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Current setup: Harman Kardon 3490 Magnepan MMGW pair Energy ESW-M6 I built this when I had a single bedroom apartment; as I have a whole house now, it seems I can't get even response despite all my tuning efforts. Part of the problem is the MMGW set is very directional, so there's a real sweet spot that sounds great, but noticeably shifts when you sit outside that zone. The high end of the sub makes up for the lack of low mid ranges in the MMGW, but has been clipping/crackling at moderately high volumes lately. Is this related to how it is EQ'd? What would be the most cost effective way to improve my system? I'm mainly thinking of new speakers, but I'm open to updating everything. I haven't messed with a proper multi channel setup other than cheap 5.1 HTIB systems from my youth. Is there a benefit if most of the sources are streaming apps or consoles? I'm happy with a good 2.1 setup but again, mine is kinda anemic right now. I have NOT treated my living room with acoustic panels but mostly because the back of the living room opens up to my kitchen, behind a bar, so there's not a lot of places to put them.
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Oct 16, 2019 16:32
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Which kind of sounds is it that makes it seem to crackle and clip? Can you tell whether it's the amp or the speakers?
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Oct 16, 2019 21:22
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KozmoNaut posted:Which kind of sounds is it that makes it seem to crackle and clip? Can you tell whether it's the amp or the speakers? Deep bass (think Inception) and sometimes weirdly boomy voices.
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Oct 16, 2019 21:55
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qirex posted:I agree, spend the extra $50. You're not going to get enough out of a 4" woofer IMO. Can a 4" woofer actually produce tones under 100hz?
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Oct 17, 2019 07:33
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Yes, but not very loudly.Wasabi the J posted:Deep bass (think Inception) and sometimes weirdly boomy voices. The subwoofer outputs on your receiver are full-range, so you may have the crossover on the sub set too high. Also, that's a whole lot of power for a very small driver in that sub. If you have et EQed to extend lower than it's stated -3dB point of 42 Hz, you may be overdriving it.
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Oct 17, 2019 08:04
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I’m trying to determine what size subwoofer I should be getting for my home theater setup in an open floor plan. The total space is roughly ~5600 sq ft. I found this guide: https://www.aperionaudio.com/blogs/aperion-audio-blog/how-to-choose-a-subwoofer and its looking like I want to be getting either dual 12” or a single 15” at a minimum. Is that right? edit: Basically plugged in wanting to feel the bass, at volumes that would be loud but not disturb neighbors (no shared walls), and listening to pretty much all kinds of music. .Z. fucked around with this message at 02:58 on Oct 18, 2019 |
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Oct 18, 2019 02:51
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.Z. posted:home theater setup in an open floor plan. The total space is roughly ~5600 sq ft.
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Oct 18, 2019 03:10
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He’s gotta mean cubic feet, which would be a 700 square ft room assuming 8 ft ceilings.
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Oct 18, 2019 03:22
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falz posted:5600 sq ft open theater room? That seems massive. Sorry may have phrased that poorly. It’s an open floor plan with a total space of 5600 sq ft. The TV area occupies a third of that. Edit: skipdogg posted:He’s gotta mean cubic feet, which would be a 700 square ft room assuming 8 ft ceilings. Yes this, my bad.
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Oct 18, 2019 03:33
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Wasabi the J posted:Current setup: The 100 hz extension on the MMGWs is really optimistic, especially in a large room. Replacing those will have the biggest impact. What kind of budget are you thinking of? For subwoofers, multiple subs will pretty much always be superior, if you have the space and don’t mind having multiple boxes. Any pair SVS or Rythmik subs would work fine. The receiver is fine. There are definite advantages to going to full surround, but I get not bothering with it. I haven’t had full surround for years, and without a dedicated room, I don’t feel the need to set it up again.
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Oct 18, 2019 05:41
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.Z. posted:Sorry may have phrased that poorly. It’s an open floor plan with a total space of 5600 sq ft. The TV area occupies a third of that. I was gonna ask if you lived in a warehouse or something.
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Oct 18, 2019 05:51
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TheMadMilkman posted:The 100 hz extension on the MMGWs is really optimistic, especially in a large room. Replacing those will have the biggest impact. What kind of budget are you thinking of? Less than $1k. I know that's not a ton but I even considering building my own speakers but I know nothing about it.
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Oct 18, 2019 07:26
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Plenty of good options below $1K, especially if you're ok with bookshelf speakers. Monitor Audio Bronze 2, Wharfedale Diamond 225, Klipsch R-51M, JBL Studio 230, Dali, Polk, Paradigm, I think the SVS bookshelf speakers are decently affordable too.
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Oct 18, 2019 08:06
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I would like it to be lower if at all possible; a quality pair of loudspeakers would be great at any price though. My living room is 14 feet deep by 18 feet widewith 9 foot ceilings, and rear of the room goes into the kitchen, which is another 8 feet deep. Something that can fill the room and not collapse the soundstage by sitting just to the side is most ideal. Also this is my tv location so you can laugh at 90s housemaking norms and my life choices. 
Wasabi the J fucked around with this message at 10:36 on Oct 18, 2019 |
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Oct 18, 2019 10:32
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Quick question - just want to confirm that I don't need a samsung soundbar to use ARC to a samsung TV (that has an ARC hdmi port). I can use any brand soundbar so long as it has an ARC HDMI port right? Thanks.
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Oct 18, 2019 10:41
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VelociBacon posted:Quick question - just want to confirm that I don't need a samsung soundbar to use ARC to a samsung TV (that has an ARC hdmi port). I can use any brand soundbar so long as it has an ARC HDMI port right? Thanks. Yah you're good, I have a Samsung TV with Vizio soundbar
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Oct 18, 2019 13:35
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Wasabi the J posted:I would like it to be lower if at all possible; a quality pair of loudspeakers would be great at any price though. Yikes. That definitely falls into the "difficult space" category. Do you have any pictures showing the whole living room? I'd like to see where you are hoping to place the speakers.
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Oct 18, 2019 14:06
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teh_Broseph posted:Yah you're good, I have a Samsung TV with Vizio soundbar Thanks.
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Oct 19, 2019 01:31
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TheMadMilkman posted:Yikes. That definitely falls into the "difficult space" category. Do you have any pictures showing the whole living room? I'd like to see where you are hoping to place the speakers. I forgot to take a pic at home but basically I worry about putting them in the "obvious"place on the shelf behind the TV, or on stands/floor under where the current speaker panels are. Part of me wants to turn that windowed area into a huge speaker enclosure. This is partially why I considered doing something weird and custom. But both weird and custom cost money usually.  Here's a pic of it empty  v there's a fireplace there v Wasabi the J fucked around with this message at 12:04 on Oct 19, 2019 |
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Oct 19, 2019 08:24
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Put a 4:3 CRT in the fireplace hole, live like it's the 80s.
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Oct 19, 2019 09:23
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I'm imagining the slap echo in there and dying inside
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Oct 19, 2019 15:28
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Is there a crawl space behind your fire place? Why is it inset next to it?
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Oct 19, 2019 17:37
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KillHour posted:Is there a crawl space behind your fire place? Why is it inset next to it?
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Oct 19, 2019 17:42
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This poo poo is what happens when we build structures to hold specific eras of technology.
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Oct 19, 2019 17:43
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Thanks for the advice about the Atmos bar, guys. Since we moved I promised my wife I wouldn't have the tangle of wires that my 7.1 setup from our old place had, so that's why the soundbar was appealing.
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Oct 20, 2019 00:04
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Hey guys, I cannot simply rebuild my house for acoustics. pls help.
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Oct 20, 2019 00:49
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Wasabi the J posted:Hey guys, I cannot simply rebuild my house for acoustics. pls help. Have an industrial accident so you have to remodel 
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Oct 20, 2019 01:00
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You could fill in or cover up the odd shaped VCR cubbies. Maybe with furniture. Some kind of divider might work, or maybe a fake wall.
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Oct 20, 2019 01:01
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Wasabi the J posted:Hey guys, I cannot simply rebuild my house for acoustics. pls help. I doubt your commitment to Sparkle Motion
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Oct 20, 2019 02:02
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.Z. posted:~5600 sq ft. You're gonna need roughly 6-8 of these guys depending on your ceiling height to pressurize that space. https://www.svsound.com/products/sb16-ultra Also, I'm not a fan of subwoofers for music. You really shouldn't be depending on a sub to play things nicely up in the audible range. You should be looking at properly sized speakers with the bass extension you need to make boom boom. I fell into that trap of using a sub with studio monitors a while back and I regretted it. Having the right sized speaker really does make all the difference. Subwoofers are really meant for playing subsonic frequencies. That is, pressure waves you feel more than you hear. That being said, I'll bet you all would be surprised how little a subwoofer is actually used when watching a movie. It's comical how little information is sent to the LFE channel. Test it. If you have a receiver with an LFE channel, you should disable all the other channels except that one (if even by just unplugging the speakers) and watch a movie.
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Oct 24, 2019 20:11
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A subwoofer doesn't just play the LFE channel, it plays LFE and what the bass management/crossover sends to it. I'm not a fan of using tiny satellite speakers that rely way too much on a subwoofer for any kind of bass response. The main speakers must be able to stand on their own merits, and be satisfyingly full-sounding without a subwoofer. A sub (or two) just adds the lowest octave or so, and lends nice heft to well-recorded kick drums and such. The trick is that the sub has to be integrated correctly, both in placement, volume and EQ. Room correction such as in an AVR is useful, but like any tool, it needs to be used correctly. Just trying to match the main speakers' rolloff is going to give mediocre results at best. You need a proper crossover. I've got a set of Monitor Audio Bronze 2s, which do go below 50Hz, so certainly capable enough for bookshelf speakers. The subs add the lowest bottom end, but otherwise draw no attention to themselves. If you have the space for big floorstanders, definitely get some. But I would still add a sub or two. I dream of a setup with a pair of big ol' Pioneer HPM-100s or maybe pro speakers like JBL SRX 835s or something. Just huge beefy things with 12-15" woofers. And I would probably still consider a couple of subs, too. My dad's band used to use a pair of JBL JRX 225s with a pair of HK 18" subs, that setup could move some serious air. KozmoNaut fucked around with this message at 21:33 on Oct 24, 2019 |
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Oct 24, 2019 21:26
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KozmoNaut posted:A subwoofer doesn't just play the LFE channel, it plays LFE and what the bass management/crossover sends to it. I miss the days when 18" woofers were not uncommon. It's too bad that most 80's speakers were terrible poo poo-stacks of 5-7 drivers that didn't play considerably well together because they were definitely onto something with big drivers. I totally understand the idea of adding low end support for small speakers though. It is rather satisfying. But on the flip side of that coin, even when paired with an SVS SB-1000 my KEF LS50's lacked presence and cohesion that a proper large speaker has. Even when you have a nice space and room correction software. But I'm incredibly okay with how crystal clear they are and they do thump pretty nice down to 100hz so I'm fine with listening to just them without a sub.
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Oct 24, 2019 21:54
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There's only so much small drivers can do in the midbass range, where a subwoofer won't help. That's why I bought bookshelf speakers with 6.5" woofers instead of 5" or heaven forbid, even smaller woofers. My living room is tiny, so floorstanding speakers are unfortunately not an option. If I could have gotten something with 8" woofers that is still somehow less than 23cm wide, I would probably have done that. No replacement for displacement etc.
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Oct 24, 2019 22:37
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#subgang
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Oct 24, 2019 22:42
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IMO 5" woofers should be the normal acceptable minimum barring Spouse Acceptance Factor concerns. If you know you're getting a sub anyway there's not a ton of upside to getting huge mains.
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Oct 24, 2019 23:10
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qirex posted:IMO 5" woofers should be the normal acceptable minimum barring Spouse Acceptance Factor concerns. If you know you're getting a sub anyway there's not a ton of upside to getting huge mains. I mean, you're not wrong. Hell even for my desktop speakers (which is what I bought the LS50's for, I won't go smaller than than that. THE ONLY exception would be Realistic / Optimus Minimus speakers because they are so drat cute  but that's not for serious music listening.
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Oct 24, 2019 23:32
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The Aperion 4T speakers are pretty good even with a <5" woofer.
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Oct 24, 2019 23:38
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qirex posted:IMO 5" woofers should be the normal acceptable minimum barring Spouse Acceptance Factor concerns. If you know you're getting a sub anyway there's not a ton of upside to getting huge mains. There is just something visceral that a big speaker with big drivers can do. Maybe it's because they need less excursion to produce the same output, but they do tend to give a better, "drier" punch than most small speakers, which can get boomy and struggle with dynamics when you crank it. Of course, I'm comparing 5" woofer bookshelf speakers fed by ~50WPC amps, to dual 15" woofer PA speakers fed by ~500WPC amps. Not really a fair comparison for most living rooms
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Oct 25, 2019 06:36
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If my 5.1 Onkyo receiver suddenly is giving "sparkles" on my HDMI pass through, no matter which channel I'm doing, but doesn't do it if I bypass the 5.1 receiver, would you assume then the Onkyo is having problems? What could be done to fix it, if any?
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Oct 26, 2019 03:06
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KozmoNaut posted:There is just something visceral that a big speaker with big drivers can do. Maybe it's because they need less excursion to produce the same output, but they do tend to give a better, "drier" punch than most small speakers, which can get boomy and struggle with dynamics when you crank it. No, you’re absolutely correct. 5” drivers are fine with small rooms at reasonable levels, but you definitely get some dynamic compression when you push them. Even if you’re using subs, there’s a definite advantage to a larger woofer. 2 ways with a 6 1/2 works, but a 3-way with a 5” mid and an 8” woofer is even better. I really like the new Wharfedale Linton Heritage bookshelf speakers, and would enthusiastically recommend them to anyone looking in the $1k - 1.5k range. Me personally? I’m saving up for Revel Performa F208s and foregoing subs altogether. It should be noted, though, that my system is solely for music, so LFE isn’t a consideration.
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Oct 26, 2019 03:28
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