|
quidditch it and quit it posted:Pardon my stupidity but can someone tell me what happens if Boris does just ignore it until we default out? He would be in breach of the law and in contempt of parliament, either one of them can impose consequences either via a court judgement or bercow himself, and the consequences are at bercow's discretion in the case of parliament. It is extremely unlikely he would get far if he actually refuses to comply.
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:09
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 2, 2024 23:50 |
|
|
quidditch it and quit it posted:Pardon my stupidity but can someone tell me what happens if Boris does just ignore it until we default out? "I got a new deal, I proposed it to Parliament, Parliament didn't accept it. I pledged to get Brexit done by 31st October, so we're gonna Brexit by then, whether Parliament approves the deal or not, that's the end of it."
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:10
|
|
|
I’ve been reading tweets by British politicians all morning and I can’t understand who is on what team but I’ve gathered that the Lib Dems can’t decide that either. Also Corbyn giving his pronouns at a conference. 
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:11
|
|
|
Doccykins posted:Full voting results are out The Labour No votes: 
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:11
|
|
|
Sulphagnist posted:Bercow doing a solid and playing for time by jabbering while people are noisily leaving the chamber so the MP in turn doesn't lose it This giant of a man will be missed.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:11
|
|
|
dispatch_async posted:The Labour No votes: Didn't Hoey say she'd vote with the DUP? I guess that only counts when they toe the government line.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:14
|
|
|
Private Speech posted:Didn't Hoey say she'd vote with the DUP? I think she wasn't going to vote for the deal, which she never actually got the chance to do.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:16
|
|
|
Private Speech posted:Didn't Hoey say she'd vote with the DUP? She seems to consistently vote against anything which might reduce the government's ability to do whatever the gently caress it likes re: Brexit so it's entirely expected
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:18
|
|
|
lol Rory Stewart also voted no
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:18
|
|
|
https://commonsvotes.digiminster.com/Divisions/Details/721?byMember=false#notrecorded 2 Tory abstentions. How likely are we to see them getting the boot?
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:20
|
|
|
So what's going on here - they're arguing over what the government's actually planning to bring forward on Monday. All anyone knows is Mogg said they're bringing a motion forward, but he's not done it in the right way (just announced it in a point of order instead of through an emergency business statement) and Bercow's not totally sure how to deal with it kinda seems like they're trying to redo the vote without the amendment?
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:20
|
|
|
baka kaba posted:So what's going on here - they're arguing over what the government's actually planning to bring forward on Monday. All anyone knows is Mogg said they're bringing a motion forward, but he's not done it in the right way (just announced it in a point of order instead of through an emergency business statement) and Bercow's not totally sure how to deal with it Doesn't that fall foul of the same rule may did where you can't bring the same motion forward multiple times? Like I know hers actually got rejected but there should presumably be a way to refuse them repeatedly pulling it at the amendment stage.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:22
|
|
|
baka kaba posted:So what's going on here - they're arguing over what the government's actually planning to bring forward on Monday. All anyone knows is Mogg said they're bringing a motion forward, but he's not done it in the right way (just announced it in a point of order instead of through an emergency business statement) and Bercow's not totally sure how to deal with it Probably buying time to try and get individual EU leaders to make statements definitively ruling out another extension, to force vote on it vs no deal.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:24
|
|
|
Soylent Yellow posted:https://commonsvotes.digiminster.com/Divisions/Details/721?byMember=false#notrecorded About as likely as the 4 Labour abstentions i.e. loving not at all OwlFancier posted:Doesn't that fall foul of the same rule may did where you can't bring the same motion forward multiple times? Interesting that in spite of his rhetoric everything Boris has done so far has been exactly like TM except worse, almost like he's completely unused to actually having to do things other than talk poo poo
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:24
|
|
|
OwlFancier posted:Doesn't that fall foul of the same rule may did where you can't bring the same motion forward multiple times? If bercow doesn't know off the top of his head I sure don't! but he hasn't been given advance notice or anything. Mogg's pulling some shenanigans and Bercow doesn't actually know what the deal is yet
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:24
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/SebastianEPayne/status/1185556343895285761 Cummings huge throbbing brain is at work again
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:24
|
|
|
This vote changes nothing. Boris will send the letter, but he'll hold another meaningful vote on Monday. The EU won't respond to the letter before that vote. So it still comes down to whether his deal will pass, before we start talking about him going to court or anything like that. We still need to defeat the deal.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:27
|
|
|
Ok Mogg's been dragged to the despatch box and said they're gonna do an emergency business statement on monday, so it's meant to be a big surprise Bercow started intensely talking about whether it's orderly and that the government ain't the arbiters of that, and threw a bit of shade at Mogg's big constitutional brain
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:28
|
|
|
dispatch_async posted:https://twitter.com/SebastianEPayne/status/1185556343895285761
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:29
|
|
|
jabby posted:This vote changes nothing. And if Monday's vote is amended in the same way as today?
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:29
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/pointlesslettrs/status/1185559873364353026
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:30
|
|
|
jabby posted:This vote changes nothing. xtothez posted:And if Monday's vote is amended in the same way as today? This, if it can't pass today then there is little reason to believe it will pass on monday. That's if Bercow even allows it.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:31
|
|
|
OwlFancier posted:This, if it can't pass today then there is little reason to believe it will pass on monday. That's if Bercow even allows it. Letwin himself said he would vote for it on Monday. Odds are it will be defeated, but not by as big a margin.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:33
|
|
|
xtothez posted:And if Monday's vote is amended in the same way as today? Amended to say what? The Letwin amendment existed to make Boris send the letter, just in case the deal passed but then somehow got scuppered on the way through parliament. There's no need for a similar amendment once an extension has already been requested. We need there to be fewer than 9 switchers from today's vote. Letwin has already said he'll vote for a deal. So has Onn, and she abstained today. The deal vote is going to be closer than this. OwlFancier posted:This, if it can't pass today then there is little reason to believe it will pass on monday. That's if Bercow even allows it. This makes no sense. Several people who have explicitly said they will vote for the deal also voted for this amendment as a safeguard. Including Letwin himself!
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:34
|
|
|
Doesn't Letwin stop another MV until the withdrawal bill is passed? How can there be any votes on Monday if that hasn't happened?
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:34
|
|
|
baka kaba posted:Ok Mogg's been dragged to the despatch box and said they're gonna do an emergency business statement on monday, so it's meant to be a big surprise Reclassify Northern Ireland as a 'colony' so no longer part of the UK. Solves all problems, as laws don't mention NI in any way directly.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:34
|
|
|
Qwertycoatl posted:That's some bullshit, I'm pretty sure I remember reading they have chatlogs of traders basically saying "hey let's rig libor" "ok I'm rigging libor" Those traders went down, this is shutting down the investigation before it looks into involvement from the Bank of England. So it's the establishment protecting itself.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:34
|
|
|
Steve2911 posted:Doesn't Letwin stop another MV until the withdrawal bill is passed? How can there be any votes on Monday if that hasn't happened? They never actually passed it, as soon as the amendment went through boris pulled the entire vote.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:35
|
|
|
OwlFancier posted:They never actually passed it, as soon as the amendment went through boris pulled the entire vote. So they'd need to re-vote on the same amendment again if the vote was brought back?
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:37
|
|
|
lol eat poo poo Boris.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:38
|
|
|
OwlFancier posted:They never actually passed it, as soon as the amendment went through boris pulled the entire vote. It passed without division because the government abstained, the government can't pull a motion already put to the house. It also wouldn't matter, because the whole purpose of the amendment was to delay the meaningful vote until after today, so that Boris is forced to send the letter. Bercow is now going to rule if they can have another MV on Monday, as the government wants, or if the de facto new meaningful vote will be the second reading of the withdrawal act on Tuesday. Either way we are tee'd up for another meaningful vote BEFORE the EU responds to the extension letter, and it will be closer than this.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:38
|
|
|
jabby posted:Amended to say what? The Letwin amendment existed to make Boris send the letter, just in case the deal passed but then somehow got scuppered on the way through parliament. There's no need for a similar amendment once an extension has already been requested. No there absolutely is, because the text of the benn act is such that if parliament passes this bill unamended on monday, it gives the prime minister fiat to withdraw the extension before the 31st, even if the actual legislation fails: quote:If, following a request for an extension under subsection (4) but before the end of 30 October 2019, the condition in subsection (1) or the condition in subsection (2) is met, the Prime Minister may withdraw or modify the request. So, if they want to prevent a scenario where the benn act is satisfied but the deal itself fails at the legislation fails, they still must pass the letwin amendment.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:40
|
|
|
Doccykins posted:Full voting results are out Lol at Bercow’s ancient photo under “no vote recorded”.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:40
|
|
|
namesake posted:Those traders went down, this is shutting down the investigation before it looks into involvement from the Bank of England. Ahh, good old "it's not an institutional problem, it's just a large number of isolated cases of bad apples"
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:41
|
|
|
OwlFancier posted:No there absolutely is, because the text of the benn act is such that if parliament passes this bill unamended on monday, it gives the prime minister fiat to withdraw the extension before the 31st, even if the actual legislation fails: https://twitter.com/PARLYapp/status/1185554624436146177
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:43
|
|
|
Letwin got into some technicalities, and I think what he was getting at is that delaying the vote until after the letter has been sent enables Joris to cancel it if the deal is passed. I guess because it separates the WA bill with the need to send the letter, since it was already sent? So he could send the letter, the EU will stall until the bill is voted on, and then if the government wins they can revoke it and boom no extension So that way the Benn act is undermined through another loophole, and we're back to the possibility of a whoopsie doodle looks like we didn't sort things in no time, no deal it is then (nobody really knows what they're up to but I think that was Letwin's reading of a possibility) Bercow's gonna work out if it's allowed, it's one of those after hours style sessions where everyone's hanging around talking to him about what to do next e- beaten by the big letwin fans also when he was explaining this loophole that's allowed for in the Benn act, Hillary Benn had a weird look of confusion on his face which ain't promising!!
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:43
|
|
|
Then I am confused because what are they voting on next week? If it's literally the unamended bill again that would, presumably, undo the letwin amendment. Because it would satisfy the benn act and give boris the ability to cancel the extension by himself whether we pass the legislation or not? That's the point of this bill, to basically nullify the benn act.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:45
|
|
|
OwlFancier posted:Then I am confused because what are they voting on next week? If it's literally the unamended bill again that would, presumably, undo the letwin amendment. Because it would satisfy the benn act and give boris the ability to cancel the extension by himself whether we pass the legislation or not? The government wants a meaningful vote on Monday, but Bercow may not allow it as it's technically the same motion as today. If they can't have that, they'll table the Withdrawal Bill itself, and by voting for the second reading MPs will approve the deal. That will be on Tuesday. Either way, MPs will vote on the deal early next week and it will be closer than today. https://twitter.com/paulwaugh/status/1185565514912948227 E: https://twitter.com/PippaCrerar/status/1185565640721088512
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:46
|
|
|
So is "no vote recorded" the same as sustained? I looked at Doccykins' link and it looks like Melanie Onn got to dodge a bullet.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:48
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 2, 2024 23:50 |
|
|
Comrade Fakename posted:Lol at Bercow’s ancient photo under “no vote recorded”. Bercow's is great, but my god: 
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2019 15:56
|
|
