|
Suspicious posted:funnily this worldview wasn't around until the 70s (unless you were catholic) it's catholics I'm talking about (since I live in a catholic country), you protestants are just loving weird it probably was there before that but it was less important to people (less single-issue voters, in other words) it was instrumentalized to effect election victory, it wasn't made out of thin air
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 02:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 22, 2024 11:31 |
|
|
Doctor Jeep posted:it probably was but look at it realistically, if in your world view there are (among others) two huge laws - "life is sacred" and "life begins at conception", then the logical endpoint is "abortion is murder" They don't believe the second part.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 03:30
|
|
|
VitalSigns posted:They don't believe the second part. They believe it’s true for anyone who isn’t them.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 03:32
|
|
|
VitalSigns posted:They don't believe the second part. yes they do, "the only moral abortion is my abortion" isn't a good reply since that's what people generally do when their beliefs bite them in the rear end - they ignore them, and you can't generalize from a limited number of cases edit: or what antifa turkeeesian said
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 03:57
|
|
|
i don't believe this is going to be the iteration of Something Awful psychoanalyzing anti-choicers to get further than "they sure seem to claim it's about fetuses being the same thing as toddlers pretty vehemently, but their actions do not line up with that and they will not elaborate on the disconnect"
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 03:58
|
|
|
Catholic views on this were changing wildly over the years https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ensoulment
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 07:59
|
|
|
If you told me children didn't get souls until they were, like, 7 I'd believe you.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 08:03
|
|
|
Epic High Five posted:its okay he's apologized for it he is saved now on one hand that's a lovely way to treat women but on the other than that's a great way to treat evangelical leaders
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 11:51
|
|
|
lynch_69 posted:You hate to see it... that's the stuff genuinely surprised that this idiot decided to cut ties with trump after this there are around 5 similar stories (most probably posted in here) of deported immigrants getting hosed over but not changing their views on trump
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 11:54
|
|
|
VitalSigns posted:They don't believe the second part. They don't believe either. They love the death penalty.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 14:22
|
|
|
FMguru posted:"I'm sure when white people talk about cracking down on and banning and deporting all muslims, they'll make a careful distinction and exception for minority sub groups like us." - something those dumb fuckers actually believed. A lot of people bought into the marketing of our foreign policy
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 15:15
|
|
|
ElGroucho posted:So Iraqi Christians = Arab Gusanos, yes? No, it's a sad and ugly domino thing of persecutions. Not descendents of rich landowners sniffing about their losses.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 15:38
|
|
|
Volcott posted:If you told me children didn't get souls until they were, like, 7 I'd believe you.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 16:04
|
|
|
lynch_69 posted:You hate to see it... If there is any clear cut time to  in your life, that's pretty much it
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 16:07
|
|
|
Volcott posted:If you told me children didn't get souls until they were, like, 7 I'd believe you. well there is reincarnation and paranormal research where the findings heavily imply that 7-8 years old is when the soul completely binds to a person i mean take that with a grain of salt
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 17:16
|
|
|
Doctor Jeep posted:yes they do No they don't. Birth control is a magical pill that prevents murders according to them and yet they don't want anyone to have it. It may be theoretically possible that someone has a genuine belief that life begins at conception and all their politics is based on a principled stance of minimizing murder, but they ain't voting GOP because the GOP maximizes the deaths of zygotes *and* living children. E: don't forget the Alabama legislator who admitted they aren't going to ban killing the surplus fertilized eggs created during IVF because it's "not in a woman". None of these so-called life voters care about those blastocysts because saving them doesn't punish SLUTS VitalSigns has issued a correction as of 19:07 on Oct 14, 2019 |
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 19:05
|
|
|
Elephant Ambush posted:They don't believe either. They love the death penalty. Also wars
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 19:08
|
|
|
Dr. Killjoy posted:well there is reincarnation and paranormal research where the findings heavily imply that 7-8 years old is when the soul completely binds to a person That means that abortion IS morally equivalent to killing a five-year-old. I guess the fundies are right, just not quite in the way they thought they meant.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 19:18
|
|
|
VitalSigns posted:No they don't. if being a hypocrite meant you didn't actually believe the thing you say you do almost nobody could be said to have any beliefs they do believe that and that's why they create elaborate justifications for when they break their own laws it's a soft and squishy belief that gets stomped on when the shoe is on their foot but like I said, that's a normal thing, people are generally hypocrites
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 20:06
|
|
|
Doctor Jeep posted:if being a hypocrite meant you didn't actually believe the thing you say you do almost nobody could be said to have any beliefs It goes beyond simple hypocrisy. I can believe embezzling is bad, even if I personally embezzled and came up with a justification for why it's okay when I do it. Pro-life poo poo isn't that, they take a ton of affirmative stances that directly contradict this 'belief', because it isn't something they actually believe it's just an external rationalization for what they really want to do which is impose medieval sexual mores on everyone. They even admit it openly, see Alabama not giving a poo poo about precious zygote baby-wabys if they're in a freezer instead of in a woman.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 20:19
|
|
|
With the exception of some small genuine religious groups, they don't support maternity leave, subsidized daycare, WIC, higher minimum wages to allow for more single-job homes, etc. There's also a point that a bunch of miscarriages are likely caused by women not being able to switch to light-duty or more bedrest early in the pregnancy, because they have to work. If the anti-abortion people cared, then wide-ranging maternity leave would be a bedrock. It's either squishy to the point of not being a real belief, or yeah, it's about punishing and controlling women.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 20:51
|
|
|
VitalSigns posted:It goes beyond simple hypocrisy. I can believe embezzling is bad, even if I personally embezzled and came up with a justification for why it's okay when I do it. the alabama thing has to be an aberration because the zygote issue is a big thing in christian disapproval of IVF, or maybe the idiots in the legislature didn't even read the law lol embezzling is a simple issue, come on, the sanctitiy of life is much more complex because it's so fundamental the belief is there, it's just criss-crossed with a bunch of other beliefs (like what you mentioned, medieval sexual mores) which often trump it e: Parakeet vs. Phone posted:With the exception of some small genuine religious groups, they don't support maternity leave, subsidized daycare, WIC, higher minimum wages to allow for more single-job homes, etc. There's also a point that a bunch of miscarriages are likely caused by women not being able to switch to light-duty or more bedrest early in the pregnancy, because they have to work. If the anti-abortion people cared, then wide-ranging maternity leave would be a bedrock. It's either squishy to the point of not being a real belief, or yeah, it's about punishing and controlling women. this is where being a piece of poo poo trumps life being sacred or there's some bullshit about "well we're not killing them, just making them have lovely lives of suffering which is fine" Doktor Avalanche has issued a correction as of 20:57 on Oct 14, 2019 |
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 20:53
|
|
|
Doctor Jeep posted:it's catholics I'm talking about (since I live in a catholic country), you protestants are just loving weird It's like all the transphoboa. Basically not a thing politically til maybe 3 years ago. Then came roaring in like a lion.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 21:38
|
|
|
Doctor Jeep posted:the alabama thing has to be an aberration because the zygote issue is a big thing in christian disapproval of IVF, or maybe the idiots in the legislature didn't even read the law lol They don't want women who get abortions to go to prison or be punished at all, even though according to their own reasoning the women are either guilty of murder or conspiracy depending on whether they did it or had someone else do it. Even though a woman who murdered or paid someone to murder her born children would go to prison. A quarter of women have had abortions, there are 100 million or so adult women in the USA, are they going to put 25 million women in prison for murder? We're going to multiply the prison population by 8 and pretty much torch the economy, civil society, fertility rates, etc and hire everyone who isn't in jail into the prison-industrial complex? That's what we need to do because 1/8 of the country is guilty of murder right, and probably half as many men are guilty of conspiracy for helping their wife/gf murder their zygote right. They want women who try to get abortions to be forced to give birth and raise the child, even though those women are attempted murderers according to them. If someone tried to kill their born children would they give the victims back to their attempted murderer, no, that would be insanely dangerous. Unless you don't think abortion is really murder then it makes sense. Birth control prevents murder, they don't want women to have it. Sex ed prevents murder, they don't want it taught. VitalSigns has issued a correction as of 23:12 on Oct 14, 2019 |
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 23:03
|
|
|
you're overthinking it, the only thing you need to consider to realize how shallow and fraudulent the forced birthers are about their single issue is how the role of the man in the pregnancy is never discussed and they will react in horror if you suggest they should also be held to account for their sleeping around Evangelical Protestantism is basically what you'd get if a venture capital firm hired a fertility cult to do all their messaging
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 23:07
|
|
|
at some point it's like all the AREN'T THE REPUBLICANS SUPPOSED TO BE THE PARTY OF LIMITED GOVERNMENT, HMMM? stuff. the whole rationale isn't anything more complicated than "gently caress you". That's all it is. They're never going to care about being hypocrites.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 23:09
|
|
|
Smirking_Serpent posted:at some point it's like all the AREN'T THE REPUBLICANS SUPPOSED TO BE THE PARTY OF LIMITED GOVERNMENT, HMMM? stuff. Yes I know that's my point. None of the pro-lifers care about any of that, and if you point it out to them they won't care because their goal is punishing sluts for disobeying the Lord or whatever, and the saving babies poo poo is just something they say to justify it to others or maybe themselves. That's why waxing about their sincere heartfelt belief in fetal personhood is nonsense.
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 23:14
|
|
|
Thundercracker posted:It's like all the transphoboa. Basically not a thing politically til maybe 3 years ago. Then came roaring in like a lion. It's because they can't get any more mileage out of simply hating gays. I haven't heard a conservative pundit rail on gay marriage or gay anything really in some time now. This is the new frontier and conservatives are, practically by definition, the last people to admit to or really learn anything new about anything at all. The whole..well..."movement" is a bad word but...the idea behind it is "this is how it was, this is how it is, this is how it should be". Hence "read this book from centuries ago but only these certain parts". I mean, to me, it's basically the modern extension of people who thought Columbus would sail off the edge of the earth. BiggerBoat has issued a correction as of 23:23 on Oct 14, 2019 |
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 23:19
|
|
|
Epic High Five posted:you're overthinking it, the only thing you need to consider to realize how shallow and fraudulent the forced birthers are about their single issue is how the role of the man in the pregnancy is never discussed and they will react in horror if you suggest they should also be held to account for their sleeping around If they thought there was a chance of getting a law passed that makes abortion the man's choice they would champion it, and come up with a theology that says God puts the soul in there when the father wishes for a child, so it's murder if the woman aborts it even if she never tells him. Also if she refuses to abort it when he tells her to she's guilty of grand larceny (of his sperm) (which is priceless) (death penalty)
|
|
#
?
Oct 14, 2019 23:27
|
|
|
Thundercracker posted:It's like all the transphoboa. Basically not a thing politically til maybe 3 years ago. Then came roaring in like a lion. The gently caress are you talking about? Trans people have been getting murdered for being trans since the dawn of this country
|
|
#
?
Oct 15, 2019 01:01
|
|
|
Dreddout posted:The gently caress are you talking about? i think the idea is, trans people were always on the conservative shitlist, but they were a lower priority than "the gays" because they were far fewer in number and there was very little attempt at giving them visibility on a national stage (rupaul and some other token people notwithstanding) now that "the gays" are have achieved a significant level of accepted normalcy in our country (and more importantly, have secured actual legal protections) the hate for trans people has become amplified, because they're next on the shitlist and they don't yet have the same legal protections that cis gay people have obviously it's unsafe for both cis gay and trans people to be out in large swaths of our country even in TYOOL 2019, but relatively speaking gay rights have become more mainstream so trans rights is the next thing the conservatives will piss and moan about
|
|
#
?
Oct 15, 2019 01:10
|
|
|
I don't think it's possible to take that claim seriously if you've looked at any meaningful amount of pre-2000s pop media. Caricatures of hairy perverts dressed in womens' clothing and traps springing a dick on unfortunate dudes are extremely common stock boogeymen/subjects of jokes where the punchline is punching, going back pretty much as far as you care to look. this is what a double platinum album sounded like back before gay rights had made traction https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLzNer0CiGM pop culture had chilled out marginally by the next year, Funky Cold Medina only got single platinum and nobody got their dick shot off https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63ZIf2H9S0E A Wizard of Goatse has issued a correction as of 01:51 on Oct 15, 2019 |
|
#
?
Oct 15, 2019 01:21
|
|
|
also fyi the supreme court has bent over backwards not to give homosexuals protected group status several states have ofc, but it isn't federally protected from discrimination like it is for race and disability obama did enact this tho in 2014
|
|
#
?
Oct 15, 2019 01:34
|
|
|
Can't believe I gotta break out this golden oldie: Pro-life stances don't give a gently caress about life, they care about controlling and punishing women for being uppity and thinking they are people instead of objects. See: any Republican who forces his mistress to get an abortion to cover an affair.
|
|
#
?
Oct 15, 2019 01:50
|
|
|
VitalSigns posted:Yes I know that's my point. None of the pro-lifers care about any of that, and if you point it out to them they won't care because their goal is punishing sluts for disobeying the Lord or whatever, and the saving babies poo poo is just something they say to justify it to others or maybe themselves. this is the actual reason of true believers. the politicians are grifters and a lot of voters are mostly voting a cultural vibe where they’re anti abortion but don’t think about it much, but the people who are really passionate about abortion, if you can pry their belief out of them, will boil down to “abortion is against gods will.” they are religious authoritarians, which always goes with subjugation and control. if the Bible instead said “the first time a woman conceives it must be aborted, this is God’s sacrifice” that’s what they would be advocating for.
|
|
#
?
Oct 15, 2019 02:29
|
|
|
since when does the text of the bible determine christian fundamentalist ideology like it's pretty unequivocal about what you're supposed to do with wealth and how involved you're supposed to be in secular politics A Wizard of Goatse has issued a correction as of 02:44 on Oct 15, 2019 |
|
#
?
Oct 15, 2019 02:37
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/peterbakernyt/status/1183936219631280128 lolol
|
|
#
?
Oct 15, 2019 05:18
|
|
|
J.A.B.C. posted:Can't believe I gotta break out this golden oldie: these people, by which i mean the base of voters who are single-issue abortion voters, are so pea-brained they think banning abortion will alone stop babies from being "murdered". they don't think about preventing the pregnancy in the first place because it simply does not cross their mind. they can't connect the dots between contraception and preventing abortion. they can't put together that giving families welfare will keep their children alive and healthy the top brass absolutely know it's a sham and that it's a way to just punish women for having sex, but i would argue the single-issue voters truly are stupid enough not to be able to think beyond the immediate "well we shouldn't kill babies"
|
|
#
?
Oct 15, 2019 05:31
|
|
|
lmao when it's getting too sleazy and illegal for John Bolton
|
|
#
?
Oct 15, 2019 05:34
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 22, 2024 11:31 |
|
|
Bolton is going to play a role in saving the US, and that’s a big lol.
|
|
#
?
Oct 15, 2019 05:36
|
|
