm still in disbelief that this Ukraine poo poo is sticking. The way that I know its sticking is when I observe my facebook feed. Typical conservative folk are either radio silent with their poo poo tier memes or "the world is in a bad state, but don't panic" existential bullshit memes. Also their libertarian 'both sides are the problem' stuff too. It's like his distraction machine can't keep up.
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Oct 10, 2019 00:06
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GreyjoyBastard posted:https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2019-10-08/trump-tax-return-ruling-could-open-a-door-to-indictment That is a federal judge. It’s on appeal to the second circuit and should get a ruling from the 2nd this month.
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Oct 10, 2019 00:07
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evilweasel posted:That is a federal judge. It’s on appeal to the second circuit and should get a ruling from the 2nd this month. you're right I was unclear, I meant that it's new York making the doc demand, not the feds / the House
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Oct 10, 2019 00:09
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Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:https://mobile.twitter.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/1182053871499333632 that doesnt surprise me.
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Oct 10, 2019 00:09
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Has there been any idea why Trump made the move to abandon the Kurds? Personal business? Help with the campaign?
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Oct 10, 2019 00:12
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Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:https://mobile.twitter.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/1182053871499333632 This is why he should have been tossed out Day One for emoluments. The Kurds continuing to stick by us is better than they, or we, deserve. This sucks. Especially for indigenous training teams like this, who have lived with these folks for months getting them up to speed to help us fight. From a service perspective: If their names (hell, if my name) got out describing this as bullshit, then that pops up a red flag for our counter-terror/OPSEC training. 'Dissatisfaction of US Policy' is considered a warning signal for an insider threat. I an not an insider threat by any stretch (wrong temperament, lack of red flags, access to info), Leaders on the ground aren't insider threats. But it'll pop up anyway because of this. Props to the operator on ground speaking out, and I hope he remains anonymous. Be safe, guys. Niwrad posted:Has there been any idea why Trump made the move to abandon the Kurds? Personal business? Help with the campaign? No one is sure, but the best guess is a mix between 1) his love for strongmen, 2) General disdain for other NATO allies telling him this is a poo poo idea, and 3) Trump Tower Istanbul. J.A.B.C. fucked around with this message at 00:17 on Oct 10, 2019 |
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Oct 10, 2019 00:13
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Niwrad posted:Has there been any idea why Trump made the move to abandon the Kurds? Personal business? Help with the campaign? he had a call with Erdogan shortly before he triggered this shitshow, but nobody who's talking knows the specifics of Trump's, ahem, decision making process on this one yet it's conceivable that literally nobody actually knows and this was just Trump going "well I need a win and fast, people like presidents who end wars and bring the troops home" or something
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Oct 10, 2019 00:13
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