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Due to space constraints, I'm looking into building a PC that needs to be under 11" tall. This case looks pretty good to me, but are there any other options that would still support a top-end video card (both length- and height-wise)? And if I do go with microATX, what's the motherboard of choice, AMD-wise?
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Oct 16, 2019 21:47
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Stickman posted:"ITX" and "quiet" are pretty much on opposite ends of the spectrum. ITX doesn't have to be ridiculously loud, but cases have less sound dampening and often put the GPU right up against a vent for better cooling. Tower cases are going to be the best bet - like Mu Zeta's suggestion of the NZXT H200, or the Fractal Design Nano S or BitFenix Prodigy. Thanks! Is there any reason to go up on the CPU, or is that pointless since I'm GPU bottlenecked anyway? Let's say I end up using it to encode video or something? I can't imagine what else I'd do that would be CPU heavy.. Also, I heard back in the day it was worth upping the RAM to 32gb, is that still the case or cost-prohibitive now?
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Oct 16, 2019 22:01
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Mu Zeta posted:Any particular case you're interested in? I like the NZXT H200 but it's larger than most itx cases. I feel like you go any smaller it starts to get annoying to build. Not really, but I do like small. I don't mind it being annoying to build since I just need to do that once. Right now I have an EVGA Hadron Air which is serving it's purpose. I would consider re-using that case and just selling the mobo/cpu/ram, but it uses a proprietary PSU which is ~5 years old now.
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Oct 16, 2019 22:03
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Bank posted:Thanks! Is there any reason to go up on the CPU, or is that pointless since I'm GPU bottlenecked anyway? Let's say I end up using it to encode video or something? I can't imagine what else I'd do that would be CPU heavy.. Not really if your main goal is to run GTA 5 at 60fps. The 2600 is more than capable of doing so and is capable of overclocking up to 2600x performance with an aftermarket cooler. In fact, if your monitor maxes out at 60fps a 2600 won't hold you back for any game currently on the market. A 3600 is a decent improvement in single-core performance, but the beauty of AM4 is that you can always upgrade to 3600/3700x (or probably 4th-gen Ryzen) down the line when more intensive games are released (and if you decide to play them). 3600+ITX is a bit of pain now because X570 itx boards are expensive, but no B450/x470 boards have cpu-less bios flashing meaning you'd either need to buy from a brick-and-mortar that offers free bios flashing (like Microcenter) or go through the hassle of finding another way to flash the bios. 32GB is an overkill for gaming right now (games have just started using more than 8GB) and you're unlikely to see much of a performance improvement. That said, ram has fallen far enough in price that it's basically personal preference whether you want to spend the extra $60 for peace-of-mind. Usually I recommend against it but it does make a little more sense on itx, where you only have two RAM slots. On the other-other hand, if you're buying it for the future it's easy enough to flip your old sticks and just buy 32GB new when you get to the point you need it! Bank posted:Not really, but I do like small. I don't mind it being annoying to build since I just need to do that once. Right now I have an EVGA Hadron Air which is serving it's purpose. I would consider re-using that case and just selling the mobo/cpu/ram, but it uses a proprietary PSU which is ~5 years old now. If you're willing to pay ~$200 for the case and maybe wait until December for availability, the NCase M1 is about as small as you can get and still have a horizontal gpu!
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Oct 16, 2019 22:21
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Stickman posted:How cheap are you thinking? Honestly, you get better performance and more control by stretching for a good 500GB or 1TB drive and installing the OS on it along with any current games you're playing that could benefit from SSD load times. Also, be aware that StoreMI can also be a headache if either drive fails - it makes recovering data off the spinny disk much more difficult. I was thinking an Intel 545, they have 256es for like 40 bucks. It's not a crap SSD, it's just an old one but I don't really need something super fast to make the spinning rust much faster. The 545 also has a high TBW rating. It would really mostly just be for games (and local mirroring of iCloud) so it can crash if it wants to. VMs and other home lab poo poo will be going on a separate SSD. 
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Oct 16, 2019 23:30
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I'm looking for some suggestions for a new case. My current PC is built in a Nanoxia Deep Silence 4 which is great except for one fatal flaw: The power button is on the top of the case. Right where the cat likes to sit with her paw on the button. For the new case I'd like: -Power button on the front to prevent more kitty-induced PC shutdowns -A case designed to be quiet. The PC lives in the family room with the TV so I don't want any noisy fans -My ideal case is just a black box so I don't need to pay extra for glass sides or LED lights -Size doesn't matter and I'm perfectly happy with a huge case if necessary to provide adequate airflow. Buduget is $100 although I can go higher if necessary. I'll eventually be putting a AMD r5 3600 processor and my existing RTX 2060 into it I'm looking at the black be quiet! Pure Base 600 ATX Mid Tower Case but I'm open to suggestions - I'm not super happy with the placement of the power button.
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Oct 16, 2019 23:32
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Looking to build a rendering box (Daz3D) for work that also functions as a gaming machine when I want it to. Main focus is maximizing core count on Nvidia graphics cards, looks like 2 1070tis gives me the best bang for my buck. Other than a 1 TB SSD nothing else has special requirements, just need to make sure it doesn't hamstring the investment in GCs. Hoping to keep it around $2000. Never built a PC before from scratch but I have flipped out some parts here and there if that makes a difference.
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Oct 16, 2019 23:39
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Exodor posted:Power button on the front to prevent more kitty-induced PC shutdowns You can always set the power button to do nothing in Windows. You can still use it to power on your PC.
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Oct 16, 2019 23:53
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Exodor posted:I'm looking for some suggestions for a new case. My current PC is built in a Nanoxia Deep Silence 4 which is great except for one fatal flaw: Have you thought about just disabling or changing the power button's functionality in Windows? should still work as a power-on boot button when it's off though so you'll still be vulnerable to an accidental power on when it's off (maybe set a 20min sleep timer) but personally I'd be exhausting other options before spending another hundo and then also having to transfer all of the hardware and redo all the headers for the new case etc blech yuck
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Oct 16, 2019 23:58
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Schadenboner posted:I was thinking an Intel 545, they have 256es for like 40 bucks. It's not a crap SSD, it's just an old one but I don't really need something super fast to make the spinning rust much faster. The 545 also has a high TBW rating. The 545s is a good drive and would be a solid choice for StoreMI. You're only $15 from a 512GB su800, though, and having the space manually manage what's on the drive should reduce write wear and improve performance. Stickman fucked around with this message at 00:20 on Oct 17, 2019 |
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Oct 17, 2019 00:13
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Exodor posted:I'm looking for some suggestions for a new case. My current PC is built in a Nanoxia Deep Silence 4 which is great except for one fatal flaw: Besides Constellation's and the good Doctor's "change the power button's ability to shut off the computer" suggestion, there's also a variety of "place anywhere" power buttons you can use to move the button somewhere better. If you have free 5.25" bays that might be a good place for it!
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Oct 17, 2019 00:18
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Constellation I posted:You can always set the power button to do nothing in Windows. You can still use it to power on your PC. I've done so on my current PC - the motivation for a new case is a new build to replace my current i5-4690 based PC. I just want to avoid having the same issue with the new PC.
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Oct 17, 2019 00:32
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tL1F-qliSUk Tech Jesus did a big research piece on TDP values and what the hell they even mean and how they're calculated differently between CPU manufacturers and cooler manufacturers, and how a cpu with 95W TDP and a cooler with 95W TDP do not match up, and how god drat useless the number is. orange juche fucked around with this message at 00:37 on Oct 17, 2019 |
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Oct 17, 2019 00:34
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Exodor posted:I've done so on my current PC - the motivation for a new case is a new build to replace my current i5-4690 based PC. I just want to avoid having the same issue with the new PC. I just think it's not worth the hassle given it's an easy enough problem to solve and that the majority of cases out there have the power button up top.
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Oct 17, 2019 00:39
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Mozi posted:Due to space constraints, I'm looking into building a PC that needs to be under 11" tall. This case looks pretty good to me, but are there any other options that would still support a top-end video card (both length- and height-wise)? That's a solid choice, as is the mATX version. Most cases would fit 11" lying sideways, though the i/o may not be as accessible with something like a Meshify C. On the cheaper side, the Core V1 is just under 11 inches tall and will fit 2-slot gpus as long as the triple-fan Gigabyte OC (but not 2.5-slot cards, or tall cards like the MSI Gaming X). Mozi posted:And if I do go with microATX, what's the motherboard of choice, AMD-wise? Budget, the ASRock B450m Pro4 has a decent feature set for a B450 mATX board. If you want 2x PCIe M.2 slots/upgraded audio/more USB 3.1 ports/M.2 key-e for wifi, the only X570 option is the X570 version of the Pro4, which also happens to be a decent value board in it's own right.
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Oct 17, 2019 00:40
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Exodor posted:I'm looking for some suggestions for a new case. My current PC is built in a Nanoxia Deep Silence 4 which is great except for one fatal flaw: Super happy with my (admittedly on the big side) Corsair Obsidian 750D. When I was shopping for cases I wanted something that was a plain "monolith", big with no fancy lights or edgy angular gamer style bullshit. Cutting out the 5.25" drive bay also made it compatible with 420mm (140x3) radiators which is what I was aiming for since I don't need internal optical drives. All the buttons are forward facing so it passes the cat test as well. Downsides would be: stock it comes with a windowed side panel and its a rather expensive full tower case ($160 on newegg at the moment). Indiana_Krom fucked around with this message at 02:25 on Oct 17, 2019 |
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Oct 17, 2019 02:21
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Awesome, thanks!
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Oct 17, 2019 14:17
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Sorry if this is the wrong topic, but I have a quick question about my GPU's fan. I've noticed that when I'm playing Control(this is the only game it's happened with so far) it tends to rapidly accelerate to ~800RPMs, then immediately stop. Here's a photo of it: Is this normal? Did I hook up a cable wrong when installing it?  I hope I don't have to deal with the mess of cables I looked at once I finished building it and thought, "well I won't have to deal with this again."
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Oct 17, 2019 15:43
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You should probably post over here: https://forums.somethingawful.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=170
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Oct 17, 2019 15:54
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Been reading since my last post here and a quick question/request on the build Stickman posted a bit ago: PCPartPicker Part List CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600 3.6 GHz 6-Core Processor ($194.79 @ OutletPC) Motherboard: Asus TUF GAMING X570-PLUS ATX AM4 Motherboard ($189.69 @ OutletPC) Memory: Crucial Ballistix Sport LT 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($74.99 @ Adorama) Storage: HP EX920 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive ($135.00) Video Card: EVGA GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER 8 GB XC ULTRA GAMING Video Card ($533.98 @ Newegg) Case: Fractal Design Meshify C ATX Mid Tower Case ($89.99 @ Amazon) Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS Plus Gold 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($101.99 @ SuperBiiz) Operating System: Microsoft Windows 10 Pro OEM 64-bit ($25.00) Total: $1345.43 Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available Generated by PCPartPicker 2019-10-17 13:19 EDT-0400 What would a similar build look like with the new MSI B450 Tomahawk max and a 2070 vs the super? I keep running into compatibility issues on pcpartpicker when I change anything, which stresses me out. I'd like to be gaming at 1440 if it makes a big different on the GPU. Thanks!
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Oct 17, 2019 18:21
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PCPartpicker gives you that B450 firmware caution but the MAX already has the firmware update I think? It would be about $70 cheaper. The 2070 Super is the same price as the 2070. It straight replaced it.
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Oct 17, 2019 18:25
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Yeah I wouldn't buy any X570 boards unless you're sure you need PCIE 4. The MSI ones with Max in the name are compatible out of the box with Ryzen 3000.
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Oct 17, 2019 18:36
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FratBoyJesus posted:Looking to build a rendering box (Daz3D) for work that also functions as a gaming machine when I want it to. Main focus is maximizing core count on Nvidia graphics cards, looks like 2 1070tis gives me the best bang for my buck. Other than a 1 TB SSD nothing else has special requirements, just need to make sure it doesn't hamstring the investment in GCs. Hoping to keep it around $2000. Quoting myself just in case it got lost in the shuffle. In the US and I'll figure out the monitor situation after I get this built, may just hook it into my TV like I currently do.
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Oct 17, 2019 19:52
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Professional needs are trickier to make recommendations for as we're unlikely to be familiar with the software you're using and it's requirements. Look up benchmarks for your program and make purchases accordingly. If it is all cuda based a 3600 is a solid generalist pickup, 16+ gb of ram depending on your programs needs and a high quality power supply, but it really all comes down to what your program uses. GPU based rendering boxes are very unlikely to be bad at gaming.
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Oct 17, 2019 19:57
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OK, trying to flesh this out a bit. Case: Project S Midi Drawer Case for Micro-ATX Desktop/HTPC/Rackmount (Rev. B) CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 3.6 GHz 8-Core Processor ($327.89 @ OutletPC) Motherboard: ASRock X570M Pro4 Micro ATX AM4 Motherboard ($179.88 @ OutletPC) Storage: Sabrent Rocket 4.0 2 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive ($399.98 @ Amazon) Obviously I'm going a little high-end here, but I don't want to just burn money for no reason so let me know if I'm doing that. With that in mind, which RAM should I be looking at here? And I'm thinking of getting a used video card to last a year and then getting in on the next wave - which would be a good one to tide me over? Will be doing some VR stuff and gaming on my 2560x1440 144hz monitor.
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Oct 17, 2019 20:11
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Two schools of thought exist here. Most say that a 3700x is a waste of money given that almost nothing uses 16 threads on gaming so the price premium over a 3600 is not a good value. Another school of thought says with cross platform development and both major consoles launching next year with 8 core 16 thread CPUs, that 6 core processors will get left in no mans land and you will potentially take performance hits. Documents have been released to developers showing methods taking advantage of extra cores. As Stickman always points out, AM4 has easy drop in upgrades and it is almost certain that Zen3 (Ryzen 4000) will still be on AM4.
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Oct 17, 2019 20:41
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I see a few folks opting for 3600/3700X for games when 2600/2700 seems to be fine..why? Is it just in case or is there a legit reason to have a faster CPU, assuming you're Joe Schmo consumer?
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Oct 17, 2019 20:46
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Bank posted:I see a few folks opting for 3600/3700X for games when 2600/2700 seems to be fine..why? Is it just in case or is there a legit reason to have a faster CPU, assuming you're Joe Schmo consumer? 1% and 0.1% lows on Zen+ are noticeably worse than on the Zen2 unless fully GPU bound in 4k. Faster clocks, ram, and IPC gains on 3600 mostly wipe out the Zen+ 8 core advantage unless fully saturating all 16 threads in some apps. Check benchmarks for your use case. Zen+ is still a good value proposition at the right price point. Ex Ryzen 2600 is 165 dollars in Canada right now vs 265 for the 3600. A 2700 is at 220 vs 430 for a 3700x
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Oct 17, 2019 21:01
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Bank posted:I see a few folks opting for 3600/3700X for games when 2600/2700 seems to be fine..why? Is it just in case or is there a legit reason to have a faster CPU, assuming you're Joe Schmo consumer? If you have a 144hz monitor and are CPU limited it'll push 10-15 more fps. Accordingly, unless 6c/12t gets absolutely left in the dust as some fear, it'll last a bit longer. If you're not an fps junkie I'd say it's in no way worth it over a 2600. The $80-100 savings will pay for a good chunk of a new cpu if and when you wind up in the gap where the 2600 is too old but the 3600 isn't yet.
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Oct 17, 2019 21:03
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It's also worth noting that poorly optimized games like Borderlands 3 perform considerably better on the 3600/3700x due to their improved cache.
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Oct 17, 2019 21:11
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ItBreathes posted:If you have a 144hz monitor and are CPU limited it'll push 10-15 more fps. Accordingly, unless 6c/12t gets absolutely left in the dust as some fear, it'll last a bit longer. If you're not an fps junkie I'd say it's in no way worth it over a 2600. The $80-100 savings will pay for a good chunk of a new cpu if and when you wind up in the gap where the 2600 is too old but the 3600 isn't yet. And in productivity, the gap is frequently larger than gaming. The 3600 is nearly equal to the 2700x in many tasks and likely exceeds it in avx2 workloads. Anyhow, it really depends on budget and your future upgrade plans. It depends whether you will be playing 60Hz forever or not. Lots of things to consider. If you're really on a budget the $79.99 R5 1600 with $20 off motherboard at microcenter is a lot of processor for next to no dollars. I'd choose it over a ~$115 2600. I'd also choose 3600 at $189.99 over the $159.99 2700x unless you have a very specialized workload, like running many virtual machines that need entire cores dedicated to them. Khorne fucked around with this message at 21:46 on Oct 17, 2019 |
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Oct 17, 2019 21:35
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New 450w power supply from Corsair arrived today. Not the 550GM from EVGA. Did the paper clip test, fan did the same power on for one second and turn off routine. I think that’s just the way all these new auto-eco mode/auto semi-passive mode PSU fans behave. Mobo still didn’t power on using new PSU. No lights on the diagnostic LEDs. I highly doubt that PSU is the problem here. If I went back to have a chat with the folks at the shop who flashed my BIOS, I feel like they’re gonna just accuse me of loving it up. Best course of action is returning/exchanging it, I think? With all the shipping fees I’m gonna end up eating, I feel like I should’ve just gone with an X570 instead of a B450.
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Oct 17, 2019 22:32
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Iron Lung posted:Been reading since my last post here and a quick question/request on the build Stickman posted a bit ago: Don't get that power supply; the cables are drat near unusable. I got the same case and PSU one month ago, and the PSU cables have huge 3" pieces of shrink tubing filled with glue right next to the connectors, so they don't bend and you can't route them through the cable management holes in the case. The PCIe cable is so bad I couldn't even use the first plug. It's a $100 psu and I had to spend an extra $30 on extensions to use it properly. They're really the worst cables I've ever seen on a PSU in 20 years of doing this. 
AgentCow007 fucked around with this message at 23:29 on Oct 17, 2019 |
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Oct 17, 2019 23:19
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Lost 2 spinning rust disk just now, need recommendations for some SSD brands to replace main disk with something bigger
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Oct 17, 2019 23:35
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AgentCow007 posted:Don't get that power supply; the cables are drat near unusable. I got the same case and PSU one month ago, and the PSU cables have huge 3" pieces of shrink tubing filled with glue right next to the connectors, so they don't bend and you can't route them through the cable management holes in the case. The PCIe cable is so bad I couldn't even use the first plug. It's a $100 psu and I had to spend an extra $30 on extensions to use it properly. They're really the worst cables I've ever seen on a PSU in 20 years of doing this. I have the same PSU and didn't have problems because my case doesn't have any cable management so it didn't matter. I can see that tubing being really annoying in a better case. What's a better alternative for future builds?
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Oct 18, 2019 00:39
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I've got the same PSU, can confirm that mine have the long tubes. I haven't had much trouble with using them in my build though, there's enough free cable at the ends to bend it so that the tubes don't get in the way. 
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Oct 18, 2019 00:45
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I have a PC that would often stop showing video after POST, and it was a battle to get it to display again, whether it was using the onboard Intel whatever or the GTX1070 I had. I gave up on it after the fourth time. I'm guessing it's the board. I shoved it into storage for a while but would like to bring it back out because I'd like to start gaming now and again. I am definitely not a hard core gamer. Here's what I have: Asus Z97M-Plus i5 Devil's Canyon 4690K 3.5Ghz 16 GB (I think) of DDR3 Gigabyte Founder's Edition GeForce GTX 1070 8 GB Is the video card still good enough? I'm hoping I can just swap out mobo/CPU/RAM. I think I have a 550w power supply from the same era but I'm not sure how connectors have changed. I have a mATX case and SSDs and all of that. What would you recommend for a new board/CPU/RAM?
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Oct 18, 2019 03:01
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How much are you looking to spend? The video card is good enough to play most games on 1080p ultra settings. You can get a Ryzen 2600, a b450 board, and 16gigs DDR4 3200mhz ram for around $300 and you'll be set for a long time. If your PSU is reaching the end of the warranty I'd get a new one.
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Oct 18, 2019 03:03
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https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/cfxeq7/stop_recommending_msi_b450_motherboards_for_ryzen/ As mentioned in the Reddit thread, it could be a case of selection bias, but it still seems like a lot of people are having trouble getting their system to boot. Now that my attention has shifted from the PSU to the motherboard as the reason for my system not booting, I'm tripping over all sorts of reports on compatibility issues. It could be the wrong RAM (case 1, case 2). You could've successfully flashed the BIOS to recognize newer 3rd gen Ryzen and there's a chance it still won't reliably boot afterwards. I am dumb dumb with poopoo opinions. huhwhat fucked around with this message at 07:14 on Oct 19, 2019 |
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Oct 18, 2019 05:27
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huhwhat posted:Anyone reading this thread considering a Ryzen 5 3000 series + B450 motherboard (from any maker) build, do reconsider, even if you're not on ITX. Get an X570 motherboard or maybe an Intel system. You are absolutely correct in that there are some people having problems. However, the majority of people are booting up their A320, B350, B450, X470 boards with Ryzen 3000 series just fine. You will find techtubers of all sorts doing stuff like trying out R9 3900x on an A320 board for example. A while back, Paul's Hardware did an extensive test where he flashed the bios on a whole pile of non-X570 boards and got the Ryzen 3000 series to work. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHdeyAuQCtM. RAM issues include sticks that are not on the QVL of a motherboard and not booting the first few times before the board defaults to 2133 Mhz with absurd timings and you have to manually go into BIOS and enter the timings to get your rated speed back up. I think one thing we should do more is to encourage people to get to RAM that is on a motherboard's QVL for a Ryzen system. Your point is well taken though, AMD is still somewhat of the wild west of computing and doing the stuff to make it work properly doesn't bother the enthusiasts. Techdeals on Youtube had a video recently where he made the point that while he loved the value proposition on AMD, he had to constantly update BIOS as AMD continues to iron out bugs in their hardware and software especially in the early days of Zen and Zen+. We recently saw a BIOS update required to get Ryzen 3000 chips to boost properly at their rated speeds even though they were only short 50 MHz in some cases. Meanwhile, Intel very much has an "it just works" appeal though the price premium for equivalent performance is brutal.
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Oct 18, 2019 05:44
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