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His Divine Shadow posted:Another Mark Blyth video, I have to say I'm not really following his logic re Corbyn and why an election after hard brexit means a sure win for Johnsson. I wonder if it stems from his homebrew idea that Corbyn never wanted to be PM. I haven't watched that, but when he's talked about it before it's basically come down to
it all comes down to the Tories needing an election during that honeymoon period, before things start to go south e-  107 Cat FM, all the mews Crewe can use baka kaba fucked around with this message at 20:10 on Oct 11, 2019 |
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Oct 11, 2019 20:07
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BalloonFish posted:Or am I being far too naive? I think you are. XR is a middle-class liberal protest movement which much like the FBPE crowd was born from people who have never had to stakeout a political identity before. They've been brought up believing the world works for them because until the world has worked for them. They're still in the middle of processing the state won't always go their way and they don't know how to react to that yet. But they've grown up in a world where asking nicely and being respectful is all you need to do to get what you want so that's what they're going with. However their tactics are highly dangerous for rank and file members, especially those of working class and BAME backgrounds which is something they have zero acknowledgement for. As I said in the podcast there are some positives about what XR have achieved but at the end of the day the fact that you're putting your own people at risk of losing their jobs, their finances and their lives is at best ignorance and at worst active callousness.
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Oct 11, 2019 20:10
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tbh any talk of "after a hard Brexit" is basically moot because there's no real way for it to happen hard Brexit necessitates a hard border in Ireland which is unacceptable both to them and to the EU and Parliament has made it entirely clear that it's opposed to No Deal and will pass any required legislation to prevent it happening the only way I can imagine it happening is after an election which somehow gives the Tories enough of a majority of disaster capitalists and raving nutjobs that they can No Deal without Parliament voting to stop it
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Oct 11, 2019 20:14
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BalloonFish posted:The first bit is correct, and if the rank and file XR membership are being misled into genuinely thinking that the police will play fair and treat them with kid gloves because they send flowers to the station and pause their protests when the cops nip to the loo then that's not good. "Look at the television Maud, the police are beating those decent people up. People like us." I think a corollary is that a lot of people at the protests are people whose entire experience of the police is as an invisible benevolent service provider. The ideas that underpin their view of the world- "decent people have nothing to be fear" and "all this will be solved if we just sit down and talk reasonably" will be shattered the moment they experience the police the same way large, ignored parts of society do- as a brutal occupying force. Being the victim of police is a big signpost to radicalisation. Still rubbish that someone has to get their head smashed in to make it happen though.
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Oct 11, 2019 20:17
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The issue with that reasoning is that the television won't show the police beating people up because it never does, that would make the police look like violent thugs. What it will show is lots of protestors doing silly things and then a bunch of people saying how useless it is and how they're just making their lives harder, and now your protestors are crazy and the police are our noble heroes defending us from them.
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Oct 11, 2019 20:25
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Rarity posted:I think you are. XR is a middle-class liberal protest movement which much like the FBPE crowd was born from people who have never had to stakeout a political identity before. They've been brought up believing the world works for them because until the world has worked for them...As I said in the podcast there are some positives about what XR have achieved but at the end of the day the fact that you're putting your own people at risk of losing their jobs, their finances and their lives is at best ignorance and at worst active callousness. Endjinneer posted:"Look at the television Maud, the police are beating those decent people up. People like us." OwlFancier posted:The issue with that reasoning is that the television won't show the police beating people up because it never does, that would make the police look like violent thugs. These are all excellent points. Thanks. I'm afraid to say my only 'protest' experience was an anti-Iraq War mingle-and-wave-placards affair in Bristol and the junior docs march in London in 2016, so I'm straight from the "middle-class liberal who thinks you can get things by asking nicely" upbringing. If I hadn't already been reading this thread regularly for over five years I'm pretty sure I'd be singing the praises of XR while being too much of a wuss to either join them or do anything more constructive.
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Oct 11, 2019 20:42
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People shouldn't be disparaged for protesting a meaningful cause because of their class or privilege. If XR manages to garner attention to the cause its good, but pretty much every clip I've seen of them seems to be them singing how much they love the cops kettling them so I'm not sure.
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Oct 11, 2019 20:50
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I'm scared of large crowds and I often want to run away if I feel any attention directed at me from people. I also think that I don't like being "seen" protesting partially because of my own cowardice and partially because if I do something bad I could get everyone else in trouble.
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Oct 11, 2019 20:57
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They should probably be disparaged when their privilege blinds them to the vulnerabilities of their would be comrades and makes them willing to throw them into the grinder rather than listen to people with more experience.
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Oct 11, 2019 20:57
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On the topic of protests, I've always wanted to be more involved with various bits and pieces including direct action. However, I have diabetes and you better loving believe I'm not getting myself put in the cells for even one night given that (google for some delightful stories of people almost dying of DKA/hypoglycemia because their medication + emergency carbs have been confiscated and the cops have just ignored them yelling). How can I help out in a way that I'm putting myself in any (unnecessary) risk/making myself a liability?
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Oct 11, 2019 21:00
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ThomasPaine posted:On the topic of protests, I've always wanted to be more involved with various bits and pieces including direct action. However, I have diabetes and you better loving believe I'm not getting myself put in the cells for even one night given that (google for some delightful stories of people almost dying of DKA/hypoglycemia because their medication + emergency carbs have been confiscated and the cops have just ignored them yelling). How can I help out in a way that I'm putting myself in any (unnecessary) risk/making myself a liability? Not even willing to die for the cause smh
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Oct 11, 2019 21:05
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OwlFancier posted:They should probably be disparaged when their privilege blinds them to the vulnerabilities of their would be comrades and makes them willing to throw them into the grinder rather than listen to people with more experience. Are you talking collectively? Because I've got colleagues who have gone to some of these protests, and we're massively underpayed conservationists/ecologists so know our stuff. I know the local uni here had a massive turnout for one too. I'm for the protests, but the attention needs to be on the issues not the police worship. Plus, Greta is way cooler than some old white dude.
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Oct 11, 2019 21:05
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ThomasPaine posted:On the topic of protests, I've always wanted to be more involved with various bits and pieces including direct action. However, I have diabetes and you better loving believe I'm not getting myself put in the cells for even one night given that (google for some delightful stories of people almost dying of DKA/hypoglycemia because their medication + emergency carbs have been confiscated and the cops have just ignored them yelling). How can I help out in a way that I'm putting myself in any (unnecessary) risk/making myself a liability? Become a martyr and I'll buy you a sweet av to remember you by
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Oct 11, 2019 21:05
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ThomasPaine posted:On the topic of protests, I've always wanted to be more involved with various bits and pieces including direct action. However, I have diabetes and you better loving believe I'm not getting myself put in the cells for even one night given that (google for some delightful stories of people almost dying of DKA/hypoglycemia because their medication + emergency carbs have been confiscated and the cops have just ignored them yelling). How can I help out in a way that I'm putting myself in any (unnecessary) risk/making myself a liability? Protests take a lot of organising so you could always pitch in with the prep work. Best thing to do is get in touch with a local activist group and build connections. Any left-wing group will appreciate your situation and help you stay out of risk.
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Oct 11, 2019 21:06
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Ratjaculation posted:Become a martyr and I'll buy you a sweet av to remember you by A tempting offer
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Oct 11, 2019 21:06
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ThomasPaine posted:On the topic of protests, I've always wanted to be more involved with various bits and pieces including direct action. However, I have diabetes and you better loving believe I'm not getting myself put in the cells for even one night given that (google for some delightful stories of people almost dying of DKA/hypoglycemia because their medication + emergency carbs have been confiscated and the cops have just ignored them yelling). How can I help out in a way that I'm putting myself in any (unnecessary) risk/making myself a liability? Stuff a bunch of insulin in a condom then swallow it. Regardless of if you're off to a protest.
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Oct 11, 2019 21:08
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You could always smuggle some emergency non-nestle smartie type things up your butt incase you get locked up
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Oct 11, 2019 21:08
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Trying to imagine reading a news report of a goon being arrested and found with entire insulin syringes smuggled up his arse and lolling deeply.
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Oct 11, 2019 21:09
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thats my understanding of diabetes btw, please feel free to be offended if sweets would actually kill you
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Oct 11, 2019 21:09
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Tesseraction posted:Trying to imagine reading a news report of a goon being arrested and found with entire insulin syringes smuggled up his arse and lolling deeply. my brothers mate did 6 months inside and his cell mate was doing serious damage to his arse because he kept a mobile in it and used shampoo as the lube. he apparently only ever used it to just call friends to talk
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Oct 11, 2019 21:11
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JFC I'm half-listening to HIGNFY from the other room where my wife has it on and steam is already coming out of my ears.
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Oct 11, 2019 21:12
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Jose posted:my brothers mate did 6 months inside and his cell mate was doing serious damage to his arse because he kept a mobile in it and used shampoo as the lube. he apparently only ever used it to just call friends to talk did your brothers mate ever borrow the phone
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Oct 11, 2019 21:14
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Jose posted:my brothers mate did 6 months inside and his cell mate was doing serious damage to his arse because he kept a mobile in it and used shampoo as the lube. he apparently only ever used it to just call friends to talk Friends please only insert your butt phones with a body safe lubricant thanks
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Oct 11, 2019 21:15
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How did he charge it?
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Oct 11, 2019 21:18
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No idea. At least one famous person has seen Greta thunbergs speech https://twitter.com/TorbsTalks/status/1180819459382169600?s=19
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Oct 11, 2019 21:19
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Jose posted:my brothers mate did 6 months inside and his cell mate was doing serious damage to his arse because he kept a mobile in it and used shampoo as the lube. he apparently only ever used it to just call friends to talk Most new prisons have phones in the call, these phone up the arse tricks will fall by the wayside as older prisons are closed. Another tradition will be lost.
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Oct 11, 2019 21:20
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Jose posted:my brothers mate did 6 months inside and his cell mate was doing serious damage to his arse because he kept a mobile in it and used shampoo as the lube. he apparently only ever used it to just call friends to talk Now we know the source of the prolaspe pics.
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Oct 11, 2019 21:21
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RabidWeasel posted:Friends please only insert your butt phones with a body safe lubricant thanks
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Oct 11, 2019 21:23
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ThomasPaine posted:On the topic of protests, I've always wanted to be more involved with various bits and pieces including direct action. However, I have diabetes and you better loving believe I'm not getting myself put in the cells for even one night given that (google for some delightful stories of people almost dying of DKA/hypoglycemia because their medication + emergency carbs have been confiscated and the cops have just ignored them yelling). How can I help out in a way that I'm putting myself in any (unnecessary) risk/making myself a liability? There are people who are basically observers to check the polis aren't getting up to shenanigans and taking advantage of folk who don't know their rights. Hell, my first march was pre-Iraq and I had no loving clue what I was up to. There's also people who help by handing out water and poo poo like that so people don't keel over while being kettled for hours. Plenty of ways to be useful without joining your local black bloc.
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Oct 11, 2019 21:26
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Josef bugman posted:I'm scared of large crowds and I often want to run away if I feel any attention directed at me from people. I also think that I don't like being "seen" protesting partially because of my own cowardice and partially because if I do something bad I could get everyone else in trouble. A couple of people in this thread have mentioned that protests take admin. There are also some links to green and black cross who need legal observers- your role would be not to participate. Or, if the whole hug-a-copper thing all starts to turn sour, you could do a Brown Moses and specialise in linking together all the tweets and videos of the protests to work out what really went down.
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Oct 11, 2019 21:37
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Ratjaculation posted:People shouldn't be disparaged for protesting a meaningful cause because of their class or privilege. If XR manages to garner attention to the cause its good, but pretty much every clip I've seen of them seems to be them singing how much they love the cops kettling them so I'm not sure. BAME and working class people meanwhile get their lives and future prospects destroyed for doing the same. It's not about class, it's about XR thinking that what essentially amounts to a picnic with the police is the same thing as someone rioting because if they don't the government are going to starve them. It reminds me of the start of Orange is the New Black, where Piper gets to say goodbye to her friends and family, has a going away party and makes her husband promise not to binge any of their favourite shows. Then immediately lands in a prison full of people who were slammed against a car and then locked the gently caress up without the barest ceremony, often for doing much less than she did. It's not that the middle class shouldn't protest, it's that the people participating in XR don't understand how privelaged they are to be able to do this and walk away unharmed.
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Oct 11, 2019 21:43
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Endjinneer posted:A couple of people in this thread have mentioned that protests take admin. There are also some links to green and black cross who need legal observers- your role would be not to participate. I do love logistics.
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Oct 11, 2019 21:47
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Ratjaculation posted:Become a martyr and I'll buy you a sweet av to remember you by Something sweet is surely the last thing they need.
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Oct 11, 2019 21:59
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goddamnedtwisto posted:Something sweet is surely the last thing they need. I mean, it's frequently the exact thing they need, assuming type 1 diabetes.
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Oct 11, 2019 22:00
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Jose posted:No idea. This is bad rear end
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Oct 11, 2019 22:06
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Bobby Deluxe posted:The point is not really in taking the piss out of the middle class, it's that the middle class get to treat it like a fun activity day, and if they get arrested they'll probably get at worst an informal caution and a story to tell at work and feel like they are officially now protesters. Isn't there over a thousand or so of these people going through the courts right now. Its good to criticise their methods in regards to the police, but disregarding it entirely as a middle class picnic is a disservice to those who now have to defend their cause in our courts. I've already commented that I know working class people at these protests, so I don't think that is a valid point. There might be merit in the BAME statement, and XR are loving idiots for the lovely messages they sent to protestors about 'most cops are black, so you'll be fine.' But there were plenty of BAME protestors visible, even at the smaller protests around the country, don't do them an injustice by assuming they wouldn't turn up. I've also got no idea what you're talking about with Orange if the New Black, have you got a classic Simpsons equivilant reference?
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Oct 11, 2019 22:09
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^^^ You're right about not writing it off completely, and I think combined with everything else that's going on it is having some effect on things. It just feels like it's not the heroic gesture that the name Extinction Rebellion would imply. Homer, his arms wide. thespaceinvader posted:I mean, it's frequently the exact thing they need, assuming type 1 diabetes. Bobby Deluxe fucked around with this message at 22:13 on Oct 11, 2019 |
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Oct 11, 2019 22:09
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lol if true https://twitter.com/AzadiRojava/status/1182744542946168833
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Oct 11, 2019 22:11
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NATO rules. In more exciting news, my PC has been doing a Windows update for 3 hours now and is at 22% complete.
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Oct 11, 2019 22:15
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forkboy84 posted:NATO rules. ymmv but my update was slow for the first 30% and then jumped to 80% pretty quickly
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Oct 11, 2019 22:19
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