|
Now you're telling me Thunderbird couldn't fly???? I thought the whole thing with his death is that he flew up to stop the evil general escaping on the plane Gripweed posted:Unfortunately I got the entire event in trades. At least I only paid a dollar each for them. the amazing thing about Jesse Bedlam is that he wasn't even created by Ellis, he was a product of the guy who was writing X-Force before Counter X, John Francis Moore, who is American. also I have no idea where I got the idea he could make earthquakes from. maybe I was confusing him with Rictor.
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2019 23:53
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 16:07 |
|
|
Alaois posted:Now you're telling me Thunderbird couldn't fly???? I thought the whole thing with his death is that he flew up to stop the evil general escaping on the plane No he was hanging on to the plane that the count was escaping with. If he could fly then he would not have died. I think bedlam was the 616 version of a character from age of apocalypse
|
|
#
?
Nov 24, 2019 00:17
|
|
|
Alaois posted:Now you're telling me Thunderbird couldn't fly???? I thought the whole thing with his death is that he flew up to stop the evil general escaping on the plane I sort of like the John Francis Moore run-- I read it in chunks in real-time, but with enough gaps that whatever was going on always felt excitingly baffling. And the art was a lot of fun in a very 90s way.
|
|
#
?
Nov 24, 2019 05:39
|
|
|
Archyduchess posted:I sort of like the John Francis Moore run-- I read it in chunks in real-time, but with enough gaps that whatever was going on always felt excitingly baffling. And the art was a lot of fun in a very 90s way. i liked that he gave Domino like 20 different "real names", which is something thats been sadly mostly abandoned ever since they gave her an actual real name.
|
|
#
?
Nov 24, 2019 05:57
|
|
|
I don't know why but I've assumed forever that both John Francis Moore and John Ney Rieber were both British. Neither is. I also remembered him as John Rey Nieber but that's a separate issue. Jesse Bedlam is an Ellis-rear end name though.
|
|
#
?
Nov 24, 2019 06:03
|
|
|
Edge & Christian posted:I don't know why but I've assumed forever that both John Francis Moore and John Ney Rieber were both British. Neither is. So his name is Jesse Aaronson, and his codename is Bedlam, and my only real exposure to him was my curiosity about Counter X so for all I know, Warren Ellis is the one who decided to have everyone just refer to him as "Jesse Bedlam"
|
|
#
?
Nov 24, 2019 06:08
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/NikkiMcR/status/1198281339583250442 drat you, Joker.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 24, 2019 20:31
|
|
|
Just finished reading Marshal Law(and most of it's sequels), and man that was an incredibly lovely experience overall, just several hundred pages of the people who made it masturbating to how much they hate superhero comics and being a bunch of nihilistic edgelords, sure the art was nice, but that just emphasizes even more that it was all style and no substance(seriously it reads like it was written by a psychotic with extremely advanced dementia, barely anything makes any sense whatsoever)
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 11:42
|
|
|
drrockso20 posted:Just finished reading Marshal Law(and most of it's sequels), and man that was an incredibly lovely experience overall, just several hundred pages of the people who made it masturbating to how much they hate superhero comics and being a bunch of nihilistic edgelords, sure the art was nice, but that just emphasizes even more that it was all style and no substance(seriously it reads like it was written by a psychotic with extremely advanced dementia, barely anything makes any sense whatsoever) Yeah, I wasn't blown away by any of it. It was kind of sold to me as being like Judge Dredd but it has so little humor that it was a bit hard to get through. Maybe the tone was a revelation for its time or something?
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 13:53
|
|
|
At the time Marshall Law was kind of edgy, but that edge is so worn off that it's gone and there's nothing underneath it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 14:26
|
|
|
I finished Counter X. What? I had assumed it was an event, which it wasn't. It also wasn't really a relaunch or a rebrand or anything like that. It was more like a hired hit. They got Warren Ellis to just loving murder three series at the same time. He got in there, smashed them up with a crowbar, gave everyone the ugliest goddamn costumes, and left, and all three series died five issues later. With those last five issues being the character and narrative equivalent of a punch drunk fighter stumbling around before faceplanting into the ground. Absolutely awful but also completely baffling.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 14:34
|
|
|
Gripweed posted:I finished Counter X. What? CX was supposed to last longer but sales sucked so it got killed. Ellis mentioned he had a plan once. He never said what the plan was, just that he had one.
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 15:04
|
|
|
drrockso20 posted:Just finished reading Marshal Law(and most of it's sequels), and man that was an incredibly lovely experience overall, just several hundred pages of the people who made it masturbating to how much they hate superhero comics and being a bunch of nihilistic edgelords, sure the art was nice, but that just emphasizes even more that it was all style and no substance(seriously it reads like it was written by a psychotic with extremely advanced dementia, barely anything makes any sense whatsoever) The art is so good.
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 15:32
|
|
|
Rhyno posted:CX was supposed to last longer but sales sucked so it got killed. Ellis mentioned he had a plan once. He never said what the plan was, just that he had one. Lost it in a hard drive failure RIP
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 15:39
|
|
|
Endless Mike posted:Lost it in a hard drive failure RIP Most likely!
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 15:41
|
|
|
Gripweed posted:I finished Counter X. What? You should look into the X-Force revamp that rose from Counter-X's ashes-- the Milligan/Allred run. It hasn't aged as gracefully as I once would have thought but it really is something special and a really fascinating snapshot of where Marvel was at in 2001. The X-titles were definitely adrift around that time and Counter-X was one of several efforts to nail down a direction that felt more fresh and contemporary-- and I think you'll agree that a lot of the later 2001 retoolings were much more successful in that regard (also G. Mo's New X-Men and to a much lesser extent Joe Casey's Uncanny). I want to say Cable's Soldier X rebranding and the trajectory up to it-- which was an interest spin, especially when Darko Macan took over writing-- was also part of this push? But I'm not 100% sure the dates line up. How Wonderful! fucked around with this message at 15:57 on Nov 25, 2019 |
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 15:52
|
|
Rhyno posted:CX was supposed to last longer but sales sucked so it got killed. Ellis mentioned he had a plan once. He never said what the plan was, just that he had one. I definitely believe that. I think that's the whole thing. Ellis had plans, but the three comics he was given control of didn't fit those plans. So rather than change his plans, he decided to spend eight months leisurely bashing the comics to bits so they would eventually be able to fit in whatever plan shaped holes he intended to cram them in.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 15:53
|
|
|
Gripweed posted:I definitely believe that. I think that's the whole thing. Ellis had plans, but the three comics he was given control of didn't fit those plans. So rather than change his plans, he decided to spend eight months leisurely bashing the comics to bits so they would eventually be able to fit in whatever plan shaped holes he intended to cram them in. He only outlined the books after the first arc on each. From there it was his co writers in control. I think I remember mention of a Counter X one shot that was supposed to tie things up but sales were so lovely they just poo poo canned everything.
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 15:56
|
|
Archyduchess posted:You should look into the X-Force revamp that rose from Counter-X's ashes-- the Milligan/Allred run. It hasn't aged as gracefully as I once would have thought but it really is something special and a really fascinating snapshot of where Marvel was at in 2001. The X-titles were definitely adrift around that time and Counter-X was one of several efforts to nail down a direction that felt more fresh and contemporary-- and I think you'll agree that a lot of the later 2001 retoolings were much more successful in that regard (also G. Mo's New X-Men and to a much lesser extent Joe Casey's Uncanny). I want to say Cable's Soldier X rebranding and the trajectory up to it-- which was an interest spin, especially when Darko Macan took over writing-- was also part of this push? But I'm not 100% sure the dates line up. I have absolutely read Milligan's X-Force, and X-Statix, and the Dead Girl minseries. They are all fantastic
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 16:34
|
|
|
Archyduchess posted:You should look into the X-Force revamp that rose from Counter-X's ashes-- the Milligan/Allred run. It hasn't aged as gracefully as I once would have thought but it really is something special and a really fascinating snapshot of where Marvel was at in 2001. The X-titles were definitely adrift around that time and Counter-X was one of several efforts to nail down a direction that felt more fresh and contemporary-- and I think you'll agree that a lot of the later 2001 retoolings were much more successful in that regard (also G. Mo's New X-Men and to a much lesser extent Joe Casey's Uncanny). I want to say Cable's Soldier X rebranding and the trajectory up to it-- which was an interest spin, especially when Darko Macan took over writing-- was also part of this push? But I'm not 100% sure the dates line up. Soldier X, Agent X, and X-Statix all launched around the same time, supposedly so they wouldn't have to pay Rob Liefeld royalties, but I'm not sure how true that is (especially given they all went back to their original titles eventually).
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 16:45
|
|
|
Jordan7hm posted:The art is so good. That's probably why I'm so mad about it, and a lot of the basic setting concepts are decent enough too(like I could probably take them and make a pretty good RPG setting out of them once I wash them clean of some of the dumber parts), it's just so much of everything else that drags it down into mediocrity Archyduchess posted:You should look into the X-Force revamp that rose from Counter-X's ashes-- the Milligan/Allred run. It hasn't aged as gracefully as I once would have thought but it really is something special and a really fascinating snapshot of where Marvel was at in 2001. The X-titles were definitely adrift around that time and Counter-X was one of several efforts to nail down a direction that felt more fresh and contemporary-- and I think you'll agree that a lot of the later 2001 retoolings were much more successful in that regard (also G. Mo's New X-Men and to a much lesser extent Joe Casey's Uncanny). I want to say Cable's Soldier X rebranding and the trajectory up to it-- which was an interest spin, especially when Darko Macan took over writing-- was also part of this push? But I'm not 100% sure the dates line up. I am probably one of the biggest Grant Morrison fanboys on these forums, but man I really wish he hadn't gotten the X-Men gig, as it paved the way for so much edgy nonsense from others at Marvel that it still hasn't fully recovered from(I don't think everything has to be light, after all Immortal Hulk is probably my favorite ongoing at the moment, but I feel like the average tone for a universe like either Marvel or DC should on average stay somewhere around that of the late Silver Age or Early Bronze Age) Also I would metaphorically give up my right nut to see a nice collection of the Marvel UK Zoids comic he worked on back in the 80's, it's such a nice little hidden gem of the era
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 18:32
|
|
|
Random Stranger posted:At the time Marshall Law was kind of edgy, but that edge is so worn off that it's gone and there's nothing underneath it. Yeah it was very much a time and a place kind of story, and the ideas presented aren't very new any more. Also everything past the first main story is essentially tie in garbage. I still fell that final battle interspersed with narration from the essay is pretty effective though.
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 21:49
|
|
|
Scaramouche posted:Yeah it was very much a time and a place kind of story, and the ideas presented aren't very new any more. Also everything past the first main story is essentially tie in garbage. I still fell that final battle interspersed with narration from the essay is pretty effective though. Probably doesn't help that while the original mini series was fairly mean already, all the later comics just dial that up to 11 in the worst possible way(with Marshal Law himself just becoming a completely unlikable douche), not to mention they become unbearably preachy in regards to how hard they try to push the whole "superheroes are bad and stupid and so is the reader for liking them" message that is basically the core of the whole franchise
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 22:45
|
|
|
Yeah the weirdest part for me is that somehow Ennis wasn't involved.
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2019 23:08
|
|
|
I finished reading all of Metal last night and it was fun comics. I guess Snyder wanted to do his take on Morrison DC (especially in the later issues, what with music and anti-music, "HAVE HOPE, HOPE WILL SAVE US" speeches, and retreading a lot of Final Crisis, Batman RIP, some of his JLA and Multiversity) but didn't quite land it except on a few scenes. Were the books that came after it good? I'm asking more like, the state of the DC Universe, if that makes sense. Or more precisely, how are DC books in general now? It seems like they started huffing their own farts with regards to Metal and everything right now is basically Batman Who Laughs but for X character and year of the villain stuff.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 00:52
|
|
|
Snyder's JL started out a bit rough, but it's very fun now, and it's about to end. I'm kind of bummed it was all about this one big storyline wrapped up in the Year of the Villain stuff and he didn't have the chance to slow it down and have some quieter moments in the series just for variety, but maybe he just didn't want to. The Batman Who Laughs has been a little bit useful cause his titular mini got Snyder and Jock back together and they kind of made it a follow-up to their pre-New 52 Detective Comics run. The main books aren't quite as vital or exciting as they were for the Rebirth relaunch, but there are interesting varied things happening at the edges like Matt Fraction's Jimmy Olsen book, Joe Hill's horror imprint. Bendis has been a little disappointing on Superman, but his little 'Wonder Comics' corner has gotten some neat stuff made. I love the new Dial H For Hero. Their "grown up" line Black Label is starting to come into it's own after the Bat-penis thing. The Sandman spin-off stuff is great. The Young Adult/Kids OGN line has some great stuff like 'Harley Quinn Breaking Glass' and 'Superman Smashes The Klan' Teenage Fansub fucked around with this message at 01:10 on Nov 26, 2019 |
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 01:03
|
|
|
Teenage Fansub posted:Snyder's JL started out a bit rough, but it's very fun now, and it's about to end. I'm kind of bummed it was all about this one big storyline wrapped up in the Year of the Villain stuff and he didn't have the chance to slow it down and have some quieter moments in the series just for variety, but maybe he just didn't want to. Thanks!
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 05:25
|
|
|
I read two volumes of Grindhouse: Doors Open At Midnight. Not great. The idea of a series of intentionally trashy one shots is good, but the ones I read were bad. It felt way too self aware. What if trashy stories with gore, but they're feminist?!?!?!?. Is your mind blown? I dunno, I think to be really properly entertainingly trashy, you gotta be a just putting out something that you really enjoy, or at the very least think the audience will enjoy, on a pure base level. You can't set out to "Take back" trash and expect to produce good trash. Like, I think of another trashy gory comic written by a lady, Murcielago. The lady who does Murcielago is 100% open about the fact that she started it because she wanted to draw tits and gore. Not only is it more entertaining than Grindhouse, if you wanna talk about female reappropriation of violent titty media, Murcielago does that way better too because it feels genuine. The last story In the collections I read, Lady Danger: Agent of B.O.O.T.I. was especially bad. It's supposed to be like a blaxploitation secret agent story. Almost immediately I got a very strong vibe that it was written by a white lady, and when I googled to check it turns out Alex De Campi is like the whitest goddamn lady. She directed music videos for Amanda Palmer. Real bad So yeah. straight from Counter X to Grindhouse, I've hit a pretty bad patch in this stack of clearance TPBs I've been going through. Here's hoping Force Works breaks that streak.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 05:26
|
|
|
I only read the first volume, but Bitch Planet was a pretty good "Trashy exploitation comic, but feminist." It was riffing on Women in Prison movies, not gory horror flicks though.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 05:52
|
|
|
Gripweed posted:So yeah. straight from Counter X to Grindhouse, I've hit a pretty bad patch in this stack of clearance TPBs I've been going through. Here's hoping Force Works breaks that streak. I'm really enjoying your takes on those mediocre to bad comics you picked up--what's still left on your pile?
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 20:41
|
|
|
Gripweed posted:So yeah. straight from Counter X to Grindhouse, I've hit a pretty bad patch in this stack of clearance TPBs I've been going through. Here's hoping Force Works breaks that streak.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 20:50
|
|
A Strange Aeon posted:I'm really enjoying your takes on those mediocre to bad comics you picked up--what's still left on your pile? let's see, here's the whole stack  Out of that I have left Avengers: Celestial Quest Avengers / Iron Man: Force Works Captain America Corps Justice League 3001 Sachs & Violens Thor: Thunderstrike Thunderbolts 1-3 Vampblade Leveled Up X-Men The Hidden Years Young Inhumans DC Comics Year Zero Empowered 6-8 and, not pictured, The Incredible Changebots Gripweed fucked around with this message at 21:43 on Nov 26, 2019 |
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 21:41
|
|
I'm a couple issues into Force Works already and JESUS CHRIST. Look at how this fucker draws Tony Stark
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 21:42
|
|
|
I need that book.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 21:52
|
|
|
I am extremely interested in your takes on Empowered.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 21:52
|
|
|
Justice League 3000/1 were pretty fun. It isn't all bad pickings up there.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 22:08
|
|
|
Gripweed posted:I'm a couple issues into Force Works already and JESUS CHRIST. Look at how this fucker draws Tony Stark Tony looks like Jonah Hex in these panels because of that use of the shadows.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 23:30
|
|
|
I really enjoyed Michael Fiffe's article about Tom Tenney in TCJ last month. It's not my taste but the article pointed out some aspects of it that I do think are worth appreciating and Fiffe highlights some really lovely panels. I guess Force Works was the last thing he did for Marvel, then some Image stuff, and then he bounced out of comics for good. Honestly I think his pencils only really work for me at all with Reynaldo Garcia inking.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2019 23:49
|
|
|
That’s the issue of Force Works people were talking about during Civil War 2. Dude was trying to predict crime with Scarlet Witch and a computer.
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2019 01:17
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 16:07 |
|
|
https://twitter.com/Doncates/status/1199493650314600448
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2019 02:18
|
|