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Is it really a "failure" if the intent was to milk as much as possible out of modern players before dropping the format entirely?
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Nov 17, 2019 01:46
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:Yeah so several months later is it safe to say modern horizons is the failure we predicted? Double the price for no good reason, didn't really elevate any tier two decks to speak of (maybe some Karn artifact deck that's now urza), Hogaal summer... it actually surpassed all of our expectations. even the most cynical goon could never have predicted that it would also ruin pauper and legacy
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Nov 17, 2019 01:46
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:Yeah so several months later is it safe to say modern horizons is the failure we predicted? Double the price for no good reason, didn't really elevate any tier two decks to speak of (maybe some Karn artifact deck that's now urza), Hogaal summer... It brought Jund back so that is cool and good.
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Nov 17, 2019 02:12
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Legacy UB Mill made top 8 at the Card kingdom 1k, format unruined.
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Nov 17, 2019 02:34
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Cactrot posted:Legacy UB Mill made top 8 at the Card kingdom 1k, format unruined. Oh yeah where is that list, gimme that list
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Nov 17, 2019 02:44
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GoutPatrol posted:Oh yeah where is that list, gimme that list It just finished it's semifinal round, it won. Dunno if it will be on stream again at http://twitch.tv/cardkingdom Edit, it is on stream and there is cardboard live decklists Cactrot fucked around with this message at 02:55 on Nov 17, 2019 |
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Nov 17, 2019 02:50
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Bust Rodd posted:And it’s basically all Eldraine’s fault lol War of the Spark, Modern Horizons and Eldraine all have hosed over the non-Standard formats, and Eldraine hosed up Standard more than any other set since....Mirrodin? Maybe not even then. Aether Revolt + Kaladesh was bad, Mirrodin needed Darksteel to get real stupid, but Eldraine is the single set that most hosed over Standard that I can recall.
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Nov 17, 2019 03:13
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Cactrot posted:It just finished it's semifinal round, it won. Oh man Delver vs. Mill. Delver EoTs Brazen Borrower with Vista up. Mill Dazes and Delver player goes to search to pay. But they had no basics left they they're boned. THEN THE ARCHIVE TRAP edit: MILL DID ITTTTTTTT GoutPatrol fucked around with this message at 03:42 on Nov 17, 2019 |
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Nov 17, 2019 03:22
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legacy is more hosed up by Wrenn and Six than anything else. who would have thought that a 2 mana planeswalker with +1 draw a card -1 remove a creature would be too good?!
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Nov 17, 2019 03:31
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Cactrot posted:It just finished it's semifinal round, it won. Thank God for Snipping Tool
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Nov 17, 2019 03:38
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Jabor posted:Is it really a "failure" if the intent was to milk as much as possible out of modern players before dropping the format entirely? Lmao Skyl3lazer posted:it's a format comprised entirely of the best mindless linear aggro deck from the past few standards. entirely uninteresting. Give it a few months
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Nov 17, 2019 03:39
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If there is any upside to Oko, it might be that its dominance coincides with the price of a lot of MH singles coming down. Can't imagine it will still be in print next year. Getting near time to watch if things bottom out on whatever cards you might want for EDH/Cube/whatever. I wouldn't buy any MH sealed, though. Box EV (<$120) is way below what they've been selling for on Ebay (~$170), and that is well below what the big storefronts are trying to sell boxes at ($200+).
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Nov 17, 2019 04:20
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Hellsau posted:War of the Spark, Modern Horizons and Eldraine all have hosed over the non-Standard formats, and Eldraine hosed up Standard more than any other set since....Mirrodin? Maybe not even then. Aether Revolt + Kaladesh was bad, Mirrodin needed Darksteel to get real stupid, but Eldraine is the single set that most hosed over Standard that I can recall. I have the feeling that this new "compress blocks into one set" idea is actually really big problem when they have a new mechanic they want to push. GRN/RNA/WAR got away from it by not pushing their mechanics as Ravnica tends to be, and Dominaria I guess wasn't so internalized. But I guess we'll see how Theros2 and Ikea turn out.
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Nov 17, 2019 05:17
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Bought a pack of MH for fun, got The First Sliver. I guess I have my commander if I ever get around to making that commander deck. Not a big winner, but it's the only card I actually specifically wanted. Love slivers.
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Nov 17, 2019 05:25
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araeris posted:If there is any upside to Oko, it might be that its dominance coincides with the price of a lot of MH singles coming down. Can't imagine it will still be in print next year. Getting near time to watch if things bottom out on whatever cards you might want for EDH/Cube/whatever. Historically, the prices for modern cards in general hit their lows around November - January. Not entirely sure how the elimination of legacy as a GP/SCG format will change this. Once the PTQ/PPTQ/MCQ/whatever the hell they’re calling it now season switches back to modern prices should increase a bit.
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Nov 17, 2019 05:26
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Spiderdrake posted:Yeah, Mirrodin wasn't quite the disaster at all. It did shake up extended, and affinity didn't really hit the mainstream til DST like you said, though maybe in the Arena age it would. So really the biggest gently caress up era since Saga. They should just make blocks and one off sets whenever the inspiration strikes instead of commit to "one set is an entire story". Like a new plane should at least have two sets while Theros is probably fine being a one off.
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Nov 17, 2019 05:42
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Eej posted:They should just make blocks and one off sets whenever the inspiration strikes instead of commit to "one set is an entire story". Like a new plane should at least have two sets while Theros is probably fine being a one off. That’s basically what they’re doing now. No set number, do a block if they want, or just do three unconnected sets if they want. They’re doing three unconnected sets this year.
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Nov 17, 2019 05:45
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i have no idea what half of this thread expects modern to be its still too expensive but like, modern is fine
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Nov 17, 2019 06:49
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I’m mostly a fan of Modern Horizons. Hogaak had to be banned, but I mean, whatever. It’s fine if cards have to be banned from eternal formats occasionally. I only play FNM, though, and we’re not super competitive, so I do mostly see the fun and interesting sides of modern.
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Nov 17, 2019 06:56
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tinaun posted:i have no idea what half of this thread expects modern to be The day 2 metagame at the invitational was 29% urza decks.
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Nov 17, 2019 07:00
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tinaun posted:i have no idea what half of this thread expects modern to be Modern is definitely Not Fine unless you either don't care about winning or don't mind playing 2 Urza mirrors per league.
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Nov 17, 2019 07:07
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Modern Horizons shifted the format to pretty much be exclusively about Modern Horizons cards and the best way to use MH1 cards effectively. This sucks because before the. modern had this gigantic 16 year card pool to play with and now it’s just extremely homogenous.
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Nov 17, 2019 07:58
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Yeah MH was horrible for modern and legacy, which is a shame because a lot of the cards are really cool designs. But the few egregious cards really made a lot of formats worse (hogaak, urza in modern, w6 in legacy, astrolabe everywhere). The way it affected prices and how inorganic it feels is the worst though.
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Nov 17, 2019 09:04
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Bonus posted:Yeah MH was horrible for modern and legacy, which is a shame because a lot of the cards are really cool designs. But the few egregious cards really made a lot of formats worse (hogaak, urza in modern, w6 in legacy, astrolabe everywhere). The way it affected prices and how inorganic it feels is the worst though. Modern Horizons laid bare the fact that capitalism makes this game worse. It just made that unfortunate fact too obvious with the particular new cards printed, the particular reprints chosen, and Prismatic Vista being printed into a new $10 a pack set when it could go into literally any set anywhere. Strangely enough, the set was actually not that bad for Vintage, since Force of Vigor dramatically weakened Shops locks and Force of Negation gave blue decks more Force of Wills to stop nonsense but that they couldn't use to defend their own nonsense, which is cool. Unfortunately the sets around Modern Horizons terminally hosed Vintage, so that's less cool.
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Nov 17, 2019 09:34
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Bust Rodd posted:Modern Horizons shifted the format to pretty much be exclusively about Modern Horizons cards and the best way to use MH1 cards effectively. This sucks because before the. modern had this gigantic 16 year card pool to play with and now it’s just extremely homogenous. Is this actually true? There’s still a ton of variety at major tournaments.
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Nov 17, 2019 09:43
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Despite how stupid MH was, I think modern would be in a pretty good spot (for some time at least) if Urza got the axe. The best way to play modern and legacy is in local scenes, where people mostly play what they want. Me and my buddies run a modern FNM and it gets 20-30 people every week, and every week you play against five very different decks usually.
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Nov 17, 2019 09:58
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Arivia posted:That’s basically what they’re doing now. No set number, do a block if they want, or just do three unconnected sets if they want. They’re doing three unconnected sets this year. Yeah but I mean... Eldraine probably could've used at least two sets to flesh out flavour and explore mechanics instead of the aforementioned very pushed Food mechanic.
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Nov 17, 2019 10:31
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I don't think that continuity of mechanics through sets/blocks has much influence on power level compared to the design of the mechanic itself. Food is another mechanic where one group of cards generate a secondary resource, and a second group of cards consume it for additional benefits. these cards read fine in isolation, but combined with an arbitrarily large pool of resource, you get unkillable ultrafuckers. I have never thought a set sucked because of art style/themes/flavour, and I think the work of the artists and world designers has been and continues to be excellent. Creating parasitic mechanics by restricting them to individual sets is entirely on the card design team. For example, Emry has affinity for artifacts; if Wizards can print reminder text as rules text like that then there are no restrictions on what mechanics can appear where.
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Nov 17, 2019 13:09
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Eldraine is fine in terms of big picture design. There’s nothing inherently broken about food in the way that energy was. It’s just the power level of individual cards and that most of the power got concentrated into green.
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Nov 17, 2019 13:14
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The difference between food and energy is that food is every kind of resource in the game. It’s a permanent you can sacrifice for mana, or cards, killing a dude, or whatever you want. It’s an extremely versatile mechanic, the problem is just that the main food generator in the set in unfortunately balanced very poorly
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Nov 17, 2019 14:06
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They don't seem to know how to balance planeswalkwra yet.
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Nov 17, 2019 14:42
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DAD LOST MY IPOD posted:legacy is more hosed up by Wrenn and Six than anything else. who would have thought that a 2 mana planeswalker with +1 draw a card -1 remove a creature would be too good?! That and to a lesser extent Plague Engineer have totally killed tribal decks/aggro. DRS was clearly ban worthy but even it never drove graveyard decks out of the format or anything. Skyl3lazer posted:lol the pioneer shown on camera at the SCG Invi looks absolutely miserable. seems like a totally trash format Pioneer is really the only format I have any interest in now. There's a TON of brewing potential. The invi is only a little boring because people are just taking early proven decks they've playtested since there just hasn't been enough time to really explore the format. freeman fucked around with this message at 15:09 on Nov 17, 2019 |
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Nov 17, 2019 14:52
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Yeah the fact that any aggro/tribal strategy has basically no way to stop Engineer from just wiping you out is very bad. D&T/Elves/Goblins just has to race you with basically no information and creatures are the easiest thing to tutor up.
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Nov 17, 2019 15:10
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Impermanent posted:They don't seem to know how to balance planeswalkwra yet. you don't seem to know how to spell it 
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Nov 17, 2019 15:11
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Impermanent posted:They don't seem to know how to balance planeswalkwra yet. Oh, they know how to balance Planeswalkers, it just doesn’t drive with their actual mandate to sell Planeswalkers
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Nov 17, 2019 15:23
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If Urza and oko ate a ban modern would be pretty much the old modern again.
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Nov 17, 2019 15:45
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Sickening posted:If Urza and oko ate a ban modern would be pretty much the old modern again. Would Oko really be a problem card in Modern without Urza?
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Nov 17, 2019 16:38
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What’s keeping Oko in check in Modern?
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Nov 17, 2019 16:44
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Copter is definitely getting banned in Pioneer. It has to go.
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Nov 17, 2019 16:51
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Bust Rodd posted:What’s keeping Oko in check in Modern? Nothing. That's why Simic Urza is doing so well and is over a quarter of day 2 decks.
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Nov 17, 2019 16:52
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